meyers7
You Talkin’ To Me?
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Just a smaller marketplace, that's all.
Two views of gender pay differences
- Thread starter azfan
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eebmg
Fair and Balanced
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That is my point but so many posts seem to be so critical of professional women sports in general implying that people should have their head examined if they even entertain the thought of going to see a professional WNBA game. For the record, I enjoy the WNBA (in many ways more than WCBB) and though the pure 'orgasmic' entertainment value may not be the same as an NBA game, there are many aspects of the game to enjoy.
It seems I am in the minority but sometimes the WNBA bashing just gets tiring to me. And if all the professional opportunities disappear (WNBA or international) , the college game will inevitably suffer.
And I am not one to try to say that salaries should be artificially inflated beyond what the market would bear but let's not bash it for not being the same as a Mens' game.
Excellent point. The discussion/debate over pay and salaries does have a tendency to veer off into directions that are off point. Understanding why women's professional athletes and WNBA players in particular make less than men is a useful endeavor. That pay differential it is clear it's based upon the demand for each of those types of entertainment. Like you I see them as different forms of entertainment or different games and I prefer the women's game. I admire those athletes and find the game very interesting. However for every fan like you or me there appears to be several hundred fans who prefer the men's game. That is at the root of pay differential not discrimination.
Over time we seen the NBA expand it is now an international game and growing in terms of the number of franchises, the number of participants and most importantly the number of people who watch NBA games. Unfortunately on the other hand we've seen the WNBA shrink in terms of franchises and while the ESPN broadcast deal, subsidized by the NBA, is a step in the right direction I'm really not certain that we're seeing a significant expansion of the audience for the WNBA.
On this thread or another a poster observed that WNBA tickets for most franchises can be had for a small sum or in the case of the franchise I follow, the Phoenix Mercury, are given away. Trying to find a WNBA game televised is a frustrating endeavor. Both of these are signs of a very small demand for this entertainment stream.
Over time we seen the NBA expand it is now an international game and growing in terms of the number of franchises, the number of participants and most importantly the number of people who watch NBA games. Unfortunately on the other hand we've seen the WNBA shrink in terms of franchises and while the ESPN broadcast deal, subsidized by the NBA, is a step in the right direction I'm really not certain that we're seeing a significant expansion of the audience for the WNBA.
On this thread or another a poster observed that WNBA tickets for most franchises can be had for a small sum or in the case of the franchise I follow, the Phoenix Mercury, are given away. Trying to find a WNBA game televised is a frustrating endeavor. Both of these are signs of a very small demand for this entertainment stream.
This example, U of Oregon, illustrates the demand differences between the men and women's programs, both highly successful.
Women's season tickets appear to range $64 - $209
Men's season tickets appear to range $165 - $910
If this is representative of the difference in revenue from ticket sales more broadly, it clarifies a major factor in pay differences by gender.
The price of tickets here is an indicate of revealed preferences by consumers of these two entertainments.
247sports.com
Women's season tickets appear to range $64 - $209
Men's season tickets appear to range $165 - $910
If this is representative of the difference in revenue from ticket sales more broadly, it clarifies a major factor in pay differences by gender.
The price of tickets here is an indicate of revealed preferences by consumers of these two entertainments.
Oregon women's basketball selling season tickets at record rate
Oregon women's basketball selling season tickets at record rate
247sports.com
Relevant data on television attendance NBA vs. WNBA. This is All-Star game television ratings. It appears that in 2018 over ten times as many people watched the NBA All-Star game as the WNBA All-Star game. I think this might be relevant because All-Star game yoviewetship might be for the casual fan as opposed to the hardcore fan. If that theory is correct it reveals the wide discrepancy and interest between these two sports. As I've tried to argue in this thread the demand for entertainment labor is a derived demand based on the size of the audience.
For a market to be sustainable wages and other costs of production must be in line with the revenue generated. By that I mean those costs of production must be less than total revenue allowing for enough profit to incentivize an entrepreneur to the continued production.
www.wnba.com
www.sportsmediawatch.com
For a market to be sustainable wages and other costs of production must be in line with the revenue generated. By that I mean those costs of production must be less than total revenue allowing for enough profit to incentivize an entrepreneur to the continued production.
WNBA All-Star Game On ABC Up 17 Percent - WNBA.com - Official Site of the WNBA
The Verizon WNBA All-Star Game (Saturday, July 28, 3:30 p.m. ET) averaged 709,000 viewers, up 17 percent year over year. The 2018 All-Star Game, which saw Team Parker defeat Team Delle Donne 119-112, peaked at 849,000 viewers (5:45 – 6 p.m.), and is the most-viewed all-star game since 2015...
www.wnba.com
NBA All-Star Ratings History (1990-present)
See which NBA All-Star Game had the largest audience with this list of ratings and viewership dating back to 1990.
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USMNT comes out in support of USWNT on equal pay issue...
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This example, U of Oregon, illustrates the demand differences between the men and women's programs, both highly successful.
Women's season tickets appear to range $64 - $209
Men's season tickets appear to range $165 - $910
If this is representative of the difference in revenue from ticket sales more broadly, it clarifies a major factor in pay differences by gender.
The price of tickets here is an indicate of revealed preferences by consumers of these two entertainments.
Oregon women's basketball selling season tickets at record rate
Oregon women's basketball selling season tickets at record rate
There are hardly ever any sellouts for our men's team, but they make money. The women lose money. The men's season tickets are double the price of the women's. A lot of local businesses will buy the men's season tickets.
An Easy Fix for Soccer’s Gender Pay Gap | Satya Marar
The solution lies in paying male and female athletes an equal flat fee with a bonus determined as a share of the sponsorship revenue for each match. It’s the fairest, most free-market way to resolve the pay dispute in intra-sex national and international-level competitive sports.
fee.org
This is a solid analysis that confirms the basis for pay differentials across sport and gender.
"
Supply and Demand for Sponsorships
A lot of sports today are funded by private sponsorship. In 2017-18, for example, the United States Soccer Federation (USSF) sourced over half of its revenue from sponsorship, TV licensing, and royalties. The comparison of skill and training in competitive hockey and soccer is largely irrelevant when a sport receives greater interest from viewers than another. For these sports or competitions, broadcasters are willing to pay more for broadcasting rights, and companies are willing to pay to advertise, own, or sponsor soccer teams.
This is also why Karsten Braasch was lucky if he made even a fraction of what the Williams sisters each made over the course of their tennis careers—despite proving he was a better player. People were simply more interested in watching the Williams sisters take on other highly-ranked women."
it would be helpful for those unclear on the rationale for gender sports pay difference to consider this last example. Serena Williams over her tennis career made for far more money then all but the top 15 male tennis players.As the analysis above confirms this is not due to sex discrimination or gender discrimination but by demand. Far more people wanted to watch Serena Williams play tennis than most of the male tennis players who are not elite.
Open Letter July 29, 2019 - Finding Common Ground
US soccer and international soccer administration have clear credibility problems. That's said this information does reflect on the complexity of negotiated collective bargaining wage agreements.
Further developments in the soccer world. Economic issues typically are not resolved in the political arena. Think of the decades long energy invested in various equal pay schemes
deadspin.com
I am not a fan of deadspin which I don't believe represents as a journalism site.
This observation is on point and applies to the upcoming or ongoing WNBA CBA situation ..... particularly on the issue of intimate party violence.
"What’s especially frustrating about these lobbyist hires is that U.S. Soccer could be doing so much to actually fulfill its mission of growing the sport (or, you know, pay its women) with the hundreds of thousands they’re likely spending on these firms. Statements from both the men’s and women’s teams echoed as much."
www.politico.com
U.S. Soccer Hires Lobbyists To Fight Equal Pay Bill In Congress
As the USWNT continues its fight for equal pay against U.S. Soccer, which is supposed to enter into mediation soon, Democratic lawmakers in both the House and the Senate have introduced legislation that would withhold federal funding from the 2026 World Cup (hosted by North America) if the men’s...
deadspin.com
I am not a fan of deadspin which I don't believe represents as a journalism site.
This observation is on point and applies to the upcoming or ongoing WNBA CBA situation ..... particularly on the issue of intimate party violence.
"What’s especially frustrating about these lobbyist hires is that U.S. Soccer could be doing so much to actually fulfill its mission of growing the sport (or, you know, pay its women) with the hundreds of thousands they’re likely spending on these firms. Statements from both the men’s and women’s teams echoed as much."
U.S. Soccer hires lobbyists to argue women’s national team isn’t underpaid
The lobbyists have circulated a presentation that emphasizes the benefits the women’s team players receive, including a guaranteed salary and maternity leave, that players on the men’s team do not.
Women's small soccer salaries are fair
The outrage goes much, much deeper than salary disparity in women's sports.
amp.businessinsider.com
The real question is not why female athletes are paid less. People should be asking why fans and sponsors are less interested in supporting women's sports - and this is what they should be outraged about.
This excellent 2015 analysis goes on to make the point
The lack of attendance and sponsorships contribute to a chicken-or-the-egg problem when it comes to getting women's sports up off the ground.
"Absent deep-pocketed investors who can commit for several years, women's professional teams and leagues find themselves scrambling to survive almost from the moment they launch," Shira Springer writes in the Boston Globe .
This article also informs I think the discussion by pay differentials in professional basketball. For example those of us looking forward to watching a WNBA game tomorrow first of all have the oppotunity to watch games at 4 rather than a more user-friendly 7 p.m. Further rather than on the ESPN flagship games are on NBA TV and ESPN3. This would be a rational decision on the part of the network based on their projection of potential audience interest.
www.independent.ie
A key statistic used on that '60 Minutes' broadcast back in 2016 and in the debate that followed was that the biggest ever US TV audience for a soccer game had tuned into the women's 2015 crowning glory. But comparing US men's and women's friendlies before their last respective World Cups, 70 per cent more tuned in to the men; comparing send-off games, that number was 87 per cent greater; in group games at those two tournaments, 212 per cent more watched the men.
Even when you include that record 25 million who turned on the 2015 final, the US men outdrew the US women by 74 percent as an average across all World Cup games. On top of that, while broadcaster Fox brought in $17 million in ad revenue from women's games in 2015, ESPN brought in $529 million from the last men's tournament. That's all this really comes down to.
Ewan MacKenna: Gender pay gap in sport is justified - women's games can't come close to matching the men's earning power
In November of 2016, a story on the CBS show '60 minutes' began a broader debate across the sporting spectrum.
www.independent.ie
A key statistic used on that '60 Minutes' broadcast back in 2016 and in the debate that followed was that the biggest ever US TV audience for a soccer game had tuned into the women's 2015 crowning glory. But comparing US men's and women's friendlies before their last respective World Cups, 70 per cent more tuned in to the men; comparing send-off games, that number was 87 per cent greater; in group games at those two tournaments, 212 per cent more watched the men.
Even when you include that record 25 million who turned on the 2015 final, the US men outdrew the US women by 74 percent as an average across all World Cup games. On top of that, while broadcaster Fox brought in $17 million in ad revenue from women's games in 2015, ESPN brought in $529 million from the last men's tournament. That's all this really comes down to.
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I think the true question is...Should all athletes that represent the United States be paid the same regardless of sport?
eebmg
Fair and Balanced
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Not exactly an article on Pay differences but this very extensive article in NYTimes Magazine discusses alot of different topics about league viability from all sides (as may be expected 
)
The Dream are a major focus and Renee is featured prominently.
The W.N.B.A. Is Putting on Some of the Best Pro Basketball in America
)The Dream are a major focus and Renee is featured prominently.
The W.N.B.A. Is Putting on Some of the Best Pro Basketball in America
"On top of that, while broadcaster Fox brought in $17 million in ad revenue from women's games in 2015, ESPN brought in $529 million from the last men's tournament"
I think about how John Kenneth Galbraith in The Affluent Society asserted that large corporations could create demand which seemed like a odd assertion at that time and it certainly doesn't seem to be the case when it comes to women's Athletics. What I mean by that is efforts to increase, stimulate or create demand among the viewing public for women's Athletics have not been successful. As we approach pro football season more fans watch meaningless NFL exhibition games then watch highly meaningful WNBA games down the stretch. This is the reason why pay differentials exist there's simply not enough money in the women's sport to increase pay for these outstanding athletes a rate of pay that comes close to approaching the men's game. By focusing on the real cause of gender pay difference it makes understanding the situation much easier and clear.
I think about how John Kenneth Galbraith in The Affluent Society asserted that large corporations could create demand which seemed like a odd assertion at that time and it certainly doesn't seem to be the case when it comes to women's Athletics. What I mean by that is efforts to increase, stimulate or create demand among the viewing public for women's Athletics have not been successful. As we approach pro football season more fans watch meaningless NFL exhibition games then watch highly meaningful WNBA games down the stretch. This is the reason why pay differentials exist there's simply not enough money in the women's sport to increase pay for these outstanding athletes a rate of pay that comes close to approaching the men's game. By focusing on the real cause of gender pay difference it makes understanding the situation much easier and clear.