Two Facts and a Suggestion | The Boneyard

Two Facts and a Suggestion

diggerfoot

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Fact One: Auriemma spends more time in shaping and giving reps to the first team in practice over other players. This is probably the biggest factor for why such a drop-off in "performance art" occurs the farther down the bench, they have neither the same amount of reps nor coaching. This also explains why Stevens might still have a learning occur this season; she did not practice with the first team last season.

Fact Two: Auriemma is one of the best, likely the best, teachers of the game and molder of players. This explains why players like Conlon and Gardler can perform so well on the best Division I team. When I hear opinions that Bent, Irwin or Butler are mid-major material at best I shake my head. Butler in particular has much more going for her to become a center for the best of college programs than Conlon had for becoming a point guard or Gardler a power forward. There are more examples but those are what comes to the top of my head. What Butler did not have, however, was the timing and good fortune of a Conlon; Auriemma had no choice but to mold Conlon into the point guard he needed. Timing is an issue for Bent and Irwin as well, both of whom could have replaced Conlon or Gardler respectively if they had the same molding at the time.

In my situation I am never able to watch games live. Fortunately, MJL and tcf provide the opportunity to watch all games later (Thanks!). By then I know how the game has gone and I tailor my viewing accordingly. I watch only the quarters when the best "performance art" occurs. Consequently I come away with quite a different view of the team and the players than what I read either during or after games from some of the more concerned posters, because what I am watching is mainly what the best coach in the game does with the players he gives the most attention.

Year after year I see the same concerns written on the Boneyard during and after games, even in the seasons that end up being undefeated. Every. Single. Year. I realize this is the nature of concerned folks and some years their concerns may even be realized, such as for the 00-01 season. Yet being constantly concerned is not healthy. You concerned folks release much more cortisol into your system than us unconcerned folks. Enough to undermine your health? Perhaps, in some cases. So I suggest you do what I do. In a year when the victor is virtually predetermined each game, watch the games later and watch only the quarters when the "performance art" is at its best. You are bound to have more holiday cheer that way.
 

ctfjr

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Well, your fact 2 won't get any dissenters on this board, lol. However having been called a devil's advocate before (among other not so nice things) I wonder how you came up with your fact 1??? It certainly seems what you say is logical but as you said you are 'never able to watch live games' I assume you have never watched a live practice (or any, as I am not aware that regular practices are televised).
I always assumed there was some 'earn your game minutes' tied to how well you practiced. . .
 
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watch only the quarters when the "performance art" is at its best.

1. Sports is competition.

2. Your solution would miss the M. State win over UCONN, one of the best games of the year.

3. Looking at the score and then watching drains the sense of urgency.

4. So ignore all the hard work that the guys put in and just watch ballet?

I do hope you enjoy watching last years World Series this year!
 
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1. Sports is competition.
2. Your solution would miss the M. State win over UCONN, one of the best games of the year.
3. Looking at the score and then watching drains the sense of urgency.
4. So ignore all the hard work that the guys put in and just watch ballet?
I do hope you enjoy watching last years World Series this year!
I don't think that is what diggerfoot is saying. Because he can't watch live, he watches the tape and fast forwards through patches in which play is ragged, recognizing (as we all should!) that ragged play happens and is not a cause for despair, but he prefers to see just what pleases him. That doesn't preclude, for example, watching parts or all of the Mississippi State game, because it's not the outcome that determines whether he watches but rather the quality of play. I think a lot of us are drawn to UConn WCBB because we think that right now it is, for long patches, the highest quality basketball being played in the world, at any level and by either gender. When it ceases to be that (most likely when Geno calls it a day) a lot of us will be less enthusiastic followers. Of course, you might not be one of them: you might be a true Blue Husky fan and follow them because of your love of the school. But, like diggerfoot, I too think of the team as displaying performance art, and that's why I watch (also because I come from the same hometown as Geno). And like diggerfoot, I focus on the elegance of their game; unlike diggerfoot, because I watch it live (and often in person) I simply let the ragged play go by, knowing that it is what it is and that it will be better again in the next quarter or the next game.
 
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Fact One: Auriemma spends more time in shaping and giving reps to the first team in practice over other players. This is probably the biggest factor for why such a drop-off in "performance art" occurs the farther down the bench, they have neither the same amount of reps nor coaching. This also explains why Stevens might still have a learning occur this season; she did not practice with the first team last season.
My wife and I have sort of concluded over the years through listening to Geno and the players during interviews that if you are on the "first" team, you practice until you can't get it wrong. If any player is even an inch out of position, practice stops and you do it over. If you are on the "second" team, if you are in the proper time-zone, practice continues BUT you are "rewarded" with game minutes for how close to the proper inch you got.
 
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Well, your fact 2 won't get any dissenters on this board, lol. However having been called a devil's advocate before (among other not so nice things) I wonder how you came up with your fact 1??? It certainly seems what you say is logical but as you said you are 'never able to watch live games' I assume you have never watched a live practice (or any, as I am not aware that regular practices are televised).
I always assumed there was some 'earn your game minutes' tied to how well you practiced. . .
lots of tape on-line of practices. often part of the Geno show. what diggerfoot and trisallin say are my impressions as well.
 
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Year after year I see the same concerns written on the Boneyard during and after games, even in the seasons that end up being undefeated. Every. Single. Year.

I hear you! It seems that more often than not, fans participating in this forum proceed from a fear of losing, rather than taking pleasure in watching the narrative unfold before our eyes in real time.

Stop worrying about the outcome, and enjoy the ride. Take pleasure in every aspect of the game-including when other teams perform well.
 
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I must watch the replays 5 times each, because of the "art" of the game.

Exactly! I usually watch each game replay at least 1 to 2 times all the way through. Sometimes I will watch an entire quarter focusing only on one player. Other times, I will watch the game as if I am a committed fan of the other team-focusing my attention on how the other team‘s players guard, run the floor, anticipate, react, and so on. You’d be surprised at what you see when adopting such a perspective.
 
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Fact One: Auriemma spends more time in shaping and giving reps to the first team in practice over other players. This is probably the biggest factor for why such a drop-off in "performance art" occurs the farther down the bench, they have neither the same amount of reps nor coaching. This also explains why Stevens might still have a learning occur this season; she did not practice with the first team last season.

Fact Two: Auriemma is one of the best, likely the best, teachers of the game and molder of players. This explains why players like Conlon and Gardler can perform so well on the best Division I team. When I hear opinions that Bent, Irwin or Butler are mid-major material at best I shake my head. Butler in particular has much more going for her to become a center for the best of college programs than Conlon had for becoming a point guard or Gardler a power forward. There are more examples but those are what comes to the top of my head. What Butler did not have, however, was the timing and good fortune of a Conlon; Auriemma had no choice but to mold Conlon into the point guard he needed. Timing is an issue for Bent and Irwin as well, both of whom could have replaced Conlon or Gardler respectively if they had the same molding at the time.

In my situation I am never able to watch games live. Fortunately, MJL and tcf provide the opportunity to watch all games later (Thanks!). By then I know how the game has gone and I tailor my viewing accordingly. I watch only the quarters when the best "performance art" occurs. Consequently I come away with quite a different view of the team and the players than what I read either during or after games from some of the more concerned posters, because what I am watching is mainly what the best coach in the game does with the players he gives the most attention.

Year after year I see the same concerns written on the Boneyard during and after games, even in the seasons that end up being undefeated. Every. Single. Year. I realize this is the nature of concerned folks and some years their concerns may even be realized, such as for the 00-01 season. Yet being constantly concerned is not healthy. You concerned folks release much more cortisol into your system than us unconcerned folks. Enough to undermine your health? Perhaps, in some cases. So I suggest you do what I do. In a year when the victor is virtually predetermined each game, watch the games later and watch only the quarters when the "performance art" is at its best. You are bound to have more holiday cheer that way.
Going back to “Fact 1” in the original post, far be it for me to question the approach taken by the best coach ever in Women’s BB, but I do have to admit agreement and concern, at times , in regard to our women on the so-called “second team”. Recognizing that “playing time has to be earned, there still are times in these early games that I wish they were allowed more minutes. I couldn’t care less that we’re often not as productive in the fourth quarter. I feel we can more than afford not to be and care little regarding the final point spread between UConn and our opponent —knowing that it could easily have be much greater. Again, I more than acknowledge and am thankful that Geno has been successful with the approaches he’s taken —and you certainly can’t knock success. I would, however, love to see the talented freshman show-up with more in respect to their individual box scores....and maybe as the year goes on, hopefully they will.
 
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If I were to add a corollary to the OP I would suggest to those who focus on flaws in this year's team. Watch replays from the 2002 team, the team that is often used as the "gold standard" by which other UConn teams are measured. And if you watch the entire game and not just a highlight video you'll see Bird throwing passes away, Cash missing layups, opponents stealing balls and occasionally you'll see substantial leads erased. It might give some perspective when this year's team screws up a play.
 

UcMiami

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Interesting note on Conlon - she was not the first choice for starting PG on that 2002-3 team. Nicole Wolff started until her injury 10 games in and was playing really well.

Digger, I take a bit of exception to the way you characterize the coaching - three years ago, Lou, Napheesa, and Gabby were all getting a whole lot of attention and coaching from the staff even though variously they were not starting. And even before Lou's injury, I am pretty sure Stevens was being coached pretty darned hard.

The distinction I would make is that players get coached as hard as the coach's expectations for them go. A sixth player freshman like Maya was getting everything thrown at her because the expectations and her abilities to absorb the coaching were 'starting five' level. Same with Lou, Napheesa, and Gabby in my above example. But generally Freshman are not expected to contribute at the same level, and putting them on the court with four starters in practice screws up the starters more than it helps the freshman.

Transfers are a whole different story and the coaches are not likely to devote a lot of energy in full team practice to a player that will never see the floor the whole year.
 

diggerfoot

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1. Sports is competition.

2. Your solution would miss the M. State win over UCONN, one of the best games of the year.

3. Looking at the score and then watching drains the sense of urgency.

4. So ignore all the hard work that the guys put in and just watch ballet?

I do hope you enjoy watching last years World Series this year!

My suggestion was geared more towards health than being a fan. Life events have made me particularly sensitive to brain health research. As a competently trained, qualified and practiced researcher I form my opinions from original research papers, not blogs, interest groups or media outlets. In regards to brain health at least my suggestion is informed and sound.

I understand watching games for the thrill of competition. I loved being both a men's and women's fan during the nineties for precisely this reason. I also understand the motivation expressed by others of watching players develop and the story of a season unfold. When a team's mantra is "Play smart. Play hard. Have fun." that's bound to be a plot worth watching.

Watching for the thrill of competition as you do carries no health risk, particularly for a UConn WCBB fan. Both cortisol and adrenaline have adaptive functions when released through episodal events; they are performance enhancers. Make love after a thrilling UConn victory and your spouse will be most appreciative. Lol. Even if there were no adaptive advantage to these hormones, a thrilling UConn game is so rare as to still hold no health risk, unless your heart is in particularly bad shape. It's the chronic release of hormones meant to provide temporary performance enhancement that carries the risk.

I used the term "performance art" because that's a term others used when defending why they should be concerned even in a blow out. They are concerned not only because the high performance they come to expect is lacking in the moment (and will be lacking at some point in virtually every game), but for what this might mean for some future date. This borders on turning the "episodal" of thrilling competition for any particular game into the "chronic" of everlasting concern for an ongoing season. Since the outcome of the games this year are predetermined, at least for now, they would be doing themselves a favor by only watching the good quarters.

As for me, I admit I've changed. I'm no longer into competition. It started with how the Olympics became tainted, then professional sports and finally now the college scene. The NCAA as a governing body saddens me. True, they have had little effect on UConn women; they have had significant effect on UConn men. So I now count myself as one of those in the "performance art" category.

My exposure and study of brain health leads me to my own mantra of "Seek beauty. Love kindness. Embrace joy." I find that watching women of high character as they enjoy playing beautiful basketball is good for my brain and my soul. That's why I watch and I feel no commitment nor compulsion to watch for any other reason. In a way I'm glad I have no choice but to watch games afterwards, but that's just my own fan preference.
 

diggerfoot

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Interesting note on Conlon - she was not the first choice for starting PG on that 2002-3 team. Nicole Wolff started until her injury 10 games in and was playing really well.

Digger, I take a bit of exception to the way you characterize the coaching - three years ago, Lou, Napheesa, and Gabby were all getting a whole lot of attention and coaching from the staff even though variously they were not starting. And even before Lou's injury, I am pretty sure Stevens was being coached pretty darned hard.

The distinction I would make is that players get coached as hard as the coach's expectations for them go. A sixth player freshman like Maya was getting everything thrown at her because the expectations and her abilities to absorb the coaching were 'starting five' level. Same with Lou, Napheesa, and Gabby in my above example. But generally Freshman are not expected to contribute at the same level, and putting them on the court with four starters in practice screws up the starters more than it helps the freshman.

Transfers are a whole different story and the coaches are not likely to devote a lot of energy in full team practice to a player that will never see the floor the whole year.

I'll raise you an exception to your exception, while yet admitting my guilt to another's poster accusation that I've not watched a practice. I recount this as Auriemma's own opinion, offered in fact as an explanation why despite a year of practice Stevens still has a ways to go. His own words were that he gives the first team more attention. Now I do take that to mean 5+, as in starting five plus others that might get significant time, so I'm not suggesting something different than you. I am offering it as an explanation as to why fourth quarters do not perform up to expectations and why Stevens may not be entirely up to speed out of the gate. I'm only the messenger here.
 
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I'll raise you an exception to your exception, while yet admitting my guilt to another's poster accusation that I've not watched a practice. I recount this as Auriemma's own opinion, offered in fact as an explanation why despite a year of practice Stevens still has a ways to go. His own words were that he gives the first team more attention. Now I do take that to mean 5+, as in starting five plus others that might get significant time, so I'm not suggesting something different than you. I am offering it as an explanation as to why fourth quarters do not perform up to expectations and why Stevens may not be entirely up to speed out of the gate. I'm only the messenger here.

Diggerfoot - re Stevens...can't understand the doubters. Has there EVER been a Husky that's had double-doubles in three out of their first four games as a starter under Geno? And, she might just be gettin' warmed up. Let's see how it plays out on Sunday, and the rest of the season.
 

UcMiami

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I'll raise you an exception to your exception, while yet admitting my guilt to another's poster accusation that I've not watched a practice. I recount this as Auriemma's own opinion, offered in fact as an explanation why despite a year of practice Stevens still has a ways to go. His own words were that he gives the first team more attention. Now I do take that to mean 5+, as in starting five plus others that might get significant time, so I'm not suggesting something different than you. I am offering it as an explanation as to why fourth quarters do not perform up to expectations and why Stevens may not be entirely up to speed out of the gate. I'm only the messenger here.
OK - I certainly read your OP to be starters (5) and all others.

I have always felt that 4th quarters (and this year is not 'exceptional' in this respect falter in the level of execution because the players playing are 1) freshman still learning the ropes, 2) sophomores that didn't have a 'leap' in performance, and 3) players whose skills do not (and will not?) allow them to perform at the level of the starters.

One of the things with basketball is how bad it looks when shots don't fall - prime example was the Uconn Stanford NC game - that was very skilled players on both teams failing to hit the broad side of the backboard from 5 feet in the first half and it looked terrible.

Put a bunch of players on the court in the fourth who are thinking about everything they are doing and consequently missing their shots, and suddenly the other team is running transition offense much more smoothly than they ran their half court when the Uconn starters were hitting 60%. Doesn't help that we have been blowing out good teams so the bench is playing against a lot of starters for long minutes and not the other teams bench.

Stevens was a transfer and he specifically was setting her aside as such, placing her in a different universe from the players who could actually end up getting minutes in the game.

The other thing that has improved the performance in the fourth quarter some years ... the roster has been limited to 7-8 healthy bodies! Amazing how much better it looks when you are playing your whole bench and still have two or three starters in the game! :eek::cool::)
 
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If you saw Maria play the in high school, you would have seen how good she was before UConn. That's why Geno recruited her. She was really freakin good. It seems that everyone else's job on that team was to set a screen for her or get her the ball. She was a lights out shooter.
 
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If you saw Maria play the in high school, you would have seen how good she was before UConn. That's why Geno recruited her. She was really freakin good. It seems that everyone else's job on that team was to set a screen for her or get her the ball. She was a lights out shooter.
With UConn's motion offense, every player needs to have strong offensive skills or its effectiveness breaks down. Suspect that anyone who shows a reluctance to shoot or limitations will see their minutes decline or go away.
 
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Many times I have stated I coached HS Wrestling in MO for 3 years then the last 29 in East Lyme, CT. I coached 32 total years and even though the level of athletics was no where at UCONN's WBB levels, athletes are athletes! I coached at a high enough level to be inducted into the National Wrestling Hall of Fame in 2005! That being said, I think the belief by some members of the BONEYARD that ALL members of UCONN's roster should be at a top level at all times is foolish! As great as most of Geno & his staff's recruits are, they are all not DT, Maya Moore, Sue Bird, and Brianna Stewart level athletes coming into UCONN but will grow as players and people by the time they leave, bet the ranch on that! Any coach rounds out his/her roster with great "pieces" that add to the mix and help bring out the best in the top athletes on that season's roster!
I also have stated previously that my only hope for the upcoming season is that all players on that roster stay illness & injury free all season and let the pieces fall where they may! With the great recruits and the best Coaching Staff in WBB I know they'll have have a great season if the health comes to pass! I don't need a NCAA Championship each year to be fulfilled!
As I watch the games in person and on TV I do not expect the world from the end of the bench! I want to see improvement each game but I don't expect to see the last 4 off the bench maintain a 30 point lead in the 4th quarter vs many of our opponents best players!
The thrill is seeing the lower skilled players far exceed the level of play they came into CT with by the end of their eligibility!
My joy and tears that flowed when Briana Pulido hit that 3 at the end of the 2016 Finals made a moment for the UCONN WBB program and all their fans that will never be forgotten! The memories of BP letting her opponents score in the 4th 1/4 will never be recalled!
Please BYers appreciate what you have while you have it! Because when Geno & CD leave things will not be at the level it is now!
 
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Going back to “Fact 1” in the original post, far be it for me to question the approach taken by the best coach ever in Women’s BB, but I do have to admit agreement and concern, at times , in regard to our women on the so-called “second team”. Recognizing that “playing time has to be earned, there still are times in these early games that I wish they were allowed more minutes. I couldn’t care less that we’re often not as productive in the fourth quarter. I feel we can more than afford not to be and care little regarding the final point spread between UConn and our opponent —knowing that it could easily have be much greater. Again, I more than acknowledge and am thankful that Geno has been successful with the approaches he’s taken —and you certainly can’t knock success. I would, however, love to see the talented freshman show-up with more in respect to their individual box scores....and maybe as the year goes on, hopefully they will.

I take the complete opposite view. Our conference is weak. UCONN is playing their toughest schedules now. There is absolutely imo no logical reason to force-feed the freshmen to more minutes if they aren't ready. Late in the year when we get into the AAC- sure with our weak conference they can get a few more - maybe. But this team has a completely different dynamic than some of the prior years with the incorporation of Z and her style along with a much better Danger. They need as many minutes possible early to be prepared to play against teams early scheduled such as UCLA and ND. This is the toughest schedule they've played early on in a long time, hasn't it? The top players need the minutes.

For example, Collier's game has been off offensively vs last year. Playing her less minutes early imo isn't a very good answer to help her. Danger working with Z and as the new floor general (she is entirely different this year than last) imo is very important. Playing them less minutes is not a good answer. Nurse learning to play pg while Danger is out very important too. Not letting Nurse work on being the backup pg and not playing with the regulars as well as working on her pg skills during games is not a good answer. These are the players that are going to get you a championship. The 13-15th players on the bench could sit a bit more this early. It won't kill them.

Thus it comes down to which approach we feel is best for the team. IMO hands-down it's how Geno is handling it.
 
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Many times I have stated I coached HS Wrestling in MO for 3 years then the last 29 in East Lyme, CT. I coached 32 total years and even though the level of athletics was no where at UCONN's WBB levels, athletes are athletes! I coached at a high enough level to be inducted into the National Wrestling Hall of Fame in 2005! That being said, I think the belief by some members of the BONEYARD that ALL members of UCONN's roster should be at a top level at all times is foolish! As great as most of Geno & his staff's recruits are, they are all not DT, Maya Moore, Sue Bird, and Brianna Stewart level athletes coming into UCONN but will grow as players and people by the time they leave, bet the ranch on that! Any coach rounds out his/her roster with great "pieces" that add to the mix and help bring out the best in the top athletes on that season's roster!
I also have stated previously that my only hope for the upcoming season is that all players on that roster stay illness & injury free all season and let the pieces fall where they may! With the great recruits and the best Coaching Staff in WBB I know they'll have have a great season if the health comes to pass! I don't need a NCAA Championship each year to be fulfilled!
As I watch the games in person and on TV I do not expect the world from the end of the bench! I want to see improvement each game but I don't expect to see the last 4 off the bench maintain a 30 point lead in the 4th quarter vs many of our opponents best players!
The thrill is seeing the lower skilled players far exceed the level of play they came into CT with by the end of their eligibility!
My joy and tears that flowed when Briana Pulido hit that 3 at the end of the 2016 Finals made a moment for the UCONN WBB program and all their fans that will never be forgotten! The memories of BP letting her opponents score in the 4th 1/4 will never be recalled!
Please BYers appreciate what you have while you have it! Because when Geno & CD leave things will not be at the level it is now!

Great post. :):):):):)
 

UcMiami

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Many times I have stated I coached HS Wrestling in MO for 3 years then the last 29 in East Lyme, CT. I coached 32 total years and even though the level of athletics was no where at UCONN's WBB levels, athletes are athletes! I coached at a high enough level to be inducted into the National Wrestling Hall of Fame in 2005! That being said, I think the belief by some members of the BONEYARD that ALL members of UCONN's roster should be at a top level at all times is foolish! As great as most of Geno & his staff's recruits are, they are all not DT, Maya Moore, Sue Bird, and Brianna Stewart level athletes coming into UCONN but will grow as players and people by the time they leave, bet the ranch on that! Any coach rounds out his/her roster with great "pieces" that add to the mix and help bring out the best in the top athletes on that season's roster!
I also have stated previously that my only hope for the upcoming season is that all players on that roster stay illness & injury free all season and let the pieces fall where they may! With the great recruits and the best Coaching Staff in WBB I know they'll have have a great season if the health comes to pass! I don't need a NCAA Championship each year to be fulfilled!
As I watch the games in person and on TV I do not expect the world from the end of the bench! I want to see improvement each game but I don't expect to see the last 4 off the bench maintain a 30 point lead in the 4th quarter vs many of our opponents best players!
The thrill is seeing the lower skilled players far exceed the level of play they came into CT with by the end of their eligibility!
My joy and tears that flowed when Briana Pulido hit that 3 at the end of the 2016 Finals made a moment for the UCONN WBB program and all their fans that will never be forgotten! The memories of BP letting her opponents score in the 4th 1/4 will never be recalled!
Please BYers appreciate what you have while you have it! Because when Geno & CD leave things will not be at the level it is now!
Yes, yes, yes!
One of mysteries of athletic development is how time and progression up levels of competition (and changing teammates) changes seemingly similarly gift kids. Uconn has tons of examples but since Conlon has been mentioned: two CT high school stars - Heather Buck and Maria Conlon had VERY different careers at Uconn. (And add in a 'what if': if Nicole doesn't blow out her knee in the tenth game of the year, would Maria ever have gotten a start and proven to be a perfect complement to DT for the next two years?!)
Watching the various walk-ons over the years and the happy bench warriors is part of the joy - Meg Gardler and Tahirah Williams and all the others.
Expecting Molly Bent to be Dangerfield or Irwin to become Charles is a fools game - watching them become the best versions of themselves over the short window we get is much more satisfying.
 
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Yes, yes, yes!
One of mysteries of athletic development is how time and progression up levels of competition (and changing teammates) changes seemingly similarly gift kids. Uconn has tons of examples but since Conlon has been mentioned: two CT high school stars - Heather Buck and Maria Conlon had VERY different careers at Uconn. (And add in a 'what if': if Nicole doesn't blow out her knee in the tenth game of the year, would Maria ever have gotten a start and proven to be a perfect complement to DT for the next two years?!)
Watching the various walk-ons over the years and the happy bench warriors is part of the joy - Meg Gardler and Tahirah Williams and all the others.
Expecting Molly Bent to be Dangerfield or Irwin to become Charles is a fools game - watching them become the best versions of themselves over the short window we get is much more satisfying.

Awesome post!
 

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