Thoughts on the Bench

[Aluminny69]

Geno tried an interesting experiment tonight. With about 15 minutes to go, Geno put four non-starters ( Stokes, Chong, Williams, and Ekmark) in to play together, along with one starter.
Here are some of my observations now, maybe some later when I can see the actual stats.
1. Most important, to me, there is a clear drop off in talent from the starting five. I can see why Geno is reluctant to make a sub. It looked like the second five had trouble staying with Tulsa, which is not saying much.

Individually,
Williams - Best of the four, had a nice bounce back game after only 2 minutes against St. Johns\
Stokes - I don't think she is ever going to be a scorer. Great rebounder and shot blocker, but no offense at all.
Ekmark - Nice three point shot, but I hope she's not just a one dimensional player. Nothing else about her game stood out to me.
Chong - Basically, no confidence at all. Not a great game for her.

Like everyone else, I'm rooting for these four to improve, but I didn't see it tonight ( except Williams).

I would like to read others "objective" observations on Geno's experiment. Right now, I have to reluctantly agree with him. The drop off in talent from the starting five is pretty clear.

 

[HoopsFan21]

At this point first off the bench is a toss up between Gabby and Kiah, depending on what you want to do at that particular moment in the game. Gabby being just a freshman has much more potential, so I think getting her more minutes is more worthwhile for the future of the team. Kiah is what she is going to be in three months from now whether she plays 5 minutes a game or 20 minutes. I'm cutting Ekmark some slack given that she's missed a lot of time. Chong just plays like she doesn't care what happens, not much else I can say about that.

 

[ursusminor]

My opinions:
Williams played like her tail was on fire. In a good way.
Stokes is what she is, which is arguably the best post defender in the country. The offense thing... it's been four years, it's not gonna change between now and the post-season.
Ekmark had some nice passes to go with her points; she passed up a good look at the basket for an assist before she scored.
I don't really remember anything Chong did during the game at all, good or bad. That's probably not good.

 

[HoopsFan21]

My opinions:
Williams played like her tail was on fire. In a good way.
Stokes is what she is, which is arguably the best post defender in the country. The offense thing... it's been four years, it's not gonna change between now and the post-season.
Ekmark had some nice passes to go with her points; she passed up a good look at the basket for an assist before she scored.
I don't really remember anything Chong did during the game at all, good or bad. That's probably not good.

Chong had a nice drive to the hoop for her 2 pts with about 3 minutes left. But she had made a lazy pass that was easily picked off and taken the other way. Then she was just dribbling at the top the key and a Tulsa player just came up and stole the ball away from her. Chong also had a 5 second violation trying to inbound the ball. Not a good night for her when it was a big chance to shine - inferior opponent and lots of time. A year and a half into her UConn career, some light bulbs should be clicking on by now. Next year we add four players while only losing one from the bench and one from the starting five. Competition for playing time will get tougher next year.

 

[Farney]

Williams was much better tonight. As a freshman she's going to be up and down. Just hoping to see her be as consistent as possible. As has been said, Stokes is what she is. Piles of rebounds and blocks, great post defense, and the occasional hoop. Ekmark looks a bit slower from her HS days, possibly as a result of adding a bunch of muscle during her senior year. I think she's very fundamentally sound and will hit 3s when open. Chong has looked completely out of it since ND. Just can't find it. Hopefully she bounces back because she seems to be his choice as the guard to give Jefferson and Nurse a quick rest.

 

[huskeynut]

Stokes - she's a defensive machine and that has its place in UCONN's game plan.

Williams - that girl can jump. Sitting courtside and watching her elevate is unbelievable. Big upside. She will get more minutes as she improves. Her understanding of were she is in relation to the basket and her defender is uncanny. Quick, strong moves to the basket. Her defense is improving. And she is strong.

Ekmark - as was said, she's coming off that stress thing. She needs court time. She's looks comfortable on the court. Aware of the offensive flow. Nice stroke. Defense needs work but that's nothing new for freshman at UCONN. I think her minutes increase over the next month at the expense of -

Chong - she's playing her way to the end of the bench. Lazy passes tonight. Not looking to shot at all unless its a layup. Can't get the ball in on an inbounds and is unaware of the 5 second rule.

 

[housekeys]

I would like the experiment done with Stewart in the game. My guess is that, like the starters, the other 4 would play much better. Also game time familiarity for the subs is an issue. In other words, if this is tried a few more times in blow outs during the course of the season, they will be much improved. Practice makes perfect.

 

[JoePgh]

Regarding Courtney Ekmark, I think an appropriate comparison is to Mel Thomas. Good 3-point shooter, not very fast or athletic, had to learn defense, but was smart and put in the effort to learn what the coaches were trying to teach. By her senior year, she was an essential glue player. After her injury, she was really missed.

I don't think Courtney will ever be quick, fast, or acrobatic, but she will be a smart 2-way player who does not make mental errors and can make shots, passes, and backdoor cuts. And she is several inches taller than Mel, which helps a lot.

 

[pvdoggy]

I would like the experiment done with Stewart in the game. My guess is that, like the starters, the other 4 would play much better. Also game time familiarity for the subs is an issue. In other words, if this is tried a few more times in blow outs during the course of the season, they will be much improved. Practice makes perfect.

Not only that, if you put Stewart in with the other 4, Stewart won't look that good either.
It is easy to point to the 15 pts that Gabby scored and said that she had a great game, but the fact that she scored the points a s a by-product of the spacing of the system with the starters when she was in. Chong on the other hand is looking totally lost.

 

[geneticrex]

If there is a better combination of a post defender/rebounder/shot blocker in America than Stokes, post her name.

Gabby, to go along with her high vertical has a VERY high ceiling.

Ekmark can obviously shoot the deep ball and seems to have decent court awareness considering her short time on a big time court.

Right now, Chong is a liability on both ends.

 

[Bigpetunia]

1. Williams: It's fun to watch her development. Unlike her classmate, Nurse, she plays totally like a Freshman, as one should expect, but her innate athleticism is so apparent that she is a virtual "can't miss" to have a huge impactful career here. It's not going to happen overnight, but it will be highly entertaining for all of us to follow her inevitable rise to eventual stardom.

2. Stokes. Clearly the decision to have her come off the bench, and not start, was a wise one. Her inability to consistently finish on great scoring opportunities down low can be terribly frustrating, but for her contributions in rebounding and shot blocking she remains a valuable asset who can give the team a big lift coming off the pine.

3. Ekmark: Her best shot at getting minutes resides in her potential to be a great perimeter shooter, so it was nice to see her connect on a couple, but she's got a long way to go. Hope she gets there.

4. Chong: Confronting inevitable demotion, I'm afraid. Did absolutely nothing to help herself. It's too bad, but let's be honest.

 

[housekeys]

Not only that, if you put Stewart in with the other 4, Stewart won't look that good either. It is easy to point to the 15 pts that Gabby scored and said that she had a great game, but the fact that she scored the points a s a by-product of the spacing of the system with the starters when she was in. Chong on the other hand is looking totally lost.

Excellent point. Starters have the benefit of playing with starters, subs have the benefit of playing with subs, as far as the 'experiment' goes.

 

[hoophuskee]

Obviously Gabby's energy was real good- very nice - very strong play. While posters bring up the spacing why she was successful - it was much more than that. Why was the spacing so good for Gabby yet when Stokes comes in - we can't get her the ball in the low post? And Gabby did have offensive rebounds that she converted I think. WHile Stokes gets an offensive rebound it gets lobbed back outside. With that said Stokes defense still incredible and a very high value player despite what Geno says he can put her in to defend anything inside.

I liked what I saw from CE. She looks like a terrific glue player - but we may have other players that are all-americans that compete for her position. I'm very happy with the little I saw of her. Very happy.

 

[Oldbones]

Good news: Both team's subs got to play a lot in the blowout, with a chance to show their talents

Bad news: Tulsa outscored UConn 28-18 down the stretch. (From 80-32 to 98-60)

 

[UcMiami]

I found it more interesting looking at the effect each starter had on the organization of the offense when playing their minutes with the four bench players - my opinion was that Moriah was the most effective leading them.
As for what you see - Gabby was very effective on the floor with three or four other starters and pretty ineffective when out there with the other three bench players.
Same for Stokes, and I will say that the entry passes she gets are DREADFUL even with the other starters. Hard to score when most of the passes you get lead you right into the defender or the help defender.
Same for Chong in that when she is in with starters she isn't the liability she became with the bench rotation
Hard really to say anything about Ekmark - she is still getting her legs back but at least her shot looks good.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Regarding Courtney Ekmark, I think an appropriate comparison is to Mel Thomas. Good 3-point shooter, not very fast or athletic, had to learn defense, but was smart and put in the effort to learn what the coaches were trying to teach. By her senior year, she was an essential glue player. After her injury, she was really missed.

I don't think Courtney will ever be quick, fast, or acrobatic, but she will be a smart 2-way player who does not make mental errors and can make shots, passes, and backdoor cuts. And she is several inches taller than Mel, which helps a lot.

I'm inclined to agree considering what I've read about her and heard about her. She's a hard working kid and a good shooter who will learn to be a decent defender and with a lot of hustle, she'll definitely fill a role. I think the Mel Thomas injury really came back to bite UConn in the Final Four because her shooting and defense might have made the difference that would have gotten UConn through. Sometimes those intangibles really make all the difference.

 

[hjoerring]

Let me understand the problem here. We had four reserves with one starter and they were expected to play better, no drop off, better then Tulsa (apparently they scored a few more points then Tulsa in the 2nd half). And this is why the coach doesn't play them? I'm not a bb genius, but they are usually big differences bet starters who play 20± mins together every game with subs in between and 5 players who are put in a game together. It's chemistry (and of course talent, but very much chem). I'm sure if these players are elevated to starters and have a pre-season (or if they are allow to play together during conf games) behind them they would play better. We have this Uconn myth that we are sometimes 2 to 3 teams in one and we can send the 2nd or 3rd team in with no drop offs. Heavens. Our starting 5 only began gelling recently and they are not defensively where they could be-- chemistry. This experiment is not the same as him not trusting or knowing what an individual player will give when they are called upon to enter the game with starters. These are of different orders.
Individually, I saw very little to change the general opinion about where this or that player is in their development. Consistency probably cannot be rushed (Nurse is one of those exceptions, but she may also slip a little going forth). Chong? I think she is suffering from the blues over her overall performance, and that is not something she can snap herself out of-- she will probably have to hit the bottom and then rise up. In the meantime it will show itself in concentration, lethargy and bodily comportment (affecting her shots). IMHO. But the talent is there, and I think the team will need her big time at the end.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Let me understand the problem here. We had four reserves with one starter and they were expected to play better, no drop off, better then Tulsa (apparently they scored a few more points then Tulsa in the 2nd half). And this is why the coach doesn't play them? I'm not a bb genius, but they are usually big differences bet starters who play 20± mins together every game with subs in between and 5 players who are put in a game together. It's chemistry (and of course talent, but very much chem). I'm sure if these players are elevated to starters and have a pre-season (or if they are allow to play together during conf games) behind them they would play better. We have this Uconn myth that we are sometimes 2 to 3 teams in one and we can send the 2nd or 3rd team in with no drop offs. Heavens. Our starting 5 only began gelling recently and they are not defensively where they could be-- chemistry. This experiment is not the same as him not trusting or knowing what an individual player will give when they are called upon to enter the game with starters. These are of different orders.
Individually, I saw very little to change the general opinion about where this or that player is in their development. Consistency probably cannot be rushed (Nurse is one of those exceptions, but she may also slip a little going forth). Chong? I think she is suffering from the blues over her overall performance, and that is not something she can snap herself out of-- she will probably have to hit the bottom and then rise up. In the meantime it will show itself in concentration, lethargy and bodily comportment (affecting her shots). IMHO. But the talent is there, and I think the team will need her big time at the end.

You've brought up some good points that I really hadn't put a lot of thought into. You are so right that when you're playing in a game environment with a group of teammates that you haven't really spent any substantial amount of time with, there is surely going to be a lack of cohesion. Chemistry takes a lot of repetition and ordinarily you are apt to be a little (at least) out of sync both offensively and defensively. Well done!

 

[Wbbfan1]

The bench does get to play some together going up against the starting five in practices when the male players aren't available. Even when the male players are available and working with the starting five, the bench players are practicing amongst themselves. As a fan, do I expect a drop off when the bench comes in to play. Of Course I do. However, I do not expect that the drop off is so great, that a team like Tulsa could easily outscore and outplay them.

Last night the team had 84 points with 10:55 left. Team ended up with 98 points. The bench playing with an ocasional starter with them scored 14 points in 10:55. By any standard that's unacceptable. Besides the poor offense, I'm not sure if their defense wasn't worse as they allowed easy baskets. What was also disconcerting that Saniya had a great opportunity to lead the players on the court and run the offense. She didn't do it.

 

[ctfjr]

Geno tried an interesting experiment tonight. With about 15 minutes to go, Geno put four non-starters ( Stokes, Chong, Williams, and Ekmark) in to play together, along with one starter.
Here are some of my observations now, maybe some later when I can see the actual stats.
1. Most important, to me, there is a clear drop off in talent from the starting five. I can see why Geno is reluctant to make a sub. It looked like the second five had trouble staying with Tulsa, which is not saying much.

Individually,
Williams - Best of the four, had a nice bounce back game after only 2 minutes against St. Johns\
Stokes - I don't think she is ever going to be a scorer. Great rebounder and shot blocker, but no offense at all.
Ekmark - Nice three point shot, but I hope she's not just a one dimensional player. Nothing else about her game stood out to me.
Chong - Basically, no confidence at all. Not a great game for her.

Like everyone else, I'm rooting for these four to improve, but I didn't see it tonight ( except Williams).

I would like to read others "objective" observations on Geno's experiment. Right now, I have to reluctantly agree with him. The drop off in talent from the starting five is pretty clear.

I think your comments are right on the mark. No big surprise (but disappointed) that Stokes hasn't stepped up her offensive game. Maybe she really should work on a 3 pt shot. Defenders sag off her so much when she is on the perimeter its almost like 4 on 5.
The conundrum with Chong is she needs more playing time to develop her game. Unfortunately the way things are that isn't going to happen any time soon.
I have a lot of hope for Ekmark. With time she will be a real contributor.

 

[rugbymate]

Our starting five is probably the best passing team in the nation and often there are at least 5 passes before a shot without the ball hitting the floor. Typically all the starters are involved and the tempo is very fast. . But then there is interesting dynamic that comes into play when we have several bench players on the floor. Trying to emulate that style doesn't work. Clearly Kiah and Gabby when in the game together change the effectiveness of the rapid pass, up tempo style. Chong gets it (although she has had some tough games) and the jury is out on CE. More playing time for Gabby will elevate her effectiveness.
Having said that , when Kiah and Gabby are in the game we are a much better rebounding team, particularly on the offensive boards. . In fact, IMO we go from only being a good rebounding team to a great one when they are both on the court.
So the coaching conundrum is do you change the style of play to fit the skills of those currently on the court or do you try to mold all your players into a consistent style of play? They will figure it out.

 

[Striper69]

Our starting five is probably the best passing team in the nation and often there are at least 5 passes before a shot without the ball hitting the floor. Typically all the starters are involved and the tempo is very fast. . But then there is interesting dynamic that comes into play when we have several bench players on the floor. Trying to emulate that style doesn't work. Clearly Kiah and Gabby when in the game together change the effectiveness of the rapid pass, up tempo style. Chong gets it (although she has had some tough games) and the jury is out on CE. More playing time for Gabby will elevate her effectiveness.
Having said that , when Kiah and Gabby are in the game we are a much better rebounding team, particularly on the offensive boards. . In fact, IMO we go from only being a good rebounding team to a great one when they are both on the court.
So the coaching conundrum is do you change the style of play to fit the skills of those currently on the court or do you try to mold all your players into a consistent style of play? They will figure it out.

Depends on who you're playing.

Texas or South Carolina- they'll need Kiah and Gabby in there.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

The bench does get to play some together going up against the starting five in practices when the male players aren't available. Even when the male players are available and working with the starting five, the bench players are practicing amongst themselves. As a fan, do I expect a drop off when the bench comes in to play. Of Course I do. However, I do not expect that the drop off is so great, that a team like Tulsa could easily outscore and outplay them.

Last night the team had 84 points with 10:55 left. Team ended up with 98 points. The bench playing with an ocasional starter with them scored 14 points in 10:55. By any standard that's unacceptable. Besides the poor offense, I'm not sure if their defense wasn't worse as they allowed easy baskets. What was also disconcerting that Saniya had a great opportunity to lead the players on the court and run the offense. She didn't do it.

Spot on Wbb. As this 2d half 2d string experiment began - about 2 minutes in - the thought emerged unbidden: What has Kiah done to deserve this mess! I thought her defense was heroic in the face of the Tulsa bee swarm that beset her. As for her offense - did you not love the sweet little 12 footer she delivered I the first half. She has it in her; if she will just do it enough to draw her defender away from the hoop I'll be very, very happy with Kiah.

As for CE, if you followed her court movement in the first half you saw a player who has grasped UConn court spacing and player movement very well. She had one play where heading back on defense she set up a charge in Tulsa's backcourt which worked, though ref chose to call it an out of bounds off Courtney. She is a savvy player who is not yet in game shape.

As to Saniya: In Geno I trust. I believe that Geno believes with her abilities the "light will go on" at some point in the second half of the season. If it does not, then others will advance around her. I did spend some time following her last night and she had flashes where her defense looked significantly better.

 

[lanieer]

If Saniya doesn't "get it" pretty soon she may be delegated to the bench with others ahead of her. I love the fact that Gabby answered Geno's call and Courtney who is really behind in court time at least was aggressive enough to take some shots. I realize that Courtney is behind in minutes but I have no doubt that she has the confidence to jump ahead of others. There was one game at the beginning of the year that Eckmart was the second one off the bench. I really hope that Saniya gets back to pre-season form. Unfortunatly for me I haven't seen her shine other than the Stanford game that Moriah had a horrible game. I'm rooting for her because she does have the talent but not sure of the confidence.

 

[Striper69]

Chong had a nice drive to the hoop for her 2 pts with about 3 minutes left. But she had made a lazy pass that was easily picked off and taken the other way. Then she was just dribbling at the top the key and a Tulsa player just came up and stole the ball away from her. Chong also had a 5 second violation trying to inbound the ball. Not a good night for her when it was a big chance to shine - inferior opponent and lots of time. A year and a half into her UConn career, some light bulbs should be clicking on by now. Next year we add four players while only losing one from the bench and one from the starting five. Competition for playing time will get tougher next year.

The "lazy" pass was supposed to go to CE. I think she just wanted to get Courtney involved. She needs to be more careful with her passes.

She tried to drive into the middle and they stole the ball from her- it happens. At least she was trying to make something happen but she has to pick her spots better.

The 5 second violation- the other players were just standing around. Not totally her fault.