The Timeout?

[oldude]

No, and it wouldn’t have mattered to me anyway. Would it have bothered you?

Not particularly, but I never much concerned myself with people who didn’t know what they were talking about.

 

[CocoHusky]

Not particularly, but I never much concerned myself with people who didn’t know what they were talking about.

One would never be able to tell that from this thread you started and the 8 paragraphs you wrote to get this pity party started. Christyn Made a mistake, Geno make a mistake- it happens! 8 more paragraphs or attacking the people pointing that out is not going to make it go away.

 

[oldude]

One would never be able to tell that from this thread you started and the 8 paragraphs you wrote to get this pity party started. Christyn Made a mistake, Geno make a mistake- it happens! 8 more paragraphs or attacking the people pointing that out is not going to make it go away.

Not sure what your point is. But if this thread bothers you that much, please feel free to ignore it.

 

[CocoHusky]

Not sure what your point is. But if this thread bothers you that much, please feel free to ignore it.

Here you go suggesting again.

 

[Martin]

They really could have extended the game by fouling. You are down three and the team you’re playing is shooting lights out from three for crying out loud don’t let them take the shot if it goes in game over. Foul them see if they can make free throws when it really matters. Gino gift wrapped that game for Arkansas with his coaching decisions in the last 30 seconds.

 

[BobbyJ]

Not particularly, but I never much concerned myself with people who didn’t know what they were talking about.

Same here.

 

[oldude]

Here you go suggesting again.

Well, if you want to hang around that’s up to you, but I have to tell you, this cut and paste stick is getting old.

 

[CocoHusky]

Well, if you want to hang around that’s up to you, but I have to tell you, this cut and paste stick is getting old.

 

[oldude]

So this is like a thing for you. I guess if you only have the one move, you might as well stick with it.

 

[CocoHusky]

So this is like a thing for you. I guess if you only have the one move, you might as well stick with it.

 

[cbraarj]

As I commented elsewhere, Christyn was not the only UConn player on the court who could have glanced at the shot clock and called for a timeout.

This is really a moot point. The close games in the last few years they just weren't prepared for. Dating back to the Stanford game in 2014. UConn has been so dominate my question is. How much situational basketball does the team work on?

 

[oldude]

This is really a moot point. The close games in the last few years they just weren't prepared for. Dating back to the Stanford game in 2015. UConn has been so dominate my question is. How much situational basketball does the team work on?

I think it depends on the players each year. I know the Huskies work on end of game situations in practice, but there is something to be said about having faced the fire before in real games.

For instance, Arkansas has been involved in no less than 6 x two or less possession games this season prior to the UConn game. 3 of those games were against ranked teams and Arkansas was 4 & 2 overall in those games, including a win vs Baylor.

So when it came to crunch time, Arkansas had been there a lot more than UConn this season, and it showed down the stretch.

 

[MD#12Fan]

This is really a moot point. The close games in the last few years they just weren't prepared for. Dating back to the Stanford game in 2015. UConn has been so dominate my question is. How much situational basketball does the team work on?

Good teams and coaches spend the end of practice on it everyday. If you watched the HBO series, it showed the team working on situations.

 

[Alydar]

Last night I, and many other BY’ers, assumed that Christyn should have called a timeout immediately after securing a rebound with a little over 3 seconds left in the game in order for UConn to advance the ball to half court and draw up a last play to tie the game. Some have also suggested that the bench or Christyn’s teammates could have called the timeout.

At that point in the game, a timeout was certainly warranted and everyone on UConn could have called it immediately, but didn’t. Why not? Listening to Geno’s take after the game, the answer is a little more complicated.

The first question put to Geno in the postgame presser was about that play. At first he said, “It was going to be a timeout.” But he went on to say, “We talked about it in the huddle and if there was enough time it was going to be a breakaway.” If I understand what Geno was getting at it sounds like he may have overcoached the situation.

The initial thought appears to be that if Arkansas took a shot with enough time on the clock, UConn would not call timeout, but would push the ball up the court with a much better opportunity to get an open look from the arc. This makes sense. But the problem was that AR is an experienced, well coached team that was not going to take a shot until the last possible second. In fact it was so close to the shot clock expiration that the referees really couldn’t tell on the replay, and they ended up sticking with the call on the floor, that the AR player had released the shot before the shot clock expired.

That being the case, Plan B was for UConn to call timeout immediately. The problem with this two-tiered plan is that it puts enormous responsibility on the players on the court, specifically Christyn, to play tough defense, box out, secure the rebound and be aware of exactly how much time was left on the clock to be able to determine whether to push the ball up the court or immediately call timeout.

I know UConn has some really intelligent basketball players but that’s a lot to put on a player at the end of an intense game. So I for one don’t hold Christyn responsible. Geno needed to keep it simple. “Get the rebound and call timeout.”

With that said, one play doesn’t determine whether you win or lose the game, and there was no guarantee that if UConn had immediately called a timeout they would have been able to knock down a 3 to tie the game....and they still would have needed to win it in OT.

Geno is the one who should have called TO. But those officials .... If it was Neighbors' team an official would have been standing right next to him, ready to blow a whistle. Shame on Geno for not being ready.

 

[cbraarj]

Good teams and coaches spend the end of practice on it everyday. If you watched the HBO series, it showed the team working on situations.

Then how come they have stunk at it for a while now. Don't question anyone on what they watched because have watched alot of film of Genos teams and applied alot of it to my teams when I coached! When you see that caliber of a program make terrible plays at the end of games on a consistent basis. Guess what, the players weren't getting it or not getting enough practice in those situations.

 

[cbraarj]

I think it depends on the players each year. I know the Huskies work on end of game situations in practice, but there is something to be said about having faced the fire before in real games.

For instance, Arkansas has been involved in no less than 6 x two or less possession games this season prior to the UConn game. 3 of those games were against ranked teams and Arkansas was 4 & 2 overall in those games, including a win vs Baylor.

So when it came to crunch time, Arkansas had been there a lot more than UConn this season, and it showed down the stretch.

Example on how they don't get it. Stanford 2014. UConn needs a last shot so who do you have pushing it up the floor? Answer would have been Moriah and you set screens for KML and Stewie to hopefully take the last shot but it ended with Kaleena bringing it up with no last shot taken. They practice against the guys so saying it's not real game is an excuse especially for a team that supposedly goes over all the little details for everything.

 

[oldude]

Example on how they don't get it. Stanford 2014. UConn needs a last shot so who do you have pushing it up the floor? Answer would have been Moriah and you set screens for KML and Stewie to hopefully take the last shot but it ended with Kaleena bringing it up with no last shot taken. They practice against the guys so saying it's not real game is an excuse especially for a team that supposedly goes over all the little details for everything.

You point back to 2014. That was an entirely different group of players than the team that just lost to Arkansas, playing their 2nd game of the season on the road against a very good Stanford team. That UConn team only lost that one game, went on to win the National Championship and didn’t lose again the entire season thereafter and the year after that the Huskies didn’t lose until the National semifinal. In the process UConn set the all time consecutive winning record for WBB.

As for practice, it doesn’t matter if UConn practices against the Seattle Storm, there is something different about doing it during the pressure of a real game, and through the years, UConn has had precious few games that game down to the last possession, precisely because they executed their offense & defense down the stretch.

During the 2016-17 season there were at least 3 regular season games that were back and forth that could have gone either way: Baylor, ND & SC. In all 3 games, UConn’s 4th qtr execution at both ends of the court was exceptional, so they never came down to a last possession.

This year’s team may not have executed down the stretch vs Arkansas, but how about looking at the TN game. In the last minute of a one possession game, UConn used the entire shot clock passing the ball around the perimeter against TN’s zone until E fired a pass to an open Paige to knock down the 3 that put the game out of reach.

Most teams come up short during end of game situations when they are behind. UConn has had so few of them, that we as fans tend to overemphasize their significance. Consider, if you will, that the game you are focused on took place over 6 years ago.

 

[CajunHusky]

They should've been playing a very aggressive defense ... force a turnover at the inbounds or foul which would not necessarily have hurt. Arkansas didn't need to score they just needed to run out the shot clock - three seconds or less which is what they did.

 

[MD#12Fan]

They should've been playing a very aggressive defense ... force a turnover at the inbounds or foul which would not necessarily have hurt. Arkansas didn't need to score they just needed to run out the shot clock - three seconds or less which is what they did.

I agree.
2 schools of thought. IMO you can argue for both.
1 way- what they did. Trust your D to get a stop and use the 4 remaining seconds to tie the game. They score, game over. We muffed that 4 seconds as has been covered ad nauseum.
2nd way- lengthen the game by fouling, sending them to the line. So we do that and they hit one of 2 FT's, now we're down 2 possessions. Gotta keep fouling, hoping for misses, and you have to convert on our end. They make their FT's it's over anyway, we miss on our end it's over anyway. A lot has to go right.
Depends on the game and who you're playing. We weren't getting many stops which to me would have made you inclined to foul and lengthen the game. Plus they had missed FT's. (Geno showed some trust in his defense. Too bad we muffed the 4 seconds we had left)

 

[cbraarj]

You point back to 2014. That was an entirely different group of players than the team that just lost to Arkansas, playing their 2nd game of the season on the road against a very good Stanford team. That UConn team only lost that one game, went on to win the National Championship and didn’t lose again the entire season thereafter and the year after that the Huskies didn’t lose until the National semifinal. In the process UConn set the all time consecutive winning record for WBB.

As for practice, it doesn’t matter if UConn practices against the Seattle Storm, there is something different about doing it during the pressure of a real game, and through the years, UConn has had precious few games that game down to the last possession, precisely because they executed their offense & defense down the stretch.

During the 2016-17 season there were at least 3 regular season games that were back and forth that could have gone either way: Baylor, ND & SC. In all 3 games, UConn’s 4th qtr execution at both ends of the court was exceptional, so they never came down to a last possession.

This year’s team may not have executed down the stretch vs Arkansas, but how about looking at the TN game. In the last minute of a one possession game, UConn used the entire shot clock passing the ball around the perimeter against TN’s zone until E fired a pass to an open Paige to knock down the 3 that put the game out of reach.

Most teams come up short during end of game situations when they are behind. UConn has had so few of them, that we as fans tend to overemphasize their significance. Consider, if you will, that the game you are focused on took place over 6 years ago.

I was talking about end of game plays. It doesn't matter who did it in 2014. Crunch time plays Stanford 2014 slowest player bringing it up the court didn't get a shot off! 2017 Chong takes it to the hoop shoots an airball from 10 feet. It's been a pattern for a while. As far as Paiges shot that was great but it was at the end of the shot clock made by UConns 2 best players ( Paige and Evina ). Paige was open and nailed it!
Here you go on one rants with a history like nobody on the boneyard doesn't know already. Which you do when you don't like someones opinion.

 

[oldude]

I was talking about end of game plays. It doesn't matter who did it in 2014. Crunch time plays Stanford 2014 slowest player bringing it up the court didn't get a shot off! 2017 Chong takes it to the hoop shoots an airball from 10 feet. It's been a pattern for a while. As far as Paiges shot that was great but it was at the end of the shot clock made by UConns 2 best players ( Paige and Evina ). Paige was open and nailed it!
Here you go on one rants with a history like nobody on the boneyard doesn't know already. Which you do when you don't like someones opinion.

My point is simply that in the past 10 years or 5 years or whatever period of time you want to look at, there have been very few UConn games that go down to the last possession. It’s not like the NBA where every game seems to go down to the last possession and game winning shots are about as frequent as a windy day in Chicago.

The other point I would make is that around WCBB, there are very few game winning shots made by anyone. Ogunbowle’s 2 FF game winners for ND in 2018 were extraordinarily unique.

 

[MD#12Fan]

My point is simply that in the past 10 years or 5 years or whatever period of time you want to look at, there have been very few UConn games that go down to the last possession. It’s not like the NBA where every game seems to go down to the last possession and game winning shots are about as frequent as a windy day in Chicago.

The other point I would make is that around WCBB, there are very few game winning shots made by anyone. Ogunbowle’s 2 FF game winners for ND in 2018 were extraordinarily unique.

I think this is a great topic. No matter how rare, it only takes one of these to derail your season. (Duh) The Final Four losses recently were all "end-of-game" scenarios. Did we like Gabby's off balance jumper in the lane? When we were coming back against Arkansas, did we like all the shots we were taking?
I actually think we do pretty darn good with end-of-quarter situations. It's not that much different end-of-game.
I think Geno takes advantage of all scoring opportunities. We got at least 3 layups today off out-of-bounds plays. We got a fast break layup off the opening jump ball. That's 8 points right there.
You practice all this stuff. What a coach like Geno does, is he gives the first 5 a situation, like say, down 5 with a minute to go. You use the clock and play out the scenario. Different things come up each time. You change the scenario. 30 minutes at the end of practice? In my day, with no clock, everyone had a stall/4-corners for the end of the game. You practiced that.
When I'm coaching, I practice OB plays all practice long. I'll start a sequence with a side OB play or OB under, etc. Or start a sequence with a free throw.
Obviously you also draw up plays during TOs. For example, they have practiced side OB plays 1000 times. You might have 4-5 plays for each setup. Game situations are also unique to the game you're playing and the personnel.
One more point: the more experienced and smart your team is, the more time in practice you have to work on situations. If you cannot stop dribble drive- kick against a good offensive team, unfortunately fixing that takes a lot of time out of a practice.

 

[oldude]

I think this is a great topic. No matter how rare, it only takes one of these to derail your season. (Duh) The Final Four losses recently were all "end-of-game" scenarios. Did we like Gabby's off balance jumper in the lane? When we were coming back against Arkansas, did we like all the shots we were taking?
I actually think we do pretty darn good with end-of-quarter situations. It's not that much different end-of-game.
I think Geno takes advantage of all scoring opportunities. We got at least 3 layups today off out-of-bounds plays. We got a fast break layup off the opening jump ball. That's 8 points right there.
You practice all this stuff. What a coach like Geno does, is he gives the first 5 a situation, like say, down 5 with a minute to go. You use the clock and play out the scenario. Different things come up each time. You change the scenario. 30 minutes at the end of practice? In my day, with no clock, everyone had a stall/4-corners for the end of the game. You practiced that.
When I'm coaching, I practice OB plays all practice long. I'll start a sequence with a side OB play or OB under, etc. Or start a sequence with a free throw.
Obviously you also draw up plays during TOs. For example, they have practiced side OB plays 1000 times. You might have 4-5 plays for each setup. Game situations are also unique to the game you're playing and the personnel.
One more point: the more experienced and smart your team is, the more time in practice you have to work on situations. If you cannot stop dribble drive- kick against a good offensive team, unfortunately fixing that takes a lot of time out of a practice.

You made my other point. That if you execute throughout the game, it’s seldom necessary to execute on the last possession to win the game.

While it didn’t matter to the ultimate outcome today, I’m sure UConn saw that DePaul doesn’t drop a defender back on the opening jump ball, so the Huskies ran one the most basic plays in the book by releasing E on the wing with Liv getting the tap to Paige who passed to E for the easiest assist of the game.

 

[cbraarj]

My point is simply that in the past 10 years or 5 years or whatever period of time you want to look at, there have been very few UConn games that go down to the last possession. It’s not like the NBA where every game seems to go down to the last possession and game winning shots are about as frequent as a windy day in Chicago.

The other point I would make is that around WCBB, there are very few game winning shots made by anyone. Ogunbowle’s 2 FF game winners for ND in 2018 were extraordinarily unique.

My point because how dominate they have been in the last 12 years and probably further. They don't spend as much time on those plays because Geno and CD usually practice it so the players don't get it wrong instead of just getting it right. With them even crushing top 10 teams until the last 3 years. IMO getting complacent with that part of the game could be easy. Especially during the 2009-2018 seasons because no team was safe except NDs 7-1 run against them. Even the best coaches get complacent.

 

[MD#12Fan]

You made my other point. That if you execute throughout the game, it’s seldom necessary to execute on the last possession to win the game.

While it didn’t matter to the ultimate outcome today, I’m sure UConn saw that DePaul doesn’t drop a defender back on the opening jump ball, so the Huskies ran one the most basic plays in the book by releasing E on the wing with Liv getting the tap to Paige for the easiest assist of the game.

100%
Coaching here in bush Alaska, most of the young men are short, except they have long limbs and explosiveness. My center (5'11") last year could sky and also direct the ball. We tried our best to score on the opening tap every game. It gives you "an attitude" to be aggressive right from the jump, like PB likes to say.

 

[oldude]

My point because how dominate they have been in the last 12 years and probably further. They don't spend as much time on those plays because Geno and CD usually practice it so the players don't get it wrong instead of just getting it right. With them even crushing top 10 teams until the last 3 years. IMO getting complacent with that part of the game could be easy. Especially during the 2009-2018 seasons because no team was safe except NDs 7-1 run against them. Even the best coaches get complacent.

All that I can say is that UConn does work on end of game situations in practice frequently, notwithstanding the fact that they may have come up short a few times through the years.

 

[Skeets]

All that I can say is that UConn does work on end of game situations in practice frequently, notwithstanding the fact that they may have come up short a few times through the years.

If a timeout was called immediately after the rebound at most it would be 2 or 3 seconds on the clock. Not a good situation. FWI, it looked like both on the floor and GA were trying to call the TO, but it was a little late in coming from the zebras. Should never get in that situation...

 

[HuskylnSC]

The good thing is, "We won't do that again!" I hope.