The pump fake, dribble drive, travel

[ucbart]

I need someone to explain to me how almost every stepback jumper is never a travel, but that pump fake, dribble drive is a travel almost every single time? When did the rule change on a stepback jumper? I think that travel creates so much separation from a defender; far more than than the pump fake, dribble drive. Somehow though, the one off the dribble, going backward, is a legal move, but the one going forward, which gives almost no advantage to the offensive player, is a travel every time.

We get called for that pump fake travel A LOT and have for quite a few years.

 

[oldude]

I need someone to explain to me how almost every stepback jumper is never a travel, but that pump fake, dribble drive is a travel almost every single time? When did the rule change on a stepback jumper? I think that travel creates so much separation from a defender; far more than than the pump fake, dribble drive. Somehow though, the one off the dribble, going backward, is a legal move, but the one going forward, which gives almost no advantage to the offensive player, is a travel every time.

We get called for that pump fake travel A LOT and have for quite a few years.

It is annoying, to be sure. It’s all about picking up your pivot foot and putting it back down before you dribble the ball. But the best players (think Paige) will pump fake and then initiate their dribble a split second before they pick up and put down their pivot foot.

 

[BobbyJ]

I need someone to explain to me how almost every stepback jumper is never a travel, but that pump fake, dribble drive is a travel almost every single time? When did the rule change on a stepback jumper? I think that travel creates so much separation from a defender; far more than than the pump fake, dribble drive. Somehow though, the one off the dribble, going backward, is a legal move, but the one going forward, which gives almost no advantage to the offensive player, is a travel every time.

We get called for that pump fake travel A LOT and have for quite a few years.

 

[WiseWillie]

I need someone to explain to me how almost every stepback jumper is never a travel, but that pump fake, dribble drive is a travel almost every single time? When did the rule change on a stepback jumper? I think that travel creates so much separation from a defender; far more than than the pump fake, dribble drive. Somehow though, the one off the dribble, going backward, is a legal move, but the one going forward, which gives almost no advantage to the offensive player, is a travel every time.

We get called for that pump fake travel A LOT and have for quite a few years.

 

[TheGOAT23]

Most of the time players will pump fake then shuffle their feet before dribbling. Shade was called for this violation at least twice yesterday. She was a little p’ed off by one of the calls. I refuse to even have a convo about the step back. Not all of them are violations, but some are just an atrocity. 🙄

 

[WiseWillie]

A pump fake followed by a dribble drive is called a travel if the pivot foot is lifted BEFORE starting the dribble. A pump fake and then continuing to move forward by dribbling is not traveling as long as the dribble is initiated AFTER a pump fake WITHOUT lifting the pivot foot or by establishing a new pivot foot before driving. Also if dribbling, stopping and then dribbling and driving again is a travel. The problem some of us have if watching a high school or college game versus the NBA is the latitude given in the pros for traveling calls. They are hardly ever called.

What I am finding also questionable lately is the non-calls for moving picks. Opposing players setting picks on the perimeter are almost always moving their hips or even their legs into the guarding player but yet hardly are ever called. All you need to do is think back to the Final Four call against Ailiyah when she was stationary yet moved her hip ever so slightly into the Iowa player and it was called. (I know. It's over so let it be. I bring it up only to show how things seem to have changed. Better or worse? Good question that I'll let others opine upon.)

 

[ucbart]

I know why its a travel, that's not why I'm asking. I want to know why one travel is called EVERY TIME and the other travel(the step back), which is much more egregious and creates a bigger advantage, is not? If we aren't calling one travel that's so blatant, why is the one that's less blatant, whistled every time?

 

[LwrcasefaN]

Pump…dribble (ball makes contact with the court) …now you can move the pivot. It’s the dribble part where the ball HAS NOT contacted the court and the feet are moved that bites players. Having said that…traveling is on the rise. It’s replaced…head and shoulder fakes and to some extent the hesitation dribble to create space or more favorable driving paths. Evolution is never a straight line. 😆

 

[DemonDeac22]

After the number of calls for this, especially when they were pushing the ball up court, Geno has something important for the team to focus on in practice this week. They left a lot of points on the table yesterday.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

I know why its a travel, that's not why I'm asking. I want to know why one travel is called EVERY TIME and the other travel(the step back), which is much more egregious and creates a bigger advantage, is not? If we aren't calling one travel that's so blatant, why is the one that's less blatant, whistled every time?

I’ve seen step backs that were travels, but if done correctly…it isn’t a travel.

 

[TheGOAT23]

I know why its a travel, that's not why I'm asking. I want to know why one travel is called EVERY TIME and the other travel(the step back), which is much more egregious and creates a bigger advantage, is not? If we aren't calling one travel that's so blatant, why is the one that's less blatant, whistled every time?

I believe that they changed the rules over the summer regarding the step back, if I’m not mistaken.

 

[Bigboote]

What I am finding also questionable lately is the non-calls for moving picks. Opposing players setting picks on the perimeter are almost always moving their hips or even their legs into the guarding player but yet hardly are ever called. All you need to do is think back to the Final Four call against Ailiyah when she was stationary yet moved her hip ever so slightly into the Iowa player and it was called. (I know. It's over so let it be. I bring it up only to show how things seem to have changed. Better or worse? Good question that I'll let others opine upon.)

Young Kitts got called for at least two yesterday. She really got her money's worth on the first one, which absolutely leveled Heckel and was really obvious.

 

[Basingstoke]

Young Kitts got called for at least two yesterday. She really got her money's worth on the first one, which absolutely leveled Heckel and was really obvious.

To my mind she also skated when she set a pick (I think on Kayleigh) and then extended her arm which really impeded Kayleigh, allowing Cambridge an easy foul line jump shot.

 

[BBallF]

It is annoying, to be sure. It’s all about picking up your pivot foot and putting it back down before you dribble the ball. But the best players (think Paige) will pump fake and then initiate their dribble a split second before they pick up and put down their pivot foot.

Blanca and Ash each move both feet after receiving the ball. At that point, you have to pass or shoot. If you receive the ball without moving your feet la Paige, you can do what you want. As you say, don't fake with your feet but with the ball or your eyes.

 

[WiseWillie]

Surprised that there are not more injuries from illegal picks. They are particularly noticeable and potentially injurious when an opposing player, most often a 5'7"-5'9"guard, gets blind sided and flattened usually by a larger and heavier 6'1"-6'3" F or 6'4"- 6'6" C who hip checks or deliberately moves into their field of motion. These are worrisome to any coach as the smaller guard either gets whacked or backs off. I for one would like to see more infractions of this kind called.

 

[BBallF]

A pump fake followed by a dribble drive is called a travel if the pivot foot is lifted BEFORE starting the dribble. A pump fake and then continuing to move forward by dribbling is not traveling as long as the dribble is initiated AFTER a pump fake WITHOUT lifting the pivot foot or by establishing a new pivot foot before driving. Also if dribbling, stopping and then dribbling and driving again is a travel. The problem some of us have if watching a high school or college game versus the NBA is the latitude given in the pros for traveling calls. They are hardly ever called.

What I am finding also questionable lately is the non-calls for moving picks. Opposing players setting picks on the perimeter are almost always moving their hips or even their legs into the guarding player but yet hardly are ever called. All you need to do is think back to the Final Four call against Ailiyah when she was stationary yet moved her hip ever so slightly into the Iowa player and it was called. (I know. It's over so let it be. I bring it up only to show how things seem to have changed. Better or worse? Good question that I'll let others opine upon.)

Worse. It will cause injuries if allowed. Kayleigh got belted yesterday on one of them. it's not basketball. The principle of verticality was developed because the area on the court is limited and there are 10 players occupying a small area. It's allowed perhaps this year because setting a pick is a lost art. Think John Stockton- Karl Malone. The true pick and roll is basketball's unstoppable play. The pick is stationary or at least supposed to be so it is up to the dribbler to rub his man off the pick not for the pick to move.

 

[FanSince17]

Worse. It will cause injuries if allowed. Kayleigh got belted yesterday on one of them. it's not basketball. The principle of verticality was developed because the area on the court is limited and there are 10 players occupying a small area. It's allowed perhaps this year because setting a pick is a lost art. Think John Stockton- Karl Malone. The true pick and roll is basketball's unstoppable play. The pick is stationary or at least supposed to be so it is up to the dribbler to rub his man off the pick not for the pick to move.

Nice one! So much of the responsibility is on the ballhandler using the screen properly. Faster isn't always better. Wait for the screen.
BTW I think UConn overall is pretty darn good at screening, considering the amount of high post action employed, plus even the guards are tough.

 

[BBallF]

Nice one! So much of the responsibility is on the ballhandler using the screen properly. Faster isn't always better. Wait for the screen.
BTW I think UConn overall is pretty darn good at screening, considering the amount of high post action employed, plus even the guards are tough.

I agree. Screener can't move into the defender. It's that simple.

 

[ucmiami2]

While we are talking about changing standards (or (s)lacking standards) might as well mention the never called carry while dribbling! If they called the rule old school, it would turn into a game of turnovers because almost every modern dribble is a carry, even when the player is just bring the ball up court without any pressure. 😎

 

[FanFromMaine]

While we are talking about changing standards (or (s)lacking standards) might as well mention the never called carry while dribbling! If they called the rule old school, it would turn into a game of turnovers because almost every modern dribble is a carry, even when the player is just bring the ball up court without any pressure. 😎

For those a bit older, Billy Packer must be rolling in his grave. I remember a men’s game in the early ‘90s where he was apoplectic about Chris Smith carrying the ball.

 

[JoePgh]

On a somewhat related rules question, the female announcer in the Ohio State - UConn game made a comment about an offensive foul that had just been called (it might have been on Blanca). She said that the offensive player "left her feet, which allows the defense to move in front of her and establish position" (to take a charge).

I believe this is 100% incorrect. I have always heard that a defender on a drive must establish his/her position BEFORE the offensive player starts his/her shooting motion, and leaving one's feet certainly implies that the offensive player has started his/her shooting motion. So if the defender moves into position to take contact after that, the foul is on the defender -- it is a block and not a charge.

Or is this the rule only in the NBA? I've heard that explanation most often while watching NBA games. But it makes perfect sense -- an offensive player who has started a shooting motion cannot change direction to avoid a defender who moves in front of him/her, so he/she should not be called for a charging foul. Is this the rule in WCBB also?

 

[stamfordhusky]

Pump…dribble (ball makes contact with the court) …now you can move the pivot. It’s the dribble part where the ball HAS NOT contacted the court and the feet are moved that bites players. Having said that…traveling is on the rise. It’s replaced…head and shoulder fakes and to some extent the hesitation dribble to create space or more favorable driving paths. Evolution is never a straight line. 😆

Actually, you can move the foot as soon as the ball leaves your hand to begin the dribble. You don’t have to wait until it hits the court.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Different, but maybe in the same vein. I will never stop thinking the Euro step is a travel. Every time. I keep hearing people say "It's not," but my eyes tell me differently.

 

[BBallF]

Actually, you can move the foot as soon as the ball leaves your hand to begin the dribble. You don’t have to wait until it hits the court.

Ash and also Blanca and K9 took the step first and then began to dribble. In other words, they are doing what they would ordinarily do if they had not moved both feet before. If you ball or eye fake, you don't move your feet. Most of the time this happens when the player sets up for an outside shot only realizing that there is a clear path to the basket and then they begin a drive with a step not a dribble. Shoot the 3.

 

[Rowdy831]

To me if you allow the Euro step then you should throw out any travel unless it is 4 or 5 steps toward the basket. Almost every Euro as they are done now is a travel but are never called regardless of how improper they are executed. The step back on the other hand is legal as long as it is a step back, not a "hop" back. But again this travel is almost never called.

To me the officiating is so poor overall that they could completely remove the travel from the rule book and focus on just contact fouls and I would be fine.