The Official Big East is Poverty Thread

[John]

What school are you a fan of?

don't worry if Xavier folds, we can invite a barn-burner big time athletic department school like St Louis

 

[Kolumbo]

It costs $40 million, minimum, to field a P4 bowl caliber football team, and a playoff caliber team is well over $50 million. Football sucks every spare nickel out of most athletic programs and booster clubs.

On the flip side is the total economic impact of having a FBS caliber football team.

Everyone is feeling the pinch. Even the poor big ten programs

 

[KryHavok]

On the flip side is the total economic impact of having a FBS caliber football team.

Everyone is feeling the pinch. Even the poor big ten programs

Isn't that not so ducking sad? LMAO, if they had such financial hardships to lose players to the portal, maybe they could ask Nike to donate to a NIL fund instead of coming up with those ducking ugly atrocious uniforms week after week...it's like the team isn't comfortable in its own feathers. I can't wait for players to be cut mid-season cuz their NIL evaluation was off, after all, if the players want to paid like employees, then they should be subjected to employment at will. Poor performance = no place on the team, so bye bye NIL.

 

[uconnyankee]

don't worry if Xavier folds, we can invite a barn-burner big time athletic department school like St Louis

I would like to add Dayton and St Louis to Big East now.
We need more depth in the league.
Gonzaga and St Marys was a miss IMO.

Instead of being proactive and going after some key adds, it seems BE leadership is simply laying low and hoping nothing else happens to further weaken league.

 

[JwittersPAC]

What school are you a fan of?

I am a fan of UConn. A state university. By the way what does that matter Val when we are discussing which school has a greater chance of going under - Xavier or University of Kentucky?

 

[nelsonmuntz]

don't worry if Xavier folds, we can invite a barn-burner big time athletic department school like St Louis

WAIT....We have been invited to the Big 10? SEC? Big 12? ACC? No? Oh, you just want to post the same complaint about the Big East that you have been making for 10+ years. For future reference, just assume that we already know.

 

[Hoophound]

I would like to add Dayton and St Louis to Big East now.
We need more depth in the league.
Gonzaga and St Marys was a miss IMO.

Instead of being proactive and going after some key adds, it seems BE leadership is simply laying low and hoping nothing else happens to further weaken league.

It is more likely that they would move to the Big East and then stink. Then we'd have to live with the mistake. What we need is for the schools with the coaches and resources available to deliver results. We should have UCONN, SJU, Providence, Nova and Marquette in the tourney most years. Creighton should be there too, but let's sea about the coaching change.

I'd rather teach Shaka how to work the portal or Willard how to land a 5* than hope and pray that Dayton and St Louis can solve our problems.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I am a fan of UConn. A state university. By the way what does that matter Val when we are discussing which school has a greater chance of going under - Xavier or University of Kentucky?

You made it a choice. I have posted several times in this thread that Xavier is in big trouble. So you saying that I don't think Xavier is in trouble means that you are: A) Stupid, or B) deliberately lying. I think it is a little of both, but mostly B.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I would like to add Dayton and St Louis to Big East now.
We need more depth in the league.
Gonzaga and St Marys was a miss IMO.

Instead of being proactive and going after some key adds, it seems BE leadership is simply laying low and hoping nothing else happens to further weaken league.

I like St. Louis a lot more than Dayton because it is a bigger city with less competition for fans. If there is a seismic change in college athletics in the next few years, then adding one or both won't matter to the Big East. If there is not a seismic change in college athletics in the next few years, then adding one or both won't matter to the Big East. I am pretty much indifferent.

 

[John]

You made it a choice. I have posted several times in this thread that Xavier is in big trouble. So you saying that I don't think Xavier is in trouble means that you are: A) Stupid, or B) deliberately lying. I think it is a little of both, but mostly B.

out of the P4+1, which conference do you think is most at risk for school failures?

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

league stinks

 

[Kolumbo]

Welp, so much for Hampshire College

Hampshire College closure leaves students, alumni heartbroken

Hampshire College’s board of trustees has announced that the college will be closing at the end of the year.

www.westernmassnews.com

 

[KryHavok]

Welp, so much for Hampshire College

Hampshire College closure leaves students, alumni heartbroken

Hampshire College’s board of trustees has announced that the college will be closing at the end of the year.

www.westernmassnews.com

Whoa, small school. My high school had more kids, and we actually 2 high schools in my city. Sucks for the students there. Gotta wonder if they priced themselves out: $63K for tuition, $10K for housing, $7K for food...for a tiny liberal arts school?!!? Maybe we'll see a documentary on their decline by their famous alumnus Ken Burns.

 

[JwittersPAC]

You made it a choice. I have posted several times in this thread that Xavier is in big trouble. So you saying that I don't think Xavier is in trouble means that you are: A) Stupid, or B) deliberately lying. I think it is a little of both, but mostly B.

you are evading the question. All I stated was Xavier has a much greater chance of folding than a school that is backed by a state government like University of Kentucky. Can you answer the question?

 

[Kolumbo]

Whoa, small school. My high school had more kids, and we actually 2 high schools in my city. Sucks for the students there. Gotta wonder if they priced themselves out: $63K for tuition, $10K for housing, $7K for food...for a tiny liberal arts school?!!? Maybe we'll see a documentary on their decline by their famous alumnus Ken Burns.

It's a very unique institution and philosophy. Very small and students can more or less create their own majors. Not surprised it is folding.

 

[Chuck]

out of the P4+1, which conference do you think is most at risk for school failures?

I know you guys are just arguing with Nelson, but it's clearly the Big East that has the best chance of a school failure. Flagship universities (including Kentucky and even West Virginia) won't fail. There will be consolidation of state schools, but not the large P4 institutions. Penn State is already consolidating, and some of the SUNY's that exist are ridiculous. I'd expect "directional" schools in a lot of states will be consolidated.

The private schools in the P4 are all pretty strong institutions, regardless of sports. The Big East is more vulnerable because of the type of institutions in the conference. In general, Catholic schools have mediocre endowments and financial condition (with some exceptions). Interestingly, if you look at the Forbes College Financial Grades, Xavier wasn't in bad financial shape at the time of the rankings in 2025.

• Butler C- which starts to get risky (only one step to D which is the group of schools that are close to failing).
• St. John's and Seton Hall get C+s.
• Xavier, Providence, Marquette get B-s which is fine.
• Georgetown has a B+ which is okay, but somewhat weak based on its academic standing.
• Creighton and Villanova get A-s which is very strong.

Patriot League (other than Loyola of Maryland which doesn't quite fit) and NESCAC schools are all in good shape.

Things can change quickly though so Xavier has to be careful with its enrollment hit. Hampshire had a C on the last publication. U New Haven and U Hartford have D grades.

 

[jostar1]

On the flip side is the total economic impact of having a FBS caliber football team.

Everyone is feeling the pinch. Even the poor big ten programs

Well, UConn is funding an FBS football team, too...with nothing.

Oregon receives a half-share from the Big Ten ($49.1 million), and the Ducks will continue to receive less than its fellow conference members, besides Washington, until 2030. Cry me a river.

 

[jostar1]

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I know you guys are just arguing with Nelson, but it's clearly the Big East that has the best chance of a school failure. Flagship universities (including Kentucky and even West Virginia) won't fail. There will be consolidation of state schools, but not the large P4 institutions. Penn State is already consolidating, and some of the SUNY's that exist are ridiculous. I'd expect "directional" schools in a lot of states will be consolidated.

The private schools in the P4 are all pretty strong institutions, regardless of sports. The Big East is more vulnerable because of the type of institutions in the conference. In general, Catholic schools have mediocre endowments and financial condition (with some exceptions). Interestingly, if you look at the Forbes College Financial Grades, Xavier wasn't in bad financial shape at the time of the rankings in 2025.

• Butler C- which starts to get risky (only one step to D which is the group of schools that are close to failing).
• St. John's and Seton Hall get C+s.
• Xavier, Providence, Marquette get B-s which is fine.
• Georgetown has a B+ which is okay, but somewhat weak based on its academic standing.
• Creighton and Villanova get A-s which is very strong.

Patriot League (other than Loyola of Maryland which doesn't quite fit) and NESCAC schools are all in good shape.

Things can change quickly though so Xavier has to be careful with its enrollment hit. Hampshire had a C on the last publication. U New Haven and U Hartford have D grades.

WVU has effectively already failed, needing unexpected, significant cuts during a semester, and the trend is bad. These flagships are reaching the limit of what the states are willing to fund. BTW, UConn is pretty vulnerable because it gets a relatively high percentage of its funding from the state. We are in a little better shape than many of the others because the school is still attractive academically. The open admissions schools are in a tough spot long term, because why pay $45k+ for a school like that when there is a local branch that costs much less.

Forbes is very endowment focused, and doesn’t address the demographic cliff and enrollment issues at all.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

out of the P4+1, which conference do you think is most at risk for school failures?

It won’t be a failure exactly, but it will be massive cutbacks which will make the school very different.

It will be school to school, not a whole conference in trouble. WVU is not going to make it as a major university. Mississippi State and Oklahoma State are two others, although OSU has some wealthy alumni.

As I have said before, the prestige universities are not all on board with becoming minor league sports teams. BCU and Syracuse don’t seem to be trying. Why would they?

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Well, UConn is funding an FBS football team, too...with nothing.

Oregon receives a half-share from the Big Ten ($49.1 million), and the Ducks will continue to receive less than its fellow conference members, besides Washington, until 2030. Cry me a river.

Every nickel of revenue was spoken for before the House settlement. Just because a program has revenue doesn’t mean it has to spend it on the athletic program.

 

[SinBin]

Dancing Queens?

Killer Queens?

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Every university is going to look at deep cost cuts, and overhaul how teaching is actually performed. Education is overdue for an overhaul.

It will be interesting to see the impact of AI. It would seem to have lots of applications in areas like grading, for example, but the long-term costs are so uncertain that many are reluctant to commit to the large LLMs because their pricing is going to have to go way up at some point. Like 500% to 1000% or possibly even larger increases. The LLMs can not afford to lose billions of dollars a month forever.

 

[ecasadoSBU]

When its all said and done... the Big East will probably be the fourth of fifth best league in the country next year. Where it has been the past few years. Nothing has changed.

 

[John]

It won’t be a failure exactly, but it will be massive cutbacks which will make the school very different.

It will be school to school, not a whole conference in trouble. WVU is not going to make it as a major university. Mississippi State and Oklahoma State are two others, although OSU has some wealthy alumni.

As I have said before, the prestige universities are not all on board with becoming minor league sports teams. BCU and Syracuse don’t seem to be trying. Why would they?

out of the P4+1, which conference do you think is most at risk for massive school downgrades?

 

[Rufus]

I would like to add Dayton and St Louis to Big East now.
We need more depth in the league.
Gonzaga and St Marys was a miss IMO.

Instead of being proactive and going after some key adds, it seems BE leadership is simply laying low and hoping nothing else happens to further weaken league.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

out of the P4+1, which conference do you think is most at risk for massive school downgrades?

The Big 10 is safe. The new schools are west coast and not facing the population cliff that the Midwest is facing. The core schools are all pretty good. Michigan, Illinois and Ohio have over capacity in public higher education, but the MAC schools are going to bear the brunt of those cuts.

The ACC is in good shape, with the caveat that I don’t see most of the private and prestige schools even trying to be competitive. I think one of UConn’s obstacles with this league is that half of it doesn’t care about getting better.

The Big 12 and SEC have challenges. The southern states are growing, but a few of the schools are cash starved and close to open admissions. The big state schools like Florida and Georgia are in good shape, but some of the others have challenges. You are seeing it on the field/court already.

 

[John]

The Big 10 is safe. The new schools are west coast and not facing the population cliff that the Midwest is facing. The core schools are all pretty good. Michigan, Illinois and Ohio have over capacity in public higher education, but the MAC schools are going to bear the brunt of those cuts.

The ACC is in good shape, with the caveat that I don’t see most of the private and prestige schools even trying to be competitive. I think one of UConn’s obstacles with this league is that half of it doesn’t care about getting better.

The Big 12 and SEC have challenges. The southern states are growing, but a few of the schools are cash starved and close to open admissions. The big state schools like Florida and Georgia are in good shape, but some of the others have challenges. You are seeing it on the field/court already.

what about the Big East?

 

[Rufus]

The Big 10 is safe. The new schools are west coast and not facing the population cliff that the Midwest is facing. The core schools are all pretty good. Michigan, Illinois and Ohio have over capacity in public higher education, but the MAC schools are going to bear the brunt of those cuts.

Plenty of schools will be hurt before the MAC schools. The many small, unranked private institutions are at the top of the list. And then there are public universities that are not D1 football schools that would be next in line, such as Wright State in Ohio.

Buffalo is AAU. Not going anywhere.

Ohio, Kent State, Toledo, and UMass are R1 universities. Not going anywhere.

Miami is a Public Ivy. Not going anywhere.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

what about the Big East?

Already covered. Xavier has to merge. Butler probably does too. Seton Hall has a path as long as they don't do anything stupid. After that, the rest should be fine for the next 10 years.