the escalator is for cowards

[8893]

I think Manuel felt he had to put his foot down and show he's the boss. But I agree with you.

I don't think it will cripple Ollie's recruiting efforts. Did you guys hear him today? He'll have recruits running through brick walls. He's going to succeed by getting kids and their families to BELIEVE in him. If he can convince them that he's going to succeed, then I really don't think they'll be worried about his contract. (And as HooperScooper pointed out above, aren't all coaches vulnerable to termination if the AD doesn't like the job they're doing?)

We're in a better position recruiting than we were yesterday, IMO, one-year deal or not.

Can't forget that this will be Manuel's first year in HIS new job too. He's using the one year contract as HIS out, in the unlikely event that Kevin shows he has more to learn about coaching. I don't believe that will be the case, as I feel he will be very successful. I think Manual is sold on Ollie...he is so positive and determined to succeed! Manuel just needs to see that his first year of actual game coaching is at least respectably decent.

The other thing that the one year will do is allow Manuel to make the decision to affirm Ollie as coach after the season, with no significant influence from JC. In that way...it will be solely Manuel's decision!

IMO, that was the wrong place to put his foot down. You can always buy out the second year, and you know that the buy-in here is not expensive. You give him a two year deal because that is the classy, confident and right thing to do in this situation. It's obviously his call, but I am surprised by it. It looks bush-league to me.

And after today, I'm thinking that Kevin may well make him pay for that mistake. Not by way of vengeance; but by way of exceeding expectations, making himself an instant national commodity, winning our hearts sooner than expected, and thereby making Manuel have to pay a premium to lock him up. That's my hope, at least.

 

[CL82]

The majority of the posters in this forum bleed husky blue. The biggest debate in this forum is whether KO's lack of experience is a problem or not.

I didn't have any other concerns until my wife offered an opinion. It basically translates to this: there are people who are not passionate about men's bb, or worse, people who love the University and dislike the notoriety of the men's program. In this latter category I would include fans of other sports who are envious of the bb program. Also there are people only interested in academics. These people will primarily focus on the APR issue and express the need to bolster the image of the University - a front to their real agenda of wanting men's bb to become unimportant. And among some of them there could be a concern that KO's communication is a detriment to this goal. They will never express it, not in this day and age. They would find a politically acceptable problem when insisting his contract not be renewed.

Shortly after she expressed this opinion, Jay Bilas in his commentary about JC stated the sport lost the last of his kind. He said JC was a blue collar coach who spoke it like it was, whether it should have been spoken or not. He said with all the money in college sports the trend has changed to a "corporate image" of coaches. So the big question isn't just whether KO can coach but can he coach and demonstrate the "corporate image" for UConn?

Depends on who you think his target audience is. I think KO comes across as being very real, very genuine, very humble and very hard working. That is a pretty compelling "image". I, for one, much prefer that to the slick, Calipari/Pitino types.

 

[TheChamps990411]

with his college and nba experience i truly believe ko can coach at this level. i also believe he can bring in the recruits to keep this program elite. my only question and it can only be answered by experience is does he have the intangibles as a coach that the great ones have. that "it" factor.
i dont think ward manuel is sold on ko he has a lets just see attitude. if he really believed in ko he`d have stood up and said this is our guy and he will be here for atleast the next two years and many more after that.
imo i think ko is going to be a big time coach and a big time winner at uconn for decades to come. let the coach ollie era begin.

 

[Kitaman]

I knew KO would fire people up. And I loved his answer to Katz's question about the 7-month contract.

How did others feel about Manuel's statement on the 1-year deal? He convinced me that he genuinely wants Ollie to succeed and is giving him a real chance. I don't think we're going to win a lot of games this year but I don't think that's how Ollie will be judged. All Kevin has to do is run a clean program, maintain the respect of his players, and maybe make some inroads in recruiting, and he'll get a longer contract.

Good points. I'm not fretting the one year contract. He will get an extension basically on your conditions. He just didn't have the head coaching experience and Manuel made the PC move, with Hobbs on the bench and with JC in his ear. He just needs to show he can coach.

Is one year enough? No, but when one looks at Kevin's character, its more than enough for him.

Towards the end of next season I hear the fans chanting (and loudly) "We want Ollie" or "4 more years" which will be more intimidating, believe it or not, than Calhoun Manuel's ear. He will get an extension, of at least 4 years (coaching his recruits). I'm willing to bet on it.

 

[4UConn]

I think Manuel felt he had to put his foot down and show he's the boss. But I agree with you.

I don't think it will cripple Ollie's recruiting efforts. Did you guys hear him today? He'll have recruits running through brick walls. He's going to succeed by getting kids and their families to BELIEVE in him. If he can convince them that he's going to succeed, then I really don't think they'll be worried about his contract. (And as HooperScooper pointed out above, aren't all coaches vulnerable to termination if the AD doesn't like the job they're doing?)

We're in a better position recruiting than we were yesterday, IMO, one-year deal or not.

One thing that came though crystal clear to me watching that press conference is that Ward Manuel is the BOSS.

 

[upstater]

I think Manuel felt he had to put his foot down and show he's the boss. But I agree with you.

I don't think it will cripple Ollie's recruiting efforts. Did you guys hear him today? He'll have recruits running through brick walls. He's going to succeed by getting kids and their families to BELIEVE in him. If he can convince them that he's going to succeed, then I really don't think they'll be worried about his contract. (And as HooperScooper pointed out above, aren't all coaches vulnerable to termination if the AD doesn't like the job they're doing?)

We're in a better position recruiting than we were yesterday, IMO, one-year deal or not.

All coaches are vulnerable to termination by AD. Usually, the AD doesn't show he doesn't have faith in the coach when he's hired.

 

[upstater]

I believe that Manuel decided to forego the search for one year, if not for a much longer period! This was the compromise that he, Herbst and JC reached! You can just hear JC saying something like....Look...just give him one year to show that he has it ... and you too will be a believer!! I believe Herbst and Manuel bought in. Recall all the thank yous that Ollie bestowed on them at the presser as well! It just makes too much sense.

If it doesn't work out, then Manual can assemble his search committee next year. After all, he has to protect HIS reputation as the new AD as well. All you have to do is to look up to Amherst to see what happens when you appoint a loyal assistant who has never coached..following the departure of someone highly successful and give him an extended contract right off the bat. Bruiser wasn't able to handle it...and the program fell into obscurity! This is Manuel's insurance policy, but he'll never have to use it...because IMO, KO WILL succeed!!

I can give a flying fig less about Manuel's reputation. Who cares?

 

[upstater]

with his college and nba experience i truly believe ko can coach at this level. i also believe he can bring in the recruits to keep this program elite. my only question and it can only be answered by experience is does he have the intangibles as a coach that the great ones have. that "it" factor.
i dont think ward manuel is sold on ko he has a lets just see attitude. if he really believed in ko he`d have stood up and said this is our guy and he will be here for atleast the next two years and many more after that.
imo i think ko is going to be a big time coach and a big time winner at uconn for decades to come. let the coach ollie era begin.

The AD should not have an "I'm not sold" attitude. It's not part of the job description.

 

[nomar]

So, Upstater, just so we're clear, are you happy with Warde Manuel or not?

 

[mets1090]

Here's how I look at it. It's pretty clear this is a 1 year try out for the head coaching position. He will likely not be judge by W-L because of the overall situation (no post-season and all that nonsense) but by recruiting and general in game management. Therefore, if he walks into recruits living rooms and says hey they're going to extend me if I do a good job recruiting (which I believe they will) then they will know that the act of them signing with the Huskies will in itself ensure Ollie is still around. And if they don't sign they don't care what happens to Ollie. So really it's a moot point.

Other coaches can throw out the "coaching instability" line but it's obvious that Ollie will be extended if he recruits well and isn't a disaster of an in game coach. And if he is a disaster of an in game coach then recruits won't sign anyways. So it all kinda shakes itself out.

 

[HuskyV]

Didn't see the presser. But this is making the best of it. UConn gets a supportive JC & KO gets an extended audition. KO has shown to be a solid recruiter. If KO & the team represent well he will have a 3-4 year extension before Presidents Day.

JC gets chooses his successor & WM gets to hire his coach. There is no upside for WM to offer a 3-4 yer contract.

If it deos not work out with KO he is able to openup a national search at the optimal time for hiring. Which big time coach is going to take the job at this time without JC support & probably unable to get his half his staff to join him.

 

[UConnSwag11]

watching this uconn vs duke game with ollie running the point, you guys think ollie is going to have the guys pushing the ball like he did and uconn back then? maybe even press since were guard heavy this year??

 

[2Infinity]

Didn't see the presser. But this is making the best of it. UConn gets a supportive JC & KO gets an extended audition. KO has shown to be a solid recruiter. If KO & the team represent well he will have a 3-4 year extension before Presidents Day.

JC gets chooses his successor & WM gets to hire his coach. There is no upside for WM to offer a 3-4 yer contract.

If it deos not work out with KO he is able to openup a national search at the optimal time for hiring. Which big time coach is going to take the job at this time without JC support & probably unable to get his half his staff to join him.

That is it HuskyV! You hit all the relevant points! The additional bonus is that JC gets to keep all of his assistants employed as well...at least for another season and hopefully more. Upstater doesn't seem to understand that WM could easily have not agreed to this and decided that he was going to open this up to a national search. Any program of UConn's stature would almost always make such a move. Allowing KO this opportunity for one year, was a way that all parties, including Susan H., could be happy. Next year, it will be WM's decision, but KO will very likely have sold him by that time.

WM giving KO a 3-4 year contract at this point, with no head coaching experience, would have been silly. All you need to do is look at UMass and what happened there after Calipari left...Bruiser Flint just wasn't up to the challenge!

 

[John Fryer]

Agree with you on Kevin.

I'm mixed on Manuel. I want to believe him, but I just don't see what the downside would have been to giving Kevin at least a two year contract, with the understanding that we would buy the second and send him packing if things go horribly wrong and he is determined not to have done a good enough job to keep it.

IMO, the one year contract has more to do with the AD, President and BG re-establishing the fact that control of the Men's Basketball program belongs to the UConn.

It isn't the private fiefdom of any coach just because he might be a legend.

Peace,

John Fryer

 

[upstater]

So, Upstater, just so we're clear, are you happy with Warde Manuel or not?

Whether I'm happy or not, I tend to disagree with most that ADs are the power brokers. Maybe it's from seeing what goes on at other schools with ADs that have too much power. At UConn, and in much of the northeast, this isn't the case, and that's good. ADs should be the ultimate arbiters of how the program is run, keeping it clean, etc. When it comes to expertise, however, they should defer. Inside universities, people always defer to others when hiring decisions are made, according to expertise. In cases when the candidate is clearly an , that's the only time an expert's recommendation is unheeded.

My biggest concern is what this does for recruiting.

 

[upstater]

IMO, the one year contract has more to do with the AD, President and BG re-establishing the fact that control of the Men's Basketball program belongs to the UConn.

It isn't the private fiefdom of any coach just because he might be a legend.

Peace,

John Fryer

And that's good. If they don't this up.

 

[Excalibur]

ADs should be the ultimate arbiters of how the program is run, keeping it clean, etc. When it comes to expertise, however, they should defer. Inside universities, people always defer to others when hiring decisions are made, according to expertise.

Because coaches have done such a good job historically in picking their successor . . . .

 

[upstater]

Because coaches have done such a good job historically in picking their successor . . . .

Yeah, Izzo sucks.

ADs always do a great job too!

 

[Excalibur]

Yeah, Izzo sucks.

ADs always do a great job too!

The coach and AD were in complete agreement on Izzo, who had 15 years of coaching experience.

 

[upstater]

The coach and AD were in complete agreement on Izzo, who had 15 years of coaching experience.

So, it was was coaching experience then. Billy Donovan was hired after a couple as assistant, and two bad to mediocre years at Marshall. He spent years playing before that though, just like Kevin Ollie.

I'm not going to get into a study of bad hires like Guthrie, because one could easily do a study of bad hires of HCs by big programs as well, and the results would be similar, I bet. Lots of bad choices given both contexts. It would be a waste of time.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

After watching the Ollie speech from the press conference it has eased some of my main concerns going forward.

While I can't comment on how his head coaching ability will be, the one thing I can say for sure is that I know Kevin Ollie will give us everything he has and more. KO has been a part of the UConn family and truly gets what Jim Calhoun and UConn Basketball is all about. Those two things are highly important to me and I'm not sure an outsider can fully appreciate the magnitude of UConn Basketball to the school, coaches, players, fans and alums.

Will Ollie work out for UConn? Nobody knows, but I feel a lot more comfortable giving the first crack at post-Calhoun UConn to someone already in the family.

 

[caw]

Is it really shocking to anyone that there are tons and tons of examples of failures in hiring coaches? There are very few great coaches and only a handful at the level of Calhoun (literally if you go by NC's won). The odds are not in UConn's favor.

Very few programs don't go through some pain finding the next great coach, let alone legendary coach. Using NCAA championships as the criteria (which UConn's fanbase likes to do), I think is a good illustrator of what I mean.

14 Schools with multiple NCAA championships, you have 4 categories:

Found their coach "smoothly":

1. Michigan State went from Heathcoat to long time assistant Izzo, though it took 21 years from the first to the second and Izzo was in his 5th year
2. UK actually stands out for it's ability to find coaches who are able to win, they went from Rupp (4) to Assistant Hall (1) to HC elswhere Sutton (0) to NBA HC Pitino (1) to HC elsewhere Smith (1) to HC elsewhere Gillespie (0) to HC elsewhere Calipari (1).

Eventually found another coach to win a national championship:

1. UCLA took about five coaches to get another NC after Wooden and is on #2 after Harrick (maybe soon at #3)
2. UNC took three from Smith to Williams, though went straight from McGuire to Smith
3. Indiana is on number 4 after Knight and had 3 coaches between McCracken and Knight
4. Kansas went through 3 between Allen and Brown but only 1 between Brown and Self, which isn't bad
5. NC State is at #4 after Valvano, though they did get from Sloan to Valvano

Still waiting:

1. Cincy is at #7 since it won a NC
2. OK State is on #7
3. San Fran. - it's been awhile.
4. UL has only gone from Crum to Pitino (11 years so far at UL)

Hasn't replaced NC coach yet, or successor has yet to coach:

1. Duke
2. Florida
3. UConn

Of the single time winners you have two categories:


Still waiting:

1. Maryland (2002) on it's first replacement
2. Arizona (1997) on it's 3rd with Miller
3. Arkansas (1994) on it's 3rd with Anderson
4. UNLV (1990) on it's 7th or 8th coach, I lost track
5. Michigan (1989) on it's 3rd coach
6. Villanova (1985) on it's 2nd coach after Rollie
7. Georgetown (1984) two already after Thompson
8. Marquette (1977) on #7
9. I refuse to go further back, but you get the idea

Hasn't replaced NC coach yet:

1. Syracuse (2003)

If someone asks why I don't expect a NC every year, or from the next coach, this is why. It's extremely rare and very few schools are lucky enough to have two coaches win a NC let alone after the previous NC coach left. You have UK, NCState, MSU and UNC. UK has done it twice.

I hope Ollie can pull UConn up to that level, but it's not an easy feat.