The Chicken or The Egg? | The Boneyard

The Chicken or The Egg?

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Which came first?

I think we're all in agreement that our offensive line play has been atrocious.
So, is it they are so bad because of the coaching?
Or is it that our play calling been horrific beacuse of our line?
 
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How about they do not have FBS talent despite all the teaching and instruction. Not everyone coming from high school FB has the ability to progress and/or perform at the highest level of CFB. The same individuals may excel at Div. 1-aa, II, or III.

No different than any of us. Not everyone with a degree has the aptitude or skills to become a V.P. or Pres. of a company, but may excel as a mid level manager, if that is their inclination.
 
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How about they do not have FBS talent despite all the teaching and instruction. Not everyone coming from high school FB has the ability to progress and/or perform at the highest level of CFB. The same individuals may excel at Div. 1-aa, II, or III.

No different than any of us. Not everyone with a degree has the aptitude or skills to become a V.P. or Pres. of a company, but may excel as a mid level manager, if that is their inclination.
Completely disagree. This is the common wisdom approach. They said the same thing about P when he had 11 future NFL players on his team. There is lots of talent on this team. It is just not being used right and the personnel decision are atrocious.
 
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Completely disagree. This is the common wisdom approach. They said the same thing about P when he had 11 future NFL players on his team. There is lots of talent on this team. It is just not being used right and the personnel decision are atrocious.

O.k., I double dare you. How much would you like to bet that there have not been eleven huskies on the field this year who are going to the NFL? And why in the world do you think that the players HCRE recruited have anything to do with this year's problems. You understand that very few teams anywhere near our level had that number.
 

FfldCntyFan

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O.k., I double dare you. How much would you like to bet that there have not been eleven huskies on the field this year who are going to the NFL? And why in the world do you think that the players HCRE recruited have anything to do with this year's problems. You understand that very few teams anywhere near our level had that number.
Yeah but do you double dog dare him?

 
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We don't have the lineman or tight ends to run a power offense. We do have the receivers and now have elusive backs to run a spread offense. We have our QB take snaps under center, play fake then drop back and turn around and YIKES! Scrambled eggs. You make the call.
 
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Completely disagree. This is the common wisdom approach. They said the same thing about P when he had 11 future NFL players on his team. There is lots of talent on this team. It is just not being used right and the personnel decision are atrocious.
Give me a break. If there is NFL talent on this OL they will be in the NFL after they leave UCONN. The over/under is 0.0.

PP ruined the team. Edsall left him NFL talent and he wasted it. Diaco needs time to get 5 guys who can play Division 1-A football.
 

sdhusky

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O.k., I double dare you. How much would you like to bet that there have not been eleven huskies on the field this year who are going to the NFL? And why in the world do you think that the players HCRE recruited have anything to do with this year's problems. You understand that very few teams anywhere near our level had that number.

There could be more than we think.

The problem is they might be frosh, red shirts and sophs in many cases..
 
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Which came first?

I think we're all in agreement that our offensive line play has been atrocious.
So, is it they are so bad because of the coaching?
Or is it that our play calling been horrific beacuse of our line?
Completely disagree. This is the common wisdom approach. They said the same thing about P when he had 11 future NFL players on his team. There is lots of talent on this team. It is just not being used right and the personnel decision are atrocious.

Pal....I "liked" your post only because it harkens something along the lines of .....what would be your "coaching" decision if you had the coaching reins.?

When I first saw this OP, I thought it was going to be about corrections needed in the first year of a turnaround project. IMO, many of us are getting tired of seeing the same rehash being posted by here of what caused this mess. We all know it started years ago with bad administrative decisions. IMO, I'd rather look to a different OP chicken or egg in correcting this mess:
1) Do you burn redshirts and get them game experience when you know the season is going nowhere?
2)do you increase your travel budget and get 2 assistant coaches and graduate assistants out on the road now to look at prospects and begin the hard sell recruiting now...if possible? What do NCAA guidelines allow us to do NOW??
3)do you go after good JUCO prospects...HARD-right now ?
4)do you go JUCO route to build depth or try to build from within?
5)how do you keep the present group of young players (18 & 19 y.o) motivated to keep on improving when they hear some the boos coming from the stands?{and you're 19 y.o and working your off}.
6)how do you keep interest up with a pretty smart UCONN fanbase? how do you build a fanbase when you know the product isn't where you want it to be?
7)How do you build up interest on campus for a losing program (knowing you won't see them at the SMU game because of exams but the cynical interpretation is that the students aren't here so they don't give a s$44**....)?
8) Winning solves problems. How far down to you take the program without hurting the core of all the above but still build for the future.?? (UCF & Oleary took it down to a winless first year).
9) How do you build confidence in young players and a young QB knowing they have but little opportunity to perform due to limited potential of certain "recruited" teammates and lack of depth up front??.
10) Are the D2 players recruited capable of being "coached up" or do I go with youth??

To get to the promised land will take time. Very easy to be cynical. What would you do to correct, get the EGG and hatch it or buy the chicken and hope it brings the beef...or maybe a little of both if the COOP is big enough?

THANK GOD FOR THE BYE WEEK!!!
 

FfldCntyFan

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Pal....I "liked" your post only because it harkens something along the lines of .....what would be your "coaching" decision if you had the coaching reins.?

When I first saw this OP, I thought it was going to be about corrections needed in the first year of a turnaround project. IMO, many of us are getting tired of seeing the same rehash being posted by here of what caused this mess. We all know it started years ago with bad administrative decisions. IMO, I'd rather look to a different OP chicken or egg in correcting this mess:

3)do you go after good JUCO prospects...HARD-right now ?
I doubt that there will be more JUCO's under this regime than there were under Edsall. If the right kid (not a JUCO due to academics) arises, he'll get a look (doesn't mean he'll take the offer), if not, we won't waste much effort.
4)do you go JUCO route to build depth or try to build from within?
See above. We will build from within even if it takes a bit more time than some of us will like.
6)how do you keep interest up with a pretty smart UCONN fanbase? how do you build a fanbase when you know the product isn't where you want it to be?
Have you seen some of the threads on this board? It may be a bit of a stretch to call this a pretty smart fanbase.
8) Winning solves problems. How far down to you take the program without hurting the core of all the above but still build for the future.?? (UCF & Oleary took it down to a winless first year).
I wish all posters on this board would look at the above. We've heard from early last season (evidently UCF didn't exist before their win against Louisville) how great a job O'Leary was doing. We need to realizer that it takes time.
9) How do you build confidence in young players and a young QB knowing they have but little opportunity to perform due to limited potential of certain "recruited" teammates and lack of depth up front??.
All anyone needed to do to understand what poor offensive line play can do to an offense was watch last night's Chiefs-Patriots game. I personally don't believe that Brady is now a terrible QB or that Bellichick can no longer coach.
10) Are the D2 players recruited capable of being "coached up" or do I go with youth??
1 - Shy of a few walkons they are not D2 players. 2 - There have even been some top 50 recruits at major programs who couldn't get coached up. On the whole these kids should improve. It just may not happen as qucikly as some here want.

To get to the promised land will take time. Very easy to be cynical. What would you do to correct, get the EGG and hatch it or buy the chicken and hope it brings the beef...or maybe a little of both if the COOP is big enough?

THANK GOD FOR THE BYE WEEK!!!
 
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We don't have the lineman or tight ends to run a power offense. We do have the receivers and now have elusive backs to run a spread offense. We have our QB take snaps under center, play fake then drop back and turn around and YIKES! Scrambled eggs. You make the call.

The best summary of the problem I have seen so far.
 
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There could be more than we think.

The problem is they might be frosh, red shirts and sophs in many cases..

Right. But the point is, the fact that P sucked with a lot of NFL players on his roster doesn'tmean HCBD has a lot of NFL players on his roster. It doesn't matter for purposes of this year how many redshirting frosh go on to the NFL. But I dare anyone to point to 11 players on this roster who are reasonable candidates to play on Sunday. And then back it up with green.
 

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I think there is some talent on this team. If Pasqualoni was such a terrible recruiter, how come the defense doesn't suck too? If there was any semblance of an offense, I don't think any team other than BYU would have scored 3 TD's on UConn.
 
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I think there is some talent on this team. If Pasqualoni was such a terrible recruiter, how come the defense doesn't suck too? If there was any semblance of an offense, I don't think any team other than BYU would have scored 3 TD's on UConn.

I think there's some, too, although very little of it is up front on offense and that makes us look incompetent offensively no matter who is under center. Also, not to state the obvious, but we're doing things that bad teams do. If you look at the numbers, last week's game against Temple was a wash. If you look at the scoreboard, it was a blowout. We just make some pretty painful mistakes, many in the first half, and we're not good enough to come back from them.

Can these mistakes be corrected? I don't know, but I do know that Davis is the best offensive player we've had since Todman, that Newsome and Johnson (and perhaps Marriner) have the potential to be very, very good, that Foxx has great speed and that I like our TEs (even if we don't know how to use them yet).
 

SubbaBub

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I think the talent argument only gets you to a certain depth of suck. There has to be a coaching component to what we are seeing.

None of our opponents to date have outstanding or even average talent, yet they don't have our problems.

Getting blown out and overrun by top 25 teams is one thing. Having the same thing happen against the bottom quartile of teams is something else entirely. These kids weren't picked up off the street. They have played FB before, some even at the college 1A level with marginally better results.
 
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I think there is some talent on this team. If Pasqualoni was such a terrible recruiter, how come the defense doesn't suck too? If there was any semblance of an offense, I don't think any team other than BYU would have scored 3 TD's on UConn.
Because the D is loaded with 10-12 4th and 5th year players that get alot of the playing time and those were recruited by Edsall
 
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Since the moment he got here P tried to get transfer, JC and 5th year eligibility OL and his only get was Mateas. You have 2 staffs that were/are telling you something.
 

UConnDan97

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Because the D is loaded with 10-12 4th and 5th year players that get alot of the playing time and those were recruited by Edsall

By my count, here are the players that were recruited by Edsall on the D 2-deep:

Adeyemi, McBryde, Frank, Vann, Jones, Adams. So, 6 players. Mind you, they are 6 high-impact players, but 6 of the 22 are Edsall's.

Campenni, Ashiru, Stewart, Obi, Jh. Williams, Summers, Floyd, Marder, Green, Myers, Fatukasi, Ormsby, Hicks, Stapleton, Carrezola, Joseph (16 players) are Pasqualoni's.

Look, Pasqualoni sucked as a head coach. Nobody will argue that. But the majority of the 2-deep are his recruits...
 
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By my count, here are the players that were recruited by Edsall on the D 2-deep:

Adeyemi, McBryde, Frank, Vann, Jones, Adams. So, 6 players. Mind you, they are 6 high-impact players, but 6 of the 22 are Edsall's.

Campenni, Ashiru, Stewart, Obi, Jh. Williams, Summers, Floyd, Marder, Green, Myers, Fatukasi, Ormsby, Hicks, Stapleton, Carrezola, Joseph (16 players) are Pasqualoni's.

Look, Pasqualoni sucked as a head coach. Nobody will argue that. But the majority of the 2-deep are his recruits...
Of course they are because they are the upper classmen on this team. You'd expect them to be the majority of the 2-deep. I have to admit that I have never witnessed an offensive line that was this bad, though, regardless of the coach. It is just awful. It is awful against good teams like BYU. It is awful against not good teams like USF. It is awful against FCS teams. And while there are some young players, there are some veterans, too. Mateas, Cruz, Gifford, Samra all have at least some experience but it doesn't seem to show. You have to wonder if at least a part of it is coaching. We don't seem to have an offensive philosophy that maximizes what strengths we have right now either. The last time our offensive line even approached this level of ineptitude was back in the first transition season...and maybe not even then.
 

CL82

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The thing about an OL is that it only takes one guy making a mistake to make it look awful and it can be a different guy ever time. I think that's what we're seeing. Sometimes that guy hasn't even been on the line with the tight ends or young running backs failing to pick up the pressure.

Still it's on the coaches to fix that. It's one thing to be out muscled but another to have blown assignments.
 
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I'm going with the egg.

The scheme does make the problem worse, as does a QB who runs into trouble as often as he runs out of it. I think the OL is better than they have shown.
 
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