Taking a look back at the HoopGurlz 2016 Recruiting Class Rankings | The Boneyard

Taking a look back at the HoopGurlz 2016 Recruiting Class Rankings

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As we get closer to the 2016 class beginning their senior season, I'll take a stab at 5 overrated prospects and 11 underrated 2016 prospects (Link to the rankings: 2016 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN)

11 Underrated Prospects:
- Sabrina Ionescu
- Ruthy Hebard
- Bella Alarie
- Mikiah Herbert-Harrigan
- Chelsea Dungee
- Aari McDonald
- Amber Smith
- Kathleen Doyle
- Kat Tudor
- Erika Ogwumike
- Brittany Brewer

5 Overrated Prospects:
- Erin Boley
- Sierra Campisano
- Valerie Higgins
- Natalie Chou
- A'Tyanna Gaulden

I left Joyner Holmes off, but she could very easily be added.

The overrated is a little bit harder, all 5 of my selections have transferred, but I just felt they haven't really lived up to their hype. Some of them are solid role players though.
 
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nwhoopfan

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More underrated...

oops, I was gonna add several but you already had them on the list, somehow I missed them on the first glance. I would say Mikayla Pivec though, she's had a better career than quite a few of the players that were ranked higher.




overrated...

Amber Ramirez
Alecia Sutton
those 2 haven't been bad, but for as highly ranked as they were...

Anna Wilson (she's had a series of injuries, but just hasn't had much impact)

Honestly, probably at least 1/4 of the players on the list I'd have to say "Who?" Either because they play at a school that gets no exposure, or they've had virtually no impact at all as far as I'm aware.
 
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As we get closer to the 2016 class beginning their senior season, I'll take a stab at 5 overrated prospects and 11 underrated 2016 prospects (Link to the rankings: 2016 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN)

11 Underrated Prospects:
- Sabrina Ionescu
- Ruthy Hebard
- Bella Alarie
- Mikiah Herbert-Harrigan
- Chelsea Dungee
- Aari McDonald
- Amber Smith
- Kathleen Doyle
- Kat Tudor
- Erika Ogwumike
- Brittany Brewer

5 Overrated Prospects:
- Erin Boley
- Sierra Campisano
- Valerie Higgins
- Natalie Chou
- A'Tyanna Gaulden

I left Joyner Holmes off, but she could very easily be added.

The overrated is a little bit harder, all 5 of my selections have transferred, but I just felt they haven't really lived up to their hype. Some of them are solid role players though.
Agree with all of it except Valerie Higgins. She's very very talented and did well last year being double teamed all the time with no supporting cast. Things will be different this year. I think they get a big transfer from Louisville.
 
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Agree with all of it except Valerie Higgins. She's very very talented and did well last year being double teamed all the time with no supporting cast. Things will be different this year. I think they get a big transfer from Louisville.
Did not realize how well she played at Pacific. But yeah, they added Loretta Kakala, so it should be a much better year.
 

nwhoopfan

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Amber Melgoza from Washington isn't even on this top 100 list. She's better than several of the players ranked in the top 20. Recruiting is definitely an inexact science.
 

bballnut90

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As we get closer to the 2016 class beginning their senior season, I'll take a stab at 5 overrated prospects and 11 underrated 2016 prospects (Link to the rankings: 2016 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN)

11 Underrated Prospects:
- Sabrina Ionescu
- Ruthy Hebard
- Bella Alarie
- Mikiah Herbert-Harrigan
- Chelsea Dungee
- Aari McDonald
- Amber Smith
- Kathleen Doyle
- Kat Tudor
- Erika Ogwumike
- Brittany Brewer

5 Overrated Prospects:
- Erin Boley
- Sierra Campisano
- Valerie Higgins
- Natalie Chou
- A'Tyanna Gaulden

I left Joyner Holmes off, but she could very easily be added.

The overrated is a little bit harder, all 5 of my selections have transferred, but I just felt they haven't really lived up to their hype. Some of them are solid role players though.

Boley had a good sophomore year but I thought she'd be more of a go to threat than just a 3pt specialist at this point. At this point I'd agree with her being overrated at 5.

Chou was buried on a deep roster for 2 years, I think she could make a big impact at UCLA this year. Really pretty stroke.

Holmes I'd put in the overrated bunch. Or maybe label her as underproducing since I don't think she was overrated as a freshman.

Herbert-Harrigan is underrated at 72.

Kaila Charles also underrated.
 

Carnac

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Agree with all of it except Valerie Higgins. She's very very talented and did well last year being double teamed all the time with no supporting cast. Things will be different this year. I think they get a big transfer from Louisville.

I saw Higgins 3 times. Twice in HS, once during her freshman year at USC. She is an above average player who simply chose the wrong college. USC was in turmoil at the time. She was Pacific’s best and most consistent player last year. I followed her closely last year as Pacific has a special place in my heart. My son played for Bob Thomason (men’s basketball) at Pacific in the 90’s.
 
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If you re-ranked the class I suspect the top 15 would look like this:
1. Sabrina Ionescu
2.Lauren Cox
3. Jackie Young
4.Kaila Charles
5. Crystal Dangerfield
6. Ruthy Hebard
7. Ty Harris
8.Mikayla Pivec
9.DiJonai Carrington
10. Destiny Slocum
11. KiKi Herbert-Harrigan
12. Sug Sutton
13. Stephanie Jones
14. Juicy Landrum
15. Joyner Holmes/ Erin Boley
 

bballnut90

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If you re-ranked the class I suspect the top 15 would look like this:
1. Sabrina Ionescu
2.Lauren Cox
3. Jackie Young
4.Kaila Charles
5. Crystal Dangerfield
6. Ruthy Hebard
7. Ty Harris
8.Mikayla Pivec
9.DiJonai Carrington
10. Destiny Slocum
11. KiKi Herbert-Harrigan
12. Sug Sutton
13. Stephanie Jones
14. Juicy Landrum
15. Joyner Holmes/ Erin Boley

Harris wouldn't be that high. Slocum would be higher too. Other big names are missing like Dungee and Alarie.
 
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Harris wouldn't be that high. Slocum would be higher too. Other big names are missing like Dungee and Alarie.

I forgot Alarie and Dungee, but you could argue Harris is a top 3 PG in the country. I would put both Alarie and Dungee in the top 15 though.
 

bballnut90

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I forgot Alarie and Dungee, but you could argue Harris is a top 3 PG in the country. I would put both Alarie and Dungee in the top 15 though.

I'm not sure youd get a whole lot of support with that argument. Off hand I'd say Slocum, Williams (Stanford), Ionescu, and Dangerfield are all clearly better at this point. I'd also rank Sutton ahead of her and probably several others once the season pans out.
 
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I'm not sure youd get a whole lot of support with that argument. Off hand I'd say Slocum, Williams (Stanford), Ionescu, and Dangerfield are all clearly better at this point. I'd also rank Sutton ahead of her and probably several others once the season pans out.

Based on what exactly? Even though Ionescu won the Lieberman award I don’t consider her a PG but I think she and Dangerfield are the only ones I would consider better. Yes some of those players are better scorers but when you consider A/TO ratio and game management their are very few who are better than Harris. She doesn’t only effect the game with her passing but she’s also a way better defender than most of the players you mentioned. She’s the SEC’s active leader in steals and assists and probably has more career assists than them all except Ionescu. I may be a little biased but in terms of a pure PG she fits the bill.
 

CamrnCrz1974

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As we get closer to the 2016 class beginning their senior season, I'll take a stab at 5 overrated prospects and 11 underrated 2016 prospects (Link to the rankings: 2016 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN)
The overrated is a little bit harder, all 5 of my selections have transferred, but I just felt they haven't really lived up to their hype. Some of them are solid role players though.

Amber Melgoza from Washington isn't even on this top 100 list. She's better than several of the players ranked in the top 20. Recruiting is definitely an inexact science.

If you re-ranked the class I suspect the top 15 would look like this:

With all due respect to @DaBball , @nwhoopfan , and @SCspur (and other BYers who posted in this thread), I find the discussion of "underrated" and "overrated" a bit misleading, in the sense of examining the HS Class of 2016 rankings (largely completed in the fall of 2015, after the previous HS season and summer AAU events) and looking at them through 2019 lenses.

Recruiting rankings involve evaluations of where a player IS at that particular moment in time, in terms of skills and abilities -- with some measure/allowance for potential (e.g., an uber-athlete who is just getting by on instinct and athleticism, having a metric to assess potential to correct shooting form, etc.).

Recruiting rankings CANNOT predict how a player -- likely 17 years old at the time of the last major evaluation and the rankings release before the fall signing period -- will respond to a particular coach, will adjust to college, will interact with her teammates, will overcome injuries, etc. It is a present sense impression assessment with a certain metric component for future potential; it is not a be-all, end-all prediction of college performance, nor can it be.

I do not believe that a player cannot be considered "overrated" simply because she was a very highly ranked player in the fall 2015 rankings but did not become a superstar three years later while others passed her, in terms of accolades, accomplishments, etc.. It simply means that other players improved a lot more and surpassed expected performances for their respective rankings. "Living up/not living up to expectations for the ranking" might be a better characterization.

But looking at this nearly FOUR years later (again, focusing on the last major rating/evaluation occurring in the fall before a player's senior year), without accounting for all of the variables (and them some) that I listed above, then going back to critique the original rankings and determining who was/is "overrated" or "underrated" by the recruiting services? Sorry, I do not see the requisite foundation for such an argument/assessment.

Now, if the recruiting rating services have a player ranked fairly low but she comes into college and immediately dominates from the first day and leads her team to a top ten ranking? Given the short amount of time between the evaluation and the elite performance and how it occurred immediately to have such an impact on the program, then I would consider an evaluation as having been a "miss." I will use the example below (which is from a prior post regarding Duke's Alana Beard and Iowa's Megan Gustafson) to illustrate my point:

There is a difference between showing up to college on dominating as a freshman (e.g., Alana Beard at Duke) and slowly developing over the years, in the course of natural player development as a result of talent and hard work.

Alana Beard was a "miss" by Blue Star, in terms of evaluating where she was at the time; she showed up and dominated the ACC from the jump. This is what Alana accomplished her rookie year:

  • Earned USBWA, Sports Illustrated for Women, Sports Illustrated, CBS Sportsline and Women’s Basketball Journal National Freshman of the Year honors
  • Garnered Basketball Times Freshman All-America, Kodak District II All-America, Associated Press All-America, Women’s Basketball News Service third team All-America and Women’s Basketball Journal first team Freshman All-America honors
  • Selected to the West Regional All-Tournament team
  • Named ACC Freshman of the Year
  • Named First Team All-ACC, becoming the first freshman to ever be selected to the First Team
  • Named to the All-ACC Tournament First Team
In the summer after HS and before Beard arrived at Duke, she led USA Basketball Women’s Junior World Championship Team to a 5-0 record and the gold medal, averaging 15.4 points and 4.4 rebounds. In other words, Blue Star had her ranked very low, but it was clear before she even started college that BS's ranking was, well, BS.

Gustafson averaged 10.7 ppg and 6.8 rpg her first year and was named to the Big Ten All-Freshman Team. But she was not the best player on her team (Ally Disterhoft had that honor for 2015-16; Disterhoft was also named Second Team All-Big Ten that year), nor was she the best freshmen in the Big Ten (Nebraska's Jessica Shepard earned that honor and Shephard and Penn State's Teniya Page were the only two unanimous selections to the Big Ten All-Freshman Team). And in terms of immediate impact, the Big Ten comparable player to the ACC's Alana Beard was Ohio State's Jantel Lavender, who became the first Big Ten player, male or female, to be named the Big Ten Player of the Year four times (winning the coaches' award, the media award, or both) and the only women’s basketball player in a Power Five conference to accomplish that feat.

Gustafson improved her sophomore season and was named to the 2016-17 All-Big Ten First Team (both coaches and media), as was teammate Ally Disterhoft. But neither was a unanimous selection to either First Team (coaches or media); Maryland's Shatori Walker-Kimbrough and Brionna Jones, Michigan State's Tori Jankoska, and Ohio State's Kelsey Mitchell were the only unanimous selections for both (with Mitchell winning POY).

Gustafson really improved by the team her junior year rolled around and turned into a dominating offensive force around the rim. But to say she was a recruiting "miss" is a bit difficult for me, only because she accomplished this a few years after the fact, under the tutelage of college coaches, thousands of hours of workouts, etc. The difference with Beard is that Alana was dominating USA Basketball before she started college, then went on to tear up the ACC during her first year.
 

bballnut90

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Based on what exactly? Even though Ionescu won the Lieberman award I don’t consider her a PG but I think she and Dangerfield are the only ones I would consider better. Yes some of those players are better scorers but when you consider A/TO ratio and game management their are very few who are better than Harris. She doesn’t only effect the game with her passing but she’s also a way better defender than most of the players you mentioned. She’s the SEC’s active leader in steals and assists and probably has more career assists than them all except Ionescu. I may be a little biased but in terms of a pure PG she fits the bill.

She's a pass first point guard but I dont think she comes close to impacting the game like Slocum or Sutton. She may fit the mold of a 'pure PG' but she isnt a better player than any of the ones I listed. All of those players are PGs (besides Sabrina which is a gray area) so I'd rank her below those players even if she has a better A/TO ratio or fits the traditional PG mold better.

Career numbers are nice but we're talking about the present. I dont look at what she did as a freshman, I'm mostly concerned about what she has done in the last season or so.
 
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Based on what exactly? Even though Ionescu won the Lieberman award I don’t consider her a PG but I think she and Dangerfield are the only ones I would consider better. Yes some of those players are better scorers but when you consider A/TO ratio and game management their are very few who are better than Harris. She doesn’t only effect the game with her passing but she’s also a way better defender than most of the players you mentioned. She’s the SEC’s active leader in steals and assists and probably has more career assists than them all except Ionescu. I may be a little biased but in terms of a pure PG she fits the bill.

She was actually behind Ionescu in ATO and total Assist last year. She was tied for 24th last season for assist. Even Chloe Jackson had around 25 assist last year. She is good, but not to be ranked higher just due to her assist. I was expecting her to be in the top 5 in the assist stats by your post and she wasn't.

She actually averaged less assist last year than her sophomore season.
 
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She was actually behind Ionescu in ATO and total Assist last year. She was tied for 24th last season for assist. Even Chloe Jackson had around 25 assist last year. She is good, but not to be ranked higher just due to her assist. I was expecting her to be in the top 5 in the assist stats by your post and she wasn't.

She actually averaged less assist last year than her sophomore season.
I would argue Kelly Campbell from DePaul is a better PG than Harris. Better Assist to Turnover ratio, better shooting stats, and way better rebounder, more steals.
 
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She's a pass first point guard but I dont think she comes close to impacting the game like Slocum or Sutton. She may fit the mold of a 'pure PG' but she isnt a better player than any of the ones I listed. All of those players are PGs (besides Sabrina which is a gray area) so I'd rank her below those players even if she has a better A/TO ratio or fits the traditional PG mold better.

Career numbers are nice but we're talking about the present. I dont look at what she did as a freshman, I'm mostly concerned about what she has done in the last season or so.

But my initial question was how are you basing them as better players if it’s not about assists or any other categories? Need I remind you neither Slocum or Sutton has ever been to an EE and neither has a conference championship(unless you count Slocum’s freshman season at Maryland). Ty has multiple including a national championship. Also Sutton doesn’t have better career numbers scoring, defensive, or passing wise. I’m not bashing either player but it’s hard for me to determine either as better players. Of course you are entitled to your opinion but I thought you would bring some facts behind your statement.
 
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I would argue Kelly Campbell from DePaul is a better PG than Harris. Better Assist to Turnover ratio, better shooting stats, and way better rebounder, more steals.

Campbell is very good and I like her but let’s not act as if her level of competition is even close to the one Harris faces.
 
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She was actually behind Ionescu in ATO and total Assist last year. She was tied for 24th last season for assist. Even Chloe Jackson had around 25 assist last year. She is good, but not to be ranked higher just due to her assist. I was expecting her to be in the top 5 in the assist stats by your post and she wasn't.

She actually averaged less assist last year than her sophomore season.

Hence why I said her stats where probably better than everyone else’s except Ionescu. Mangakahia is also a PG that jumps out at me that’s better than most of the women b-ball nut named. I didn’t say Harris should be ranked higher due solely to her assists, she also has more steals than the women he named and has better career numbers. I’m basing this on collegiate career not just one season. There were several players who had solid seasons but average career numbers. Harris has been solid since her freshman year which is why I said you can make a claim for her as one of the best PG’s.
 
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Campbell is very good and I like her but let’s not act as if her level of competition is even close to the one Harris faces.
I mean DePaul's SOS was 34 and South Carolina's was 11. We weren't playing cupcakes all year by any means.
 
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No, but the Big East isn’t the SEC.
Lol the SEC was 5th in Massey and we were 6th. SEC had 3 teams in the top 25 and the Big East had 2. Not saying our conference is better, but ummm yours wasn't that great last year.
 
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Lol the SEC was 5th in Massey and we were 6th. SEC had 3 teams in the top 25 and the Big East had 2. Not saying our conference is better, but ummm yours wasn't that great last year.

The SEC actually had 4 but I see your point..... that said I expect the SEC to be much better next year and possibly number 2 behind the PAC.
 
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The SEC actually had 4 but I see your point..... that said I expect the SEC to be much better next year and possibly number 2 behind the PAC.
Anything's possible! The SEC could just as well finish 5th again. There's a few teams that might be better, but there are also teams that will be rebuilding and then there's the bottom dwellers that won't. The ACC isn't going anywhere IMO.
 

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