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Sympathy Bowl Participant

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whaler11

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So 5 weeks in it looks to me like it's a 85-90% chance the G5 participant is East Carolina or Marshall.

East Carolina if they win out. Marshall if ECU loses and Marshall wins out.

If Marshall and ECU both dump a game it's probably ECU unless Cinci, Nevada or Colorado State wins out...

Switzerland will put a man on Mars before the G5 makes a four team playoff.
 
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I agree on the analysis about this year. I disagree on the last point. It will, however, take a team (say, ECU this year) winning their Bowl against a top team and them being dominant in the following year.

It's a longshot but really no different than in the past.
 

whaler11

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I agree on the analysis about this year. I disagree on the last point. It will, however, take a team (say, ECU this year) winning their Bowl against a top team and them being dominant in the following year.

It's a longshot but really no different than in the past.

You just can't get the schedule. All the G5 leagues are filled with dreck.
 

nelsonmuntz

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I think the playoffs will go through some major permutations fairly quickly. I would expect to quickly see a big push for an 8 team playoff as the ratings and attendance at bowls crater while the ratings for playoff games skyrockets. After that, i am not sure what happens.
 
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I think the playoffs will go through some major permutations fairly quickly. I would expect to quickly see a big push for an 8 team playoff as the ratings and attendance at bowls crater while the ratings for playoff games skyrockets. After that, i am not sure what happens.

I agree. And I think it all comes down to the committee picking a team from any conference that in fact won their respected conference over a 1 lose SEC team who did not win the SEC. Slive, Saban and the bunch will be up in arms which will quickly lead to at least an 8 team playoff so that the SEC's self fulfilling prophecy can continue to come true every year.
 

SubbaBub

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Rd of 8 at home sites
Rd of 4 in the same region as, and a week before the NCG. (Need two stadiums within 2-3 hours drive, to cut fan airfare costs)

5 auto bids for P5 Champs
3 at large bids, with 1 reserved for a highly ranked G5 champ.

Thank you, I'll collect my check on the way out.
 

nelsonmuntz

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If they go past 8 they ruin the sport.

Right. Because a big tournament absolutely destroyed college basketball. And how does FCS do it? Don't they understand that popularity and fan base size should be important factors in determining a national champion?

There is no reason to have any game but the national championship on a neutral field. The bowls literally steal right from the universities, who are leaving millions on the table by outsourcing their playoffs.

The sport has improved dramatically since the implementation of the 4 team playoff. Imagine how awesome it will be with 16. You are already seeing big improvements in scheduling, and with 16 teams, there will be a lot of opportunity for the G5 schools to sneak in. The nonsense about the regular season not mattering with a playoff is ridiculous. It makes the regular season matter a lot more for a lot more teams.
 

whaler11

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Right. Because a big tournament absolutely destroyed college basketball. And how does FCS do it? Don't they understand that popularity and fan base size should be important factors in determining a national champion?

There is no reason to have any game but the national championship on a neutral field. The bowls literally steal right from the universities, who are leaving millions on the table by outsourcing their playoffs.

The sport has improved dramatically since the implementation of the 4 team playoff. Imagine how awesome it will be with 16. You are already seeing big improvements in scheduling, and with 16 teams, there will be a lot of opportunity for the G5 schools to sneak in. The nonsense about the regular season not mattering with a playoff is ridiculous. It makes the regular season matter a lot more for a lot more teams.

College basketball doesn't exist in the national consciousness except for March. The tournament is great but killed the regular season for non diehards.

Going to 16 kills the regular season and makes it the NFL played at a lower level.
 
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College basketball doesn't exist in the national consciousness except for March. The tournament is great but killed the regular season for non diehards.

Going to 16 kills the regular season and makes it the NFL played at a lower level.
If conference champs get an automatic spot the regular season will retain its importance / excitement. What kills the regular season is when teams that don't even win their division in their conference get to play for the national title.
 

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If conference champs get an automatic spot the regular season will retain its importance / excitement. What kills the regular season is when teams that don't even win their division in their conference get to play for the national title.

Yeah that isn't happening but that would be a good thing.
 

nelsonmuntz

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College basketball doesn't exist in the national consciousness except for March. The tournament is great but killed the regular season for non diehards.

Going to 16 kills the regular season and makes it the NFL played at a lower level.

I agree. I never want to see a 7 seed play an 8 seed for the National Championship in basketball.

With a 2 team National Championship format, the regular season only mattered for about 5-7 teams. With a 4 team playoff, that number increases to 15, maybe as high as 20 in some year. The other 100+ FBS teams are just playing exhibition games or, if they are really lucky, spoiler. Imagine what November would look like if there were 3 or 11 at large bids in play? There will be 50+ games with playoff implications in the last two weeks of the season if there are 11 at-large bids available. This year, there may be 15. Last year, there were less than 10 games in November that had any real impact on the national championship picture.
 

whaler11

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I agree. I never want to see a 7 seed play an 8 seed for the National Championship in basketball.

With a 2 team National Championship format, the regular season only mattered for about 5-7 teams. With a 4 team playoff, that number increases to 15, maybe as high as 20 in some year. The other 100+ FBS teams are just playing exhibition games or, if they are really lucky, spoiler. Imagine what November would look like if there were 3 or 11 at large bids in play? There will be 50+ games with playoff implications in the last two weeks of the season if there are 11 at-large bids available. This year, there may be 15. Last year, there were less than 10 games in November that had any real impact on the national championship picture.

If you don't realize the NCAA tournament destroyed the regular season I don't know what to tell you. The tournament is great and I wouldn't change it - but there isn't anything approaching drama in the regular season. Unless you get pumped up debating a bunch of mediocre bubble teams who all should be left home.

If they went to the ten conference champions and played a 10 team tourney in FBS that would be great. But that will never happen.

If they are going to have 11 at large bids bringing the 4th-5th best SEC team and 3rd-4th best PAC12 team into the equation that will do the exact same thing that has happened in basketball. If teams can lose 3-4 games and be in the conversation the entire focus goes from the regular season onto the playoffs and devalues what is the best regular season in sports.
 

ConnHuskBask

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I think it will eventually go up to 8 teams.

As Nelson pointed out, the bowls suck ( though I know they still get ratings just because it's football on when nothing else is) and the money to be made by a playoff seems limitless.

The conference champ of the ACC, SEC, PAC, B1G, XII, two at large bids and the highest ranked G5 champ (pending say Top 16 rating?) Would be one hell of a playoff.

All games except the national title at home sites.

I don't see how that would a) devalue the regular season b) not make a ton of money c) not give the P5 99% of the power d) give the G5 at least a shot to get in with the rating disclaimer.

A lot of those Boise teams, and at least one Cinci team would've qualified under that.

I just don't see anyone getting fired up to play in these bowls and the playoff further marginalizes them.
 

whaler11

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I think it will eventually go up to 8 teams.

As Nelson pointed out, the bowls suck ( though I know they still get ratings just because it's football on when nothing else is) and the money to be made by a playoff seems limitless.

The conference champ of the ACC, SEC, PAC, B1G, XII, two at large bids and the highest ranked G5 champ (pending say Top 16 rating?) Would be one hell of a playoff.

All games except the national title at home sites.

I don't see how that would a) devalue the regular season b) not make a ton of money c) not give the P5 99% of the power d) give the G5 at least a shot to get in with the rating disclaimer.

A lot of those Boise teams, and at least one Cinci team would've qualified under that.

I just don't see anyone getting fired up to play in these bowls and the playoff further marginalizes them.

8 doesn't. 16 would.

No way does the G5 ever have a backdoor. They are going to have to have a top 5 team to make it to a field of 8.
 
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If you don't realize the NCAA tournament destroyed the regular season I don't know what to tell you. The tournament is great and I wouldn't change it - but there isn't anything approaching drama in the regular season. Unless you get pumped up debating a bunch of mediocre bubble teams who all should be left home.

If they went to the ten conference champions and played a 10 team tourney in FBS that would be great. But that will never happen.

If they are going to have 11 at large bids bringing the 4th-5th best SEC team and 3rd-4th best PAC12 team into the equation that will do the exact same thing that has happened in basketball. If teams can lose 3-4 games and be in the conversation the entire focus goes from the regular season onto the playoffs and devalues what is the best regular season in sports.

IMO, as long as ESPN & FOX are paying hundreds of millions of dollars for regular season broadcast rights they will not let the playoff expand past the current 4 team setup. They are not going to let the regular season become devalued.

There is a reason the initial contract is for 12 years and not for 4 or 5 years. The goal for ESPN was/is to lock this current 4 team format in for a long term.

While there is a lot of money on the table it still pales in comparison to what the P5 schools will be making from their regular season rights. If you read the linked article & do the math each school in a P5 conference will make somewhere in the $5-7MM/yr range from the playoff over the next 12 years. When you compare that to the $40+MM being projected to B1G schools when the next contract gets completed there is no reason to expand the playoff at the risk of regular season revenue

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...f-revenue-money-distribution-payouts/1762709/
 
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8 doesn't. 16 would.

No way does the G5 ever have a backdoor. They are going to have to have a top 5 team to make it to a field of 8.

The only way I see an 8 team playoff working in a way everyone is sort of happy is that the P5 schools conference champs get an auto bid. The highest ranked G5 conference champ gets an auto bid and then the final two are left the remaining two highest ranked teams. Therefore, the $EC can have it's "obligatory" two teams in the playoffs and the rest of the P5 doesn't get left out, while supposedly throwing a bone to the G5 schools.
 

nelsonmuntz

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The premise that the playoffs devalue the regular season is regurgitated nonsense from anti-playoff hacks. Playoffs increase the value of the regular season because more teams play meaningful games.
 

whaler11

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The premise that the playoffs devalue the regular season is regurgitated nonsense from anti-playoff hacks. Playoffs increase the value of the regular season because more teams play meaningful games.

Anyone who disagrees with Nelson and has actual evidence is a hack.
 

nelsonmuntz

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Anyone who disagrees with Nelson and has actual evidence is a hack.

No, just anyone who refuses to use common sense. By the old way or even the 4 team playoff approach, about 80 teams in the country should stop playing games right now, because the rest of their season is completely meaningless and all those schools are doing is exposing their players to injury. Is that an accurate characterization of your approach?
 

whaler11

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No, just anyone who refuses to use common sense. By the old way or even the 4 team playoff approach, about 80 teams in the country should stop playing games right now, because the rest of their season is completely meaningless and all those schools are doing is exposing their players to injury. Is that an accurate characterization of your approach?

Shockingly no it's not.

If your characterization was true why would the regular season television rights for football be so much more valuable than basketball when there is a fraction of the amount of games televised?

Why not 32? Why not 64?

Why not Texas high school where the playoffs seem to be longer than the regular season?
 
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No, just anyone who refuses to use common sense. By the old way or even the 4 team playoff approach, about 80 teams in the country should stop playing games right now, because the rest of their season is completely meaningless and all those schools are doing is exposing their players to injury. Is that an accurate characterization of your approach?

Shockingly I agree with you. FCS, DII and DIII, one of which has a 32 team play off if I remember correctly, seem to not have a "diminished regular season". I'm not advocating for 32 teams at our level, but if those three division can get a fairly successful playoffs with that many teams, there's no reason why FBS can't do it with at least 8 teams.
 

whaler11

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Shockingly I agree with you. FCS, DII and DIII, one of which has a 32 team play off if I remember correctly, seem to not have a "diminished regular season". I'm not advocating for 32 teams at our level, but if those three division can get a fairly successful playoffs with that many teams, there's no reason why FBS can't do it with at least 8 teams.

Yes the FCS and division II regular seasons are a huge deal.

You can see a college sport where the postseason has overwhelmed the regular season. If you can't connect the dots that expanding the playoffs to too many teams won't create a similar dynamic that's ok - but it is what would happen.

I haven't even said 8 is an issue. 16 would be.
 
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Yes the FCS and division II regular seasons are a huge deal.

You can see a college sport where the postseason has overwhelmed the regular season. If you can't connect the dots that expanding the playoffs to too many teams won't create a similar dynamic that's ok - but it is what would happen.

I haven't even said 8 is an issue. 16 would be.

I agree with you on 16. 8 is a nice number if only conference champs and two at large bids were allowed. I don't want to see it the top 8 teams which 3-5 of which will be the SEC. Obviously I'd like to see an autobid for every conference champ regardless if they're P5 or G5, but realistically I know that'll never happen. So I think 8 is the target number.
 

whaler11

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I agree with you on 16. 8 is a nice number if only conference champs and two at large bids were allowed. I don't want to see it the top 8 teams which 3-5 of which will be the SEC. Obviously I'd like to see an autobid for every conference champ regardless if they're P5 or G5, but realistically I know that'll never happen. So I think 8 is the target number.

I'd love to see 10 conf champs and no at larges. But I'd also like to come home and find my wife in bed with Jennifer Lawrence. I don't waste much time worrying about it though.
 
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