Summitt initially felt forced out

[doggydaddy]

Wow...what a mess.

 

[Billybonggg]

Wow...what a mess.

Never trust an AD.

 

[alexrgct]

I hate to be the one to say it, but how much is that testimony worth? She has dementia, which makes the accuracy inherently open to discussion, plus a common symptom of dementia is paranoia.

Not saying Pat is intentionally misrepresenting the truth, or misrepresenting the truth at all for that matter. Just saying it's easy to challenge her credibility as a material witness.

 

[schmendrick]

Not to mention the plaintiff's lawyer likely had an affidavit drafted and all Pat had to do was say yay or nay. Surprised her son wasn't more involved, given his statement that it was his mother's decision.

 

[Alydar]

I hate to be the one to say it, but how much is that testimony worth? She has dementia, which makes the accuracy inherently open to discussion, plus a common symptom of dementia is paranoia.

Not saying Pat is intentionally misrepresenting the truth, or misrepresenting the truth at all for that matter. Just saying it's easy to challenge her credibility as a material witness.

That line of argument, while accurate, would do more damage to the school than caving on the suit. This is a lose/lose situation for Hart and Tenn.

 

[cardfan]

I hate to be the one to say it, but how much is that testimony worth? She has dementia, which makes the accuracy inherently open to discussion, plus a common symptom of dementia is paranoia.

Not saying Pat is intentionally misrepresenting the truth, or misrepresenting the truth at all for that matter. Just saying it's easy to challenge her credibility as a material witness.

I think you are jumping to irresponsible conclusions or assumptions. You have no idea what her medical condition or symptoms are, or how she is being treated. This quote does not appear to from anyone suffering from dementia.

"This was very surprising to me and very hurtful, as that was a decision I would have liked to have made on my own at the end of the season after consulting with my doctors, colleagues and friends and not be told this by Mr. Hart. I felt this was wrong"

 

[alexrgct]

I think you are jumping to irresponsible conclusions or assumptions. You have no idea what her medical condition or symptoms are, or how she is being treated. This quote does not appear to from anyone suffering from dementia.

"This was very surprising to me and very hurtful, as that was a decision I would have liked to have made on my own at the end of the season after consulting with my doctors, colleagues and friends and not be told this by Mr. Hart. I felt this was wrong"

Please get off your high horse. Actually, it sounds like you're the one making assumptions, except you think you're being superior in some way because you're assuming she was in any condition to recall and interpret the details of these incidents correctly. Do you have some sort of inside information I don't? I specifically stated that I couldn't say whether Pat was misrepresenting the facts, either intentionally or otherwise, but rather that this was a valid question to ask given her condition. She was certainly advanced enough by the time these events occurred that she wasn't, in fact, fulfilling many of her responsibilities as a head coach. It's a question that needs to be asked rather than taking her perspective on the subject at face value. She and her longtime friend are levying fairly serious allegations against the Tennessee AD, and he has a right to defend himself.

 

[Phil]

I hate to be the one to say it, but how much is that testimony worth? She has dementia, which makes the accuracy inherently open to discussion, plus a common symptom of dementia is paranoia.

Not saying Pat is intentionally misrepresenting the truth, or misrepresenting the truth at all for that matter. Just saying it's easy to challenge her credibility as a material witness.

I can't image being the lawyer who has to pursue this challenge. If I were the plaintiff, I'd consider bring in a lawyer from out of town, because if they do their job effectively,t hey will be ridden out of town on a rail.

 

[Wbbfan1]

As unpleasant as it may be for Pat Summitt fans and supporters of the Lady Vols, Hart by his job responsibilities had a right to ask or force Pat Summitt to retire. It was obvious to most that Pat was no longer effectively coaching the Lady Vols and at some point she had to be replaced. Who knows what conversations Hart had with Pat about her eventual retirement and I speculate that he believed Pat would not retire gracefully at the end of the year and wanted to return as the Head Coach. If that is true, then Hart believed that he had to ask and/or force Pat to accept retirement. The role that Pat is currently in, is ideal for Tenn and the Lady Vols, Pat is still involved with the program but not responsible for the day to day operation and coaching the Lady Vols. Now the only question that needs answering is Holly the correct person to take over for Pat and time will answer that question.

 

[UcMiami]

As unpleasant as it may be for Pat Summitt fans and supporters of the Lady Vols, Hart by his job responsibilities had a right to ask or force Pat Summitt to retire. It was obvious to most that Pat was no longer effectively coaching the Lady Vols and at some point she had to be replaced. Who knows what conversations Hart had with Pat about her eventual retirement and I speculate that he believed Pat would not retire gracefully at the end of the year and wanted to return as the Head Coach. If that is true, then Hart believed that he had to ask and/or force Pat to accept retirement. The role that Pat is currently in, is ideal for Tenn and the Lady Vols, Pat is still involved with the program but not responsible for the day to day operation and coaching the Lady Vols. Now the only question that needs answering is Holly the correct person to take over for Pat and time will answer that question.

I think this is a pretty good assessment of the situation. I think TN did right by Pat in creating the Emeritus position for her and they are still paying her a very nice salary for very little active resposibility. And what the AD said could easily have been along the lines of 'Pat, we really need to start talking about how we handle the transition from you to your successor'. For the AD that is a straight question, for Pat, that is a request for her resignation. I don't think there are many people out there who didn't feel TN women's basketball needed to move forward at the end of last year with a new coach.
As far as the lawsuit - TN had already planned a consolidation of its athletic department. There were going to be a number of unhappy employees who got reassigned, had their position reduced/restructured or had their position cut. When that happens, chances are a number of people consult lawyers, and those that go forward, throw anything they can at the wall to make the situation as difficult for the company/institution as possible. Pat ran a little kingdom, and the people used to being protected from above in that kingdom were bound to be more unhappy/resistant to change than those in other areas of the athletic department.
Please note - the above reference to a 'kingdom'is not meant to be snarky. Both Jim and Geno are in similar situations at CT in relation to the Uconn AD, and there could well be ruffled feathers and general nastiness related to Jim leaving this year and Geno some time in the future.

 

[cardfan]

Please get off your high horse. Actually, it sounds like you're the one making assumptions, except you think you're being superior in some way because you're assuming she was in any condition to recall and interpret the details of these incidents correctly. Do you have some sort of inside information I don't? I specifically stated that I couldn't say whether Pat was misrepresenting the facts, either intentionally or otherwise, but rather that this was a valid question to ask given her condition. She was certainly advanced enough by the time these events occurred that she wasn't, in fact, fulfilling many of her responsibilities as a head coach. It's a question that needs to be asked rather than taking her perspective on the subject at face value. She and her longtime friend are levying fairly serious allegations against the Tennessee AD, and he has a right to defend himself.

Dood, it's not a valid question, at all. It's insulting. Her quote and feelings are very clear. Not remembering where your keys are is quite different from the feeling of being shown the door by the AD.

 

[Kevin G]

If this is true then I am disgusted. One of the greatest coaches to ever step foot on a basketball court and this is how you treat them?!

 

[ed4ourgirls]

I don't pretend to know all the facts of the case, but Jennings'
lawsuit alleges that she was fired because of age and/or sex
discrimination. I don't really understand this claim.

From what I've read it appears that Jennings was unhappy with
Hart and the new regime not only because of the Summitt dismissal
but perhaps also with the athletic department consolidation. By
making herself a pain in the neck, it seems to me that she's given
cause to be let go, and that age and sex had nothing to do with it.

But I haven't been keeping up with the times. Maybe being hostile
toward your boss no longer constitutes sufficient cause to be fired.

 

[ScarlettB]

I believe Pat remembers correctly and that she was forced out. Dave Hart was the AD at Florida State and was instrumental in forcing Bobby Bowden to retire against his will. He certainly has the right to do that in his position, but he also needs to own the decision, no matter how unpopular it might be with some of the fan base.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

I believe Pat remembers correctly and that she was forced out. Dave Hart was the AD at Florida State and was instrumental in forcing Bobby Bowden to retire against his will. He certainly has the right to do that in his position, but he also needs to own the decision, no matter how unpopular it might be with some of the fan base.

In the earlier thread about the lawsuit, I said, fairly delicately, that Pat was probably in a "gots to go" situation, but that I would have liked for her to have been the one to recognize this. I think Hart was in a lose/lose situation (and with Bowden likewise). For all I know - I'm not claiming it, because I don't know - he may not be as political as some others in the sense of getting what he wants without it being obvious. Some folks are smooth and others, not so much. The reasoning for not "owing the decision" ultimately can be tied to giving Summitt some dignity, but now, so much for that.

 

[Waquoit]

In the earlier thread about the lawsuit, I said, fairly delicately, that Pat was probably in a "gots to go" situation, but that I would have liked for her to have been the one to recognize this. I think Hart was in a lose/lose situation (and with Bowden likewise). For all I know - I'm not claiming it, because I don't know - he may not be as political as some others in the sense of getting what he wants without it being obvious. Some folks are smooth and others, not so much. The reasoning for not "owing the decision" ultimately can be tied to giving Summitt some dignity, but now, so much for that.

I think you pretty much nail it here.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

I don't pretend to know all the facts of the case, but Jennings'
lawsuit alleges that she was fired because of age and/or sex
discrimination. I don't really understand this claim.

Jennings has also an ADA retaliation claim.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

From what I've read it appears that Jennings was unhappy with
Hart and the new regime not only because of the Summitt dismissal
but perhaps also with the athletic department consolidation. By
making herself a pain in the neck, it seems to me that she's given
cause to be let go, and that age and sex had nothing to do with it.

But I haven't been keeping up with the times. Maybe being hostile
toward your boss no longer constitutes sufficient cause to be fired.

As far your recollection/discussion of the facts, there is a lot you are missing.

Go back to May when the Notice of Claim was submitted and documents were made available publicly. This is what I posted at the time as far as my analysis of Ms. Jenning's situation:

If you analyze Ms. Jennings' performance evaluation from March 2011, and compare it with Mr. Stanton's memo from September 2010 and the university's letter from May 24, 2012, the purported reasons for Ms. Jennings' separation from employment (consolidation of the departments; fostering a negative atmosphere; insubordination) simply do not make sense, in my estimation/analysis.

If she had been fostering such a negative atmosphere and was demonstrating a patteron of disrespect and resentment back in September 2010, why would her performance evaluation in March 2011 (which covered the period of January 1, 2010, until December 31, 2010) delineate that she fully met expectations in 100 percent of all categories evaluated and exceeded expectations (either occasionally or consistently) in 60 percent of categories evaluated?

It is also important to note that the performance evaluation for the previous year was completed in March 2011, which would encompass the purported conversation with and memorandum from Jimmy Stanton. Ms. Jennings' performance review was completed by none other than Jimmy Stanton himself.

 

[Alydar]

[quote="If she had been fostering such a negative atmosphere and was demonstrating a patteron of disrespect and resentment back in September 2010, why would her performance evaluation in March 2011 (which covered the period of January 1, 2010, until December 31, 2010) delineate that she fully met expectations in 100 percent of all categories evaluated and exceeded expectations (either occasionally or consistently) in 60 percent of categories evaluated?

It is also important to note that the performance evaluation for the previous year was completed in March 2011, which would encompass the purported conversation with and memorandum from Jimmy Stanton. Ms. Jennings' performance review was completed by none other than Jimmy Stanton himself.[/quote]

Not a lawyer but I was a union steward in a govenment agency and handled several terminations. I've seen exactly this sort of situation, where annual performance evaluations describe an excellent employee who nevertheless is fired for insubordination. The employer has been upheld in the cases I know about at a 4-1 ratio. In my experience the specific act(s) of insuborination has won out against the annual review. Until the AD's office specifically states what constitutes the insubordination Jennings case isn't as strong as it appears. Now arbitrators aren't judges but I've seen them buy all sorts of explanations of why an annual review is inconsistant with the letter of termination, some of them very thin ones. The most common one is that the employer was trying to retain the employee despite reservations and gave the employee a good evaluation in the hope it would improve their performance. Unfortunately (according to them) the employee continued to be insubordinate and they were "forced" to terminate them. They usually have a sad look on their faces as they say this.

My prediction is that Jennings will be offered about a year's salary (or 2) plus legal expenses to accept her termination and will agree to keep the settlement details to herself.

 

[itsasport]

Pat was not going to quit. Hart was doing his job. But he failed to do all that needed to be done by hiring Holly. She can't coach either. She is just a Pat clone who also can't recruit. What Tenn. needs is a capable, young, (but respected) coach to reinvigorate the program...a Shea.


I wonder what Hart felt about Pat's insistence that the Tenn/UConn series be ended. I can't recall what he said about it publically; but, any good AD would have resisted the idea. Pat's unique stature was able to get it done; but, it could have stuck in his craw as something that really was against the interests of Tenn. athletics and he didn't want to let Pat do any more damage. Just because someone builds something, it doesn't mean that she has the right to destroy it.

 

[Icebear]

See the other thread that Pat was not forced out. There is a difference between feeling forced out and being forced out. Pat says she was not forced out in the link there.