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Stokes Looking to Clear Mental Hurdles...

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I also think while players talk of the 'mental' aspect, it is also physical. HS players for the most part have never practiced the way college teams and especially Uconn practice. For the stars, usually everything has come easily for them - they were physically more gifted than 99% of the players on their teams and the players on the opposing teams so they were not pushed. They then get to college and they are not the most gifted and practices are long and they are expected to go all out for 2+ hours. And as their body tires, their mind slows down, and the coaches start yelling at them in a way that has never happened before. They are getting physically beaten up by juniors and seniors and can't seem to do anything right. (While Heather may not get much playing time in games, she is a hell of a physical specimen, and pounding against that body for two hours cannot be fun!) You can have all the foreknowledge of what is coming as a freshman, but until it happens to you, you really don't 'know'. Some players can adjust pretty quickly, others it takes longer. Few freshman anywhere get through their first year without some serious valleys and for most players it really isn't until the 2nd or 3rd year that they really break through. Players like Diana and Maya are exceptional in the speed with which they can adapt. I would say that for all the complaints that have been posted, Stewart may be one of those players that gets it the first year, and MJ maybe headed in that direction as well.
So while 'mental' is what players identify, I think it starts with physically being pushed beyond what they are used to and not being able to accomplish what they are used to accomplishing. That gets the coaches yelling and then it is tired body, tired mind, and what was always fun suddenly becomes work and drudgery. Their body may respond quicker than their mind to that situation, but it is really retraining both.
 
vtcwbuff said:
"I just get the frustrated very easily and then when all the coaches get on me I kind of just break down. "

That. Maybe she should talk to Banks.

I find it amazing when players come to UConn and then get in a funk because the coach(s) yell at them. That's like new recruits at Parris Island being surprised when the DI's "get on them."
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Maybe she shoud talk to you. You seem to have life by the scrotum, a genuine tough guy behind an avatar and pseud.

I would be the wrong person, I guess, since my life has included some bumps and failures of sort.
 
MilfordHusky said:
I believe Geno once said that it took Swin, Asjha, and Tamika almost 3 full seasons to "totally get it." Tina took about that long as well. She hit her stride in the post season of her junior year and has been a beast since.
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It may also take time for Geno to totally get his players. He's talked a little bit about coaching different people differently. Players respond best to different approaches. Some respond to criticism. Some respond to being challenged. Some really need to hear the positives first, else they're just gonna go back to their dorms and cry over the pile of homework waiting for them.

It's possible that the coaching staff and Kiah haven't quite found the right mix yet of encouragement and criticism that really pushes her to her full potential. Kiah herself probably doesn't know what that is. It can be very hard to articulate.
 
Ozzie Nelson said:
Maybe she shoud talk to you. You seem to have life by the scrotum, a genuine tough guy behind an avatar and pseud.

I would be the wrong person, I guess, since my life has included some bumps and failures of sort.
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Having a bad day Oz?
 
ursusminor said:
It may also take time for Geno to totally get his players. He's talked a little bit about coaching different people differently. Players respond best to different approaches. Some respond to criticism. Some respond to being challenged. Some really need to hear the positives first, else they're just gonna go back to their dorms and cry over the pile of homework waiting for them.

It's possible that the coaching staff and Kiah haven't quite found the right mix yet of encouragement and criticism that really pushes her to her full potential. Kiah herself probably doesn't know what that is. It can be very hard to articulate.
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Ursus, as always you are one mature young woman. Blessings in all you do.
 
Icebear said:
Ursus, as always you are one mature young woman. Blessings in all you do.
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Ice, you're making me blush.
I'm not sure I deserve that much credit. Long story short, I am where I am today partly because I failed to do, at the D3 level, what Kiah is trying to do. I have a coach for a father, so between the two of us we've analyzed this time and time again over the last 5 years. I can articulate now what was bothering me then, and see how it may apply to other people.
 
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Dealing with young people in this situation presents a couple of problems. One is time - how much available time does a coach have to spend with an individual player that needs special treatment when they have an entire team that needs their attention? The other problem is favoritism, real or as percieved by teammates. Can a coach yell at one player to get their ass in gear and then politely ask the next to please try harder to get in the correct defensive position?

Everyone knows who Auriemma is and everyone knows his coaching methods. A recruit coming to UConn should expect that the coaching staff is going to demand their absolute best effort. His coaching methods have won a lot of basketball games and even a few awards. How much should he have to change how he coaches to accommodate a player? What guarantee is there that a different approach would have a different effect?
 
vtcwbuff said:
Dealing with young people in this situation presents a couple of problems. One is time - how much available time does a coach have to spend with an individual player that needs special treatment when they have an entire team that needs their attention? The other problem is favoritism, real or as percieved by teammates. Can a coach yell at one player to get their ass in gear and then politely ask the next to please try harder to get in the correct defensive position?

Everyone knows who Auriemma is and everyone knows his coaching methods. A recruit coming to UConn should expect that the coaching staff is going to demand their absolute best effort. His coaching methods have won a lot of basketball games and even a few awards. How much should he have to change how he coaches to accommodate a player? What guarantee is there that a different approach would have a different effect?
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I honestly don't think that time is an issue here. Given the relatively small size of a basketball roster, the number of coaches, and the remarkable amount of time they spend together, I don't think anybody is short-changed on time. Favoritism can be an issue - when you read some of the books about the program, and read about some of the upperclassman/underclassman conflicts, some of the nicknames ("precious"), and just the human nature of competative people, there's gonna be some perceived inequities. Perhaps, even some real ones.

Geno has mentioned, many times, how he has had to change his coaching methods through the years. Some of his players from the earlier years are on record, commenting about "how soft he's gotten". I think what you're asking is, where's the line between trying a softer approach, and coddling a player? I don't think anyone can answer that, because it's not a hard-and-fast demarcation. I can think of a couple of ways to explain it, but they're kinda simplistic. One is "you don't have to sit in the same pew, but ya gotta be in the same church", which is to say, your value set and objective have to be the same, but you don't have to take the exact same path to get there. Another is to note that the song "Stardust" has been recorded, I believe, over a 1,000 times. Imagine - over a thousand different renditions of the same song - same lyric, same melody, but different pacing, emphasis, feeling.

I'm reading "Francona: the Red Sox years" right now, and it's pertinent to this topic. Terry Francona, in his first year with the Sox, had to manage Manny, Pedro, Nomar, Millar, Lowe, Buckholtz, Damon, Ortiz, etc.. - the "Gang of Idiots". And, he had to deal with the issues mentioned above - jealousy, perceived favoritism, finding which buttons to push with which players. With grown men, professionals, not 18 and 19 year-old students, the issues were, and are, the same. In short, I don't think there's a nice, clean, black-and-white answer. You need a patient, gifted, experienced coaching staff to make the calls as they best see them, and hope they're right.
 
MilfordHusky said:
I believe Geno once said that it took Swin, Asjha, and Tamika almost 3 full seasons to "totally get it." Tina took about that long as well. She hit her stride in the post season of her junior year and has been a beast since.
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If Kiah were playing like 4 of the above mentioned players before they "totally got it' this thread AND others re
KIAH would be very different
EFFORT,EMOTION,ENERGY How do you watch/see KELLY every day and not get that
IRA
 
I wonder about the prep of recruits. You would think the info is out there about college training.
Do they practice going to the left hand?
Do they pursue a stamina regimen?
Do they get guys to bump them around a bit?
 
Magical2 - I think there are two parts to that - one is perceiving what Kelly is bringing, and the other is perceiving yourself clearly. And then there is actually being physically and mentally capable of doing the same. Kelis Fisher is an outlier on this team and every team she has played on, so are we going to be down on every other team member for not bringing exactly what Kelis Fisher can? I am not disagreeing that she is a great example to have, just tempering the expectations for all her teammates.
And on the challenges of being a great coach for a team of individuals - I think the trick is having a set of core principles and rules that don't change, but having the flexibility to modulate everything else based on the individual team members. The expectation of what an individual player is capable of changes (e.g. Tina vs. Heather) but the effort and concentration expected does not. And recognizing that practice is a team process, while individual instruction and office time is one-to-one.
I think a great example is the CD comment about her meeting with Tina in her junior year after a tough practice - she said something like 'Tina when you came here you told coach you wanted to be the best player in the country and an AA. If you goal has changed just tell me and coach will back off.'
 
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wire chief said:
I wonder about the prep of recruits. You would think the info is out there about college training.
Do they practice going to the left hand?
Do they pursue a stamina regimen?
Do they get guys to bump them around a bit?
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For most players the answer would be yes, but that still doesn't mean the reality isn't a shock. You can hear all the stories about bootcamp and watch every movie that includes scenes of bootcamp and mean DIs but 99% of those going through it are still unprepared for the reality.
 
" . . .she said something like 'Tina when you came here you told coach you wanted to be the best player in the country and an AA. If you goal has changed just tell me and coach will back off.' "

I wonder if that was Charles' "light bulb" moment 'cause something happened that year to get her from good to great.
 
vtcwbuff said:
" . . .she said something like 'Tina when you came here you told coach you wanted to be the best player in the country and an AA. If you goal has changed just tell me and coach will back off.' "

I wonder if that was Charles' "light bulb" moment 'cause something happened that year to get her from good to great.
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It came in the winter of her Junior year Jan or early Feb, and yes it was around the moment when the lightbulb went on. The other comment she got was from Geno reminding her that at the previous FF she had said next year she would be up there getting an AA award, and she was getting fewer points fewer rebounds, so what did she think - they would just give it to her now Fowles had graduated?!
 
vtcwbuff said:
" . . .she said something like 'Tina when you came here you told coach you wanted to be the best player in the country and an AA. If you goal has changed just tell me and coach will back off.' "

I wonder if that was Charles' "light bulb" moment 'cause something happened that year to get her from good to great.
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Tina's first year ended in the NCAAs when big Syl dominated her and Tina got hurt.

Tina's second year ended in the NCAAs when Wiggins, Appel, Pedersen, et. al beat us. Geno declared we "had no post presence." That was clearly a direct shot.

Tina made progress her third year, but in the NCAAs, there were questions beforehand. Appel had put up about 45 on Iowa State. The question was could Tina match up? She did a nice job of slowing Jayne, and we won. In the finals, Renee's shooting was off for 30+ minutes and Maya's was off for 25+ minutes. That game was clearly the Tina Charles show. Those 2 games, to me, made it clear that Tina had turned the corner. The next season, she was NPOY. Then WNBA ROY. Then WNBA MVP. Throw in a FIBA WCBB and Olympic Gold. Tina is on a roll at the tip of her profession.
 
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Unfortunately, Kiah still looks completely lost on the offensive end. I fear that although she is so physically gifted, other players are going to develope and go right by her as far as playing time. She is such a good rebounder and shot blocker Ihope this will not be the case, but it is getting close to crunch time, and the freshman are starting to come into their own.
 
Unfortunately, Kiah still looks completely lost on the offensive end. I fear that although she is so physically gifted, other players are going to develope and go right by her as far as playing time. She is such a good rebounder and shot blocker Ihope this will not be the case, but it is getting close to crunch time, and the freshman are starting to come into their own.
 
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