Shaka #13 on ESPN's list. KO Officially ranked higher

[8893]

Wow, I was a KO fan from day one, but I almost forgot how horrendously insufferable scooter was about this:

"as far as the Ollie situation goes, i think this has been a complete and total disaster from virtually every angle. Calhoun screwed the University by pulling this crap this late so he could get his way on Ollie. Ollie himself is totally unprepared to be a head coach at a major D-1 power. And what the heck kind of head coach doesn't get to name his assistants? Not one. While I like Karl Hobbs, it is embarrassing that they announced that he was now going to become an assistant...Ollie didn't make that decision...Maybe they'll let him have input into the new director of operations...The athletic director has been cut off at the knees...now he knows i guess who actually runs the athletic department. Probably should have just let the interim guy keep the job. He made no pretense of not being in Calhoun's pocket.

This is the silliest hire since Notre Dame attempted to replace Dan Devine with Gerry Faust. And i can't remember a top program since that replaced its coach with someone as unprepared as Kevin Ollie is. there have been questionable hires in the past, but none quite so ridiculous as this one looks from anywhere but Calhoun's living room. i hope I'm wrong about this but I don't think I will be. I see this being a disaster in the making that could take a better part of a decade to undo. It could well take 3-4 years before anyone is willing to admit Ollie was a mistake (that is the typical run for these things), and another 4-5 before things get back on track...And if I'm Manuel, I'm putting my resume out on the street too...might as well go somewhere where they want a real AD, not a gopher for the best known head coach."

http://www.the-boneyard.com/threads...year-audition-for-ko.23712/page-2#post-329820

 

[Waquoit]

I would have offed myself if we had a coach who full court pressed and trapped every game. Junk defense

You mean like how JC made it to the Elite 8 and was a lucky bounce away from the Final Four with a team picked to finish last in conference just 4 years after the program hit rock bottom?.

 

[James]

You mean like how JC made it to the Elite 8 and was a lucky bounce away from the Final Four with a team picked to finish last in conference just 4 years after the program hit rock bottom?.

idk did he win a title? His best coaching jobs weren't shaka smart templates sorry.

 

[Gurleyman]

idk did he win a title? His best coaching jobs weren't shaka smart templates sorry.

1990 was his best coaching job. Not even really all that close. We went from NIT to an out of nowhere 1 seed in one year despite losing our best player and being picked to finish last. I'm sure you're on the younger side and weren't around then, and that's cool. The fact that you are using "did he win a title" as a measuring stick shows you don't have the perspective of where the program was then and how far it jumped in one year. Winning a title wasn't even close to a goal when that year started - avoiding Pillow Fight Thursday at the Garden was about as much as we could hope for. And after we lost by 40 to St. John's in our BE opener (or second game, maybe), it looked like we were headed there.

But to be fair, your larger point has some merit - our press lost its effectiveness over the ensuing 2-3 years as more coaches found blueprints to break it, and JC adjusted. Plus, when we had elite talents like Donyell, Ray and Rip we didn't want to wear them down in a 94-foot game. In 1990, we had 10 interchangeable parts and not a lot of size up front for that era, so the press was a good strategy.

 

[huskiesnyc]

Jim Boeheim is #12

 

[7774]

Jim Boeheim is #12

LOL. Commence the oranges going ballistic in 3...2...1....

 

[James]

1990 was his best coaching job. Not even really all that close. We went from NIT to an out of nowhere 1 seed in one year despite losing our best player and being picked to finish last. I'm sure you're on the younger side and weren't around then, and that's cool. The fact that you are using "did he win a title" as a measuring stick shows you don't have the perspective of where the program was then and how far it jumped in one year. Winning a title wasn't even close to a goal when that year started - avoiding Pillow Fight Thursday at the Garden was about as much as we could hope for. And after we lost by 40 to St. John's in our BE opener (or second game, maybe), it looked like we were headed there.

But to be fair, your larger point has some merit - our press lost its effectiveness over the ensuing 2-3 years as more coaches found blueprints to break it, and JC adjusted. Plus, when we had elite talents like Donyell, Ray and Rip we didn't want to wear them down in a 94-foot game. In 1990, we had 10 interchangeable parts and not a lot of size up front for that era, so the press was a good strategy.

Nice history lesson. You don't think VCU's havoc is a junk defense? its the same as cuse's zone. both gimmicks. this isn't 25 years ago when JC had to adjust to his roster. Smart has had plenty of talent to introduce new defensive philosophies, still hasn't. that just isn't appealing to me, IMO. Pitino has a press but he also mixes it up a bunch.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I would have offed myself if we had a coach who full court pressed and trapped every game. Junk defense

*cough* Rick Pitino

 

[johnhuskies95]

*cough* Rick Pitino

Not sure how much of Louisville you watch, but they definitely don't trap and press all game every game.

 

[Gurleyman]

Nice history lesson. You don't think VCU's havoc is a junk defense? its the same as cuse's zone. both gimmicks. this isn't 25 years ago when JC had to adjust to his roster. Smart has had plenty of talent to introduce new defensive philosophies, still hasn't. that just isn't appealing to me, IMO. Pitino has a press but he also mixes it up a bunch.

I do think that a coach who insists on playing it all the time regardless of personnel is foolish - you have to adapt on what makes your team the best. Smart is perhaps teetering on that line (he's still young) by saying this is his system and recruiting to that style to play it all the time, so you do have a fair point. But I also think someone who thinks it is simply junk is foolish - when you are deep and athletic without a singular star player you need on the floor close to 40 minutes, it is the best way to use your depth to your advantage and force tempo. I sure didn't think it was junk in 1990 when we played the soon to be best team in the country and they couldn't get the ball over midcourt. I'm sure Arkansas didn't think it was junk when they pressed their way to the 1994 title and a runner up finish in 1995. Or Kentucky under Pitino. Or VCU when they made the Final Four. UNLV pressed a lot when they won 105-75 in the championship game. These were all deep teams and used that depth.

JC also always adjusted to his roster, right up until the end. We never played Caron or Rudy or Sticks as a stretch four, since we had size up front on those teams, but we did with Roscoe Smith when we didn't and spread the floor for Kemba. If you looked at our offense in 1999 (built around Rip) and in 2004 (built around Emeka), you'd barely see any of the same plays. Still too soon to know how KO will adapt to personnel, but I think in a parallel universe when Purvis was eligible right away we might have gone to a havoc-type defense this year, since we would have had a lot of backcourt depth and no post scoring, making an uptempo game to our liking. No way we would want to wear Bazz down, though - so we played accordingly.

And sorry if you felt like the history lesson was condescending, but 1990 was simply one of the best coaching jobs ever by anyone - never mind just JC. There are very, very few examples of the success to expectations ratio being that far out of whack in a positive direction.

 

[Rocktheworld]

Not sure how much of Louisville you watch, but they definitely don't trap and press all game every game.

I've caught a few games, and they do it a fair amount in every single game. No they don't do it every single possession, but full-court pressure is something for which he and his Louisville teams have been known, and it is something that every coach should be planning for when preparing to play him.

 

[nycscooby]

Your thoughts, @freescooter?

It looks like the last 11 are: Calipari, K, Pitino, Izzo, Ollie, S Miller, Donovan, Beilein, Ryan, Self and G Marshall. Care to guess how ESPN will rank them? Here's my guess:

1. Calipari
2. K
3. Izzo
4. Pitino
5. Donovan
6. Ollie
7. Miller
8. Beilein
9. Marshall
10. Self
11. Ryan

 

[jibsey]

I'm LMAO with the post pulled from the past on KO as a disaster. All I can say is that it's like having an argument with your wife when she pulls up all the evidence against you as quick as a computer. Haven't we all been there?

 

[Rocktheworld]

7. Miller

As in Sean Miller? Of AZ? Who has gotten to two EEs in his 5 years now despite the talent? I mean , at least Boeheim, Beilein, Ryan, and especially Self have been to a FF in the last 5 years. Dude is basically Diet Jim Boeheim at this point.

 

[Javi525]

I hope Ollie ends up in the top 10 but if he doesn't, how upset should we be? The fact he's mentioned as a top 15 coach out of 300 something D1 coaches is a major compliment especially since his body of work is less than 70 games compared to the remaining coaches

 

[nycscooby]

As in Sean Miller? Of AZ? Who has gotten to two EEs in his 5 years now despite the talent? I mean , at least Boeheim, Beilein, Ryan, and especially Self have been to a FF in the last 5 years. Dude is basically Diet Jim Boeheim at this point.

I'm not saying that's how I would rank just how I think ESPN will rank. It's about current performance not career results. Miller is very good, in 6 seasons with the Wildcats he's made the tourney four times (10-4 total record), made it to two regional finals (losing both in the last minute) and one regional semifinal. He definitely has the program on an uptick.

 

[Sully]

I would have offed myself if we had a coach who full court pressed and trapped every game. Junk defense

Ahhhh that's how Calhoun built the Huskies.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I'm not saying that's how I would rank just how I think ESPN will rank. It's about current performance not career results. Miller is very good, in 6 seasons with the Wildcats he's made the tourney four times (10-4 total record), made it to two regional finals (losing both in the last minute) and one regional semifinal. He definitely has the program on an uptick.

Again, that's nice, but when you look around, you couldn't name 10 coaches who have done more i.e. at least a Final Four in the his tenure at AZ? Bo Ryan, Beilein, Self, Donovan, Izzo, Matta, Cal, K, even Boeheim, have done more. I also get that the guy can recruit, but what has he done with that talent? Pretty much little, considering the above 9 (Ollie will be above him because he just won the NC) have for the most part done more with less. So why should he be considered one of the ten best coaches right now if we have no real reason to expect him to do anything with the talent he's got coming in this year?

 

[intlzncster]

Ahhhh that's how Calhoun built the Huskies.

True, and it's a viable strategy when you don't quite have the personnel. When you do have the horses, you can't expose yourself with that tactic on a regular basis.