Shabazz? Or the Offense? | The Boneyard

Shabazz? Or the Offense?

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I'm seeing lots of posts about Napier dribbling too much, taking "hero" shots "going into chucker mode" etc . . . . These posts, besides being way too simplistic, miss a couple of points:

First, UConn has two offensive sets against man to man defense -- a high ball screen with baseline cutters, and the "circle" play, with Lamb and Giffey/Daniels/whoever curling off of a screen at the foul line. Both are dependent on the point guard handling the ball.

Second, we ran circle almost exclusively last night. While Shabazz did miss Lamb and Giffey coming off of the curls a few times, most of the time they were well defended. What I noticed is that the second element of the circle play, where the first guy to curl at the foul line runs off of a baseline screen, never happened. If the initial curls didn't produce, we just tried again and again, with Shabazz dribbling up top until the shot clock ended up inside of 10 seconds. Why were we running only half of the set?
 
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Bazz was good last night, but I feel like any time he leads the team in scoring, it's a sign that the offense is malfunctioning. It's kind of like when Marcus Williams would all of a sudden become the primary scorer in 05-06.

Sometimes it happens because Bazz is trying to do too much and other times it's because the rest of the team isn't doing enough, but either way his points usually have a higher cost in turnovers that the team doesn't pay when JL or AD are putting points on the board.
 

SubbaBub

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Good points but, the ball needs to go into the post. Both AO and AD can score down low. If it's not there, give up the ball, move, get it back, and try again.

Dribbling and the top of key for 15 seconds, missing the circle pass and saying screw it I can drive and fade away like Kemba did, is not the optimal line for this team. That's the where the criticism is coming from.

Make multiple attempts to the post or find Lamb before driving and jacking. SN will find himself with more open looks within the offense.

Our PG scores 27 in a loss that should have been a 14 point win against a team with little post defense.

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Dribbling and the top of key for 15 seconds, missing the circle pass and saying screw it I can drive and fade away like Kemba did, is not the optimal line for this team. That's the where the criticism is coming from.
This x100. I remember last night thinking to myself multiple times that this team does not run a real offense. The fact that we usually had 2 guys on the court with decisive size advantages over Cincy's 4 guard lineup and our guards neglected to throw the ball in the post really bugged me.
 
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Yah our Pgs have always dribbled a lot. I feel like Shabazz is worse but I remember times last year being rather unhappy with Kemba.
 

ctchamps

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I'm seeing lots of posts about Napier dribbling too much, taking "hero" shots "going into chucker mode" etc . . . . These posts, besides being way too simplistic, miss a couple of points:

First, UConn has two offensive sets against man to man defense -- a high ball screen with baseline cutters, and the "circle" play, with Lamb and Giffey/Daniels/whoever curling off of a screen at the foul line. Both are dependent on the point guard handling the ball.

Second, we ran circle almost exclusively last night. While Shabazz did miss Lamb and Giffey coming off of the curls a few times, most of the time they were well defended. What I noticed is that the second element of the circle play, where the first guy to curl at the foul line runs off of a baseline screen, never happened. If the initial curls didn't produce, we just tried again and again, with Shabazz dribbling up top until the shot clock ended up inside of 10 seconds. Why were we running only half of the set?
I agree with your assessment. The execution failure is not with Shabazz but with the players not running the sets the way they are designed. The thing that made Rip fantastic was that he executed things the way you describe. Last season when Shabazz ran the point position and Kemba swung to the two, Kemba ran the plays the way you describe. In this game and last neither Jeremy, Niels or DeAndre have run the plays effectively. And Roscoe's struggles on offensive sets make the others look brilliant.

Add the ineffectiveness of the front court to make bunnies, they went 3-16, the only other ball handler Jeremy being unable to create anything with passing or making shots, and it is understandable that Shabazz has to dribble long stretches or take more shots than he or the coaches would prefer.

But from the criticism Shabazz is getting, either we are seeing things wrong or others are not observing how these sets are run.
 

ctchamps

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Yah our Pgs have always dribbled a lot. I feel like Shabazz is worse but I remember times last year being rather unhappy with Kemba.
Kemba was a ball hog far more than Shabazz. He took far greater percentage of shots than probably any player in UConn history and probably dribbled the ball more than any player ever. He had to. IMO Shabazz if fine on offense.

The real loss from last season to this is on defense. Kemba was the best defensive player on last years team by far. If there was a perimeter player that was hurting UConn, Kemba played that player and neutralized him. It is this loss that is hurting UConn. Opposing teams are taking a lot of threes against UConn because it is hard to score in the lane. And so far UConn does not have a good option on the perimeter. If Gottlieb is correct that there is an emphasis to call fouls if there is the slightest perception of contact on a perimeter shooter, then perimeter defenders must go up vertically in challenging shooters and the factor that SN and RB are short will impact perimeter defense.
 

BUHusky

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I'm still under the opinion that UConn has not run a good half-court offense since AJ was running things in 08-09. In 09-10 they could barely score in half-court sets. In 10-11 the half-court offense didn't really get any better, but UConn had Kemba and other teams didn't, so his heorics in the last seconds of shot clocks made up for a lot of flaws. This year a lot of those flaws still exist and it's becoming a problem again.

The lack of chemistry and/or trust between the guards and the bigs is really a big issue right now. The guards (mostly Shabazz) hesitate to dump the ball down low because they know it's probably not coming back out and the bigs (mostly AO) hesitate to throw the ball back out once they get it because they know they probably won't get another touch for a while. The result of all that is terrible offensive flow. When your PG scores 27 and your bigs combine for 6, a lot of red flags should be popping up.
 
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Let's be serious, we have no low post presence. It's dunk or nothing for AD and the other low post players can't catch the ball or shoot it-no matter how close to the hoop they are positioned.
 
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I'm still under the opinion that UConn has not run a good half-court offense since AJ was running things in 08-09. In 09-10 they could barely score in half-court sets. In 10-11 the half-court offense didn't really get any better, but UConn had Kemba and other teams didn't, so his heorics in the last seconds of shot clocks made up for a lot of flaws. This year a lot of those flaws still exist and it's becoming a problem again.

I agree that the halfcourt sets have not been good in recent years, with the exception of the end of last season when Lamb emerged and we started running stuff for him.

We've had good halfcourt offenses in the past. During KEA's time, we murdered teams in the halfcourt. Same with Butler's team in 2002 and the 2009 Final Four team (though that team ran a different offense designed to free Price on pick and rolls and Thabeet and Adrien in the post). For the most part, our halfcourt offense is good when we have a good primary wing scorer and a point guard and bigs who can exploit the defense when too much attention is paid to the top guy. We have the first part, and I think Shabazz looks for openings for the bigs, but they don't quite understand where to go. Add to that Lamb not being proficient at reading and reacting to how he's being defended, and the offense looks dead.
 
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Let's be serious, we have no low post presence. It's dunk or nothing for AD and the other low post players can't catch the ball or shoot it-no matter how close to the hoop they are positioned.

Someone didn't watch AD in the three games prior to Wednesday night.
 

ctchamps

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I agree that the halfcourt sets have not been good in recent years, with the exception of the end of last season when Lamb emerged and we started running stuff for him.

We've had good halfcourt offenses in the past. During KEA's time, we murdered teams in the halfcourt. Same with Butler's team in 2002 and the 2009 Final Four team (though that team ran a different offense designed to free Price on pick and rolls and Thabeet and Adrien in the post). For the most part, our halfcourt offense is good when we have a good primary wing scorer and a point guard and bigs who can exploit the defense when too much attention is paid to the top guy. We have the first part, and I think Shabazz looks for openings for the bigs, but they don't quite understand where to go. Add to that Lamb not being proficient at reading and reacting to how he's being defended, and the offense looks dead.
I want to commend you on your analysis. IMO, you really follow the play of the team as a whole and are not just focusing on who has the ball, but how all the UConn players are moving during the half court play. If you are correct, and I confess my observations of the playmaking is in agreement with what you have written, then the failure is not with Shabazz but with the execution by his team mates. I've enjoyed your posts.
 
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I want to commend you on your analysis. IMO, you really follow the play of the team as a whole and are not just focusing on who has the ball, but how all the UConn players are moving during the half court play. If you are correct, and I confess my observations of the playmaking is in agreement with what you have written, then the failure is not with Shabazz but with the execution by his team mates. I've enjoyed your posts.

Seriously man blaming the execution of everyone else but not Shabazz the point guard whose job is to make the game easier for everyone else and know where they like the ball. UConn in general has never been a good half court team with some notable exceptions as have been mentioned.

The team is not in sync because there is no identity and no leadership quality in anyone to will the team together and to get guys playing at their maximum level. Kemba, El-Amin, Rip were guys who elevated the play of the guys around them. Guys gave it their all for Kemba because he was an all around player who could do everything on the court defend, score, run up tempo and half court sets, encourage guys when they were down, etc, etc. Many guys on the team are not giving their maximum effort each and every night like last year and no one looks happy to be out there on the court playing basketball which is why Kemba said after the Cincinnati loss that these are not the same guys I played with last year.

If Shabazz as the point guard and according to you is the leader of the team then he has to take a good amount of criticism for his performance and the team's poor play. Everyone needs to be held accountable for their performance including Lamb who hasn't looked good defensively and doesnt demand the ball like a future lottery pick should.
 

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Seriously man blaming the execution of everyone else but not Shabazz the point guard whose job is to make the game easier for everyone else and know where they like the ball. UConn in general has never been a good half court team with some notable exceptions as have been mentioned.

The team is not in sync because there is no identity and no leadership quality in anyone to will the team together and to get guys playing at their maximum level. Kemba, El-Amin, Rip were guys who elevated the play of the guys around them. Guys gave it their all for Kemba because he was an all around player who could do everything on the court defend, score, run up tempo and half court sets, encourage guys when they were down, etc, etc. Many guys on the team are not giving their maximum effort each and every night like last year and no one looks happy to be out there on the court playing basketball which is why Kemba said after the Cincinnati loss that these are not the same guys I played with last year.

If Shabazz as the point guard and according to you is the leader of the team then he has to take a good amount of criticism for his performance and the team's poor play. Everyone needs to be held accountable for their performance including Lamb who hasn't looked good defensively and doesnt demand the ball like a future lottery pick should.

JC will be the one to hold players accountable, not entitled fans whose need for college basketball championships lead them to think that they have a right to be outraged at sophomores in college who are not quite perfect.
 

ctchamps

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Seriously man blaming the execution of everyone else but not Shabazz the point guard whose job is to make the game easier for everyone else and know where they like the ball. UConn in general has never been a good half court team with some notable exceptions as have been mentioned.

The team is not in sync because there is no identity and no leadership quality in anyone to will the team together and to get guys playing at their maximum level. Kemba, El-Amin, Rip were guys who elevated the play of the guys around them. Guys gave it their all for Kemba because he was an all around player who could do everything on the court defend, score, run up tempo and half court sets, encourage guys when they were down, etc, etc. Many guys on the team are not giving their maximum effort each and every night like last year and no one looks happy to be out there on the court playing basketball which is why Kemba said after the Cincinnati loss that these are not the same guys I played with last year.

If Shabazz as the point guard and according to you is the leader of the team then he has to take a good amount of criticism for his performance and the team's poor play. Everyone needs to be held accountable for their performance including Lamb who hasn't looked good defensively and doesnt demand the ball like a future lottery pick should.

It was incorrect of me to give Shabazz a total pass in not bearing responsibility for the loss. I was being a counterweight to the preponderance of posts that were foisting the majority of responsibility upon Shabazz for the Cincy loss and in doing so I underplayed his responsibility. I'm a firm believer when the team wins every player including the bench guys and coaches share the win, and when a team loses the same holds true.

I do place an element of value with leadership and positive reinforcement in helping generate motivation and positive performance.

Since I can't impact the players on the team because I have no exposure to them, the best I can do is try to encourage people in this forum to express themselves in a manner that you would like to see the team demonstrate. But I recognize that not all people have the capacity to be gracious and supportive. Not every player is cast in the die of a Kemba Walker and not every poster can express themselves in the same uplifting manner that Kemba was able to do last season. I can live with the posters being who they are in the same manner I can live with Shabazz being a different individual from Kemba. However since I can interact with people in this forum, I'll continue to try to encourage people to be supportive in their criticism as opposed to be derogatory or inflammatory. And I hope in my moments of human weakness, when I succumb to my anger, people will help me regain my composure.

I expected there to be a Kemba rebound this season not only with the loss of all that he did on the court but with many of us wishing he was still on the team. And I expected that his replacement would be expected to perform to Kemba's persona as well as his skill set. This is not always conscious on our parts but this behavior is typical. When JC finally retires, the next coach will have a difficult time because so many fans have identified the program with JC. Because we tend to identify ourselves with certain things including teams, JC's absence will be our loss. The next coach will have a difficult time in satisfying many of us no matter how successful he may be.

This is getting long. I apologize. As observers we see things in the course of a game. First, not everyone sees the same things. Even the best observers miss things. Second, even when people see the same set of events, there isn't always a consensus of about that event. We place different values and weights to each event because we are "biased". By this I mean every human computer (brain) is different and is programmed differently which leads to a biased or individualized perspective.

Shabazz has exceeded my expectations. I think his role as a leader has been more than adequate. I don't feel that he can be held accountable for AD and AO going a combined 3-16, or Jeremy going 5-12. In spite of these three players having a bad game on the offensive end, they were given more than enough opportunities. I would offer they should have had been given less chances given that they had contributed so many wasted offensive possessions.

Shabazz's failures were his five turnovers, one of which was a slip that we were all fortunate he didn't injure his knee, and the two times he let his player take a wide open shot. In these circumstances he was in control of the play and those failures could be directly attributed to him. How the players ran the plays while he was waiting to get them the ball, or how they handled the ball once they got it was up to the other players and not Shabazz's responsibility. You cannot will me to think or act differently than the way I want to think or act and the opposite holds true about me trying to influence you. This applies to Shabazz and his team mates. He can only ask them to perform to a standard. It is up to them to decide to comply.
 
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