Seth Davis: Who is a team outside the top 15 who could make a run at the Final Four?

[HooperScooper]

UConn, Louisville, Miami, Providence and Wichita State. We are definitely doomed!

1. UConn (unranked). Raise your hand if you’re tired of me pimping ... er, pumping UConn. Frankly, I was shocked to see the Huskies drop completely out of the AP poll this week. They lost by close margins on a neutral court to two teams (Syracuse and Gonzaga) ranked in the top 15. And as I wrote last week, the Huskies brought their C game at best.

http://www.si.com/college-basketbal...rizona-wildcats-sleeper-ncaa-tournament-teams

 

[Shabazzkets]

Lots of commentators are on our bandwagon, Tim Welsh (of all people) chief among them. We look great against cupcakes, though, which helps this early in the season. We'll need to deliver some top 25 wins or this "under the radar" hype will die down.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

Interesting teams SD chose. All of them (5) have the personnel in my opinion to click at the right time in March and break through and make it to the Final4. A healthy WSU? A Miami offense that has the potential to be potent but needs to shore up its perimeter D (that task in the hands of a coach whose defensive principles are worthy of trusting)? Providence who I thought looked impressive in their loss to arguably the best team in the country right now Michigan State (with possibly the best player in the country in Dunn)? UConn (for all the reasons the bullish optimists here remain hopeful) and Louisville.

I still wouldn't rule out Cincinnati. JMHO

 

[MexicoHusky]

Reputation alone gets us on the list. In fact, they probably made the list for us.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Interesting teams SD chose. All of them (5) have the personnel in my opinion to click at the right time in March and break through and make it to the Final4. A healthy WSU? A Miami offense that has the potential to be potent but needs to shore up its perimeter D (that task in the hands of a coach whose defensive principles are worthy of trusting)? Providence who I thought looked impressive in their loss to arguably the best team in the country right now Michigan State (with possibly the best player in the country in Dunn)? UConn (for all the reasons the bullish optimists here remain hopeful) and Louisville.

I still wouldn't rule out Cincinnati. JMHO

I think I'd honestly be less surprised if WSU, PU, or Miami made a deep run than if we did. I hate our guard play and our halfcourt offense looks totally disjointed. Seems like Gibbs doesn't have the burst to drive to the hoop (or the passing acumen to kick out) and Purvis shotputs every floater opportunity he gets. Adams either needs to be playing more or Hamilton needs to realize he's the best player on the court and be more aggressive.

I'm also very worried about the perimeter defense on this team, at this point it seems like Adams would be the only guard with the defensive chops to shut down a hot guard on the other team.

 

[superjohn]

I think I'd honestly be less surprised if WSU, PU, or Miami made a deep run than if we did. I hate our guard play and our halfcourt offense looks totally disjointed. Seems like Gibbs doesn't have the burst to drive to the hoop (or the passing acumen to kick out) and Purvis shotputs every floater opportunity he gets. Adams either needs to be playing more or Hamilton needs to realize he's the best player on the court and be more aggressive.

I'm also very worried about the perimeter defense on this team, at this point it seems like Adams would be the only guard with the defensive chops to shut down a hot guard on the other team.

Lol

 

[August_West]

I really wish Seth would stop licking our taint. Smells like bad mojo to me.

 

[Jerry1714]

Reputation alone gets us on the list. In fact, they probably made the list for us.

You could not be wrong if you tried.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Lol

I'd rather have 1 Batman than a bunch of Robins. Gibbs would be much better as an off the ball spot up shooter, problem is we have Purvis who's more athletic and more acclimated to the UConn system. The reason the offense runs through Hamilton isn't purely because he's a great passer with amazing court vision, it's also because these are traits that Gibbs lacks.

 

[Rocktheworld]

More doomed than the Persian messengers in 300.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

I think I'd honestly be less surprised if WSU, PU, or Miami made a deep run than if we did. I hate our guard play and our halfcourt offense looks totally disjointed. Seems like Gibbs doesn't have the burst to drive to the hoop (or the passing acumen to kick out) and Purvis shotputs every floater opportunity he gets. Adams either needs to be playing more or Hamilton needs to realize he's the best player on the court and be more aggressive.

I'm also very worried about the perimeter defense on this team, at this point it seems like Adams would be the only guard with the defensive chops to shut down a hot guard on the other team.

In all honesty your criticism is warranted to a certain degree as it relates to Gibbs/Purvis and the team in general. I am buying into the fact though that right now we clearly are not 1 of the top 15 teams in the country. Because that was the premise of the SD article I think it is reasonable to categorize UConn as one of 5 teams that can right the ship and erase some of the problems you bring up. Will it happen? I am in hold mode on that at the moment. However if UConn beats Maryland on a neutral court (yep MSG for selection committee purposes) UConn will quickly erase some of the bearish sentiment surrounding our Huskies.

Right now I wouldn't pick UConn to beat Providence, Miami or WSU either. Tuesday night that can all change!

 

[James]

I'd rather have 1 Batman than a bunch of Robins. Gibbs would be much better as an off the ball spot up shooter, problem is we have Purvis who's more athletic and more acclimated to the UConn system. The reason the offense runs through Hamilton isn't purely because he's a great passer with amazing court vision, it's also because these are traits that Gibbs lacks.

I'm not enthralled with Gibbs' output in the Bahamas , but you're being unreasonable. This is basically a new team , there are a ton of hurdles involved with acclimating the personnel . Miller has made his mark as probably our best offensive player with his post efficiency , but Gibbs is still feeling things out .

You should understand Gibbs is still an elite college shooter and a heady playmaker; we know this because he's logged a crap ton of d1 minutes.. I see uconn as a team that's still gelling but has flaunted some offensive ability us fans haven't seen in YEARS . Tons of upside. Maybe Seth Davis has grown wiser since he was snot nosed youngin on cbs during the 2000s.

That said certain players need to hit the film room and understand the basic philosophies of a good man2man defense( ie getting over screens , closing out well , and most of all communicating)

 

[Husky1964]

PeeCeee??????????????????? When was their last Big Dance win???? That counts u know.Veteran leadership.

 

[David 76]

If we lose to MD by 3, how bad will we suck then?

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

If we lose to MD by 3, how bad will we suck then?

LOL....prolly close to the actual line give or take a point or 2.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

I'm not enthralled with Gibbs' output in the Bahamas , but you're being unreasonable. This is basically a new team , there are a ton of hurdles involved with acclimating the personnel . Miller has made his mark as probably our best offensive player with his post efficiency , but Gibbs is still feeling things out .

You should understand Gibbs is still an elite college shooter and a heady playmaker; we know this because he's logged a crap ton of d1 minutes.. I see uconn as a team that's still gelling but has flaunted some offensive ability us fans haven't seen in YEARS . Tons of upside. Maybe Seth Davis has grown wiser since he was snot nosed youngin on cbs during the 2000s.

That said certain players need to hit the film room and understand the basic philosophies of a good man2man defense( ie getting over screens , closing out well , and most of all communicating)

It's not really being unreasonable to say that Gibbs isn't a true pg, even last year he had a 3.8/2.0 A/TO ratio, and that was when the ball was in his hands all the time. I never said he wasn't an elite shooter, in fact the reason I think Adams should play more and keep Gibbs off the ball is because he's such a good shooter. Aside from that, Gibbs is a 5th year player, so transferring or not, he's going to have the same skills going forward that he's shown up to this point. In my opinion he'd be much more effective as a spot up corner shooter because he's not a great passer and he doesn't have the ability to penetrate and collapse a defense with the ball in his hands.

I'm not sure about saying this team has the most offensive potential any team has had in years, I think we'd need a true pg and for Hamilton to either develop a reliable shot/midrange/cut to basket move to make that happen. The halfcourt offense is currently much too stagnant except when Adams is in.

 

[Jerry1714]

In all honesty your criticism is warranted to a certain degree as it relates to Gibbs/Purvis and the team in general. I am buying into the fact though that right now we clearly are not 1 of the top 15 teams in the country. Because that was the premise of the SD article I think it is reasonable to categorize UConn as one of 5 teams that can right the ship and erase some of the problems you bring up. Will it happen? I am in hold mode on that at the moment. However if UConn beats Maryland on a neutral court (yep MSG for selection committee purposes) UConn will quickly erase some of the bearish sentiment surrounding our Huskies.

Right now I wouldn't pick UConn to beat Providence, Miami or WSU either. Tuesday night that can all change!

Clearly you have not watched PC, Miami or WSU play.

Which of the 2 WSU wins really impressed you? The one against Charleston Southern or was it the Emporia St. one?

I get people are slow and see we lose so that means we stink, but some of these posts are absurd.

 

[Jay-Bone]

I think I'd honestly be less surprised if WSU, PU, or Miami made a deep run than if we did. I hate our guard play and our halfcourt offense looks totally disjointed. Seems like Gibbs doesn't have the burst to drive to the hoop (or the passing acumen to kick out) and Purvis shotputs every floater opportunity he gets. Adams either needs to be playing more or Hamilton needs to realize he's the best player on the court and be more aggressive.

I'm also very worried about the perimeter defense on this team, at this point it seems like Adams would be the only guard with the defensive chops to shut down a hot guard on the other team.

You do realize there's a difference between November ball and March ball, don't you? I recommend slowing your roll....but I can only recommend. There was a you in November '10 and there was a you in November '13. Don't be another you.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

Clearly you have not watched PC, Miami or WSU play.

Which of the 2 WSU wins really impressed you? The one against Charleston Southern or was it the Emporia St. one?

I get people are slow and see we lose so that means we stink, but some of these posts are absurd.

Clearly you have not watched PC, Miami or WSU play.

Which of the 2 WSU wins really impressed you? The one against Charleston Southern or was it the Emporia St. one?

I get people are slow and see we lose so that means we stink, but some of these posts are absurd.

Fair points on WSU. I was looking at the match-up with UConn within the context of the Davis article and giving WSU the benefit of being at full strength (so maybe that's the disconnect?). In my opinion both teams (UConn) at full strength would be a toss up. Miami beat Utah, Butler and a respectable Nebraska team on the road. I watched all 3 games. Northeastern is not exactly a scrub team either. It was a WTF loss indeed no question there. Still if you look at the Hurricanes 8 deep roster it is legit. So is their coach. IMO. Miami should be top 3 in the ACC when all is said and done.

Providence well...I have watched them a bunch of times.

 

[Jerry1714]

Fair points on WSU. I was looking at the match-up with UConn within the context of the Davis article and giving WSU the benefit of being at full strength (so maybe that's the disconnect?). In my opinion both teams (UConn) at full strength would be a toss up. Miami beat Utah, Butler and a respectable Nebraska team on the road. I watched all 3 games. Northeastern is not exactly a scrub team either. It was a WTF loss indeed no question there. Still if you look at the Hurricanes 8 deep roster it is legit. So is their coach. IMO. Miami should be top 3 in the ACC when all is said and done.

Providence well...I have watched them a bunch of times.

PC beats an average Zona team without their best player and lose to the only other team they play with a pulse and suddenly people think they are great, so odd. Outside of Dunn that roster is bad, Bentil is good but the rest of the team stinks. They beat a terrible Illinois team by 1 at home. The same Illinois team who lost to Chattanooga and North Florida. PC is not good, but hey you thought WSU is better then us too so what should I expect.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

PC beats an average Zona team without their best player and lose to the only other team they play with a pulse and suddenly people think they are great, so odd. Outside of Dunn that roster is bad, Bentil is good but the rest of the team stinks. They beat a terrible Illinois team by 1 at home. The same Illinois team who lost to Chattanooga and North Florida. PC is not good, but hey you thought WSU is better then us too so what should I expect.

The focus of the article related to teams that may be undervalued. Providence has a strength of schedule right now that ranks higher than UConn (KP). So keep that in mind ok? Just for the sake of comparison. I still think UConn has the higher ceiling.

On a neutral court with both WSU and UConn at full strength (WSU with Frankamp) I would never bet on UConn to win right now (our defensive schemes). Losing FVV is like losing Hamilton. I am cautiously optimistic about the Maryland game. I am not as high on Syracuse as you are. Even though they are good.

Have a good1 bro.

 

[Waquoit]

I really wish Seth would stop licking our taint. Smells like bad mojo to me.

Exactly. While I appreciate the kind words for my team, this is still the guy who called the Squid a genius for going zone in the NC game. Even though they only cut the lead a few points, we still got good looks and 2 out of our top 3 players were on the bench with 2 fouls.

 

[Jerry1714]

The focus of the article related to teams that may be undervalued. Providence has a strength of schedule right now that ranks higher than UConn (KP). So keep that in mind ok? Just for the sake of comparison. I still think UConn has the higher ceiling.

On a neutral court with both WSU and UConn at full strength (WSU with Frankamp) I would never bet on UConn to win right now (our defensive schemes). Losing FVV is like losing Hamilton. I am cautiously optimistic about the Maryland game. I am not as high on Syracuse as you are. Even though they are good.

Have a good1 bro.

The article was about teams who could go to the Final Four who are not ranked in the top 15. Not hard to understand.

PC has a higher SOS because of their dregs are better than our dregs. They have 1 game against a top 50 RPI team, we have 3. If you like KenPom you realize PC is 49th and UConn is 20th?

I am not high on Cuse, I just have the ability to recognize we played bad and lost, not that since we lost we are a bad team, something you do not seem to understand.

You obviously are very high on a guy, Frankump, who has averaged 2 points a game in his career.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

The article was about teams who could go to the Final Four who are not ranked in the top 15. Not hard to understand.

PC has a higher SOS because of their dregs are better than our dregs. They have 1 game against a top 50 RPI team, we have 3. If you like KenPom you realize PC is 49th and UConn is 20th?

I am not high on Cuse, I just have the ability to recognize we played bad and lost, not that since we lost we are a bad team, something you do not seem to understand.

You obviously are very high on a guy, Frankump, who has averaged 2 points a game in his career.

Isn't that what undervalued means? Outside the Top 15 with Final4 potential? It just appeared to me from your post that you were focusing in on SOS. So from that perspective Providence arguably has played a tougher schedule than UConn. I am not adverse to any metric though my friend. Your post just seemed to scream Providence has played and beaten nobody in comparison to UConn.

I am more interested in how the WSU coach feels about Frankamp. My point really is that he adds a dynamic to that particular team that could turn out to be indispensable looking forward. He has limitations but within the context of what WSU may need to take them to the next level he may fit in VERY well. Where did I say UConn was a bad team? lol...UConn could still be good and lose to Providence, Miami or a full strength WSU team. I think UConn can make the Final4 that's why I agreed with the article. Do you understand better now? Thanks

Gregg Marshall told @CBSSports that Conner Frankamp is the best shooter he's coached in 31 years. KU transfer is eligible in December.

 

[Jerry1714]

Isn't that what undervalued means? Outside the Top 15 with Final4 potential? It just appeared to me from your post that you were focusing in on SOS. So from that perspective Providence arguably has played a tougher schedule than UConn. I am not adverse to any metric though my friend. Your post just seemed to scream Providence has played and beaten nobody in comparison to UConn.

I am more interested in how the WSU coach feels about Frankamp. My point really is that he adds a dynamic to that particular team that could turn out to be indispensable looking forward. He has limitations but within the context of what WSU may need to take them to the next level he may fit in VERY well. Where did I say UConn was a bad team? lol...UConn could still be good and lose to Providence, Miami or a full strength WSU team. I think UConn can make the Final4 that's why I agreed with the article. Do you understand better now? Thanks

Gregg Marshall told @CBSSports that Conner Frankamp is the best shooter he's coached in 31 years. KU transfer is eligible in December.

My point is UConn is a better team than PC, Miami and WSU, and with PC and WSU I do not think it is even close.

You said "Right now I wouldn't pick UConn to beat Providence, Miami or WSU either." Which I firmly disagree with, that is all.