Samson Johnson - The Value of Waiting Your Turn. Will the Fab Five Follow the Model? What Say You?

[Jbirdp5]

It's not even clear what your point is: transfers are bad? transfers are good? giving freshmen playing time is good, but it's bad if it's not the right kind of playing time? the existence of transfers is inhibiting the development of guys like Ross? if freshman don't play - no matter how ready they are - it's bad for the team? or it's bad for them and they should leave? or it's bad coaching? It's a mystery.

Thank you…I thought I knew what @HuskyWarrior611 was trying to say but it has become less and less clear every time he posts…..I do know that Hurley is a player development coach and he has proven that over and over in his 5 years here….and he’s definitely more positive on game day with young guys making mistakes than Calhoun was….so I don’t get any of his points

 

[Scot-e]

I'm very interested to see what our combo of bigs can do against a quality 5 man tonight. Want SJ to chase him all over the court!

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Thank you…I thought I knew what @HuskyWarrior611 was trying to say but it has become less and less clear every time he posts…..I do know that Hurley is a player development coach and he has proven that over and over in his 5 years here….and he’s definitely more positive on game day with young guys making mistakes than Calhoun was….so I don’t get any of his points

I’m responding to this because it seems like genuine confusion.

Points:

- Offensive development =\ shooting 3s. Teach these guys, especially Solo, other offensive skills. That’s all I’ve seen from Hurley so far offensively. Of course he’s a master defensive coach, that goes without saying.

- Have a better plan for freshmen to contribute coming in. Calhoun and Ollie turned guys like Beverly, Austrie, Amida, Olander into guys with very firm roles that made sense their freshman years who are way less talented than the guys Hurley brings in. Solo should be getting reps as a backup PG if that’s what he’ll be in the future. Not as a 3 and D guy. You have to trust a freshman PG for that to happen though. If Beverly and Austrie could do it, I don’t see any reason Solo can’t.

- Yelling =\ negativity, Calhoun for sure trusted his freshmen guys more than Hurley does. The proof is how the guys who ended up being successful here all positively contributed their first year, even the examples above. Outside of a few names from the 90s.

Maybe the transfer portal did change how freshmen are seen nowadays, but damn I miss enjoying just how well prepared and confident our freshmen always seemed to be under Calhoun.

And no, I’m not worried about these guys down the road. I trust that when they have real roles that make sense and our given the leash upperclassmen are they will be fine.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

I’m responding to this because it seems like genuine confusion.

Points:

- Offensive development =\ shooting 3s. Teach these guys, especially Solo, other offensive skills. That’s all I’ve seen from Hurley so far offensively. Of course he’s a master defensive coach, that goes without saying.

- Have a better plan for freshmen to contribute coming in. Calhoun and Ollie turned guys like Beverly, Austrie, Amida, Olander into guys with very firm roles that made sense their freshman years who are way less talented than the guys Hurley brings in. Solo should be getting reps as a backup PG if that’s what he’ll be in the future. Not as a 3 and D guy. You have to trust a freshman PG for that to happen though. If Beverly and Austrie could do it, I don’t see any reason Solo can’t.

- Yelling =\ negativity, Calhoun for sure trusted his freshmen guys more than Hurley does. The proof is how the guys who ended up being successful here all positively contributed their first year, even the examples above. Outside of a few names from the 90s.

Maybe the transfer portal did change how freshmen are seen nowadays, but damn I miss enjoying just how well prepared and confident our freshmen always seemed to be under Calhoun.

And no, I’m not worried about these guys down the road. I trust that when they have real roles that make sense and our given the leash upperclassmen are they will be fine.

I'm tapped out on this. It's just completely disconnected from reality. Craig Austrie started as a freshman because Marcus Williams was suspended and the team needed a point guard. Tyler Olander averaged 1.5 pts per game as a freshman and 1.8 pts per game as a senior. Donnell Beverly? Great dude but is this serious? He averaged less than a point a game as a freshman and less than 1.5 pts per game for his career. Were you old enough to watch UConn basketball when these guys were actually in the program? Your argument is that Solo projects as a point guard so he should play that position now and Hurley should just "trust him." This is crazy. Have you seen something from him that indicates he should be running the point right now?

As far as the stuff about Calhoun trusting freshman more and not yelling at them . . . it's not even something you should be able to say with a straight face. It's a freaking absurdity. And I absolutely love Jim Calhoun. I question whether you were old enough to follow these teams.

 

[Jbirdp5]

I’m responding to this because it seems like genuine confusion.

Points:

- Offensive development =\ shooting 3s. Teach these guys, especially Solo, other offensive skills. That’s all I’ve seen from Hurley so far offensively. Of course he’s a master defensive coach, that goes without saying.

- Have a better plan for freshmen to contribute coming in. Calhoun and Ollie turned guys like Beverly, Austrie, Amida, Olander into guys with very firm roles that made sense their freshman years who are way less talented than the guys Hurley brings in. Solo should be getting reps as a backup PG if that’s what he’ll be in the future. Not as a 3 and D guy. You have to trust a freshman PG for that to happen though. If Beverly and Austrie could do it, I don’t see any reason Solo can’t.

- Yelling =\ negativity, Calhoun for sure trusted his freshmen guys more than Hurley does. The proof is how the guys who ended up being successful here all positively contributed their first year, even the examples above. Outside of a few names from the 90s.

Maybe the transfer portal did change how freshmen are seen nowadays, but damn I miss enjoying just how well prepared and confident our freshmen always seemed to be under Calhoun.

And no, I’m not worried about these guys down the road. I trust that when they have real roles that make sense and our given the leash upperclassmen are they will be fine.

Olander was never more than a sparingly used guy his entire career, Austrie was in and out of the rotation his whole career…ended playing less than he started….beverly never had a very significant role in the teams success
Pretty sure @husky429 has said solo is not a point guard and I trust his judgement on this type of thing…so not sure why you think he’s supposed to be a point
I just think you see one thing and are making exaggerated conclusions based on a very small sample size…solo is not driving enough for your liking so that means Hurley is trying to make him a shooter and isn’t developing his game…or Hawkins got pulled from the auburn game and his confidence was low so now Hurley deflates freshman confidence and doesn’t give them clear roles….
I think in both cases ur observations are inaccurate

 

[Jbirdp5]

I'm tapped out on this. It's just completely disconnected from reality. Craig Austrie started as a freshman because Marcus Williams was suspended and the team needed a point guard. Tyler Olander averaged 1.5 pts per game as a freshman and 1.8 pts per game as a senior. Donnell Beverly? Great dude but is this serious? He averaged less than a point a game as a freshman and less than 1.5 pts per game for his career. Were you old enough to watch UConn basketball when these guys were actually in the program? Your argument is that Solo projects as a point guard so he should play that position now and Hurley should just "trust him." This is crazy. Have you seen something from him that indicates he should be running the point right now?

As far as the stuff about Calhoun trusting freshman more and not yelling at them . . . it's not even something you should be able to say with a straight face. It's a freaking absurdity. And I absolutely love Jim Calhoun. I question whether you were old enough to follow these teams.

I should have read this before responding but I find it funny that we both brought up the same 3 players as terrible examples of things he is using as an example of Calhouns freshman development plan

 

[husky429]

Olander was never more than a sparingly used guy his entire career, Austrie was in and out of the rotation his whole career…ended playing less than he started….beverly never had a very significant role in the teams success
Pretty sure @husky429 has said solo is not a point guard and I trust his judgement on this type of thing…so not sure why you think he’s supposed to be a point
I just think you see one thing and are making exaggerated conclusions based on a very small sample size…solo is not driving enough for your liking so that means Hurley is trying to make him a shooter and isn’t developing his game…or Hawkins got pulled from the auburn game and his confidence was low so now Hurley deflates freshman confidence and doesn’t give them clear roles….
I think in both cases ur observations are inaccurate

I don't think he has true PG potential, but I see the potential to be an elite second ballhandling option after he keeps developing. He has all the pieces to handle it in the open court, get downhill in the half-court, and shoot the rock well enough to keep defenses honest.

Biggest issue IMO is the relative lack of assists much more than his handles. He has 7 assists in 170 minutes and never really showed much of a propensity for passing in high school. It's much easier to teach someone to translate shooting from practice to games, or improve ballhandling than to improve passing. It is exceptionally difficult and a long road to become a better passer--a lot of it is either innate or learned at a young age.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Olander was never more than a sparingly used guy his entire career, Austrie was in and out of the rotation his whole career…ended playing less than he started….beverly never had a very significant role in the teams success
Pretty sure @husky429 has said solo is not a point guard and I trust his judgement on this type of thing…so not sure why you think he’s supposed to be a point
I just think you see one thing and are making exaggerated conclusions based on a very small sample size…solo is not driving enough for your liking so that means Hurley is trying to make him a shooter and isn’t developing his game…or Hawkins got pulled from the auburn game and his confidence was low so now Hurley deflates freshman confidence and doesn’t give them clear roles….
I think in both cases ur observations are inaccurate

I’m not saying those guys had successful careers. They’re examples of how guys with much less talent were made useful in some way or form. If they can find success in a role (however small it may be) for winning teams, I find it hard that some of these guys can’t do something. But I don’t want to harp on that too much.

Me and husky429 obviously have much different opinions on how we see basketball. I’m not going off something just because he says it. The guy also said Solo is a 3, which if that’s the case then why are we recruiting a 6’3 SF. Why he’s determined to put a cap on how good Solo can be i have no idea.

I’ve played and worked in basketball enough to have my own opinions and evaluations on things though and to me, if he can groom him into the position he’s a Russel Westbrook like lottery pick. Westbrook also played for UCLA for 2 years as a combo guard. But Hurley has to show he knows how to groom a PG. so far they’ve all been transfers 5 years in.

It’s a proven fact Solo was 2nd on the team in assists in Europe. I’m not sure how we go from that to not trusting him to be able to be a PG and making him a 3 and D guy. That doesn’t make sense to me.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Have you seen something from him that indicates he should be running the point right now?

As far as the stuff about Calhoun trusting freshman more and not yelling at them . . . it's not even something you should be able to say with a straight face. It's a freaking absurdity. And I absolutely love Jim Calhoun. I question whether you were old enough to follow these teams.

He was 2nd on the team in assists in Europe as the backup PG.

I never said he didn’t yell at them. I said yelling at them does not mean he didn’t trust them. Hell, he pulled Dyson 2 minutes into the John Wall Kentucky game (or maybe it was Memphis D Rose?) as a Senior. That’s just how Calhoun was to everyone.

 

[JohnnyJr]

I’m not saying those guys had successful careers. They’re examples of how guys with much less talent were made useful in some way or form. If they can find success in a role (however small it may be) for winning teams, I find it hard that some of these guys can’t do something. But I don’t want to harp on that too much.

Me and husky429 obviously have much different opinions on how we see basketball. I’m not going off something just because he says it. The guy also said Solo is a 3, which if that’s the case then why are we recruiting a 6’3 SF. Why he’s determined to put a cap on how good Solo can be i have no idea.

I’ve played and worked in basketball enough to have my own opinions and evaluations on things though and to me, if he can groom him into the position he’s a Russel Westbrook like lottery pick. Westbrook also played for UCLA for 2 years as a combo guard. But Hurley has to show he knows how to groom a PG. so far they’ve all been transfers 5 years in.

It’s a proven fact Solo was 2nd on the team in assists in Europe. I’m not sure how we go from that to not trusting him to be able to be a PG and making him a 3 and D guy. That doesn’t make sense to me.

We don’t need him to be a pg, we have Newton and Spencer handling the ball right now. Castle can run point too when he comes back and Newton is on the bench. I can kind of get the argument that he should drive more but I haven’t seen anything to show he’s ready to be a PG. That would be something to work on in the offseason, we’d need it next year if he could do it.

 

[JustbrewitMan]

I’m responding to this because it seems like genuine confusion.

Points:

- Offensive development =\ shooting 3s. Teach these guys, especially Solo, other offensive skills. That’s all I’ve seen from Hurley so far offensively. Of course he’s a master defensive coach, that goes without saying.

- Have a better plan for freshmen to contribute coming in. Calhoun and Ollie turned guys like Beverly, Austrie, Amida, Olander into guys with very firm roles that made sense their freshman years who are way less talented than the guys Hurley brings in. Solo should be getting reps as a backup PG if that’s what he’ll be in the future. Not as a 3 and D guy. You have to trust a freshman PG for that to happen though. If Beverly and Austrie could do it, I don’t see any reason Solo can’t.

- Yelling =\ negativity, Calhoun for sure trusted his freshmen guys more than Hurley does. The proof is how the guys who ended up being successful here all positively contributed their first year, even the examples above. Outside of a few names from the 90s.

Maybe the transfer portal did change how freshmen are seen nowadays, but damn I miss enjoying just how well prepared and confident our freshmen always seemed to be under Calhoun.

And no, I’m not worried about these guys down the road. I trust that when they have real roles that make sense and our given the leash upperclassmen are they will be fine.

Even though you're absolutely positively insane with these takes,..I'll play along...

Give me your insights on Alex Karaban's offensive game in his time here at UConn...

I'll hang up and listen.

 

[husky429]

Even though you're absolutely positively insane with these takes,..I'll play along...

Give me your insights on Alex Karaban's offensive game in his time here at UConn...

I'll hang up and listen.

I had to log out to see what this clown was saying. It's more unhinged than I expected.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

We don’t need him to be a pg, we have Newton and Spencer handling the ball right now. Castle can run point too when he comes back and Newton is on the bench. I can kind of get the argument that he should drive more but I haven’t seen anything to show he’s ready to be a PG. That would be something to work on in the offseason, we’d need it next year if he could do it.

I already outlined Europe. I don’t know why everyone wants to completely ignore and dismiss what he did there just to agree with husky429.

There was no reason at all that he couldn’t have handled PG/lead guard duties for 5-10 mins a game while Newton rested during the stretch of cupcakes we played to get his feet wet and learn. That would’ve been way more productive and confidence building for him than firing up 3s for “reps” purposes.

Even though you're absolutely positively insane with these takes,..I'll play along...

Give me your insights on Alex Karaban's offensive game in his time here at UConn...

I'll hang up and listen.

He came in with a very well rounded and polished offensive game. He’s only gotten more consistent as he’s gotten older but I’m not sure if he necessarily added anything.

But it’s early to tell too because he hasn’t had to do much so far outside of play within the flow of the offense. I was impressed by some of the shots he hit against Texas with his turnaround fadeaway and his pull up. Actually think perfecting that to make him a legit 3 level scorer is his next step to being a really unstoppable player which he’s very capable of being.

Would actually love to see more Karaban post ups.

 

[superjohn]

 

[Umami Zen]

Don't see Solo ever as a primary ball handler. Secondary and opportunistic off of fast breaks and steals. What he has done well for a freshman with 7 games under his belt is not turn the ball over and provide hustle plays. Room for improvement? Of course. Would like to see the ball go through the hoop for him . Thrown in the fire sooner than anyone would expect due to Castle injury which ripples through rotations and subbing patterns.

He'll be providing solid minutes/production sooner rather than later.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

So absolutely no one wants to address this:

Post in thread 'Box Scores'
Box Scores

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Biggest issue IMO is the relative lack of assists much more than his handles. He has 7 assists in 170 minutes and never really showed much of a propensity for passing in high school. It's much easier to teach someone to translate shooting from practice to games, or improve ballhandling than to improve passing. It is exceptionally difficult and a long road to become a better passer--a lot of it is either innate or learned at a young age.

Him not showing an ability to pass is false because of Europe. He showed it then.

He has 7 assists because that hasn’t been his role. His role has been as a catch and shoot guy. But he’s shown when given that role he can pass just fine.

I don’t know what this guy is watching a lot of the times.

The fact that everyone keeps ignoring this clear fact of Solo’s makes me think this is not genuine.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

View attachment 93580

Can you at least wait for someone to address Europe lmao

 

[Jbirdp5]

I’m not saying those guys had successful careers. They’re examples of how guys with much less talent were made useful in some way or form. If they can find success in a role (however small it may be) for winning teams, I find it hard that some of these guys can’t do something. But I don’t want to harp on that too much.

Me and husky429 obviously have much different opinions on how we see basketball. I’m not going off something just because he says it. The guy also said Solo is a 3, which if that’s the case then why are we recruiting a 6’3 SF. Why he’s determined to put a cap on how good Solo can be i have no idea.

I’ve played and worked in basketball enough to have my own opinions and evaluations on things though and to me, if he can groom him into the position he’s a Russel Westbrook like lottery pick. Westbrook also played for UCLA for 2 years as a combo guard. But Hurley has to show he knows how to groom a PG. so far they’ve all been transfers 5 years in.

It’s a proven fact Solo was 2nd on the team in assists in Europe. I’m not sure how we go from that to not trusting him to be able to be a PG and making him a 3 and D guy. That doesn’t make sense to me.

I think ur logic is severely flawed. So now Calhoun did a better job with freshmen not because he developed them better but because they had a specific role? Olander played like 5 min a game and because he had a specific role that’s better than what solo ball has been doing for 7 games? It’s just wild that you think that.
Secondly Westbrook is the only player in the last 50 years to average a triple double…let’s come up with realistic player comps for Solo

 

[BuffaloHusky]

One of the most exciting thing about being a fan during these Hurley years is watching the jumps players make season to season. With that said, I can't wait to see who makes the leap next year and hopefully that includes all the players who aren't guaranteed an NBA draft selection.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

I think ur logic is severely flawed. So now Calhoun did a better job with freshmen not because he developed them better but because they had a specific role? Olander played like 5 min a game and because he had a specific role that’s better than what solo ball has been doing for 7 games? It’s just wild that you think that.
Secondly Westbrook is the only player in the last 50 years to average a triple double…let’s come up with realistic player comps for Solo

Sorry if that’s what it sounded like but that’s not what I was saying. Going to jus t drop that.

Comps are just that. Not saying Solo is going to average a triple double, but his current physical makeup and skillset is that of a Russell Westbrook at UCLA.

On to a win at Kansas tonight though!