Rhode Island Post Game Thread

[RuffRuff]

So yea, I admit to being a Samson Stan. So all the incessant complaining about his deficiencies irk me. Granted, I do agree with some of them. But in true internet message board fashion, I think it gets exaggerated.

What follows is a long post, but I am critically re-watching the game possession-by-possession for objective analyses of SJ criticism points. There;'s a TL/DR summary at the end for ADHD folks. I'll get to the rest of the game later.

Here's narrative summary of his first rotation (from 20:00 to 15:18). Note: O1, D1, etc is offensive possession #1, defensive possession #1, etc. RebO = having a legitimate opportunity for a rebound on the play.


O1-Comes out to 3pt line. Sets 3 screens, McNeeley drives & scores while SJ still at 3pt line. No RebO

D1-On JB. High-hedges. Recovers. Does effective seal-out of JB. 3pt shot from corner clanks opposite side long, Ball with RB. No RebO.

O2-Offensive set again takes SJ out high. Enters lane when Ball shoots [and hits] corner 3. JB boxes him out since already has position established. No RebO

D2-Picks up JB at foul line. JB gets position on left side, seals. SJ re-establishes position between JB & basket. Ball reverses & play stops (? Kick ball or foul…announcers never say). Inbounds play…pass goes to JB at FT line. He passes off , rest of play SJ/JB are inconsequential. URI makes the shot. No RebO

O3-SJ set 2 high screens including the 1 that frees AK for a made 3. No RebO

D3-SJ sets up guarding JB on the blocks. Diarra steals pass at top of key. Takes it to hoop for a layup.

D4-URI pushes pace. Guard beats McNeeley down court for a layup. SJ hustles back, alters shot/may have gotten a finger on ball to block shot, missed layup URI. SJ momentum takes him under hoop, JB cleans up rebound. McNeeley fouls JB on putback. JB makes 1st FT, misses 2nd. SJ boxes out on left side OK, McNeeley gathers miss on right side. No RebO

O4-Classic beautiful UConn set, SJ sets a couple high screens, then PnR, SJ open, but Diarra lob is right over the hoop; SJ can’t dunk it without committing a goaltend.

D5-URI pushes pace after missed lob. SJ has to recover from under hoop; is ~5 yds behind all players, URI sets at top of key; McNeeley is under hoop. Left side has 2 open URI players at 3pt line. SJ runs out to cover one. JB flashes from FT line to hoop; SB rotates down to cover him (setting up a mismatch). SJ guards URI player in corner; he lobs it into JB, who gets fouled on the layup attempt by Diarra who rotates down to help SB. Nothing SJ does wrong here. JB makes the And-1. No RebO.

O5-Set starts. SJ sets effective screen at FT line to free McNeeley who misses 3pt attempt. SJ naturally out of good Reb position due to setting the screen. Reb goes left. SB grabs it and puts it back for the make. No RebO.

D6-SJ effectively battles with JB underneath. Play rotates from left to right. Shot goes up from left. SJ boxes out JB. Both are slightly left-center, a couple feet from the rim. Purists would say it may have been a little weak box-out technique-wise. Rebound goes left-baseline though, and Ball secures the RB. No RebO.

O6-SB pushes pace, SJ and JB come up court behind SB. SJ goes to left corner of FT line (to establish position for offensive set). SB hucks up a quick 3. JB naturally has position on SJ. He seals SJ. Another URI player gets the rebound. No RebO.

D7-URI player drives from top of key left side, gets a step on AK. SJ comes off JB to try and block the layup. Alters shot, it misses, but JB is left open to get Reb since SJ came to help. JB is fouled on the putback attempt by Diarra. No RebO. Could maybe quibble about if SJ should have leaked off JB to help. But I’m not a UConn coach so I don’t know what SJ should do there. JB makes both FTs.

O7-SJ starts high in the set. Gets ball, dishes to Mahaney, flashes down lane, is open for alley-oop but Mahaney misses opportunity. Ball reverses to right, Karaban shoots a 3. SJ is on the left block after curling around after his flash to the hoop. JB comes over to box out. SJ side-steps him, but stays behind him (probably not a bad thing since 3s usually miss long. Rebound goes high and long to the left FT line. Both SJ and Solo go after the Reb, both get a hand on it, it gets bounced on the floor. A 50/50 ball, URI player gets it, McNeeley strips it, SB recovers, and dishes to AK for the easy layup. SJ in position to get a Reb but he & Ball both deflect it (and it stays alive). RebO but no Reb, but play stays alive.

D8-JB gets good position down low with SJ on his back. Entry pass from FT line. JB pivots, goes right drop step. SJ contests, doesn’t foul, JB makes tough contested layup. No RebO, of course.

O8-Standard set. SJ sets a couple of FT line screens, flashes under hoop, goes to right side. SB drives around Mahaney into lane, pulls up and makes the jumper. JB stays on SJ on right side to keep lane open for the drive. No RebO.

D9-SJ & JB start down low. JB flashed up to 3pt line. Two URI guards on right side. JB looks to be setting a screen. SJ looks like he may have been anticipating this and sets his defense back-right of JB. But JB immediately cuts to the hoop. SJ in bad position. Kudos to JB and the URI set need to be made though. AK rotates over to guard JB, who receives the pass on the right block. SJ rotates down to double-team. JB could have been called for a travel, but instead a foul is called. Honestly, could have been called on either AK or SJ. Not sure who got called (think it was SJ), announcers didn’t say and then it went to commercial break.


TL/DR: What are the BY’s biggest beefs about SJ?

“Fouls too much!” - Welp, he made a ton of nice screens, played a lot of decent/adequate post defense, and got called for 1 questionable foul.

“Doesn’t Rebound” - Technically true, but his role in offensive sets often clearly puts him in no position/bad position to rebound. The one legitimate opportunity he had, he was there (with SB), and both tipped it away from each other. Both teams also made a ton of shots in this first 5min stretch…not many legit opportunities to grab rebounds.

“Only Dunks” – In this 5minute stretch, technically true, but he did not have any opportunities to legitimately do anything to take a post shot/jumper the way the offensive possessions went.

“High Hedges too much and gets burned on it and it ruins the defense” – Nope, didn’t happen in the first 5min.

Dauster Top Dogs drop - and actually does bring up the possibility of playing Oats style, interestingly enough.

 

[awy]

they had these quick 3 plays last year but didn't heavily focus on them.

the way this roster is constructed, it's a favorable way to play. ideally it's a one-two punch with the half court stuff and you can ensure both explosiveness and resilience.

but i think the strategic importance of favoring 3's more is that it's a way to ensure teams that rely on individual creation of 2 point jumpers won't ever be able to beat this team. i'm thinking of cooper taking 23 shots and scoring 25. just from a court geometry stand point a high feel guy like coop is more effective at reacting to cutters and doing help defense around the rim, which could deny the potent uconn weapon of easy layups. but a quick offense that exploits the entire team's defense and conditioning will limit the impact of an elite help rim defender.

 

[RuffRuff]

Don’t kill me. Sleepers with their recap, along with two other videos on Reibe and Mahaney.

 

[SouleMan]

It's going to be our best offensive team, best shooting team, and deepest team yet. Won't have the same lockdown abilities with Clingan and Castle gone. Won't have the two headed Sanogo Clingan monster. This team will win as an offensive juggernaut and the defense and rebounding will get better as they get more comfortable.

I don't think we'll be better than last year offensively - at least from an efficiency perspective. I'm at least expecting higher turnovers. Maybe a faster pace will offset that loss of efficiency.

 

[superjohn]

I don't think we'll be better than last year offensively - at least from an efficiency perspective. I'm at least expecting higher turnovers. Maybe a faster pace will offset that loss of efficiency.

I expect more turnovers and less dunks. I expect better three point shooting and more points.

 

[FreeKlaiber]

So yea, I admit to being a Samson Stan. So all the incessant complaining about his deficiencies irk me. Granted, I do agree with some of them. But in true internet message board fashion, I think it gets exaggerated.

Good post. As another clear member of Samson street team, clearly he needs to figure out a way to stay on the floor, without bad fouls. It remains to be seen. As for the hedge and offensive screening, it does put him out of position to get low block rebound often. But stats dont lie, and last nights rebounding numbers from the center spot don't either. It'll be interesting to see how/if Reed performs in high hedge scramble

I prefer to look at Samson, in same way that I look at Solo. What he does, he does really unicorn well, but there are some flaws in game.

"if you judge a fish by ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing its stupid".

Not sure if Solo will always make that unselfish uconn extra pass but thats his package, pro and con, along with crazy athleticism. They are who they are. Samson will probably still have problems vs big big men in the post, but gonna have to try and live with that, and focus on his lob dunks and positives. His passing has been on point as well.

 

[jibsey]

Reed looked good in the second half, he should just watch Sanogo tapes. Even though we wont be as dominant in the paint with our 5’s I think that the Karaban, McNeeley and Stewart combo will make up for some of it on glass. Solo Ball is strong, disruptive, scores, puts back, he looks really good out there. And Mahaney is very good. So much team talent.
May not be as dominant early as last year’s team but I have trust in this coaching staff to have it all together by March.

 

[SouleMan]

I expect more turnovers and less dunks. I expect better three point shooting and more points.

My brain is struggling with the idea that this will be a better shooting team. Team was at 35.8% last year with Cam (tho Tristen's % wasn't great, and Castle struggled).

This year we'll always have 4 shooters on the court while replacing 2s with 3s. The math may just prove you right based on volume. Crazy.

Typed it, still can't fathom it. Go Huskies!

 

[AntG168]

I expect more turnovers and less dunks. I expect better three point shooting and more points.

Idk if we’ll have significantly less dunks. Samson is the best dunker in CBB by the numbers. And what we lost with Clingan castle we may make up with the ridiculous athleticism of ball and ross. Definitely better 3 point shooting though. I just hope the guys buy into a more diverse shot selection so we have a way when 3’s aren’t falling. Hurley emphasized attacking the rack last night

 

[awy]

the nice thing about shooting is that it helps to space the floor and open up driving lanes to attack the rim. they even used the non-shooting bigs as passers from the high post to hit cutters going to the hole. worked for both reed and samson. just imagine a guy like reibe in that role.

 

[Waquoit]

Typed it, still can't fathom it. Go Huskies!

One way to look at it, they have Karaban, Mahaney and McNeeley who are known for their shooting. Then you have Solo Ball going 3-6 and looking good doing it. I would say fathom it.

 

[alphasigko]

How good/bad is URI?

Was quite impressed with Brown

House was pretty good too!

 

[bendm]

Idk if we’ll have significantly less dunks. Samson is the best dunker in CBB by the numbers. And what we lost with Clingan castle we may make up with the ridiculous athleticism of ball and ross. Definitely better 3 point shooting though. I just hope the guys buy into a more diverse shot selection so we have a way when 3’s aren’t falling. Hurley emphasized attacking the rack last night

Bama made it to the final 4 by being the best 3 point shooting team in the country. i think we will be the best 3 point shooting team this year and be more diversified on O than Bama was last year so we dont live and die by the 3 like they did

 

[Palatine]

Does anyone believe we actually ran our offense in a televised game before the season? We ran the most vanilla version of our base set.

According to Hurley (on JJ Reddick's podcast) we have ten sets and each of them has five or more options that can be run. That wasn't what we saw on Monday.

 

[awy]

Does anyone believe we actually ran our offense in a televised game before the season? We ran the most vanilla version of our base set.

According to Hurley (on JJ Reddick's podcast) we have ten sets and each of them has five or more options that can be run. That wasn't what we saw on Monday.

yea they only ran some limited sets, mostly with the starting lineup. but a large number of the quick three plays were set plays. they were just pretty short.

 

[Dogdeacon]

I missed the start of the game, but a question is Solo Ball the starter/majority minutes at 3 ?
Meaning that both Stewart and Ross are behind him and possibly behind McNeeley (cuz Alex is playing 34 mins in BE games)?

I thought Stewart was poised to be the breakout star, but clearly it is Solo. It could become both if Solo plays more 2.

Is there an offensively potent "Death by 3's" possible lineup of 5 shooters with Diarra(or Nowell), Mahaney, Ball, McNeeley and Karaban?!

Karaban at the 5 like he did in emergencies last year is also a way to get McNeeley more burn at 4 and open up minutes for Stewart/Ross.

 

[Iluvsuebird]

Really nice to see the guy backs on the court. They got a taste of live bullets in front of a large crowd. That is always helpful even though both sides were sloppy.The real value is that Hurley gets a chance to do a little eval on everyone. I'm pretty sure he was NOT pleased with the number of offensive rebounds URI got.

That said, this game was essentially meaningless. A sample size of one. Drawing any conclusions of the performance of the team or individuals is spotty at best. I enjoyed watching Hurley. The first half play must have been driving him crazy but he didn't betray it on the sideline and he still managed to give the crowd a Hurley moment. Onward.

All due respect, you are lost. Last summer we faced French and Spanish semi pro Players and all of us came away thinking that the team was better than the year before. It mattered. This RI team was better competition. And we trounced them. With a new team. Of course it freaking matters to all the new pieces that this year’s UConn team can demolish teams like the two different teams from the last two years.

 

[husky429]

"if you judge a fish by ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing its stupid".

This is bizarre. Samson is being judged based on the specific skills needed to be successful on a basketball court. At least as far as I've seen. The folks complaining about his dunks are weirdos... dunks are good. And the hedging isn't a problem either--Hurley is putting pressure on him now to see how much we can create havoc without sacrificing the overall defense.

I think it's pretty simple and fans are making it too complicated. Samson is good. He's not going to be great until he figures out the rebounding and fouling.

By the same token Reed is also good. He will also not be greatuntil he figures out the things that plagued him last year: turnovers and shooting %.

Whichever of the two does the best job shoring up their individual weaknesses is going to be the starter getting 25 mins a game.

 

[Fan1978]

The only area that wasn't really exposed was how UConn can defend vs a high quality PG. URI doesn't seem to have a true PG. I'm sure HD and SB can put effective pressure on good to elite PGs but I guess we will just have to wait and see.

Their point guard is very good. Averaged 20 for albany last year. He was out with a concussion

 

[Fan1978]

Only examining the box score, my takeaways are:

• Seems like a lot of games last year that were closer at halftime and then we blow them out in the second half
• Seems like better D in the second half, though we were called for a ton of fouls
• 29 assists on 41 field goals for us is ludicrous
• The centers look...about what you'd expect. Johnson efficient on few attempts, but 1 rebound and 4 fouls isn't going to cut it. Reed pretty inefficient, but a better floor game (10 boards, 0 fouls, 3 assists). Glad to see few turnovers for either.
• Not much movement on the Mahaney vs. Ball for the starting SG slot -- both with excellent games.
• Hard to complain about 9 assists to 2 turnover for Diarra as starting PG. Hope his shooting is more like last year than the year before.
• Pretty clear that Nowell is the low man on the totem pole. I thought he'd be in line for more minutes, but looks like that Ball, Mahaney, and even Ross are ahead of him on the depth chart. I expect Ross will get squeezed out of significant minutes and the rest will be our 8 man rotation.

Nowell is going to be a force. That was not in the box score. He has a beautiful stroke and will demand pt.

 

[Fan1978]

It's not a weight/strength thing, it's an instincts thing and Johnson, bluntly, doesn't have them. It was a bit unrealistic to expect him to take a leap in that area in a few months.

Let’s give samson a chance, it was one scrimmage. Reed was awful in the first half and much better in the second half. A lot of new pieces so lets not overreact to one practice game

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Is there an offensively potent "Death by 3's" possible lineup of 5 shooters with Diarra(or Nowell), Mahaney, Ball, McNeeley and Karaban?!

Karaban at the 5 like he did in emergencies last year is also a way to get McNeeley more burn at 4 and open up minutes for Stewart/Ross.

This lineup would be deadly shooting wise but my goodness they might not get a stop either.

 

[uconnfan68]

That’s one thing I’m worried about too against a team with better athletes. Who’s going to be the guy to break guys down off the dribble if things get muddied up.

Believe Mahaney showed good ability there. Didn’t see much from anyone else in this game outside of 1 drive by Solo and a few by Stewart.

I didn’t see that speed from Mahaney. He’s crafty, but he’s not a press breaker.

 

[auror]

So yea, I admit to being a Samson Stan. So all the incessant complaining about his deficiencies irk me. Granted, I do agree with some of them. But in true internet message board fashion, I think it gets exaggerated.

What follows is a long post, but I am critically re-watching the game possession-by-possession for objective analyses of SJ criticism points. There;'s a TL/DR summary at the end for ADHD folks. I'll get to the rest of the game later.

Here's narrative summary of his first rotation (from 20:00 to 15:18). Note: O1, D1, etc is offensive possession #1, defensive possession #1, etc. RebO = having a legitimate opportunity for a rebound on the play.


O1-Comes out to 3pt line. Sets 3 screens, McNeeley drives & scores while SJ still at 3pt line. No RebO

D1-On JB. High-hedges. Recovers. Does effective seal-out of JB. 3pt shot from corner clanks opposite side long, Ball with RB. No RebO.

O2-Offensive set again takes SJ out high. Enters lane when Ball shoots [and hits] corner 3. JB boxes him out since already has position established. No RebO

D2-Picks up JB at foul line. JB gets position on left side, seals. SJ re-establishes position between JB & basket. Ball reverses & play stops (? Kick ball or foul…announcers never say). Inbounds play…pass goes to JB at FT line. He passes off , rest of play SJ/JB are inconsequential. URI makes the shot. No RebO

O3-SJ set 2 high screens including the 1 that frees AK for a made 3. No RebO

D3-SJ sets up guarding JB on the blocks. Diarra steals pass at top of key. Takes it to hoop for a layup.

D4-URI pushes pace. Guard beats McNeeley down court for a layup. SJ hustles back, alters shot/may have gotten a finger on ball to block shot, missed layup URI. SJ momentum takes him under hoop, JB cleans up rebound. McNeeley fouls JB on putback. JB makes 1st FT, misses 2nd. SJ boxes out on left side OK, McNeeley gathers miss on right side. No RebO

O4-Classic beautiful UConn set, SJ sets a couple high screens, then PnR, SJ open, but Diarra lob is right over the hoop; SJ can’t dunk it without committing a goaltend.

D5-URI pushes pace after missed lob. SJ has to recover from under hoop; is ~5 yds behind all players, URI sets at top of key; McNeeley is under hoop. Left side has 2 open URI players at 3pt line. SJ runs out to cover one. JB flashes from FT line to hoop; SB rotates down to cover him (setting up a mismatch). SJ guards URI player in corner; he lobs it into JB, who gets fouled on the layup attempt by Diarra who rotates down to help SB. Nothing SJ does wrong here. JB makes the And-1. No RebO.

O5-Set starts. SJ sets effective screen at FT line to free McNeeley who misses 3pt attempt. SJ naturally out of good Reb position due to setting the screen. Reb goes left. SB grabs it and puts it back for the make. No RebO.

D6-SJ effectively battles with JB underneath. Play rotates from left to right. Shot goes up from left. SJ boxes out JB. Both are slightly left-center, a couple feet from the rim. Purists would say it may have been a little weak box-out technique-wise. Rebound goes left-baseline though, and Ball secures the RB. No RebO.

O6-SB pushes pace, SJ and JB come up court behind SB. SJ goes to left corner of FT line (to establish position for offensive set). SB hucks up a quick 3. JB naturally has position on SJ. He seals SJ. Another URI player gets the rebound. No RebO.

D7-URI player drives from top of key left side, gets a step on AK. SJ comes off JB to try and block the layup. Alters shot, it misses, but JB is left open to get Reb since SJ came to help. JB is fouled on the putback attempt by Diarra. No RebO. Could maybe quibble about if SJ should have leaked off JB to help. But I’m not a UConn coach so I don’t know what SJ should do there. JB makes both FTs.

O7-SJ starts high in the set. Gets ball, dishes to Mahaney, flashes down lane, is open for alley-oop but Mahaney misses opportunity. Ball reverses to right, Karaban shoots a 3. SJ is on the left block after curling around after his flash to the hoop. JB comes over to box out. SJ side-steps him, but stays behind him (probably not a bad thing since 3s usually miss long. Rebound goes high and long to the left FT line. Both SJ and Solo go after the Reb, both get a hand on it, it gets bounced on the floor. A 50/50 ball, URI player gets it, McNeeley strips it, SB recovers, and dishes to AK for the easy layup. SJ in position to get a Reb but he & Ball both deflect it (and it stays alive). RebO but no Reb, but play stays alive.

D8-JB gets good position down low with SJ on his back. Entry pass from FT line. JB pivots, goes right drop step. SJ contests, doesn’t foul, JB makes tough contested layup. No RebO, of course.

O8-Standard set. SJ sets a couple of FT line screens, flashes under hoop, goes to right side. SB drives around Mahaney into lane, pulls up and makes the jumper. JB stays on SJ on right side to keep lane open for the drive. No RebO.

D9-SJ & JB start down low. JB flashed up to 3pt line. Two URI guards on right side. JB looks to be setting a screen. SJ looks like he may have been anticipating this and sets his defense back-right of JB. But JB immediately cuts to the hoop. SJ in bad position. Kudos to JB and the URI set need to be made though. AK rotates over to guard JB, who receives the pass on the right block. SJ rotates down to double-team. JB could have been called for a travel, but instead a foul is called. Honestly, could have been called on either AK or SJ. Not sure who got called (think it was SJ), announcers didn’t say and then it went to commercial break.


TL/DR: What are the BY’s biggest beefs about SJ?

“Fouls too much!” - Welp, he made a ton of nice screens, played a lot of decent/adequate post defense, and got called for 1 questionable foul.

“Doesn’t Rebound” - Technically true, but his role in offensive sets often clearly puts him in no position/bad position to rebound. The one legitimate opportunity he had, he was there (with SB), and both tipped it away from each other. Both teams also made a ton of shots in this first 5min stretch…not many legit opportunities to grab rebounds.

“Only Dunks” – In this 5minute stretch, technically true, but he did not have any opportunities to legitimately do anything to take a post shot/jumper the way the offensive possessions went.

“High Hedges too much and gets burned on it and it ruins the defense” – Nope, didn’t happen in the first 5min.

10 points to Gryffindor.

 

[RuffRuff]

Let’s give samson a chance, it was one scrimmage. Reed was awful in the first half and much better in the second half. A lot of new pieces so lets not overreact to one practice game

We have a lot of film on Samson. One of the better examples in this game of things that just cannot happen: second half, URI center gets an offensive rebound off a URI missed free throw, over Samson. Samson is flat footed, and then he immediately fouls him. These are the things that just cannot happen anymore with the kid. His rebounding instincts are just not good.

Someone brought up Rodman somewhere. Rodman had in HOF spades exactly what Samson is missing. Ball instincts, following flight of ball, anticipating carom, finding the nearest body to box out like madman.