Re-alignment tidbits

[observer]

From the heart of Big12 country acknowledgement that no teams are leaving the ACC for the BigBevo conference:

http://dallas.sbnation.com/texas-lo...owl-reduces-chances-of-conference-realignment

And from Frank the Tank who has been right more often than the other bloggers:

When the Orange Bowl signed a new deal with the ACC that provided the conference with all of the bowl’s media revenues, that removed any doubt regarding the ACC’s place in college football’s power structure. I feel like the proverbial broken record here in continuously saying that the ACC is much stronger than what football fans give them credit for. The ACC’s on-the-field record in BCS bowl games is irrelevant here: a league with academically prestigious schools (many of whom are flagships) that own or have large shares of their own home markets isn’t going to get booted out of the elite club.

http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/2...ayoffs-conference-realignment-and-penn-state/

Ho hum, all is well with the ACC, soon to grow even stronger.

 

[uconndogs]

In all seriousness, do you have an emotional disorder? Because, if you do, and it would seem likely that you might, I'll stop busting your chops.

fi

 

[Santini35]

a league with academically prestigious schools (many of whom are flagships)

And don't seem to mind dragging the idea of academics through the mud by creating fake classes

 

[noeynox]

And don't seem to mind dragging the idea of academics through the mud by creating fake classes

Hey hey hey, that is irrelevant. You gotta do what you gotta do! How could their BCS bowl record not matter? It is proof positive that the conference sucks in football.

 

[jostar1]

Ho hum, all is well with the ACC, soon to grow even stronger.

Whistling in the dark again?

 

[Santini35]

Yup Yup reallllly academically prestigious those ACC schools are ....

 

[observer]

Yup Yup reallllly academically prestigious those ACC schools are ....

Definitely as prestigious as schools like UCONN whose is the ONLY name hoops schools penalized for failing to maintain an adequate APR.

A few instances of academic failings in the athletic program does not make any school less academically prestigious as far as the overall school goes.

 

[Santini35]

Yeah guys not going to class or simply not doing well enough is equal to fake classes and other people doing work for athletes....

And it may not bring down the overall academic prestige of the school... but it sure does show why it's idiotic to point to academics as a measure of quality when it comes to athletic conferences...

 

[TuxedoYoda]

I couldn't disagree with Frank more. Whoever the ACC plays in the Orange Bowl will get a payout equal to that of the ACC (he disregards this, for some reason). The sum of both payouts is expected to be about $40 million, the Rose & the Champions will be at $80 million. Throw this in with the crappy TV deal and the lack of 3rd tier $ that comes from being an ACC member (this would bring between $5 to $8 million alone for FSU in the Big 12) and staying in the ACC is a violation of the fiduciary responsibilities of the Board members.

 

[observer]

I couldn't disagree with Frank more. Whoever the ACC plays in the Orange Bowl will get a payout equal to that of the ACC (he disregards this, for some reason). The sum of both payouts is expected to be about $40 million, the Rose & the Champions will be at $80 million. Throw this in with the crappy TV deal and the lack of 3rd tier $ that comes from being an ACC member (this would bring between $5 to $8 million alone for FSU in the Big 12) and staying in the ACC is a violation of the fiduciary responsibilities of the Board members.

When was the contract signed that says the champions bowl will get 80 million?

 

[huskypantz]

Definitely as prestigious as schools like UCONN whose is the ONLY name hoops schools penalized for failing to maintain an adequate APR.

A few instances of academic failings in the athletic program does not make any school less academically prestigious as far as the overall school goes.

You need to read up on the academic scandal. We're talking about making up classes for dozens of student athletes. Also doing coursework for them. Blatant academic fraud supported by university personnel. It basically renders GPAs and APR scores for UNC useless, because they're all cooked. Diploma factory for student athletes.

 

[Jerry27]

You need to read up on the academic scandal. We're talking about making up classes for dozens of student athletes. Also doing coursework for them. Blatant academic fraud supported by university personnel. It basically renders GPAs and APR scores for UNC useless, because they're all cooked. Diploma factory for student athletes.

why do that, its easier for observer to spout off with a blatant lack of knowledge about a subject but its all in the name of being a new UConn follower so...

 

[observer]

I couldn't disagree with Frank more. Whoever the ACC plays in the Orange Bowl will get a payout equal to that of the ACC (he disregards this, for some reason). The sum of both payouts is expected to be about $40 million, the Rose & the Champions will be at $80 million. Throw this in with the crappy TV deal and the lack of 3rd tier $ that comes from being an ACC member (this would bring between $5 to $8 million alone for FSU in the Big 12) and staying in the ACC is a violation of the fiduciary responsibilities of the Board members.

I always smile when I see people throw around ten dollar words like 'fiduciary responsibilities' when they do not have the slightest idea of what those words really mean.

To the simpletons if Conference A offers more money than Conference B then a school should automatically join the higher paying conference. Such school should ignore and not consider things such as:

1) The relative stability of the conferences as in the Big12 was 10 seconds away from dissolving less than a year ago and the only thing holding it together now is a GOR that many have said is of questionable enforceability. The ACC, like the SEC, does not have nor does it need a GOR to keep its members in the conference.

The Big12 lost four, count 'em, four schools to other conference recently. How many did any other conference besides the BE lose?

If the Big12 is such a bunch of happy campers why did four of their number run for the door? Why did every Big12 member including UT talk with other conferences about membership in the past year? Might a Board exercising its fiduciary responsibilities want to know?

With the PSU possible death penalty looming there is already talk of Oklahoma and/or Texas to the B!G. Stable conference, right, lol.

2) The academic standing of the schools in each conference. Face it, other than UT and a few programs at Kansas the Big12 is no where near the academic peer of the ACC. The ACC also has an academic consortium like the B!G that provides for shared research and academic collaboration. Faculty like those things because most faculty think they are at a school with a football team attached to it as opposed to a football team with a school attached to it.

3) The effect on student athletes as far as travel required to play conference games.

4) The effect on alumni, where are they located and how convenient will it be for them to attend sporting events and/or see those events on TV.

5) The effect on recruiting of student athletes. Clemson's coach stated point blank that the rumors of Clemson to the Big12 were hurting football recruiting. WVU's recruiting has not set the world on fire since they announced they were moving to the Big12 either.

6) The costs of travel for conference games. FSU's President has said repeatedly that it would cost an additional 3 million for travel in the Big12 as opposed to the ACC.

Finally, in the exercise of a Board's fiduciary responsibilities they need to look at real numbers. Not numbers thrown around on the internet by those who know nothing but claim 'insider' status all of whom claim that the Big12 schools will each get a bazillion dollars every day and twice on Sunday.

Every ACC school that the Big12 has approached has said 'no thanks' after looking at the totality of the important factors including the money. They have all discharged their fiduciary responsibilities appropriately.

 

[TuxedoYoda]

I always smile when I see people throw around ten dollar words like 'fiduciary responsibilities' when they do not have the slightest idea of what those words really mean.

It means taking reasonable care & stewardship of the FSU athletics department and it would be reckless to leave tens of millions of dollars on the table for theorized academic benefits which don't exist and intangibles like 'tradition'.

The relative stability of the conferences as in the Big12 was 10 seconds away from dissolving less than a year ago and the only thing holding it together now is a GOR that many have said is of questionable enforceability. The ACC, like the SEC, does not have nor does it need a GOR to keep its members in the conference.

The ACC tried, and failed, to get everyone to sign a GOR. The SEC may wish it had one if/when the Big 10 ever woos Mizzou.

The Big12 lost four, count 'em, four schools to other conference recently.

BEFORE the Grant of Rights

If the Big12 is such a bunch of happy campers why did four of their number run for the door? Why did every Big12 member including UT talk with other conferences about membership in the past year?

This is simple.....The Big 10 announced it was going to expand. Mizzou publicly begs for an invite (as does their governor). Mizzou did the same when the Big 8 evolved into the Big 12. Also, when the Big 8 became the Big 12, Colorado tried desperately to join the Pac 10 & was shot down. Colorado has a ton of alumni in Cali and always wanted to be part of that conference. Mizzou's flirtation with the Big 10 freaked everyone out. Everyone started exploring their options. Nebraska found a great landing spot in the Big 10 (fortunately, before it lost AAU status), Colorado landed in its dream spot when the Pac 10 made a chess move to keep out Baylor that cost them the only A+ expansion candidate they could ever have (Texas) and that brings us to A&M. A&M wanted to join the SEC when the Big 12 formed. Their fans/alumni have always been obsessed with it. With no title since 39 and no top 5 finish in about 6 decades, A&M wanted to feel good about something, ANYTHING, and their fan base forced a change that the AD & football coach were against. Ou tried to go to the Pac without Texas and was shot down.

It was an absolute mess, started by the Big 10, that was finally settled by the Grant of Rights. Now, the Big 12 is exponentially more stable than the ACC.

The ACC also has an academic consortium like the B!G that provides for shared research and academic collaboration.

Read their website.....they coordinate some study abroad programs and minor exchanges but no one has ever been able to provide a link to one major research collaboration that would be lost if an ACC school joined the Big 12.

Also, he fact that you are bringing up false arguments like travel costs, concerns about students traveling to the games, alumni traveling to the games and recruiting show that you have done so little research on this matter that you have brought an intellectual knife to a gunfight. Go educate yourself before you call me out. The opinion of a coach like Dabo is 100% irrelevant in these matters.

Every ACC school that the Big12 has approached has said 'no thanks' after looking at the totality of the important factors including the money.

THIS is the silliest thing you wrote and you will soon be a joke because of it.

 

[jrazz12]

THIS is the silliest thing you wrote and you will soon be a joke because of it.

"Soon be"?? That ticket has been punched for awhile now

 

[observer]

It means taking reasonable care & stewardship of the FSU athletics department and it would be reckless to leave tens of millions of dollars on the table for theorized academic benefits which don't exist and intangibles like 'tradition'.



The ACC tried, and failed, to get everyone to sign a GOR. The SEC may wish it had one if/when the Big 10 ever woos Mizzou.



BEFORE the Grant of Rights



This is simple.....The Big 10 announced it was going to expand. Mizzou publicly begs for an invite (as does their governor). Mizzou did the same when the Big 8 evolved into the Big 12. Also, when the Big 8 became the Big 12, Colorado tried desperately to join the Pac 10 & was shot down. Colorado has a ton of alumni in Cali and always wanted to be part of that conference. Mizzou's flirtation with the Big 10 freaked everyone out. Everyone started exploring their options. Nebraska found a great landing spot in the Big 10 (fortunately, before it lost AAU status), Colorado landed in its dream spot when the Pac 10 made a chess move to keep out Baylor that cost them the only A+ expansion candidate they could ever have (Texas) and that brings us to A&M. A&M wanted to join the SEC when the Big 12 formed. Their fans/alumni have always been obsessed with it. With no title since 39 and no top 5 finish in about 6 decades, A&M wanted to feel good about something, ANYTHING, and their fan base forced a change that the AD & football coach were against. Ou tried to go to the Pac without Texas and was shot down.

It was an absolute mess, started by the Big 10, that was finally settled by the Grant of Rights. Now, the Big 12 is exponentially more stable than the ACC.



Read their website.....they coordinate some study abroad programs and minor exchanges but no one has ever been able to provide a link to one major research collaboration that would be lost if an ACC school joined the Big 12.

Also, he fact that you are bringing up false arguments like travel costs, concerns about students traveling to the games, alumni traveling to the games and recruiting show that you have done so little research on this matter that you have brought an intellectual knife to a gunfight. Go educate yourself before you call me out. The opinion of a coach like Dabo is 100% irrelevant in these matters.


THIS is the silliest thing you wrote and you will soon be a joke because of it.

I have read your 'response' several times and don't see that you respond to anything. The basic point I was making (and I will type it again slowly so that you can follow it) is that there are more factors as far as the exercise of fiduciary responsibility than a look at made up numbers thrown around on the internet.

You and folks like you have nothing but wishful thinking. Every little tidbit is turned into a conspiracy theory about teams just clamboring to join the Big12. Like that big announcement today at noon by Clemson. You know, the one that was going to tell the world they were joining the Big12. LOL.

The only schools that the Bevoconference has a chance at getting are BE leftovers like Cincy and Louisville.

Bottom line is I look at what people do and all I see is that NO SCHOOL HAS LEFT THE ACC BUT A WHOLE LOT HAVE LEFT THE BIGBEVO CONFERENCE.

When that changes you will have something to talk about that. Until then all you got is hot air and speculation.

That is the REALITY.

 

[pj]

observer, teams left the Big 12 before they got offered a ton of money in the latest TV contract. They left at a time after the 2008 recession when teams were getting crappy contracts, like the ACC. The Big 12's prospects didn't look good at that time. Now they do look good, and the ACC's look poor. Bad luck to the ACC that they went to market at a bad time, and didn't have the foresight to avoid getting locked in to poor terms.

a look at made up numbers thrown around on the internet.

You can be sure that FSU and Clemson have seen exact numbers from both the ACC and Big 12 and know exactly what the differential is. Whether the extra dollars are worth the geographic distance is a call that could go either way. We'll know soon enough.

 

[SubbaBub]

Bottom line is I look at what people do and all I see is that NO SCHOOL HAS LEFT THE ACC BUT A WHOLE LOT HAVE LEFT THE BIGBEVO CONFERENCE.

When that changes you will have something to talk about that. Until then all you got is hot air and speculation.

That is the REALITY.

And none have left for the ACC, so I don't see the logic in your statement. The only thing the ACC had going for it was that it wasn't as poorly run as the BE and had a core of programs that are willing to stick together.

That may keep UNC out of the SEC but, it won't keep Clemson, FSU, or Miami from leaving if they can get a better deal.

Probably won't keep Pitt, Syracuse, Maryland out of the B1G if they were offered.


Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

 

[observer]

The destination conference is less important than what conferences lose teams. The ACC got the teams it wanted from the BE that fit their geographic profile and academic and other standards. None of the four that left the Bevoconference were a fit for the ACC. The only team from the Bevoconference that the ACC would accept is Texas and that is because of how dominant team TX is on the national stage and in its home state.

Right now it is a tight race for the most raided conference between the BE and the Bevoconference.

Bevoconference--Texas A&M, Missouri, Nebraska and Colorado

Big East- Syr, Pitt, WVU and TCU

Strong conferences do not get raided. Weak ones do.

 

[pj]

Strong conferences do not get raided. Weak ones do.

Yes. Strength is indicated by per-team TV revenue. A few years ago Big12 and Big East were weak. Now ACC and Big East are weak.

 

[Jerry27]

The destination conference is less important than what conferences lose teams. The ACC got the teams it wanted from the BE that fit their geographic profile and academic and other standards. None of the four that left the Bevoconference were a fit for the ACC. The only team from the Bevoconference that the ACC would accept is Texas and that is because of how dominant team TX is on the national stage and in its home state.

Right now it is a tight race for the most raided conference between the BE and the Bevoconference.

Bevoconference--Texas A&M, Missouri, Nebraska and Colorado

Big East- Syr, Pitt, WVU and TCU

Strong conferences do not get raided. Weak ones do.

In which case a little more history checking you would have also found BCU, VT and Miami taken from the BE we hold a 7 to 4 edge. Nearly 1/3 of the ACC will be made up of teams from the BE

 

[Marty Jackson]

I have read your 'response' several times and don't see that you respond to anything. The basic point I was making (and I will type it again slowly so that you can follow it) is that there are more factors as far as the exercise of fiduciary responsibility than a look at made up numbers thrown around on the internet.

You and folks like you have nothing but wishful thinking. Every little tidbit is turned into a conspiracy theory about teams just clamboring to join the Big12. Like that big announcement today at noon by Clemson. You know, the one that was going to tell the world they were joining the Big12. LOL.

The only schools that the Bevoconference has a chance at getting are BE leftovers like Cincy and Louisville.

Bottom line is I look at what people do and all I see is that NO SCHOOL HAS LEFT THE ACC BUT A WHOLE LOT HAVE LEFT THE BIGBEVO CONFERENCE.

When that changes you will have something to talk about that. Until then all you got is hot air and speculation.

That is the REALITY.

Your only argument is that nothing has changed for the acc. I don't think any schools will leave but if they do, I guarantee you won't be anywhere in sight. Wouldnt be a bad thing.
It was said best before. You have a weak character.

 

[Waquoit]

Definitely as prestigious as schools like UCONN whose is the ONLY name hoops schools penalized for failing to maintain an adequate APR.

A few instances of academic failings in the athletic program does not make any school less academically prestigious as far as the overall school goes.

You aren't talking about few instances "academic failings", you are referring to instances of successful fraud and duplicity. That's why BCU is right at home in the ACC.

The funny thing is the APR hit is evidence of UConn's academic integrity. They didn't create fake classes for the sole purpose keeping players eligible. Players were expected to do their own work and didn't get credit when they failed.

 

[uconndogs]

Forget it Waquoit, he won't get that point. observer is three of the most stupid people to ever use the internet.

 

[docsu]

Forget it Waquoit, he won't get that point. observer is three of the most stupid people to ever use the internet.

IOW he doesn't buy into the BS blog/message board rumors that UCONN fans accept as gospel.