Question about the Triple Doubles?

[01Neaggrad02]

UCONN had had only 1 triple double prior to this season. Then this season there were two. However, with both Stef and KML hitting this milestone this year I started to think about the "Triple Double" and why have only three players actually hit that mark... and then I started to think about KML and what a prolific scorer she can be. So from KML I started to think about Maya Moore. (Sorry my mind was just going all over the place...) So I was thinking of Maya and then I thought she could get double digits in the games, and she hit double digits in rebounding... how close did she come to having another double digit category.... then it hit me... Syracuse.... January 17, 2009 Maya Moore was playing and she hit 10 three pointers. She scored 40 total points and had 13 rebounds.

Why doesn't this count toward a Triple Double? 10 three pointers is HUGE!

 

[sarals24]

I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that UConn generally has a very balanced team, so no one player fills up the stat box that much. And most games for UConn are blowouts, and Geno doesn't typically leave his starters in long enough to achieve a triple double in those types of games. In games against higher ranked opponents, it's obviously more difficult. It is strange that Maya never got one, though. Or Kelly Faris.

 

[01Neaggrad02]

Doesn't address the question as to why Maya does not have a Triple Double?

 

[Fiftyish]

I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that UConn generally has a very balanced team, so no one player fills up the stat box that much. And most games for UConn are blowouts, and Geno doesn't typically leave his starters in long enough to achieve a triple double in those types of games. In games against higher ranked opponents, it's obviously more difficult. It is strange that Maya never got one, though. Or Kelly Faris.

I'm surprised DT never got a triple double. Great shooter, outstanding passer, and tall enough to snag lots of rebounds. Triple doubles are really hard to achieve.

 

[ThisJustIn]

'cause she was a horrible ball hog..... the both of 'em

 

[Cuango]

UCONN had had only 1 triple double prior to this season. Then this season there were two. However, with both Stef and KML hitting this milestone this year I started to think about the "Triple Double" and why have only three players actually hit that mark... and then I started to think about KML and what a prolific scorer she can be. So from KML I started to think about Maya Moore. (Sorry my mind was just going all over the place...) So I was thinking of Maya and then I thought she could get double digits in the games, and she hit double digits in rebounding... how close did she come to having another double digit category.... then it hit me... Syracuse.... January 17, 2009 Maya Moore was playing and she hit 10 three pointers. She scored 40 total points and had 13 rebounds.

Why doesn't this count toward a Triple Double? 10 three pointers is HUGE!

It isn't a triple double because three point baskets are simply part of the total points. What Maya did that night, while impressive in itself, was merely a double double. Triple doubles are achieved by reaching double figures in three of the following statistical categories; points, rebounds, assists, blocks, and/or steals. Obviously, this is a difficult thing to do and thus says volumes about the skill and potential of KML. I believe Hakeem Olajuwon of NBA fame once had a quadruple double.

 

[DobbsRover2]

Maya was more at the forefront as the top scorer during her career, which left fewer chances for assists. She never had a double-digit assist game, topping out at 9 once and 8 three times. In none of the high assist games did she get a double-double, as it seems she had low amounts of rebounds when she was dishing more, probably owing to her role in different games. Her highs in blocks was 5 and steals was 6. Never really came close to a triple-double.

 

[ThisJustIn]

'cause she was a ball hog...

 

[DobbsRover2]

Well, double-doubles were never a big thing with DT, as she had just 1 as a senior and 4 as a junior. Probably scarce in first two years. She also had her injuries to stifle her a bit. I think all of her double-doubles were probably the points-rebounds combo of the 5 in her junior\senior seasons.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

It is tough to get a handle on. Tasha Pointer had 4 triple doubles her senior season (puts her tied for 2nd behind Nicole Powell for a season, and actually tied for 7th for a career). Two were against Providence, exactly 1 month apart.

Not the player I would have predicted was most likely in RU history to have the only triple doubles in RU history.

 

[meyers7]

'cause she was a horrible ball hog..... the both of 'em

Ballhog Chick.

 

[Buster]

Does 10 3-point FGs qualify as a double triple? How many of those have been made?

 

[DobbsRover2]

Just that once for Maya against Syracuse. Wendy Davis is next best with 8 back in 1991. And double-triple of that sort is way easier than the counterpart triple-double (100+ two-pointers).

 

[RedGuerrUltra]

"A triple-double is defined as a performance in which a player accumulates a double digit number total in three of five statistical categories—points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocked shots—in a game."

i.e. at least 10 points, 10 rebounds, 10 assists (or steals or blocked shots) = a triple-double

 

[pinotbear]

part of the reason for them this year may be the limited player rotation. Not only are the starters logging a lot of minutes, but none of the folks coming off of the bench are of the "microwave" variety (offensively, heat up quickly). That's not to say that BB, Kiah, and Saniya haven't had some good offensive games, but, this year, that hasn't been their long suit. It's not like bringing Keesh, Shea, or DT off of the bench as frosh, say, any of whom could create offense quickly at times.

Long-winded way of saying, not only are the starters logging minutes, but, when one of 'em goes out, their production-load largely goes to the remaining starters on the floor, rather than whomever just entered the game.

 

[Wbbfan1]

IMHO UConn's lack of depth in the front court contributed to the triple doubles by KML & Stef. UConn only has 4 front court players. Stef, Stewie, Kiah & KML. This means that these players play more minutes then they would have if Morgan was available or in comparison to prior year teams.

 

[UcMiami]

It really ends up being a 'luck' thing to get to a triple double.
Points are obviously the easiest as many players score double digit points in 90+% of games. And teams average 65+ points a game so there are enough points being scored each game for all 5 starters to have a good chance of getting to double figures.

Rebounds are second easiest as again some players are able to average double digits in rebounds for a year or even a career and a team will average around 40 +/- rebounds a game - enough that two or three starters could get to double figures in any game.

Assists come in third but become a much hard 'double' to achieve - Only a few players in NCAA history have averaged double digit assists in a year and the best teams come in the 20-22 assist/gm range and 30 assists is rare in a game. That leaves open the possibility of someone reaching double figures occasionally, but up till this year Uconn had 36 double assists games by a player in the history of their program or around one per year. This year has been exceptional as 4 different players have hit double figure assists once each. But that means a triple double that included assists (by far the most likely) could only have occurred 4 times this year out of 36 games - most years it could only have occurred once.

When you get down to steals and blocks ... the best team this year in steals averages 13/game and only 26 teams out 343 division 1 programs average in double figures. In Uconn's history only three players have ever reached double figures in a game for steals. Blocks ... Uconn is flirting with the NCAA record for blocks/game at 8.1 (record 8.3) and Uconn has never had a player record double digits. The best season average in both of these categories is 6.4/gm by a player.

And when you look at the stats the best rebounders are typically not dominating the ball on offense so getting assists become harder for them and the ones dominating the ball typically are further from the basket with less chances to pick up rebounds. And a great shot blocker is likely to by the attempt to block shots take themselves out of position for rebounds.
The teams and players that tend to get triple doubles are typically dominated by one or two players and those players average high minutes of playing time. Uconn teams tend to have four or five offensive options and while they get high assist numbers the assists come from multiple players as the ball moves around the court. And in typical years only 10 +/- regular season games are competitive so players do not often play 35 minutes let alone 40. Every minute spent on the bench is a lost opportunity to add to one or more stats. An interesting factor in this year's two triple doubles is a shorter bench. And an awareness of stats by the coaching staff that might not have occurred a few times in the past. I believe for both Stef and Kaleena's triple double, there was a 50/50 chance they would not have been put back in the game with a chance to complete the triple double had the coaches not gotten the word.

 

[Icebear]

IMHO UConn's lack of depth in the front court contributed to the triple doubles by KML & Stef. UConn only has 4 front court players. Stef, Stewie, Kiah & KML. This means that these players play more minutes then they would have if Morgan was available or in comparison to prior year teams.

That is more depth than many teams including past UCONN teams have had for the front court.

 

[ThisJustIn]

That is more depth than many teams including past UCONN teams have had for the front court.

Exactly. In fact, if I recall correctly, both KML and Stef were put BACK IN to get their triple-double. Clearly, Geno wanted them to get the t-d (vaguely like Sherri and Paris' double-double record) and our bench depth was the barrier to them getting the trip-dub

 

[DobbsRover2]

Yeah, if it was just the minutes than the 2009-10 team would have been a first choice for triple-doubles. The main factors are having flexible players who can get both high numbers of rebounds and assists, having everything fall together in a game, and having a coach who wants his players to get a certain mark. Geno has occasionally yanked a player at 29 points, but this is a mark he clearly thinks is pretty cool. Doubt this will ever happen in a really high stakes game.

 

[Buzzyboy]

I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that UConn generally has a very balanced team, so no one player fills up the stat box that much. And most games for UConn are blowouts, and Geno doesn't typically leave his starters in long enough to achieve a triple double in those types of games. In games against higher ranked opponents, it's obviously more difficult. It is strange that Maya never got one, though. Or Kelly Faris.

I'm inclined to think that Kelly Faris isn't in the same sphere as Maya or Dianna or KML because she was primarily a defensive player. She didn't average double digits in scoring until her senior year so the likelihood that she would get a double double much less a triple double was remote, at best. She may have gotten one (or two) double doubles but I don't have a recollection that she did but if she did, it was an aberration. I know everyone loved Kelly but she wasn't in the same company as numerous other UConn players, particularly on the offensive side. Why Kelly's name came up instead of players like Svet or Sue or Shea or Kelly Bascom or many other players surely surprises me.

 

[UcMiami]

Exactly. In fact, if I recall correctly, both KML and Stef were put BACK IN to get their triple-double. Clearly, Geno wanted them to get the t-d (vaguely like Sherri and Paris' double-double record) and our bench depth was the barrier to them getting the trip-dub

I think there is a difference with the Paris DD record in that the choice did not get down to a radically different amount of playing time or the final minutes of a game - Stef played 31 minutes against Oregon actually less than her 31.8 minutes/game average this year. KML played 31 minutes against St Joes - fewer than she has played in 4 of her last 5 games (I use that time period because her season has been so discombobulated) - those were 30, 31, 33, 34, 34.
And with the current size of the bench, until Lawson and Pulido get into games (last 2 minutes) at least two starter have to be playing at all times so rotating Stef or Kaleena back into games isn't unusual.
The problem that some people had with the Paris streak was that a few games she was playing into the last minute of blow outs because she was a rebound or basket short of double digits.

 

[DobbsRover2]

I'm inclined to think that Kelly Faris isn't in the same sphere as Maya or Dianna or KML because she was primarily a defensive player. She didn't average double digits in scoring until her senior year so the likelihood that she would get a double double much less a triple double was remote, at best. She may have gotten one (or two) double doubles but I don't have a recollection that she did but if she did, it was an aberration. I know everyone loved Kelly but she wasn't in the same company as numerous other UConn players, particularly on the offensive side. Why Kelly's name came up instead of players like Svet or Sue or Shea or Kelly Bascom or many other players surely surprises me.

For a triple-double the big stats don't matter so much. Kelly only had three double-doubles in her senior year, but a 13-11-7 performance against ND last year was just as close as Maya ever got. Just takes the right circumstances in the right game.

 

[ThisJustIn]

The problem that some people had with the Paris streak was that a few games she was playing into the last minute of blow outs because she was a rebound or basket short of double digits.

Someone would have to go back and double check, but for the moment, I'll stand by my statement: I used the word "vaguely" and feel the twosome were put BACK in the game for the express reason of achieving the triple double. It's not about total minutes. It's about intent.

And I have no issue with what Geno and/or Sherri did.

 

[sarals24]

I'm inclined to think that Kelly Faris isn't in the same sphere as Maya or Dianna or KML because she was primarily a defensive player. She didn't average double digits in scoring until her senior year so the likelihood that she would get a double double much less a triple double was remote, at best. She may have gotten one (or two) double doubles but I don't have a recollection that she did but if she did, it was an aberration. I know everyone loved Kelly but she wasn't in the same company as numerous other UConn players, particularly on the offensive side. Why Kelly's name came up instead of players like Svet or Sue or Shea or Kelly Bascom or many other players surely surprises me.

Kelly getting 10 points, 10 rebounds and 10 assists in a game would not have surprised me at all, since she usually had numbers in every category most games. Svet could have gotten one, she average 4 assists and 6 rebounds her senior year, but Kelly is just the most recent example of someone who filled up the stat sheet. Before the year started would anyone have thought Stef could get a triple double? Probably not. I would have picked Stewie (points, boards and blocks) or KML.