Positives from the Tulsa Game

[pj]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing.

A few items:
- Overall performance: Entering the game, Tulsa was a heavy favorite. Pregame they were about #90 in kenpom. We had been in the 80s before Gilbert went down and were plummeting ever since to #127 pre-game. If you just count the games since Gilbert re-injured the shoulder, we were probably playing Kenpom #180 basketball. With Tulsa having homecourt, you would expect another 10 point loss. But we played them even and had opportunities to win in the final seconds of each period.
- Possibly the coaches take advice from the Boneyard, since much of the gratuitous advice following Wichita State was implemented. Onuorah didn't play, Anderson's minutes were cut in favor of an Adams/Vital/Larrier perimeter, and the young guys Carlton, Whaley, and Diarra benefited with more minutes. Finally, the best players were on the floor and the young forwards were given a chance to develop.
- Some additional offensive plays were introduced and they seemed to help, the team shot 38% from 3 and 43% overall.
- 18 assists, only 7 turnovers. They protected the ball and shared it.
- Whaley! 4-6 from the floor, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1 assist, 0 turnovers, only 2 personal fouls. If he hits his free throws we win. With a year's experience and some muscle, he will be a player. Needs better conditioning, he played 41 minutes and his first 20 were much more productive than his last 20.
- If Carlton and Diarra can cut down the fouls, they'll be much more positive players.
- We are closing in on a 7 player rotation of Adams/Vital/Larrier/Anderson on the perimeter, Whaley/Carlton/Diarra on the interior. A shortened rotation was another fan request and gives them a better chance to develop chemistry.
- If we improve the rebounding and maintain the recent progress, gotta believe this team gets back to the 80s in kenpom which would assure a winning record and an NIT bid. That would be a huge step forward with an infusion of talent coming in next year. (Gilbert, Sid Wilson, Akinjo primarily; probably a new center recruit in the spring; Matthews a good shooter; Kisunas another piece adding depth inside.)

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

 

[JMick]

we still can't inbound the basketball. it's been five years of not being able to do the simplest thing

 

[CardiacAndre7]

we still can't inbound the basketball. it's been five years of not being able to do the simplest thing

Or defend the inbound

 

[Hi-Low]

That's a lot of positives from a loss.....I did like the starting lineup.

I can't look to next year and incoming players and get excited.....it's a long way off and we have no idea with real certainty what next year will bring and who will actually be here.

Right now we are 7-7 and in 2nd to last place in the AAC.

 

[whaler11]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing.

A few items:
- Overall performance: Entering the game, Tulsa was a heavy favorite. Pregame they were about #90 in kenpom. We had been in the 80s before Gilbert went down and were plummeting ever since to #127 pre-game. If you just count the games since Gilbert re-injured the shoulder, we were probably playing Kenpom #180 basketball. With Tulsa having homecourt, you would expect another 10 point loss. But we played them even and had opportunities to win in the final seconds of each period.
- Possibly the coaches take advice from the Boneyard, since much of the gratuitous advice following Wichita State was implemented. Onuorah didn't play, Anderson's minutes were radically cut in favor of an Adams/Vital/Larrier perimeter, and the young guys Carlton, Whaley, and Diarra benefited with more minutes. Finally, the best players were on the floor and the young forwards were given a chance to develop.
- Some additional offensive plays were introduced and they seemed to help, the team shot 38% from 3 and 43% overall.
- 18 assists, only 7 turnovers. They protected the ball and shared it.
- Whaley! 4-6 from the floor, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1 assist, 0 turnovers, only 2 personal fouls. If he hits his free throws we win. With a year's experience and some muscle, he will be a player. Needs better conditioning, he played 41 minutes and his first 20 were much more productive than his last 20.
- If Carlton and Diarra can cut down the fouls, they'll be much more positive players.
- We are closing in on a 7 player rotation of Adams/Vital/Larrier/Anderson on the perimeter, Whaley/Carlton/Diarra on the interior. A shortened rotation was another fan request and gives them a better chance to develop chemistry.
- If we improve the rebounding and maintain the recent progress, gotta believe this team gets back to the 80s in kenpom which would assure a winning record and an NIT bid. That would be a huge step forward with an infusion of talent coming in next year. (Gilbert, Sid Wilson, Akinjo primarily; probably a new center recruit in the spring; Matthews a good shooter; Kisunas another piece adding depth inside.)

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

Tulsa was a 2.5 point favorite. I'll just assume everything after that is just as wrong.

 

[Nostical]

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

No we aren't.

 

[auror]

We did great at preventing TOs until the Jalen play.

 

[Walker11]

No we aren't.

This may be the most damning comment I have ever seen.

 

[JMick]

This may be the most damning comment I have ever seen.

I thought my eyes were deceiving me

 

[DMIL]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing.

A few items:
- Overall performance: Entering the game, Tulsa was a heavy favorite. Pregame they were about #90 in kenpom. We had been in the 80s before Gilbert went down and were plummeting ever since to #127 pre-game. If you just count the games since Gilbert re-injured the shoulder, we were probably playing Kenpom #180 basketball. With Tulsa having homecourt, you would expect another 10 point loss. But we played them even and had opportunities to win in the final seconds of each period.
- Possibly the coaches take advice from the Boneyard, since much of the gratuitous advice following Wichita State was implemented. Onuorah didn't play, Anderson's minutes were cut in favor of an Adams/Vital/Larrier perimeter, and the young guys Carlton, Whaley, and Diarra benefited with more minutes. Finally, the best players were on the floor and the young forwards were given a chance to develop.
- Some additional offensive plays were introduced and they seemed to help, the team shot 38% from 3 and 43% overall.
- 18 assists, only 7 turnovers. They protected the ball and shared it.
- Whaley! 4-6 from the floor, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1 assist, 0 turnovers, only 2 personal fouls. If he hits his free throws we win. With a year's experience and some muscle, he will be a player. Needs better conditioning, he played 41 minutes and his first 20 were much more productive than his last 20.
- If Carlton and Diarra can cut down the fouls, they'll be much more positive players.
- We are closing in on a 7 player rotation of Adams/Vital/Larrier/Anderson on the perimeter, Whaley/Carlton/Diarra on the interior. A shortened rotation was another fan request and gives them a better chance to develop chemistry.
- If we improve the rebounding and maintain the recent progress, gotta believe this team gets back to the 80s in kenpom which would assure a winning record and an NIT bid. That would be a huge step forward with an infusion of talent coming in next year. (Gilbert, Sid Wilson, Akinjo primarily; probably a new center recruit in the spring; Matthews a good shooter; Kisunas another piece adding depth inside.)

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

Love it man....we need more posts like this. Gotta be realistic and focus on the positives. This isn't pie in the sky. Also....Kisunas is a stretch big that can shoot and pass. High Basketbll IQ.

 

[SouthBayHusky]

Sorry but no positives when you’re ranked roughly #130 and you consistently lose to Tulsa. Also, very hard to be excited with the prospect of losing both Larrier and Jalen Adams (and God know whoever else bails) and replacing them with 3 freshman (consisting of high 3 star players and a top 100 player). And the best we can hope for is NIT which is really hard to get excited about. Missing the NCAA tournament three out of four years is hard to accept, and quite frankly next years team I can’t see being much better given the likely losses of our 2 best players.

 

[AdamaNation]

Or defend the inbound

Remember when James jones from Miami stole that inbounds pass from Marcus white and beat us back ,in what was it 2003?

 

[JakeTheDog]

Remember when James jones from Miami stole that inbounds pass from Marcus white and beat us back ,in what was it 2003?

It was Darius Rice who stole the inbounds and hit the three. I remember because I hated him for about a week after that.

 

[whaler11]

Remember when James jones from Miami stole that inbounds pass from Marcus white and beat us back ,in what was it 2003?

It was Shamon Tooles who turned it over.

 

[superjohn]

Tulsa was a 2.5 point favorite. I'll just assume everything after that is just as wrong.

The poster takes it as a positive that Ollie's starting lineup and allotment of minutes is based off of reading the boneyard.

 

[whaler11]

The poster takes it as a positive that Ollie's starting lineup and allotment of minutes is based off of reading the boneyard.

I read a few more. He also said that Anderson's minutes were cut like everyone wanted. Fouling out will have that effect on a player's minutes.

 

[DMIL]

No we aren't.

More positives than negatives in this game. No shooters or point guards and a bunch of players that haven't developed a good chemistry and know how to win. With Gilbert out 20 wins is out the window. We still have a chance for a winning season. This is who we are. Our best chance for success this year with the guys we have is a tighter defense, tighter rotation, better shot selection and less turnovers.

 

[AdamaNation]

It was Shamon Tooles who turned it over.

Wink and a thumbs up emoji to you!

 

[UConnDan97]

Of course there was positive growth from the players tonight.

Of course the team is getting killed on this board because we came up on the wrong end of a double overtime game.

They played good ball tonight, and I'm sick to my stomach because they deserved to be rewarded for that effort...

 

[VAHuskyFan]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing. . . .

Agree the improvement in assists/turnovers was an encouraging step forward. Other than that, though, let’s look at some of the positives/signs of improvement mentioned:

• We were “plummeting” entering the game, but managed to “play Tulsa even,” until the part where we lost. (Tulsa.)

• KO “finally” put “the best players on the floor.” In game 14.

• We shot 43% from the floor (still worse than the season average of 200+ Division 1 teams).

• “If” we make several improvements, we can avoid another losing season and go to the NIT, which would be “a huge step forward.”

I know you’re trying to focus on the positives, but that is . . . depressing stuff. Talk about damning with faint praise.

 

[DMIL]

Agree the improvement in assists/turnovers was an encouraging step forward. Other than that, though, let’s look at some of the positives/signs of improvement mentioned:

• We were “plummeting” entering the game, but managed to “play Tulsa even,” until the part where we lost. (Tulsa.)

• KO “finally” put “the best players on the floor.” In game 14.

• We shot 43% from the floor (still worse than the season average of 200+ Division 1 teams).

• “If” we make several improvements, we can avoid another losing season and go to the NIT, which would be “a huge step forward.”

I know you’re trying to focus on the positives, but that is . . . depressing stuff. Talk about damning with faint praise.

Humbling for sure.

 

[champs99and04]

Tulsa was a 2.5 point favorite. I'll just assume everything after that is just as wrong.

I saw Tulsa -4. Either way, you could make the argument, based on the trajectories of both teams, that we should have expected another double digit loss as pj expressed. Tulsa had won five of six entering play, a stretch that included a road victory over a good K-State team. They're playing good basketball and the rest of his post is valid. Anderson is not a good player at this level but Ollie only has so many options.

 

[whaler11]

I saw Tulsa -4. Either way, you could make the argument, based on the trajectories of both teams, that we should have expected another double digit loss as pj expressed. Tulsa had won five of six entering play, a stretch that included a road victory over a good K-State team. They're playing good basketball and the rest of his post is valid. Anderson is not a good player at this level but Ollie only has so many options.

It closed 2.5 - we don’t need to go by what you ‘saw’.

If you are expecting a ten point game that closes at 2.5 - rest assured you are wrong way more often than right. If your entire premise is built upon the this conceit it can go straight in the trash.

Ollie is stuck with Anderson because of Ollie. Oh poor Kevin has no options: Having a crappy roster isn’t an excuse it’s an indictment.

You can keep trying to tell me I’m not watching a terrible coach with a terrible team in a terrible building - the problem is all the evidence points against you.

Ollie coached them out of a win because he can’t even figure out when to take timeouts. The game turned because he burned a timeout and all he came up with for an inbounds play was turning it over under the basket.

3 million dollars a year to be an anchor to your team, call a stupid timeout, not draw up something that can even get the damn ball inbounds and then have people defend it.

A frigging idiot like me can post in the game thread than calling time out in that spot is a huge mistake and he is so bad it played out that decision cost them the game. Sure I didn’t play college basketball or in the NBA - but I somehow picked up on the value of timeouts.

 

[huskyrob1]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing.

A few items:
- Overall performance: Entering the game, Tulsa was a heavy favorite. Pregame they were about #90 in kenpom. We had been in the 80s before Gilbert went down and were plummeting ever since to #127 pre-game. If you just count the games since Gilbert re-injured the shoulder, we were probably playing Kenpom #180 basketball. With Tulsa having homecourt, you would expect another 10 point loss. But we played them even and had opportunities to win in the final seconds of each period.
- Possibly the coaches take advice from the Boneyard, since much of the gratuitous advice following Wichita State was implemented. Onuorah didn't play, Anderson's minutes were cut in favor of an Adams/Vital/Larrier perimeter, and the young guys Carlton, Whaley, and Diarra benefited with more minutes. Finally, the best players were on the floor and the young forwards were given a chance to develop.
- Some additional offensive plays were introduced and they seemed to help, the team shot 38% from 3 and 43% overall.
- 18 assists, only 7 turnovers. They protected the ball and shared it.
- Whaley! 4-6 from the floor, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1 assist, 0 turnovers, only 2 personal fouls. If he hits his free throws we win. With a year's experience and some muscle, he will be a player. Needs better conditioning, he played 41 minutes and his first 20 were much more productive than his last 20.
- If Carlton and Diarra can cut down the fouls, they'll be much more positive players.
- We are closing in on a 7 player rotation of Adams/Vital/Larrier/Anderson on the perimeter, Whaley/Carlton/Diarra on the interior. A shortened rotation was another fan request and gives them a better chance to develop chemistry.
- If we improve the rebounding and maintain the recent progress, gotta believe this team gets back to the 80s in kenpom which would assure a winning record and an NIT bid. That would be a huge step forward with an infusion of talent coming in next year. (Gilbert, Sid Wilson, Akinjo primarily; probably a new center recruit in the spring; Matthews a good shooter; Kisunas another piece adding depth inside.)

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

Here are a couple more positives....UConn managed to score only 88 points in 50 minutes of basketball. Jalen Adams, Vital, and Larrier, altogether missed 37 shots during the game. Adam's was 10-25, Vital 8-20, Larrier 7-17. Great shooting guys!!! I hope all three are getting good grades in class and each gets his degree, because at this rate each will need that degree after UConn.

 

[champs99and04]

It closed 2.5 - we don’t need to go by what you ‘saw’.

If you are expecting a ten point game that closes at 2.5 - rest assured you are wrong way more often than right. If your entire premise is built upon the this conceit it can go straight in the trash.

Ollie is stuck with Anderson because of Ollie. Oh poor Kevin has no options: Having a crappy roster isn’t an excuse it’s an indictment.

You can keep trying to tell me I’m not watching a terrible coach with a terrible team in a terrible building - the problem is all the evidence points against you.

Ollie coached them out of a win because he can’t even figure out when to take timeouts. The game turned because he burned a timeout and all he came up with for an inbounds play was turning it over under the basket.

3 million dollars a year to be an anchor to your team, call a stupid timeout, not draw up something that can even get the damn ball inbounds and then have people defend it.

A frigging idiot like me can post in the game thread than calling time out in that spot is a huge mistake and he is so bad it played out that decision cost them the game. Sure I didn’t play college basketball or in the NBA - but I somehow picked up on the value of timeouts.

I understand that he is stuck with Anderson because of himself. That doesn't mean we need to criticize him twice for the same mistakes. The roster is what it is and at this point if we're going to evaluate him on this portion of the job then we need to clean the slate of any variables that might distort that picture.

My impression was that the opening lines are typically more accurate than the closing lines. I could be wrong, but either way they were ranked some 20 spots ahead of us on KenPom and those rankings tend to correlate strongly with where the line is opening. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume, especially given how we've plummeted after the Gilbert injury, that the computers were less fond of our chances than that spread might indicate. Now I'll take Vegas over all of them, but the other variables that factored into that spread can't be fully separated from human expectation which brings us back to the idea that people are counting double against Ollie.

The 3 million dollars is just another thing that distracts from the ability to accurately assess his performance as coach. When you start quibbling with how a coach uses a timeouts you're really belaboring the point because although that criticism may be valid in a vacuum it is going to influence your win probability in the long haul by a matter of decimal points. (Incidentally, I remember thinking the same thing as you at the time, but even if we are to assume that Ollie screwed up there it does not diminish the role that luck and variance played in that game). Nobody keeps track of which coaches use timeouts the best. He is bad at other aspects of his job that cause people to displace onto small things like that which is exactly my point. We can think he's guilty and he can be guilty but that doesn't mean he doesn't get a fair trial. He's not getting a fair trial from this board.