Pitino on the state of recruiting

[yungdowork]

Thought this was an interesting quote. Given the availability of proven upperclassmen transfers, retooling with high school recruits is harder than ever. If you don’t have the pull to bring in a recruiting class like ours next year, there’s something to be said for letting those kids develop elsewhere and bringing them in once they’re more known commodities.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again.

What’s the point of having a development and coaching advantage if you’re okay with another coach doing you’re development for you?

Also, yeah you never want to replace upper classmen with freshmen. That has NEVER been the case.

Youre suppose to plan you’re recruiting classes out so that when one guy leaves, the next guy who was training under him is ready to step up into his role that’s been with the program.

The conversation about freshmen replacing upperclassmen is disingenuous because that was never supposed to be the case.

 

[gtcam]

Recruiting takes time and energy
Portal takes someone's else's cash, convincing the player that your cash is better than another program's and you passing that along with promises of 16 vestal virgins from his private harem

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Recruiting takes time and energy
Portal takes someone's else's cash, convincing the player that your cash is better than another program's and you passing that along with promises of 16 vestal virgins from his private harem

Yup. Sounds more like lazy coaches than anything else

 

[UConnTrumbull]

Going forward I can’t imagine many freshmen, outside of 5 star players, getting much playing time on the biggest teams. Might actually help mid-majors by getting better recruits even if they are 1-2 year and gone.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Going forward I can’t imagine many freshmen, outside of 5 star players, getting much playing time on the biggest teams. Might actually help mid-majors by getting better recruits even if they are 1-2 year and gone.

This is not true lol

 

[superjohn]

I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again.

What’s the point of having a development and coaching advantage if you’re okay with another coach doing you’re development for you?

Also, yeah you never want to replace upper classmen with freshmen. That has NEVER been the case.

Youre suppose to plan you’re recruiting classes out so that when one guy leaves, the next guy who was training under him is ready to step up into his role that’s been with the program.

The conversation about freshmen replacing upperclassmen is disingenuous because that was never supposed to be the case.

You have this all wrong. Pitino hasn't reeled in any McDonald's all-Americans since he got to St. John's. He instantly made them a team that should've been a tournament team his first season with all transfers and now he has the #10 team in the country in his second season.

He's old, he's not going to sit around and wait hoping he can take a bunch of 3 star and a couple 4 star recruits and hopefully build them up to be a contender in a few years. He plays basically a 6 man rotation and 5 of them are transfers. He would be an idiot if he tried to do it the long way at a school that's not viewed as a great destination for top high school recruits when he has money at his disposal and can do it through the portal. Rick Pitino is not an idiot.

 

[boog204]

Thought this was an interesting quote. Given the availability of proven upperclassmen transfers, retooling with high school recruits is harder than ever. If you don’t have the pull to bring in a recruiting class like ours next year, there’s something to be said for letting those kids develop elsewhere and bringing them in once they’re more known commodities.

I get it... It's an extreme example of sorts, but would you rather have Cam for one dominant year or a 4 star-ish freshmen who will take two to three years to develop and probably never be as good? If Pitino can just replace his mercenaries every year with similar guys, what's the point of bringing in freshmen who might have growing pains and potentially flame out?

I hate the concept because part of the joy of CBB in the past was watching those freshmen develop and your Whaley's, Hilton's, or even more "lauded" players play and grow over three or four years. But I think that part of CBB is dead. I think it's entered the realm where a freshman comes in, hopes to get time, and then leaves to go somewhere else to play and be paid. On the other side, if you're a Mid-Major guy with some cred, you bail and go to $reener pastures to get noticed. The whole thing is broken.

 

[superjohn]

I get it... It's an extreme example of sorts, but would you rather have Cam for one dominant year or a 4 star-ish freshmen who will take two to three years to develop and probably never be as good? If Pitino can just replace his mercenaries every year with similar guys, what's the point of bringing in freshmen who might have growing pains and potentially flame out?

I hate the concept because part of the joy of CBB in the past was watching those freshmen develop and your Whaley's, Hilton's, or even more "lauded" players play and grow over three or four years. But I think that part of CBB is dead. I think it's entered the realm where a freshman comes in, hopes to get time, and then leaves to go somewhere else to play and be paid. On the other side, if you're a Mid-Major guy with some cred, you bail and go to $reener pastures to get noticed. The whole thing is broken.

Whaley and Hilton were great stories but I would much rather have the best players available. I had more fun watching Cam and Tristen at UConn than I did just about any junior and seniors we developed in the decades I've watched the team and they're just as much a part of the UConn family as any players we've had.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

You have this all wrong. Pitino hasn't reeled in any McDonald's all-Americans since he got to St. John's. He instantly made them a team that should've been a tournament team his first season with all transfers and now he has the #10 team in the country in his second season.

He's old, he's not going to sit around and wait hoping he can take a bunch of 3 star and a couple 4 star recruits and hopefully build them up to be a contender in a few years. He plays basically a 6 man rotation and 5 of them are transfers. He would be an idiot if he tried to do it the long way at a school that's not viewed as a great destination for top high school recruits when he has money at his disposal and can do it through the portal. Rick Pitino is not an idiot.

I understand Pitino’s view on it. I also agree with using the transfer portal when you’re brand new to a place that has no talent like Pitino did and Kentucky did because they haven’t had the opportunity to bring their own guys in.

If Pitino simply does not have the energy or time to recruit high schoolers and thinks he can’t bring in the right talent then yeah, he should keep hitting the portal.

But it’s not a philosophy that should be picked up by coaches that can actually scout and bring in great talent from the HS ranks

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Whaley and Hilton were great stories but I would much rather have the best players available. I had more fun watching Cam and Tristen at UConn than I did just about any junior and seniors we developed in the decades I've watched the team and they're just as much a part of the UConn family as any players we've had.

You had more fun watching those guys than Kemba and Shabazz?

 

[yungdowork]

But I think that part of CBB is dead. I think it's entered the realm where a freshman comes in, hopes to get time, and then leaves to go somewhere else to play and be paid. On the other side, if you're a Mid-Major guy with some cred, you bail and go to $reener pastures to get noticed. The whole thing is broken.

The landscape has changed for sure but I don’t think it’s broken. I think players have options now and I am never going to think that is a bad thing. Before you were basically risking your whole basketball career having to sit out a year to transfer, no matter what the reason is. Now kids get to pursue opportunities whether that be NIL money, more playing time, better competition, or whatever it may be.

We still have guys that we have developed over several years and are important players now like Samson and Diarra (Hass obviously transferred in but still been here for years). However we’ve been able to use the portal to acquire guys like Tristen Newton and Cam who were veteran guys important for building the culture.

And we’ve also been able to let players who wouldn’t have got much run (Diggins, Corey Floyd, Javonte Brown-Ferguson) go to schools where they’d at least have an opportunity. Diggins would never have played significant minutes for us and now he’s on a full ride scoring 17 points a game at a school that really appreciates him.

 

[boog204]

Whaley and Hilton were great stories but I would much rather have the best players available. I had more fun watching Cam and Tristen at UConn than I did just about any junior and seniors we developed in the decades I've watched the team and they're just as much a part of the UConn family as any players we've had.

Well that's my point... I loved having the 3 or 4 year guy but that's nearly dead now. I mean I love Jayden Ross. I might be his biggest fan on here. But I recognize very clearly that we would be a better team if we had taken Brea to be the backup 2/3 scorer type. Now I don't know if that was exactly a trade option, but moving forward what would be the point of us recruiting a "project" of sorts when (assuming NIL is not a factor) we can try to pilfer a dude who's already scored 1000+ points somewhere and proven he can play? Then you try to nab super high-end recruits and supplement with vets who have proven they can already do it. Pitino knows exactly what he's doing and is one of the greatest coaches ever. He's won everywhere and he knows he can Frankenstein a team together and be damn good in the process.

 

[superjohn]

You had more fun watching those guys than Kemba and Shabazz?

Reading comprehension

 

[Jaydumo20]

Recruiting takes time and energy
Portal takes someone's else's cash, convincing the player that your cash is better than another program's and you passing that along with promises of 16 vestal virgins from his private harem

Best synopsis of the sad state of affairs.

 

[yungdowork]

Recruiting takes time and energy
Portal takes someone's else's cash, convincing the player that your cash is better than another program's and you passing that along with promises of 16 vestal virgins from his private harem

This just seems like a really dismissive way to look at the portal. Why is recruiting a high school kid who has been sought after since 6th grade better than a coach recognizing Dalton Knecht’s ability and letting him climb the ranks from JuCo to Northern Colorado to Tennessee? And same goes for Cam going from Loyola to Rutgers and then winning a national championship. The current portal system is the only reason those guys ever got a chance to prove themselves and now they’re both scratching NBA rosters

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Reading comprehension

Junior and seniors that were developed in the past decade. What am I missing?

We can throw plenty of other names with the same question that fall under that criteria lol.

Ben, Emeka, Thabeet, I can go on.

Like we have a really great history lmao

 

[yungdowork]

Junior and seniors that were developed in the past decade. What am I missing?

We can throw plenty of other names with the same question that fall under that criteria lol.

Ben, Emeka, Thabeet, I can go on.

Like we have a really great history lmao

I don't really understand your perspective here. Since the post-Covid portal started, we have repeatedly had great recruiting classes. Newton was brought in to replace Gaffney transferring and RJ Cole graduating. Cam was brought in to replace Naheim Alleyne and be a stopgap for Solo and Stewart to develop.

The guys who lost their roster spot to the transfers were never going to be in the Kemba, Shabazz, Emeka tier and it just seems crazy to suggest they were.

 

[nomar]

Junior and seniors that were developed in the past decade. What am I missing?

We can throw plenty of other names with the same question that fall under that criteria lol.

Ben, Emeka, Thabeet, I can go on.

Like we have a really great history lmao

Kemba left in 2011 and Bazz left in 2014, and the others well before that. So not in the "past decade."

 

[superjohn]

Junior and seniors that were developed in the past decade. What am I missing?

We can throw plenty of other names with the same question that fall under that criteria lol.

Ben, Emeka, Thabeet, I can go on.

Like we have a really great history lmao

Of the hundreds of players I've watched play at UConn I had more fun watching Cam and Tristen "than just about any of them." Only guys I can think of I enjoyed at the same level or more are Rip, El-Amin, Okafor, Ben, Bazz, Kemba, Donovan. I'll throw Caron, Ray, and Donyell in there as well even though they never won a national championship.

The point is they are two of my favorite players who ever played here despite being transfers who only played here 2 seasons and 1 season.

 

[navery12]

Junior and seniors that were developed in the past decade. What am I missing?

We can throw plenty of other names with the same question that fall under that criteria lol.

Ben, Emeka, Thabeet, I can go on.

Like we have a really great history lmao

The point you're missing is that the Kemba and Shabazz types are never going to stop being recruited by top schools. They're still going to be developed at UConn and become great players.

The guys who were clearly not at UConn's level and at best going to be contributors for 1 year as a senior are the ones who are being recruited over in the portal. And that means more winning for UConn which is something most fans enjoy

 

[RuffRuff]

Hyper focusing on development is utopian in today’s landscape. It’s dumb.

As mentioned, have to look at development in 2 year chunks these days, whether it be HS or portal. This 3-4 year strategy has too many leaks to be useful.

You see players that have made leaps from mid majors kicking butt and leading tourney teams (Haggerty/Lanier), you see players changing high majors kicking butt in new scenery (Tonje Wisc, Mitchell Missouri). The list goes well beyond that.

You see very few freshman sans Duke leading top teams. Chasing the multi year development route is dying by the day. Adapt or die.

If you want to hang onto the 3-4 year development route YouTube plays lots of old reruns of games from 2004.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

Kemba left in 2011 and Bazz left in 2014, and the others well before that. So not in the "past decade."

Well he said decades plural that was my typo. Saying “just about” but actually meaning like top 20-30 players you enjoy watching is confusing but it’s whatever.

The point you're missing is that the Kemba and Shabazz types are never going to stop being recruited by top schools. They're still going to be developed at UConn and become great players.

The guys who were clearly not at UConn's level and at best going to be contributors for 1 year as a senior are the ones who are being recruited over in the portal. And that means more winning for UConn which is something most fans enjoy

You do know Shabazz was like 88th coming out of high school? He was rated lower than Ross and for sure lower than Nowell and was a plan D for us recruiting wise. He would not have developed to become who he was in this environment.

You’re talking in hindsight because of what they became even though you yourself didn’t even watch their careers here because you weren’t a fan at that time.

 

[RuffRuff]

Well he said decades plural that was my typo. Saying “just about” but actually meaning like top 20-30 players you enjoy watching is confusing but it’s whatever.

You do know Shabazz was like 88th coming out of high school? He was rated lower than Ross and for sure lower than Nowell and was a plan D for us recruiting wise. He would not have developed to become who he was in this environment.

You’re talking in hindsight because of what they became even though you yourself didn’t even watch their careers here because you weren’t a fan at that time.

Dude you’re living in the past. Do you know how much college sports have changed in the last 2-3 years? It’s not the same sport.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

I don't really understand your perspective here. Since the post-Covid portal started, we have repeatedly had great recruiting classes. Newton was brought in to replace Gaffney transferring and RJ Cole graduating. Cam was brought in to replace Naheim Alleyne and be a stopgap for Solo and Stewart to develop.

The guys who lost their roster spot to the transfers were never going to be in the Kemba, Shabazz, Emeka tier and it just seems crazy to suggest they were.

Honestly we have no idea what Gaffney would’ve been if we never brought in RJ Cole and just gave him the keys. But it’s a deep hypothetical that’s not worth getting into too much.

Cam was a perfect pickup and match regardless.

To be clear, I’m not saying teams shouldn’t recruit portal talent over freshman when they have a need for big starter minutes. Cam being brought in to give young guys time to develop like last year is fine. Mahaney being brought in to put Nowell on the bench completely and take opportunities away from a sophomore Ross is not. I will also not be happy if some of our sophomores and freshman walk this summer for some transfers to replace them.