Paige's Wings Page (merged thread)

[boontonbomber]

I've never been an Arike fan, but she is a hugely talented player. Besides those 37 points last night, she had 7 assists. I really think that she and Paige could be one of the best 1-2 combos in the league. And together with Siegrist, Carrington, Hines-Allen, etc, they should be very good. It's a team of players who are new to each other, and Koclanes may not be the best person for the job. Not a bunch of people with the right background to take on such a challenge, though there is one possibility in the Wings' front office.

 

[oldude]

I don’t think it’s a coaching issue. Without getting on Arike, I do think there’s a “compatibility” issue between Paige & Arike. But the Wings have a lot of issues to fix, including the need for a true Big with some mobility, as well as a bunch of better shooters and finishers to surround Paige with. That’s not all going to get fixed this year.

If I’m Curt Miller, I’m going to start shopping Arike for a versatile young player on a rookie contract and/or draft choices. The Wings are a 2-3 year rebuild job. Paige has to be the centerpiece of that rebuild. Surround her with the right complementary players and the Wings will be chasing championships.

 

[Plebe]

As sloppy as their offense looks at times, when you're giving up 97 points in a 5-point loss the bigger problem is defense.

Dallas currently is 4th in the league in PPG and 12th in opponent PPG. This is exactly their pattern from last year, when “a certain player” averaged over 20 ppg but her team ranked dead last in opponent PPG. Part of the problem is a subpar front court to be sure, but it's also a problem when your scoring star has an entrenched habit of “load management” on defense. If she hasn't yet set the record for 30-point outings in losing efforts, I'm sure she soon will.

 

[oldude]

As sloppy as their offense looks at times, when you're giving up 97 points in a 5-point loss the bigger problem is defense.

Dallas currently is 4th in the league in PPG and 12th in opponent PPG. This is exactly their pattern from last year, when “a certain player” averaged over 20 ppg but her team ranked dead last in opponent PPG. Part of the problem is a subpar front court to be sure, but it's also a problem when your scoring star has an entrenched habit of “load management” on defense. If she hasn't yet set the record for 30-point outings in losing efforts, I'm sure she soon will.

I agree that the Wings have a serious issue on defense. But I would disagree that there’s a “load management” issue with Arike. She’s 5’8”, playing in a league where small guards get taken to the cleaners on forced switches or by Big guards all the time.

5’6” Moriah Jefferson didn’t play last night for Chicago. 5’ 8” JJ Quinerly played 6 minutes for Dallas. 5’8” Arike Ogunbowle played 36/40 minutes for Dallas. The Sky forced her to guard bigger players all night. Add to that the inability of Smith, Hines-Allen and even McGowan to slow down Cardoso and Dallas is going to give up a lot of points.

 

[YKCornelius]

From my perch, yesterday's Wings game was troubling for two reasons. The first was the recurring issues - like the lack of overall team defense including the confusion on when and how to switch man coverage on picks and screens, the lack of conditioning from Teaira McCowan, and Arike's reversion to last year's posture of ignoring the team dynamic when she realizes she is hot.

The second was the dubious decisions made by the coaching staff on player substitutions (or lack thereof). Not subbing McCowan for Smith ofter the first few minutes when it was clear that Smith had no idea on how to defend the taller Cardoso. 18 of Cardoso's 23 points were achieved with Smith and Hines Allen guarding her. Bringing JJ Quinerly in against a Sky guard trio that has 28 years of WNBA experience amongst them and leaving with a +/- of -14 in six minutes is a real head scratcher.

By the fourth quarter, both Hines-Allen and McCowan had slowed considerably. Sky players were beating them down the court and both bigs were slow to establish picks and screens. This simply can't happen for a guard oriented team that has to rely on screens, picks and switches to get quality shots.

Six games into the season, the coaching staff gets a tentative bye for now. However, I will be looking for Koclanes to make adjustments when the Sky come back to Dallas tomorrow for the rematch.

 

[Geew1992]

I agree that the Wings have a serious issue on defense. But I would disagree that there’s a “load management” issue with Arike. She’s 5’8”, playing in a league where small guards get taken to the cleaners on forced switches or by Big guards all the time.

5’6” Moriah Jefferson didn’t play last night for Chicago. 5’ 8” JJ Quinerly played 6 minutes for Dallas. 5’8” Arike Ogunbowle played 36/40 minutes for Dallas. The Sky forced her to guard bigger players all night. Add to that the inability of Smith, Hines-Allen and even McGowan to slow down Cardoso and Dallas is going to give up a lot of points.

Pretty sure Moriah's injured.

 

[oldude]

Pretty sure Moriah's injured.

Moriah and Haley van Lith were both cleared to play against Dallas. Only van Lith played.

 

[Plebe]

I agree that the Wings have a serious issue on defense. But I would disagree that there’s a “load management” issue with Arike. She’s 5’8”, playing in a league where small guards get taken to the cleaners on forced switches or by Big guards all the time.

Ariel Atkins is 5'8" and is widely recognized as one of the best defensive guards in the league. Jordin Canada at 5'6" has been named to an all-WNBA defensive team.

Plenty of teams have guards 5'9" and smaller in the regular rotation and they're not giving up 97 points a game.

 

[oldude]

Ariel Atkins is 5'8" and is widely recognized as one of the best defensive guards in the league. Jordin Canada at 5'6" has been named to an all-WNBA defensive team.

Plenty of teams have guards 5'9" and smaller in the regular rotation and they're not giving up 97 points a game.

I am not saying that there aren’t some capable undersized defenders in the W. But any undersized defender is going to get picked on by opponents. It’s one of the reasons why Crystal Dangerfield is currently a free agent.

By the way, Jordan Canada has not played a game this season due to a knee injury and Ariel Atkins is actually 5’10”.

 

[FanInNC]

For the folks that follow the Wings and have a better handle on their roster and situation … does Aziaha James have a path to more minutes?

I have mostly followed through box scores but got the league pass when they played the Sun, as a Wolfpack supporter I wanted to watch Rivers and James face off.

In the opener James played 6 minutes but 2 or 3 of which came at the end when the game was completely decided. Then she didn’t play at all for 3 straight games. Against the Sun I was pleasantly surprised to see her come in early and she produced. Scored 9 points in 6 minutes in the 2nd quarter, was 2-2 from 3 and made 3-3 from the line. Then went back to the bench not to be seen again until the waning minutes of the game.

She didn’t play at all against the Sky the following game.

I recognize Dallas is guard heavy - just curious if there is a viable path for her to find minutes as a back up or if she seems destined to be glued to the pine all season.

 

[ShmiCO]

I agree that the Wings have a serious issue on defense. But I would disagree that there’s a “load management” issue with Arike. She’s 5’8”, playing in a league where small guards get taken to the cleaners on forced switches or by Big guards all the time.

5’6” Moriah Jefferson didn’t play last night for Chicago. 5’ 8” JJ Quinerly played 6 minutes for Dallas. 5’8” Arike Ogunbowle played 36/40 minutes for Dallas. The Sky forced her to guard bigger players all night. Add to that the inability of Smith, Hines-Allen and even McGowan to slow down Cardoso and Dallas is going to give up a lot of points.

The game vs the Sky was decided by front court defense (or lack thereof) IMO. The Wings looked like they were playing small ball in the final minutes of the game.

 

[oldude]

The game vs the Sky was decided by front court defense (or lack thereof) IMO. The Wings looked like they were playing small ball in the final minutes of the game.

Agreed. Smith & Hines-Allen are overmatched forwards when facing a true Big like Cardozo who had a great game. While McCowan has some size, her mobility is limited, so she really doesn’t control the paint like you would want from a true Big.

 

[WiseWillie]

Arike is ranked 15th in the WNBA with 4.2 assists per game

View attachment 109774

Ugunbowale is a dynamic scorer and opposing teams just normally double team her. No doubt that is a major contributor to her AST. However, she will most times wait to be doubled before passing off. Nothing wrong with that you can say because that means someone should have an open shot. But let's not kid ourselves. it's shoot first, pass second. Interesting to compare that to someone like Bueckers who has always had the set up the team offense with a pass first, shoot second mentality. Just ask Geno. Anyway, Ugunbowale's game isn't assisting. It's shooting and she has been pretty good at it so maybe her scoring prowess takes away from the times she passes off and her assists don't readily resonate as quickly. No matter, she is an all-star pro and deserves all the accolades she has worked hard to achieve.

 

[oldude]

Ugunbowale is a dynamic scorer and opposing teams just normally double team her. No doubt that is a major contributor to her AST. However, she will most times wait to be doubled before passing off. Nothing wrong with that you can say because that means someone should have an open shot. But let's not kid ourselves. it's shoot first, pass second. Interesting to compare that to someone like Bueckers who has always had the set up the team offense with a pass first, shoot second mentality. Just ask Geno. Anyway, Ugunbowale's game isn't assisting. It's shooting and she has been pretty good at it so maybe her scoring prowess takes away from the times she passes off and her assists don't readily resonate as quickly. No matter, she is an all-star pro and deserves all the accolades she has worked hard to achieve.

With all due respect, in watching the Wings games, the player that’s been getting doubled the most is Paige. Opponents want to get the ball out of Paige’s hands and not let her run the offense. Initially, Paige turned it over a couple times. But she figured things out and is finding open teammates all over the court. They just have to make shots.

 

[Bald Husky]

For those of you who think Paige isn't tough, she played the entire second half with a concussion.

 

[YKCornelius]

Ugunbowale is a dynamic scorer and opposing teams just normally double team her. No doubt that is a major contributor to her AST. However, she will most times wait to be doubled before passing off. Nothing wrong with that you can say because that means someone should have an open shot. But let's not kid ourselves. it's shoot first, pass second. Interesting to compare that to someone like Bueckers who has always had the set up the team offense with a pass first, shoot second mentality. Just ask Geno. Anyway, Ugunbowale's game isn't assisting. It's shooting and she has been pretty good at it so maybe her scoring prowess takes away from the times she passes off and her assists don't readily resonate as quickly. No matter, she is an all-star pro and deserves all the accolades she has worked hard to achieve.

I concur that a sizable chunk of AO's assists come from her getting rid of the ball when she is double-teamed. Which is a good thing, as you imply, and something that hopefully she will do more of going forward. She should look to her rookie starting teammate as the example for reacting to double-teams.

The interpretation of what counts as an assist in the WNBA is extremely broad. For example: Player A hands the ball of to Player B while setting a pick out on the arc, and Player B now proceeds to dribble around the new defender and then drive to the hoop for a lay-up or a running floater. Player A is given an assist. Another example: Player A grabs a defensive rebound, throws it out to Player B who receives the ball on the defense's side of the half court line, and proceeds to dribble all the way down the court full speed through or around defenders and to the hoop. Player A is given the assist.

These would not be assists in the college game.

Paige's assists this year are not so interpretive. That is because she finds the open man who has an immediate play to the basket. She's a joy to watch with the ball in her hands.

 

[WiseWillie]

For those of you who think Paige isn't tough, she played the entire second half with a concussion.

Tough yes in every sense of the word but also questionable decision to continue to play and/or not say anything to the coaching staff if not feeling well.

 

[oldude]

Tough yes in every sense of the word but also questionable decision to continue to play and/or not say anything to the coaching staff if not feeling well.

Let’s be clear. Paige is in the concussion protocol, out of an abundance of caution. That does not necessarily mean she has a concussion. After the game last night Koclanes was asked about Paige. He indicated that she complained of a headache after the game in Chicago, saying that she had taken a couple hits to the head during the game. at which point he had the doctor look at her. She was never unconscious, sick or indicating any other concussive symptoms.

Anyone who has played basketball, football, soccer, hockey or a number of other sports, has been hit in the head at one time or another. Most of those hits go largely unnoticed and unreported. It is a credit to the Wings that they are taking every precaution with Paige. She is, after all, the future of the franchise.

 

[cancontent]

Not a bad start for the rookie when she's included in this group for defensive stats.

 

[WiseWillie]

Let’s be clear. Paige is in the concussion protocol, out of an abundance of caution. That does not necessarily mean she has a concussion. After the game last night Koclanes was asked about Paige. He indicated that she complained of a headache after the game in Chicago, saying that she had taken a couple hits to the head during the game. at which point he had the doctor look at her. She was never unconscious, sick or indicating any other concussive symptoms.

Anyone who has played basketball, football, soccer, hockey or a number of other sports, has been hit in the head at one time or another. Most of those hits go largely unnoticed and unreported. It is a credit to the Wings that they are taking every precaution with Paige. She is, after all, the future of the franchise.gs

Let's be clear? Sure thing but what is anything but clear is whether the "concussion protocol" is a) merely out of an abundance of caution or b) whether Paige actually suffered a concussion. Has anything been officially released by the Wings or even so much as mentioned on one one of Paige's social media platforms? And if we want to stay in the "let's be clear" category please clarify about the speculation without any definitive explanation about when she got injured - from a hard fall or hard (flagrant?) foul.

In any event, it is hoped by anyone who loves women's basketball that Paige did not actually suffer a concussion. She has had enough injuries for one person to have to go through.

 

[RoadMaster]

 

[RoadMaster]

 

[Happydad745]

Dallas, at this point of the season is 1-7, worst in the league....Something is severely wrong with this franchise, and I doubt it will be corrected soon. That is just my opinion, not looking for a fight.

 

[oldude]

I had hoped that the silver lining in the Wings bad start would be that Dallas would trade Arike for a solid young player or draft choice as part of a major franchise rebuild next year around Paige. Unfortunately, Arike’s trade value appears to be plummeting with each & every game.

This is particularly true during the 3-game stretch when Paige was out. During those 3 Wings losses, Arike is 13/41 (31%). For the season, Arike is shooting a career low 35% from the floor and 28% from 3.

 

[Happydad745]

I had hoped that the silver lining in the Wings bad start would be that Dallas would trade Arike for a solid young player or draft choice as part of a major franchise rebuild next year around Paige. Unfortunately, Arike’s trade value appears to be plummeting with each & every game.

This is particularly true during the 3-game stretch when Paige was out. During those 3 Wings losses, Arike is 13/41 (31%). For the season, Arike is shooting a career low 35% from the floor and 28% from 3.

Trading for talent usually works out better as you basically know what you are getting...Arike and Jewel Lloyd are very similar players, both are good shooters but take too many contested or awkward shots and have a lower shooting percentage because of it.