Ouch! It must really suck

[superjohn]

If the Knicks stay flat and pick Mudiay at #4 I think they get the best player in the draft. I do not think C's have the same value they once did.

I would also be VERY aggressive trying to pick up a later 1 to pair Jordan Mickey with him and I like Josh Richardson either as a 50+ pick if we can acquire one or take my chances that he drops to UDFA.


That would give me two BIG athletic guards 6-5 and 6-6 who can both play PG and maybe the most under rated player in the draft Mickey.

Id then put all my efforts into grabbing Greg Monroe to be my C. He fits the triangle very well and at C with more space he should be really good. Finally to finish off Id cut Calderon and offer Carroll 50mm and grab Jerrelle Benimon and yes Hasheem Thabeet from the D league as my back up third string C and cutting Calderon to save 3.7mm towards the cap


Line up

C-Monroe (acquired 4 years 64mm)
PF Anthony
SF Carroll(acquired 4 years 50mm)
SG Galloway
PG Alexy Schvyed(signed using team MLE)


C Cole Aldrich
PF Mickey(acquired for 2017 #1 restricted to lottery)
F Thomas
G Hardaway
G Mudiay

C-Thabeet(vet minimum)
F Benimon 3 years 3mm non guaranteed
F Early
G Thansis A
PG Josh Richardson

That team would absolutely suck.

 

[scrappy2.0]

That team would absolutely suck.

The Knicks won 17 games last year. I dont think adding three athletic rookies Monroe and Carroll would have a negative effect. I think Mickey is the next Serge Ibaka and I love Mudiay but I dont see them starting year 1. If you can show me a way to be better Id like to see it)) my bet is you would have no clue!

 

[Stainmaster]

If you can show me a way to be better Id like to see it)) my bet is you would have no clue!

Simple. Tyler Harvey and Zeek Woodley.

 

[FartMan69]

If the Knicks stay flat and pick Mudiay at #4 I think they get the best player in the draft. I do not think C's have the same value they once did.

I would also be VERY aggressive trying to pick up a later 1 to pair Jordan Mickey with him and I like Josh Richardson either as a 50+ pick if we can acquire one or take my chances that he drops to UDFA.


That would give me two BIG athletic guards 6-5 and 6-6 who can both play PG and maybe the most under rated player in the draft Mickey.

Id then put all my efforts into grabbing Greg Monroe to be my C. He fits the triangle very well and at C with more space he should be really good. Finally to finish off Id cut Calderon and offer Carroll 50mm and grab Jerrelle Benimon and yes Hasheem Thabeet from the D league as my back up third string C and cutting Calderon to save 3.7mm towards the cap


Line up

C-Monroe (acquired 4 years 64mm)
PF Anthony
SF Carroll(acquired 4 years 50mm)
SG Galloway
PG Alexy Schvyed(signed using team MLE)


C Cole Aldrich
PF Mickey(acquired for 2017 #1 restricted to lottery)
F Thomas
G Hardaway
G Mudiay

C-Thabeet(vet minimum)
F Benimon 3 years 3mm non guaranteed
F Early
G Thansis A
PG Josh Richardson

This team would lose 70 games.....Alexy Schvyed lol

 

[scrappy2.0]

This team would lose 70 games.....Alexy Schvyed lol

Alexy was excellent with the Knicks. He gave them excellent PG play for his 20 games.

 

[FartMan69]

Alexy was excellent with the Knicks. He gave them excellent PG play for his 20 games.

You think he can lead a playoff team based on 18 mins a game on a 17 win team? C'mon use your head.

 

[superjohn]

The Knicks won 17 games last year. I dont think adding three athletic rookies Monroe and Carroll would have a negative effect. I think Mickey is the next Serge Ibaka and I love Mudiay but I dont see them starting year 1. If you can show me a way to be better Id like to see it)) my bet is you would have no clue!

The goal isn't to go from 17 wins to 22 wins and add more cr@p to the team.

 

[Lefty2one]

All I wanted all season was a Top 3 pick. Those two wins the last week of the regular season, SMH. Leave it to the Knicks...

#4 isn't awful from a general POV, I think Mudiay will be a good pro but based on his tape he's an awful fit for the Triangle. He's a typical modern NBA point guard who must be in a spread-the-floor/drive-and-kick offense where he's the centerpiece. He can't shoot, you don't want him playing off-the-ball and he won't space the floor. Also in the back of my mind I'm worried that he'll be a bust. I thought Dante Exum was unjustly hyped up last year and he was far from impressive this year. Russell would have been perfect but there is absolutely no way he doesn't go in the first three picks.

If they take Mudiay then Phil & Fisher have to be on the same page and agree to abandon the Triangle. Fisher may be willing to do so but it's all on Phil since he's making the pick and I don't think he'll want to ditch the system him that won him 11 titles. Ideally they'd move on from the Triangle, draft Mudiay, pursue a FA big like D. Jordan and move Melo back to the 4.

Winslow is a nice player but we undoubtedly have the worst roster in the NBA, it's not even close. A player like Winslow won't be a big enough of an impact guy IMO. I see him as a great glue guy but a 3rd/4th option on a good playoff team, we need more especially since we don't have our 1st rounder next year. Wonder if we'll lookin into Hezonja.

Really what I'm holding out hope for is that Russell/Mudiay impress the hell out of LA and go #2 to the Lakers. They have a lot of cap space and plenty of roster holes and there are some good free agent bigs but the PGs are garbage. They could draft a dynamic guard and then go grab a free agent big man like Gasol or potentially Aldridge/Love. If that happens then there is no way Philly will take the remaining big that Minny didn't draft #1 and Towns/Okafor will drop to us at #4. It's a pipedream but it's about all I have right now.

 

[pnow15]

One ting ya gotta say 'bout dem Knick fans: dey got big dreams.

 

[Gringo]

Hos ability to be a isnt made up - lots of data points on that, believe it or not that's up to you. It's not hate, I just don't enjoy arrogant people. Theres lots of personal and anecdotal support for support my perspective.

I'm curious to see the data points. Have you charted this in excel? Do you have a line graph that tracks how Phil Jackson's doucheness has grown over time?

 

[TheChamps990411]

Just saying we missed him by 1 pick! Makes a huge difference

Oh i see. Did not know that. My bad. I thought you meant he`d go to the KNicks somehow.

 

[Dogdeacon]

I'm curious to see the data points. Have you charted this in excel? Do you have a line graph that tracks how Phil Jackson's doucheness has grown over time?

Gotta figure the tell-all book criticizing Kobe ranks double maxipad on the data chart and then coming back after that and coaching him again (and winning a title) is a triple maxi.

Reality is simply Jackson isn't a GM and is just getting a big payday for his past successes. It does add a data point for soaking up some of Dolan's money and abusing the Knicks fans when they are down. I'd argue having him aboard gives the otherwise depressed fan-base hope (albeit un-founded) which in retrospect is mostly all they've had since 1973-ish. I'd say this is serving as a disposable .

 

[scrappy2.0]

All I wanted all season was a Top 3 pick. Those two wins the last week of the regular season, SMH. Leave it to the Knicks...

#4 isn't awful from a general POV, I think Mudiay will be a good pro but based on his tape he's an awful fit for the Triangle. He's a typical modern NBA point guard who must be in a spread-the-floor/drive-and-kick offense where he's the centerpiece. He can't shoot, you don't want him playing off-the-ball and he won't space the floor. Also in the back of my mind I'm worried that he'll be a bust. I thought Dante Exum was unjustly hyped up last year and he was far from impressive this year. Russell would have been perfect but there is absolutely no way he doesn't go in the first three picks.

If they take Mudiay then Phil & Fisher have to be on the same page and agree to abandon the Triangle. Fisher may be willing to do so but it's all on Phil since he's making the pick and I don't think he'll want to ditch the system him that won him 11 titles. Ideally they'd move on from the Triangle, draft Mudiay, pursue a FA big like D. Jordan and move Melo back to the 4.

Winslow is a nice player but we undoubtedly have the worst roster in the NBA, it's not even close. A player like Winslow won't be a big enough of an impact guy IMO. I see him as a great glue guy but a 3rd/4th option on a good playoff team, we need more especially since we don't have our 1st rounder next year. Wonder if we'll lookin into Hezonja.

Really what I'm holding out hope for is that Russell/Mudiay impress the hell out of LA and go #2 to the Lakers. They have a lot of cap space and plenty of roster holes and there are some good free agent bigs but the PGs are garbage. They could draft a dynamic guard and then go grab a free agent big man like Gasol or potentially Aldridge/Love. If that happens then there is no way Philly will take the remaining big that Minny didn't draft #1 and Towns/Okafor will drop to us at #4. It's a pipedream but it's about all I have right now.

Taking Mudiay is the equivalent of taking a franchise QB in football. If you watch extensive film on Mudiay--he is the best PG in this draft--hes going to be great. The NBA demands that you have a player who can make plays with the dribble--and hes great at it and only 18. If sign back Scvheyd--it will give him a couple of years to come on at his own pace and Alexy can play 1-2 it works just fine. We also have another big athletic young guard in Thansis and Tim Hardaway--that gives us 4 guards who are 6-5 6-6. We need perhaps one more guard for depth--I like Josh Richardson from Tennesse and if we cant get him Id like to swipe Aaron Craft Jerrelle Benimon and Jarell Eddy from the Dleague a 4-3 a 3 and utility 3rd PG.

Im not a Greg Monroe lover by any means but we need a post player and he is the one who is available. The potential is that he will be given more space to play than he had in Detroit and is a good passer/rebounder--needed for the triangle.

 

[Dogdeacon]

Taking Mudiay is the equivalent of taking a franchise QB in football. If you watch extensive film on Mudiay--he is the best PG in this draft--hes going to be great. The NBA demands that you have a player who can make plays with the dribble--and hes great at it and only 18. If sign back Scvheyd--it will give him a couple of years to come on at his own pace and Alexy can play 1-2 it works just fine. We also have another big athletic young guard in Thansis and Tim Hardaway--that gives us 4 guards who are 6-5 6-6. We need perhaps one more guard for depth--I like Josh Richardson from Tennesse and if we cant get him Id like to swipe Aaron Craft Jerrelle Benimon and Jarell Eddy from the Dleague a 4-3 a 3 and utility 3rd PG.

Im not a Greg Monroe lover by any means but we need a post player and he is the one who is available. The potential is that he will be given more space to play than he had in Detroit and is a good passer/rebounder--needed for the triangle.

You mean Mudiay looks good in the league that a washed-up 5 years ago Stephon Marbury dominates (finals MVP)?
Not denying potential, but PG sure things are tough and seasoning, work ethic & BBIQ at that position are as necessary as pure talent.

 

[dogfan96]

This is absurd.

1) Phil Jackson's won 11 NBA championships. That's an number in arguments like this.

2) Tex Winter's won zero titles at any level. He spent two decades getting fired everywhere he went until the Bulls hired him.

The head coach, not the assistant coach, runs the show. Winter coached the triangle because Phil Jackson wanted to run the triangle - Jackson put Winter into the Hall of Fame, not the other way around.

(And, not for nothing, but while he wrote a book, Winter didn't invent the triangle. He, like Jackson, added to it, but Winter's college coach Sam Berry invented it. He wrote the book before Tex Winter wrote the book. These days, there's also a guy coaching women's basketball who seems to be using it to win championships every year....)

Greg Popovich is the best coach in the NBA.. and he was even when Phil was coaching.. X number of rings don't make you better. Coach K had more rings than Calhoun but Calhoun coached circles around him when they went up against one another. Pop has had some great players no doubt but Jackson also had in many people's opinion the GOAT (and yeah they didn't win anything before Phil got there.. that was more about Pippen deciding to mature into a great player) and Shaq in his prime (the most dominant player in the league post-Jordan) and then Kobe slightly past his prime surrounded by Pau Gasol (best offensive big man in the league at the time), Bynum (before he was always hurt and stopped caring) and Lamar Odom (before crack and the Kardashians) coming off the bench. That's 3 legit 6'11 - 7'1 guys who all have great skill. Sure Phil had a lot to do with it, but players are much more important than who the coach is. LeBron has proven that the last 5 years.

 

[pnow15]

The irony of life. Every Husky fan was happy Mudiay went to China instead of SMU. Now half are pissed the Mudiay didn't get the year under Brown.

 

[Kembacity]

I think a lot of people are sleeping on Winslow. He can shoot and is going to get better. Can slash to the basket and score against contact and he can post up pretty good and with a 6`10 wingspan he can score over most g/sf wholl guard him. Hes got a lot of versatility in his game and i think hes going to be an all star on the next level. If im the knicks and Russell is off the board i take Winslow even though he plays the same position as Melo.

He's like a much earlier legit Jimmy Butler. we saw what he became and what he was, so I'm definitely on board the Winslow can be a very good pro train

 

[Dogdeacon]

Greg Popovich is the best coach in the NBA.. and he was even when Phil was coaching.. X number of rings don't make you better. Coach K had more rings than Calhoun but Calhoun coached circles around him when they went up against one another. Pop has had some great players no doubt but Jackson also had in many people's opinion the GOAT (and yeah they didn't win anything before Phil got there.. that was more about Pippen deciding to mature into a great player) and Shaq in his prime (the most dominant player in the league post-Jordan) and then Kobe slightly past his prime surrounded by Pau Gasol (best offensive big man in the league at the time), Bynum (before he was always hurt and stopped caring) and Lamar Odom (before crack and the Kardashians) coming off the bench. That's 3 legit 6'11 - 7'1 guys who all have great skill. Sure Phil had a lot to do with it, but players are much more important than who the coach is. LeBron has proven that the last 5 years.

In summation, Phil Jackson is the 2nd best coach in NBA history & it has recently been proven that players are the most important part of championships!

 

[scrappy2.0]

The other approach to the draft is taking Porzingis at 4 and giving Monroe the maximum. That woulkd make the Knicks upfront

C-Monroe 6-11 250

PF Porzingis 7-2 220

F 6-8 240 Anthony


which would be a very interesting frontline.

 

[pnow15]

He's like a much earlier legit Jimmy Butler. we saw what he became and what he was, so I'm definitely on board the Winslow can be a very good pro train

Actually, Melo likes Winston and thinks he can play along side of him. Read it on a draft board.
Having said that, if these two guards are projected to be Jason Kidd or John Wall type points, you almost have to select one of them.
But Knicks have to go for broke on this draft and pick the guy who projects to be a real star not just a nice addition.

 

[nyhusky89]

I think a lot of people are sleeping on Winslow. He can shoot and is going to get better. Can slash to the basket and score against contact and he can post up pretty good and with a 6`10 wingspan he can score over most g/sf wholl guard him. Hes got a lot of versatility in his game and i think hes going to be an all star on the next level. If im the knicks and Russell is off the board i take Winslow even though he plays the same position as Melo.

In the NBA today they can definitely play together and like i said before-are ham and egg. Winslow will be a borderline stopper from day 1, can hit the 3 and showed he can dribble/get to the lane in march. I did not realize Mudiay's situation and understand that going to china was not such a selfish move, but i still prefer winslow. there wasn't a single J on mudiay's highlight. If you add winslow, obviously you need to sign 2 pg's, but it also frees you to sign one trye C and then a david west/milsap to come off the bench for 20-30 minutes at PF if you want to go big. Just so much versatility in his game and a higher likelihood-in my estimation-of contributing to a GOOD team immediately-defense always works and 3's will fall even if he doesn't figure out how to score in the half court immediately.

 

[J187Money]

Instead you get socks and underwear.

Socks and underwear are useful.

 

[FartMan69]

If they offer Monroe the max i officially quit

 

[444JR]

Justice Winslow. Putting him with Melo immediately balances out your wing and brings in an athletic active, high-level defender with pro size who improved immensely on O over the course of a season at Duke. He can finish with authority but also draws fouls a decent rate and should be a good 3-point shooter. Also, I know this will draw criticism, but give me the kid from Duke who was remarkable in the tourney over the one who chose to play pro in China for a year. Nothing personal, get that paper.

Screw the triangle, start small with Melo at the 4.

Now for a Complete Fantasy

Dragic/P Beverly
D Green/Hardaway Jr.
Winslow/IDK
Melo/D West
Gasol/Lopez (I wold imagine Monroe is far more likely)

If you can get rid of Clderon without taking back money this might actually fit under the salary cap and would leave room to spare when it skyrockets next season. Close to $30 mil in both the back court and the front court, but they would only have about $23 mil committed originally. Deadly from 3 but can go huge with west at the 4 and winslow at the 2. Beverley and Winslow at the 2-3 is lockdown duo with Gasol protecting them at the rim. Easily top 2 in the east and a title contender.

Would be a nice team to watch but it's a complete fantasy. For Gasol to leave it would take a 4 year max-deal, same goes for Dragic. Pair those with Melo's 5 year max deal, you might already be over next season's $68 million cap. Beverly and Brook Lopez aren't about to leave for cheap contracts (neither will Monroe), or David West for that matter. If we were going in to the 2016-17 offseason, when the tv deal kicks in, your fantasy would be possible. The cap is supposed to jump to 85-90 million

 

[444JR]

The other approach to the draft is taking Porzingis at 4 and giving Monroe the maximum. That woulkd make the Knicks upfront

C-Monroe 6-11 250

PF Porzingis 7-2 220

F 6-8 240 Anthony


which would be a very interesting frontline.

Would spread the floor nicely. If the Knicks draft mudiay they will need good floor spacing for him to find the most success.