OT - time between losing record and NC

[Phil]

I'm reading Tar Vanderveer's Shooting from the Outside. Stanford won the NC in 1990, and Tara mentions that they were only four years removed from a losing record. Sounds impressive, and is, but I wondered if anyone else had a shorter time.

I see that North Carolina went from losing record to NC in three years.

I haven't checked all the others, but I assume no one else is close to beating this.

I also notice that UNC's losing record in 1990-91 wasn't just an anomaly, they had four consecutive losing records between 87-88 and 90-91.

Does anyone know the story here? Hatchell took over in 86-87, but it isn't (a la Geno) like she took over a poor team. The four prior years had a combined record of 90-36, so the team went from a solid record to an abysmal record, then to a National Championship. Just happenstance, or is there a story?

 

[Wonkster]

.
Maybe the story is that there were no real powerhouses in those days. My guess is that such feats will never happen again in wcbb.

 

[Phil]

That doesn't ring true. Connecticut was a powerhosue by then (despite the weird beliefs of a certain fan base). Interestingly, UNC had to knock off #1 seed Connecticut on the way to the NC.

While Stanford had a losing season in Tara's first year that was back on 1986, but the early 90's the Cardinal were a fixture at the top of the charts. Louisiana Tech was a powerhouse. They've faded a bit from some memories now, but as National Champions in 88, and runner up in 86, not to mention Final Fours in 89 and 90, they held a position in the powerhouse rankings only someone like recent UConn teams could rival.

Auburn is another team whose pedigree is a bit faded to memory, but Joe Ciampi took teams to three consecutive runner up finishes 87-90, so were a powerhouse, and a couple good breaks from being one of the most dominant teams in history.

 

[VAUConnFan]

I'm reading Tar Vanderveer's Shooting from the Outside. Stanford won the NC in 1990, and Tara mentions that they were only four years removed from a losing record. Sounds impressive, and is, but I wondered if anyone else had a shorter time.

I see that North Carolina went from losing record to NC in three years.

I haven't checked all the others, but I assume no one else is close to beating this.

I also notice that UNC's losing record in 1990-91 wasn't just an anomaly, they had four consecutive losing records between 87-88 and 90-91.

Does anyone know the story here? Hatchell took over in 86-87, but it isn't (a la Geno) like she took over a poor team. The four prior years had a combined record of 90-36, so the team went from a solid record to an abysmal record, then to a National Championship. Just happenstance, or is there a story?

Tonya Sampson, plain and simple.
Sampson, BTW, holds the all time UConn opponent scoring record in a NCAA Tournament game with her 30 points in the Elite 8 game in 1994. Sampson's prolific offensive performance aside, it was North Carolina's smothering second half defense that turned the tide in the underdog's favor.

 

[alexrgct]

The early 1990s were something of a transitional period. Tennessee was a powerhouse, but suffered three consecutive upsets after winning the 1991 NC. Meanwhile, 1980s powerhouses Texas and USC faded dramatically, La Tech, though still highly competitive, was a step below where they were in the 1980s, ODU was off the map until Penichero brought them back, and schools like Virginia and Long Beach State faded as well. UConn made its first Final Four in 1991 and then was mediocre for two straight seasons after that before going 30-3 and becoming a #1 seed in 1994. Coach G was just getting started at Duke, Muffet wasn't airborne yet at ND, and other than Texas Tech's run with Sheryl Swoopes, none of the other Big XII schools were competitive in WBB.

 

[Phil]

Tonya Sampson, plain and simple.
Sampson, BTW, holds the all time UConn opponent scoring record in a NCAA Tournament game with her 30 points in the Elite 8 game in 1994. Sampson's prolific offensive performance aside, it was North Carolina's smothering second half defense that turned the tide in the underdog's favor.

That looks plausible, but still quite a deal. UNC had four consecutive losing seasons, then Sampson shows up. They had one losing season when she was a freshman, then they went 22-9, 23-7 and 33-2. However, the name doesn't ring a bell, and I would have thought someone that good would have been more of a presense in some USA Basketball events. I see she was their all-time leading scorer.

 

[VAUConnFan]

That looks plausible, but still quite a deal. UNC had four consecutive losing seasons, then Sampson shows up. They had one losing season when she was a freshman, then they went 22-9, 23-7 and 33-2. However, the name doesn't ring a bell, and I would have thought someone that good would have been more of a presense in some USA Basketball events. I see she was their all-time leading scorer.

They added Charlotte Smith the following year, who would go on to sink the winning three against Louisiana Tech to win the national championship in 1994. Smith, at 6 feet tall, still holds the record for most rebounds in a national championship game. Recalling how incredibly awesome Tina Charles was against Louisville, it is hard to imagine someone going out and grabbing four more rebounds.

Why Tonya Sampson was not more of a presence on the national scene is beyond me. She was an incredible ballplayer, possibly the strongest female to have ever played the game. Maybe, at the time, her more physical style of play did not jibe with the image of USA Basketball. It is also possible that playing USA Basketball held no interest for Ms Sampson.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

That looks plausible, but still quite a deal. UNC had four consecutive losing seasons, then Sampson shows up. They had one losing season when she was a freshman, then they went 22-9, 23-7 and 33-2. However, the name doesn't ring a bell, and I would have thought someone that good would have been more of a presense in some USA Basketball events. I see she was their all-time leading scorer.

Yeah, the name doesn't really resonate, but I looked up an article from a few years ago and it looks like she was playing professional football in a women's league. Played WBB in the ABL and overseas, tearing her ACL at some point, she retired in 2001. There was also an article from her playing days, apparently (and this is in the article) many considered her a "thug", although her fellow players, Hatchell and the writer all spoke to her having learned to play with "boys" and being built so that others considered her "masculine". She is a mortage lender with a financial group, incidently.

I do remember her, as the 1994 National Championship Game on TV is what made me initially a serious fan of Women's Basketball. My first attended game (Rutgers vs. George Washington, 1995) sealed the deal.

 

[triaddukefan]

Tonya Sampson, plain and simple.
Sampson, BTW, holds the all time UConn opponent scoring record in a NCAA Tournament game with her 30 points in the Elite 8 game in 1994. Sampson's prolific offensive performance aside, it was North Carolina's smothering second half defense that turned the tide in the underdog's favor.

Tonya Sampson was a heck of a player.... one of the best to ever suit up for UNC. Kinda puts you in the mind of Shawnetta Stewart for Rutgers...... Kinda undersized... powerfully built 2 guard.... though Sampson was definitely a better scorer. Kinda ironic they both wore the number 34. I saw Sampson a few years ago when they introduced the ACC Legends during halftime of one of the ACC Semis.... she still had that powerful build

 

[Phil]

They added Charlotte Smith the following year, who would go on to sink the winning three against Louisiana Tech to win the national championship in 1994. Smith, at 6 feet tall, still holds the record for most rebounds in a national championship game. .

Did you happen to know that fact about Smith, or did you look it up here:

1994 NCAA Women's Division I Basketball Tournament

The reason I ask is that I added that fact to the article two days ago.

It may well be that the turnaround of UNC was the addition of both players. The last second shot by Smith is viewed as one of the, if not the most exciting finish in tournament history.

 

[Vowelguy]

Does anyone know the story here? Hatchell took over in 86-87, but it isn't (a la Geno) like she took over a poor team. The four prior years had a combined record of 90-36, so the team went from a solid record to an abysmal record, then to a National Championship. Just happenstance, or is there a story?

Perhaps the previous coach left the cupboard bare?
Or the existing players didn't mesh with Hatchell's style, so the team struggled?

 

[Phil]

Perhaps the previous coach left the cupboard bare?
Or the existing players didn't mesh with Hatchell's style, so the team struggled?

Jennifer Alley was 90-36 in the four years prior to Hatchell's regime, 23-9 in the year before Hatchell took over.

But I can't speak to the meshing issue, which is a possibility. I also don't know the nature of Alley's departure.

 

[VAUConnFan]

Did you happen to know that fact about Smith, or did you look it up here:

1994 NCAA Women's Division I Basketball Tournament

The reason I ask is that I added that fact to the article two days ago.

It may well be that the turnaround of UNC was the addition of both players. The last second shot by Smith is viewed as one of the, if not the most exciting finish in tournament history.

Charlotte Smith is from Shelby, NC, the town from which David Thompson hails, and I am well acquainted with a few of its residents; One of whom is now practicing medicine there.
I remember the shot Charlotte Smith hit as if it was yesterday, and still cannot believe she was that wide open on an inbounds play.
The exciting finish made up for a relatively lackluster game. If memory serves, the semis and finals were played on consecutive days: Not easy.

 

[Vowelguy]

I remember the shot Charlotte Smith hit as if it was yesterday, and still cannot believe she was that wide open on an inbounds play.

I dunno, I believe she had not made a 3-pointer all year.
If Tina was in 3-point-land, would you guard her or lay off, figuring she was going to cut to the middle?

The exciting finish made up for a relatively lackluster game. If memory serves, the semis and finals were played on consecutive days: Not easy.

Correct. 1996 was the first year that there was a day off in between.

 

[Vowelguy]

I dunno, I believe she had not made a 3-pointer all year.

Correction, she was 8/31 for the year. Still not something I'd be guarding against.