OT: Serena in a battle at the French | Page 2 | The Boneyard

OT: Serena in a battle at the French

Status
Not open for further replies.
One might also make the case that serve and volley tennis is intrinsically just as sound as the current baseline game, just a change in style now in favor.
 
msf22b said:
Somehow, characterizing Ms.Martina's game as "little girl" seems a bit off.
Expand ...

I cannot take credit for characterizing Ms Navratilova's game as little girl tennis. Mary Carillo is the first person I heard use the term 'big babe tennis'' to describe how hard today's women are hitting the ball. It may also have been Ms Carillo who used the term "little girl tennis" to describe Martina Hingis' game back in 2001 when she got thrashed by serena in the US Open semifinals on the way to the first all Williams grand slam final. However, considering how hard today's players are now hitting the ball, there is no other way to describe how players like Austin, Evert, Navratilova, et al hit the ball. Maybe it could be said that they did not hit the ball as hard.

msf22b said:
One might also make the case that serve and volley tennis is intrinsically just as sound as the current baseline game, just a change in style now in favor.
Expand ...

Absolutely nothing wrong with serve and volley. I used to love McEnroe's game; short points, deft touch. Martina, as well. But, players today seem much more adept at the passing shot. My point with Martina's serve and volley game is that it was not combined with a lot of power. As we saw with yesterdays' game against Errani, Serena could just tee off on the low velocity serves. I am not sure which announcer said it, but it was described as batting practice.
 
One has to consider the new equipment and approach to hitting.
Martina was a power serve and volleyer, much different from Martina Hingis who more resembles Ms. Errani but was much more skillful.
if you want power tennis and a net game, consider Pancho Gonzales
Monster power game (for his time) and magnificent serve and volleyer as well as returner.
I still remember him beating Anderson, Hoad, Laver, and Rosewall in successive evenings in White Plains under awful conditions back in the 60's, down a set or more every evening.
Drove down from West Point with Bitsy Harrison, a ranked player and coach of the cadet team.
He couldn't believe his eyes either.
Serena's domination is similar.
 
Much of the loss of serve and volley today is the result of changes in equipment. The larger head racquets with bigger sweet spots and more return of energy into the ball has allowed a style of play of play with bigger swings and more emphasis on power and more control on passing shots. Some originally thought these changes would unfairly favor the serve and volley when they emerged. The opposite occurred as the power and control of baseline shots emerged. A lot of cases of tennis elbow resulted from the shock and vibration in those early metal racquets as they transmitted energy up the arm.

We are a long way from the day of MacGregor Budge Tournament, Dunlop Maxply, Wilson Jack Kramer, Slazenger Challenger, or even the original trampoline strung Wilson T2000 metal racquet. When was the last time you saw a racquet press?

Trivia question. Who was the last player to win Wimbledon with a wood racquet and the year? What model was it?

Related question: the same trio of questions for the first major won with a metal racquet? Hint: It is a long forgotten Spalding racquet.
.
.
 
Good first set 6-4 win against Sharapova. Although Serena did make it more difficult with her 12+ plus unforced errors. Could easily have won it 6-1. Now hoping Serena can win the 2nd set for the French Championship.
 
Wbbfan1 said:
Good first set 6-4 win against Sharapova. Although Serena did make it more difficult with her 12+ plus unforced errors. Could easily have won it 6-1. Now hoping Serena can win the 2nd set for the French Championship.
Expand ...
its looking good
 
.-.
Serena wins the French Open with consecutive 6-4 set wins. The 2nd set was much easier even though the set scores were identical. Serena's serve was much more dominant and did have as many unforced errors. Sharapova played well, but couldn't handle how Serena's return and her serves.
 
More hardware for Serena !!!!!!

:)

coupe-lenglen.jpg
 
Wbbfan1 said:
Serena wins the French Open with consecutive 6-4 set wins. The 2nd set was much easier even though the set scores were identical. Serena's serve was much more dominant and did have as many unforced errors. Sharapova played well, but couldn't handle how Serena's return and her serves.
Expand ...

How about those final 3 aces all from the deuce court !!! :eek:

woww
 
msf22b said:
I still remember him beating Anderson, Hoad, Laver, and Rosewall in successive evenings in White Plains under awful conditions back in the 60's, down a set or more every evening.
Drove down from West Point with Bitsy Harrison, a ranked player and coach of the cadet team.
He couldn't believe his eyes either.
Serena's domination is similar.
Expand ...

Where in White Plains were those tournaments held? Would you not like to see tournament tennis return to Forest Hills?

Icebear said:
We are a long way from the day of MacGregor Budge Tournament, Dunlop Maxply, Wilson Jack Kramer, Slazenger Challenger, or even the original trampoline strung Wilson T2000 metal racquet. When was the last time you saw a racquet press?

Trivia question. Who was the last player to win Wimbledon with a wood racquet and the year? What model was it?

Related question: the same trio of questions for the first major won with a metal racquet? Hint: It is a long forgotten Spalding racquet.
.
.
Expand ...

I'll take a shot:
Last Wimbledon champion with a wood racket? How about Arthur Ashe with a Wilson.
First major with a metal racquet? Jimmy Connors
 
VAUConnFan said:
Last Wimbledon champion with a wood racket? How about Arthur Ashe with a Wilson.
First major with a metal racquet? Jimmy Connors
Expand ...

I remember Mac beat Borg in '81 at Wimbledon when he was still used a wooden (Dunlop) racquet. I assume he was still using the same racquet at the Open in the fall, so that would be the last one I know for sure. At some point he swtiched to the Max 200G (graphite), certainly by '84 and probably by '83. I would have to look at YouTube. 1982 is a question.

Not sure if there was anyone after that?

Not sure about first major with a metal - I would guess Connors also, with a T2000, possibly Wimbledon in '74
 
VAUConnFan said:
IMO, Ms Graf at her best has a chance in today's game. Martina's serve and volley, little girl game has very little chance. She would be eaten alive coming to the net as often as she does/did.
Expand ...

I agree. I think Graf's slice backhand would have given Serena fits with the way it hugged the ground. And Steffi certainly had the forehand and athleticism to compete. She was one of the fastest players I can remember. Martina also had a nice lefty serve that could have taken Serena off the court and a darn good backhand slice. Serena doesn't handle the slice with great ease.

But IMO Serena would have beaten anyone who has played the game. Her play at this stage of her career is the best I've ever seen in the women's game. I think she can play at a top level for another 4 or 5 years if she wants, barring injury.
 
.-.
My first racquet was a wooden Slazenger and I thought I was really good with it. Then came the T-2000 and then my first graphite racquet, which I think was a Head. My favorite racquet ever was a Prince and I threw a tantrum and broke it and by then they didn't make that model anymore. I've never found a racquet that I like more and gave me the combination of power and with just enough control.
 
VAUConnFan said:
Where in White Plains were those tournaments held? Would you not like to see tournament tennis return to Forest Hills?



I'll take a shot:
Last Wimbledon champion with a wood racket? How about Arthur Ashe with a Wilson.
First major with a metal racquet? Jimmy Connors
Expand ...
No, and no, but good guesses. Anyone else?

BTW, I've likely handled more racquets than most of you because I worked in a ski, skate, tennis and bike specialty shop in the late 1960s and early/mid 70s and I was a stringer. Some of the early compound racquets like the Vokyl could be a high risk adventure when stringing as they delaminated and collapsed.
 
VAUConnFan said:
Where in White Plains were those tournaments held? Would you not like to see tournament tennis return to Forest Hills.
Expand ...

I think in those days it was called the Civic Center, now the County Center.
I loved Forest Hills, but surely the Open is now too big for it,
Why not have a lesser grass court tourny there or a hard court warm-up for the open?

My first final there was the classic Mal Anderson / Ashley Cooper epic when Harry Hopkins' Aussie's ruled the tennis world.

Dating myself.
 
.-.
Hint: The last wood racquet title was won by a tennis broadcaster.
Hint: The first metal racquet title was won 12 years before the last wood racquet title.
 
Icebear said:
Hint: The last wood racquet title was won by a tennis broadcaster.
Hint: The first metal racquet title was won 12 years before the last wood racquet title.
Expand ...

John McEnroe

Unfortunately, Arthur Ashe's US Open victory in 1968 against Bob Lutz in Forest Hills is as far back as I can go in tennis. The names are all familiar, but the matches, no dice.
 
VAUConnFan said:
Yes, when I have a rooting interest, it is better for my nerves that my rooting interest not be closely challenged. However, being a fan of the game, and of its popularity, longevity, viability, what have you, one has to embrace competition, drama, compelling storylines, and the physical and mental battles. None of that was evident which, at the semifinal level, is a bit disconcerting. And, like you, I get the feeling, there will be little drama in Saturday's final.
To this day, I cannot figure out how a 17 year old Sharapova was able to beat Serena at Wimbledon in 2004; At a time when Serena was indomitable. A couple of months later, Serena gets robbed in the US Open against Capriati. Serena, right now, is every bit as good as she was 10 years ago. That really is the story. Tennis has become a young woman's game, and Serena is defying Father Time, Mother Nature, and any and all comers.
Expand ...
Actually it has been a long time since a teenager of either gender won a major - because of the power game and better nutrition/training, teenagers are being overpowered - be a long time before we see another teenage champ. But ... you are right that Serena is defying age, though I think that has to do more with the mental desire to continue playing and putting in the time, then anything else. Her problems have been consistent focus, and she seems to have final reached that point.
As for competition - check out the longest match winning streaks in the women's game and you'll realize the sport has consistently had a top heavy line-up:
Navratilova streaks of - 74, 58, 54, 41
Graf - 66, 46, 45, 44
Court - 57
Evert - 55
As for those comparing between the games of women and men from different eras ... it really starts with the equipment and continues with the training and nutrition as with most sports - golf being a prime example.
 
John McEnroe won the 1981 Wimbledon with a wood racquet. Chris Evert and Yanick Noah won the 83 French with wood racquets.

Pedro Gonzalez won the 1969 Wimbledon with the long forgotten metal Spalding Slammer Flex.
 
.-.
UcMiami said:
Actually it has been a long time since a teenager of either gender won a major - because of the power game and better nutrition/training, teenagers are being overpowered - be a long time before we see another teenage champ. But ... you are right that Serena is defying age, though I think that has to do more with the mental desire to continue playing and putting in the time, then anything else. Her problems have been consistent focus, and she seems to have final reached that point.
As for competition - check out the longest match winning streaks in the women's game and you'll realize the sport has consistently had a top heavy line-up:
Navratilova streaks of - 74, 58, 54, 41
Graf - 66, 46, 45, 44
Court - 57
Evert - 55
As for those comparing between the games of women and men from different eras ... it really starts with the equipment and continues with the training and nutrition as with most sports - golf being a prime example.
Expand ...

If you think of 2004 (Maria) and 2005 (Rafa) as a "long time", then true, but you never
can tell about prodigies.
 
UcMiami said:
Actually it has been a long time since a teenager of either gender won a major - because of the power game and better nutrition/training, teenagers are being overpowered - be a long time before we see another teenage champ. But ... you are right that Serena is defying age, though I think that has to do more with the mental desire to continue playing and putting in the time, then anything else. Her problems have been consistent focus, and she seems to have final reached that point.
As for competition - check out the longest match winning streaks in the women's game and you'll realize the sport has consistently had a top heavy line-up:
Navratilova streaks of - 74, 58, 54, 41
Graf - 66, 46, 45, 44
Court - 57
Evert - 55
As for those comparing between the games of women and men from different eras ... it really starts with the equipment and continues with the training and nutrition as with most sports - golf being a prime example.
Expand ...

You have to wonder how well the current players would fare if they had to play with the racquets that former generation played with. As any player will tell you, the racquet can make or break your game.
 
easttexastrash said:
You have to wonder how well the current players would fare if they had to play with the racquets that former generation played with. As any player will tell you, the racquet can make or break your game.
Expand ...
The players and the game would be vastly different. Just attend one of the wooden racquet tournaments sometime.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,409
Messages
4,571,826
Members
10,477
Latest member
Goose91


Top Bottom