OT - rant 1 - spelling

[Kibitzer]

As they say, those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. Those that can't teach, administrate. Those that can't administrate, become guidance counselors.

As the administrators administrate, do the commentators commentate while conversationists conversate?

 

[meyers7]

As the administrators administrate, do the commentators commentate while conversationists conversate?

Those that can play, do. Those that can't, coach. Those that can't coach, become commentators. Those that can't commentate, become sideline reporters.

 

[VAMike23]

As the administrators administrate, do the commentators commentate while conversationists conversate?

I have to admit that 'conversate' makes me cringe . . . .

I was surprised to find that 'commentate' is, in fact, an accepted word in the dictionary. It lacks the disclaimer provided in the entry for 'conversate' (which shouldn't be in the dictionary at all, IMO):

"Nonstandard except in some dialects."

 

[rvwsleep]

It's a package deal. Each part adds to the overall effectiveness of the post. A post that is well thought out, with correct spelling and punctuation, will convey the poster's opinion more effectively than a post that is missing one of those qualities.

 

[Kibitzer]

It's a package deal. Each part adds to the overall effectiveness of the post. A post that is well thought out, with correct spelling and punctuation, will convey the poster's opinion more effectively than a post that is missing one of those qualities.

A few posters come quickly to mind. I won't identify them here. Each brings enthusiasm and thoughtful insights to the board.

One needs a spellcheck or dictionary (and willingness to use either aid.

Second one has a different problem! He insists on punctuating every sentence with an exclamation mark! Honest! Every single one!

Third poster,whose posts are enriching,has not yet discovered the space bar.The one on his keyboard,at the bottom.Ergo,my mind wanders from his enlightening thoughts to my bewilderment about why,why,why,he won't pause occasionally.Or encourage me to do so.

Sorry,but I find these grammer flaws to be distractions!

 

[Zorro]

Those that can play, do. Those that can't, coach. Those that can't coach, become commentators. Those that can't commentate, become sideline reporters.

Or Boneyard posters.

 

[chrissaran]

Zorro, I agree. To someone who said those problems are way beyond just spelling and punctuation, I don't agree. These kids don't take school seriously. If adults don't take school seriously, why should they. That is our fight every day. I can't have an indifferent attitude toward the subject I teach. Also, when I mean it's a fight every day, I mean that literally. This past year was much better, but the previous three years were out of control to the point where the principal was removed. Why it took three years I don't know. I'm not a big person, and at almost 56 years old, it's not easy dealing with kids much, much bigger than me. However, if there's a fight, and I'm where I can help, I jump in. I've gotten punched and kicked by girls, punched by boys, but I cannot stand there and do nothing, which some of our teachers do. I've seen students get seriously hurt in fights, but if I can help it, they won't. I don't feel sorry for myself; I just wish more people understood about education. It's difficult seeing students you've taught wind up in jail. The armed robbery case was a former student. I then had his younger brother, who was a lot worse than him. If we can't reach them through education, it will not end well.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

And, as you so correctly point out in your post, an inability to think logically includes the inability to predict or gauge the likely effects of one's own behavior. The older I get the more I am convinced that the ability to think logically is a pretty rare attribute but what, if anything, can or should be done about it is a mystery to me.

While this is not the forum to discuss it, I read a very interesting piece citing the related art of "critical thinking" (or a lack there-of to be specific) as a primary issue in our politics related divisions in this country.

The best example I can think of (that doesn't have a real political "side") is the lawsuit recently filed by a group concerned about Tucson's homeless folks, wanting the city's ban on blocking sidewalks to be declared unconstitutional because it is unfair to the homeless. Thinking "critically" (or with common sense, if you will) - how is it logical or sensible to want folks to be able to block sidewalks and force pedestrians to walk in the street (a dangerous practice that the sidewalks are there to prevent). Thinking critically, I believe the folks correctly concerned about the homeless issue should be looking at alternatives that make more sense than this one.

 

[Zorro]

In its majestic equality, the law forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal loaves of bread. Anatole France

The fact is that increasingly kids are under the (mostly correct) impression that there is little to be gained for them in acquiring an education, because doing so is not going to get them security or respect. The reasons for this are complex, way complex. I have my own ideas as to the major reasons that this situation has come to pass, but political opinions are (rightly) banned from this board. The result is, however, exactly what could be expected. If long-run prospects are seen as slim to none, then there is no point in going to the trouble of preparing oneself for the long run, and the logical thing to do is to just carpe hell out of the diem, as it were. Having a criminal record is not injurious to one's long run prospects if one has no long-run prospects, or at least perceives that to be the case. And it is going to be a pretty brave kid who is going to be able to stand up to the taunts and persecutions of his peers and actually try to walk the good walk.

Things have changed drastically for the worse in the past half-century or so. In "The Blackboard Jungle" (1955) and "Up the Down Staircase" (1966) the kinds of behavior that you are exposed to constantly were still uncommon enough to be shocking. If you showed them to a group of students today, they would ROFLTAO. Maybe something will turn things around, but I am not hopeful.

But the Hiskies are looking good.

 

[Zorro]

Uhh-make that Huskies, ok. Not Hiskies. I can spell but sometimes my fingers can't.

 

[Zorro]

On a lighter tone;

 

[meyers7]

Uhh-make that Huskies, ok. Not Hiskies. I can spell but sometimes my fingers can't.

Too late. You screwed up big time. Chris has definitely left your corner. According to him, you'll probably end up in jail now.

 

[meyers7]

Zorro, I agree. To someone who said those problems are way beyond just spelling and punctuation, I don't agree.

And people wonder why there are problems in education.

 

[diggerfoot]

Though teaching did not become my main career, I've taught at all levels from kindergarten to university, at both traditional classroom and experiential venues, in a variety of subjects (though mainly science-related). I also was a college student in a variety of forms for four different decades. I have witnessed the degradation of logic and critical thinking, often to my great advantage when I became an older student, and have studied causes to this effect.

I note in particular three causes, yet let's begin first with what is not a cause. "Kids these days" does not apply. Natural evolution does not work that fast. Humans are hard-wired to learn new things; we delight in it in fact, whether it happens to be how a car engine or video game works instead of school subjects. We would not have survived without this hard wiring. The fault, then, lies in factors beyond the student.

Every study I know contrasting the effects of different conditions on learning breaks down when parental support and/or involvement is controlled. Private school or public? With the same parental support the differences in success are minimal. Rich or poor? Same result. Proud parents of successful students is generally a self-fulfilling condition. The pride they take in their children's education leads to superior results. Over the past five decades there has been declining parental involvement in children's educational success. The reasons are not worth discussing at this point and could land this thread in the cesspool.

This impacts both spelling and critical thinking, but there are additional factors that impact critical thinking further. The biggest reason I am glad teaching did not become my main career is how the curriculum has been geared ever more towards teaching to the test. The test could be quite "advanced," one could rote learn the theory of relativity, yet this does little for training students towards critical thinking.

The third reason is that, as a society, we have gravitated ever more towards what I call a "marketing culture." We market stuff; we market policies; we market beliefs. Marketing appeals to a different part of us, a part ruled by emotions more than critical thinking. Over the past few decades every aspect of our society has become more emotional and less empirical, including our schools.

 

[Biff]

The third reason is that, as a society, we have gravitated ever more towards what I call a "marketing culture." We market stuff; we market policies; we market beliefs. Marketing appeals to a different part of us, a part ruled by emotions more than critical thinking. Over the past few decades every aspect of our society has become more emotional and less empirical, including our schools.

I find this paragraph particularly thought provoking. I think you've verbalized a thought that, until I read your words, I've been unable to congeal.
Thanks.

 

[Hope]

Well, while I too prefer to see things spelled correctly, and grammar used correctly, in reality, the point of speaking and writing is to communicate. If the message is received and understood by the receiver, then it really matters not whether the spelling or pronunciation is correct.

Don't get caught up too much in the details and miss the big picture.

Same message. Different words.