OT- Derrick Rose

[superjohn]

D. Rose used to be one of my favorite athletes but I've completely had it with him. He was cleared by doctors months ago and still won't play. His entire team is hurt and sick and he just sits there on the sidelines in his suit eating candy. I'm disgusted that he has completely abandoned his mates. Hinrich can't walk, Noah can barely walk, Deng had to go to the emergency room yesterday, Taj Gibson was sick, Nate Robinson was throwing up in a trash can on the bench each time he came off the court and yet Rose can just sit there while he is completely healthy. David Lee came on the court last night for the Warriors after tearing his hip flexor just over a week ago.

 

[James]

Interesting topic I tend to think the youngest MVP of all time can do whatever the hell he wants. his make up would suggest he would do anything to be on the court. If he isn't comfortable he could overcompensate and get a different injury.

 

[superjohn]

Well he clearly isn't doing everything to be on the court, he was cleared over 2 1/2 months ago. People associated with the team say he has been dominating in practices for a while now and Rose has said he's 100% but he won't play until he is 120%. He and his brother have thrown out every excuse possible and his brother has said twice to the media that Derrick won't play this year because the Bulls didn't trade for better players at the trade deadline. His teammates are playing their hearts out through a lot of injuries and illness, Rose has totally let down his mates and if he's not playing because he doesn't think his team is good enough, well that is just pathetic.

 

[Waquoit]

Interesting topic I tend to think the youngest MVP of all time can do whatever the hell he wants.

Why would you tend to think that? If he came in 2nd in the voting would you expect him to play?

 

[RayRay19]

I 2nd everything you both are saying...he should have come back even if it meant to come in for a minute like what David Lee did. It would give the bulls the emotional push as well as get those nerves out slightly for him. I thought yesterdays game was the perfect time for him to come back, i don't see him coming back for an away game even though it is game 7.

 

[James]

When I wrote that I was merely suggesting how much of an asset he is. Potentially a top 3 player in the league. At 24 years old. The way hes carried himself through his career he deserves to dictate when he plays coming off the most serious injury in hoop. What is the point of rushing him back when his team isn't really in position to make a legitimate run?
As far as all that inside info I don't have much to say about that I'm no Chris Broussard. It's easy to sit behind a screen and tell a star athlete what to do.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Thibodeau and the players seem to be fine with it and seem to think he's earned the right to come back when he feels ready. This is a serious knee injury, not the kind of thing you tape up and play with, and it makes sense from a mental standpoint and a game shape stand point that he's not going to jump into the middle of a playoff series. And it's not like he's been injury free the rest of his career. This seems like an overly harsh response from people who are completely external to the process and the decision making.

 

[bmayuc]

Thibodeau and the players seem to be fine with it and seem to think he's earned the right to come back when he feels ready. This is a serious knee injury, not the kind of thing you tape up and play with, and it makes sense from a mental standpoint and a game shape stand point that he's not going to jump into the middle of a playoff series. And it's not like he's been injury free the rest of his career. This seems like an overly harsh response from people who are completely external to the process and the decision making.

I think the point here is not that he doesn't have a right to wait to play until he feels ready.

The point is two fold

1. He has been, and IS ready to play. He has been going 100% in practice for 2 months. So its not like he is gimping around or "overcompensating". He's been playing full-go with the exception of when the lights are on.

2. A number of his teammates are absolutely killing themselves in this series, and this playoffs, and yet Rose has not even given it a go.

3. Imagine if LeBron were in the same position. Medically cleared but watching his teammates drag themselves around the court, puking in trashcans. IMAGINE the public response. He would be called out BIGTIME. People would claim he has no heart, etc etc.

I am a big Rose fan but this reflects VERY poorly both now, and will resonate in the story being told of his career.

 

[aceboon]

If this was Melo he wouldn't be able to even sit on the bench, the fans would destroy him.

I think the point here is not that he doesn't have a right to wait to play until he feels ready.

The point is two fold

1. He has been, and IS ready to play. He has been going 100% in practice for 2 months. So its not like he is gimping around or "overcompensating". He's been playing full-go with the exception of when the lights are on.

2. A number of his teammates are absolutely killing themselves in this series, and this playoffs, and yet Rose has not even given it a go.

3. Imagine if LeBron were in the same position. Medically cleared but watching his teammates drag themselves around the court, puking in trashcans. IMAGINE the public response. He would be called out BIGTIME. People would claim he has no heart, etc etc.

I am a big Rose fan but this reflects VERY poorly both now, and will resonate in the story being told of his career.

 

[partial]

I'm sure he'll still be a great player but he's not the competitor i thought he was. It feels like Rose has written off this season no matter what. It might be that he physically can't play, but given that he's been cleared for a while now it seems like he's just not mentally prepared and this doesn't jive with the image i had of him as a player.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

If this was Melo he wouldn't be able to even sit on the bench, the fans would destroy him.

Yeah but Carmelo's a clown. Track record matters a little bit. Will it affect Rose's reputation? Maybe, but some guys deserve the benefit of the doubt more than others, and Rose certainly does more than Carmelo. Either way, Nate Robinson's loving this ****.

 

[superjohn]

The players and Thibodeau are towing the company line, I'm sure they are seething inside. Rose has shown he isn't a real competitor. He has gotten a break from everyone because he is so well liked but it's gotten to the point where it's just ridiculous. Jay Cutler has played through injury and the media and fans still kill him. Lebron would get absolutely crushed if he pulled something like this.

 

[James]

Yeah it's gonna resonate a bunch while he's an all nba performer for the next decade.

 

[James]

So if he wins another MVP you guys will denounce what a competitor he is? Track record people , this isn't a Bynum situation . I don't get what makes a bunch of posters so sure he's beyond ready to play. Because you read he's practicing in the Sun?

 

[bmayuc]

Yeah it's gonna resonate a bunch while he's an all nba performer for the next decade.

If you are someone that is going to be an All-NBA player for a Decade, not competing during the Playoff when you are completely healthy is EXACTLY the thing you are measured on.

not trying to make a huge deal about this, or more than it is, but as a fervent NBA fan...

well, its hard to see him jumping up and down on the bench in a suit.

 

[bmayuc]

So if he wins another MVP you guys will denounce what a competitor he is? Track record people , this isn't a Bynum situation . I don't get what makes a bunch of posters so sure he's beyond ready to play. Because you read he's practicing in the Sun?

He has been practicing, according to his own teams trainers, at 100%, no limitations. I'm not sure what else there is to say.

I will add: Iman Shumpert had an IDENTICAL injury within days of DRose: Ligament tear/meniscus tear.

He has been playing live NBA games for 4 months now. He played his way back into shape once he was cleared, helped the knicks team, and looks great.

Adrian Peterson had an identical issue, came back and competed(shoot, ran for 2000 yards) 7 months later.

Again, not killing DRose, but this "100% mentally ready thing" is a bit of a drama queen move. Get on the court and help your teammates out.

 

[Waquoit]

Rose was just quoted that he doesn't have the "muscle memory".

 

[Chin Diesel]

Rose was just quoted that he doesn't have the "muscle memory ".

What several people have suspected.

He's limp diicckkk.

 

[Waquoit]

Shump is not derrick rose, and ap isn't the most explosive pg of all time that relies so much on jumping. completely healthy ? He hasn't played all friggin year, and you wanna toss him in the middle of a playoff series. Your suggesting he's as healthy as he can get, which is just farcical. the way he plays, being mentally + physically ready go hand in hand.

I'm not sure being afraid to fail is as good a reason to sit as being hurt is.

 

[Chin Diesel]

I'm not sure being afraid to fail is as good a reason to sit as being hurt is.

I saw this on FB yesterday.

Seems apropos.

 

[superjohn]

Shump is not derrick rose, and ap isn't the most explosive pg of all time that relies so much on jumping. completely healthy ? He hasn't played all friggin year, and you wanna toss him in the middle of a playoff series. Youre suggesting he's as healthy as he can get, which is just farcical. the way he plays, being mentally + physically ready go hand in hand.

You're right AP isn't the most explosive point guard of all-time, he's the most explosive running back of all-time and he came back ahead of schedule. You are also right that Shumpert isn't a point guard, he's a shooting guard who came back right after doctors cleared him and said he was good to go. Rose was cleared by doc's, given a clean bill of health 2 1/2 months ago and he still hasn't stepped on the floor in a game. David Lee was told he was out the whole playoffs with a torn hip flexor, he begged his coach the last 5 days to play and his coach put him out there for a couple of minutes, he could only really go on one leg but he needed to be out there for his team and it was an inspirational moment for his team. Some players have heart others not so much.

 

[champs99and04]

I've gave Rose the benefit of the doubt right up until Joakim Noah went out there limping on one foot in game one of the playoffs, Nate Robinson and the Bulls rallied from 14 down with three minutes to play to win in triple overtime, and half the team played with the flu last night.

This is the NBA, you're getting paid more money than 99.9% of Americans can even comprehend, an entire city has had your back (this isn't New York where a player is crucified for being anything less than perfect), and most of all, a very limited Bulls team has fought their balls off to get to within one game within the conference semi's. In a perfect world, Derrick Rose could take his time, shine up that knee, and wait until he's 120% and his peace of mind is re-established. But , this is life - everybody has their bumps and bruises this time of year, and they show up to work every day because they owe it to the thousands of paying customers that allow them to play a game for a living. I'm all for players proceeding with caution when returning from serious knee injuries, but there comes a time when third world circumstances won't allow for a first world recovery, and I think we're there.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Simmons:

Q: Can you hold it against Derrick Rose for not coming back?
Absolutely not. See, Gilbert Arenas affected the NBA in four ways …
1. He's the first NBA star who tapped into the potential of connecting with fans on the Internet (with his groundbreaking Agent Zero blog). Then Twitter happened, and Facebook, and Instagram, and now we're at a point where Kobe could run for president because he's so good at social media. In fact, I think I'd vote for him in 2016. As long as he wasn't running with Dwight Howard.
2. After he bolted Golden State for the Wizards, they named a rule after him — the Gilbert Arenas provision, which makes it easier for teams to sign their own restricted free agents who were second-round picks.
3. They also named three unwritten rules after him: "Don't bet large sums of money with teammates during poker games on chartered flights," "Don't bring guns into the locker room for any reason," and "Don't give someone a massive nine-figure contract if you're not positive he's healthy."
4. He's the all-time "came back too soon" cautionary tale for anyone who suffered a major knee injury. Gilbert tore a meniscus near the tail end of the 2006-07 season, came back too soon, reinjured it in November, missed much of the season, came back too soon a second time, reinjured his knee in the playoffs, came back too soon the following fall, had a third surgery, and ended up playing 15 games total in two years. Make no mistake — he was NEVER the same.
Now? He's a cautionary tale, the name that floats through the head of any player who wants to keep pushing himself to play, feels really good … but doesn't totally trust his knee yet. Magic Johnson's biggest professional regret is coming back too soon during the 1981 season. He knew his surgically repaired knee didn't feel right, but as Magic tells it, you start feeling that pressure from every direction. Fans, teammates, coaches, the owner, you name it. And it's not even intentional. Might even be something as simple as someone saying, "How's the knee feeling?," only they make eye contact for an extra second and you start thinking, Does he not believe me? You get in your own head. You feel guilty all the time. Your confidence is shaken. You can't do the one thing that always came easiest to you. So you start pushing yourself to come back, tricking yourself, convincing yourself to feel a certain way. And that's when you can get in trouble.
As Magic put it, When you're ready, you know. If you're wondering even a little? Then you don't know. I think that's where Derrick Rose is right now. He's in his own head. He doesn't totally trust his knee yet. His hammies still hurt. And yet … he feels horrible that he can't help his team. So he's vacillating, and fortunately, GILBERT ARENAS keeps flashing through his head in all caps. Over everything else, that's Arenas's real legacy. Nobody wants to be The Next Guy Who Came Back Too Soon.

 

[alexrgct]

Yes, but Bill Simmons, albeit entertaining, doesn't actually know if he knows what he's talking about.

Rose cheated in order to be eligible for an ultimately fruitless attempt to get that greaseball used car salesman a national championship at Memphis. I've never liked him.

As for the Bulls, they got six with Jordan. Their fans can kiss my ass of they want to complain about anything.

 

[Kitaman]

I saw this on FB yesterday.

Seems apropos.

The Original King of Failures.

Thomas A. Edison quotes:

“I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.” ​

“Many of life's failures are people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up.”
​

“Negative results are just what I want. They’re just as valuable to me as positive results. I can never find the thing that does the job best until I find the ones that don’t.”

“Just because something doesn't do what you planned it to do doesn't mean it's useless.”