OT: Another HS FB Player dies from on field hit

[Husky25]

The Romans played football? How about those Germans? Alexander the Great? Ghengis Kahn? Napoleon?

According to Patches O'Houlihan, Genghis Kahn played Dodgeball.

 

[Carl Spackler]

https://library.noctrl.edu/archives...l_at_miltary_training_centers_during_wwII.pdf

Football at these institutions was used for a number of reasons as outlined by the creators of the V-5 program.

The program had backing in very high places such as from the Secretary of Navy Frank Knox. Knox believed strongly in the use of football as a training tool for combat. He was one of the biggest advocates of the program and he
8
was also in the best position to see that the program continued on during the war years. Knox is quoted in the Great Lake’s Bulletin as saying, “[t]his is a war where you kill or get killed! And I don’t know anything that better prepares a man for bodily contact, including war, than the kind of training we get on the football field.”13 As one can see from these strong words, Knox believed deeply in the advantages of using football as a training technique. He goes on to say that “[there is] a definite relationship between the spirit which makes great football players and the spirit that makes great soldiers or sailors.”14




OK? so people that don't think football is respected and treated as a sport that trains men for warfare, perhaps you'd rather the Nazi's won world war 2.

 

[BlueMAB]

When we get back to fighting wars the way we did in 1944, let's talk about how important that opinion piece is.

Get help Carl. In one post you admit to writing a dumb thing, in another you imply anyone who doesn't agree with that dumb thing is a Nazi.

You've jumped the shark.

 

[John]

https://library.noctrl.edu/archives...l_at_miltary_training_centers_during_wwII.pdf

Football at these institutions was used for a number of reasons as outlined by the creators of the V-5 program.

The program had backing in very high places such as from the Secretary of Navy Frank Knox. Knox believed strongly in the use of football as a training tool for combat. He was one of the biggest advocates of the program and he
8
was also in the best position to see that the program continued on during the war years. Knox is quoted in the Great Lake’s Bulletin as saying, “[t]his is a war where you kill or get killed! And I don’t know anything that better prepares a man for bodily contact, including war, than the kind of training we get on the football field.”13 As one can see from these strong words, Knox believed deeply in the advantages of using football as a training technique. He goes on to say that “[there is] a definite relationship between the spirit which makes great football players and the spirit that makes great soldiers or sailors.”14




OK? so people that don't think football is respected and treated as a sport that trains men for warfare, perhaps you'd rather the Nazi's won world war 2.

The Germans did pretty good for never strapping on the ol' leather helmet, no? I think what you're saying is complete bunk.

 

[BlueMAB]

If football was so integral to the education, why do they bother playing any other sport, and why don't they require all cadets to play football or sprint football?

Can it help? Absolutely. So can Chess.

 

[Carl Spackler]

You know it is a crazy day for me. Anniversary of sorts.

Probably better if I check out. I think it would be interesting for people to read that paper some kid put together at North Central college though. It was the first hit I got. Not a great paper, but it's got the nuts and bolts.

There were people in World War 2 as well, that thought it was bunk that football mattered in training men for combat, but they didn't win the argument, as to whether or not was important, and things like the Sprint football league, still exist today, because people think it matters. The academies don't field just one team for football, they have two teams each.

Have a nice weekend all.

 

[Bonehead]

https://library.noctrl.edu/archives...l_at_miltary_training_centers_during_wwII.pdf

Football at these institutions was used for a number of reasons as outlined by the creators of the V-5 program.

The program had backing in very high places such as from the Secretary of Navy Frank Knox. Knox believed strongly in the use of football as a training tool for combat. He was one of the biggest advocates of the program and he
8
was also in the best position to see that the program continued on during the war years. Knox is quoted in the Great Lake’s Bulletin as saying, “[t]his is a war where you kill or get killed! And I don’t know anything that better prepares a man for bodily contact, including war, than the kind of training we get on the football field.”13 As one can see from these strong words, Knox believed deeply in the advantages of using football as a training technique. He goes on to say that “[there is] a definite relationship between the spirit which makes great football players and the spirit that makes great soldiers or sailors.”14




OK? so people that don't think football is respected and treated as a sport that trains men for warfare, perhaps you'd rather the Nazi's won world war 2.

STOP -

I was trained for war and we didnt play football - not once.

If it wat that respected it would be part of Boot Camp, Basic Training and Combat Training.

 

[John]

You know it is a crazy day for me. Anniversary of sorts.

Probably better if I check out. I think it would be interesting for people to read that paper some kid put together at North Central college though. It was the first hit I got. Not a great paper, but it's got the nuts and bolts.

There were people in World War 2 as well, that thought it was bunk that football mattered in training men for combat, but they didn't win the argument, as to whether or not was important, and things like the Sprint football league, still exist today, because people think it matters. The academies don't field just one team for football, they have two teams each.

Have a nice weekend all.

so you're saying that our military incorporates football into the training of our service people? ROTC kids have to play football as a mandatory activity in order to become officers? There's a football requirement in basic training? how about in advanced training?

Sprint Football? List of real military movers and shakers there

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_football#Notable_players_and_coaches

 

[BlueDogs]

The Germans did pretty good for never strapping on the ol' leather helmet, no? I think what you're saying is complete bunk.

They were also part of a traditional warring society. Nobody is saying Football is war. That is ludicrous. It is, however, psychological preparation for youth and the metaphors and concepts are obvious.

 

[CL82]

3 high school FB deaths this week - is possible that one of the others had pre existing medical condition but had read it would be difficult to tell at this time.

Shame that this is happening at the rate it is. And I saw a CTE study - 93 out 0f 97 former NFL players studied showing signs of CTE. (dont hold me to the numbers but it was HIGH - cant find link right now)

Javon Belcher, Mike Webster, Chris Henry and Junior Seau made it through the game but all showed signs of CTE in their unfortunate deaths.

Weight limits the answer?
Better helmets?
Lineman only in standing positions?

I dont know the answers but these are some of the options out there.

In my opinion "worse" helmets are the answer. People are less likely to to use their head as a battering ram if it's not in a padded cocoon. A padded 'soft' helmet would encourange people to protect their head. Tackling would move away from high speed impacts trying to bounce a guy out of bounds and back to fundemental wrapping a guy up, with your head to the side. Injury would still be possible, especially if you get knocked backwards on to the turf, but I think things would improve overall.

On edit: I see that that this got raised above. I'd like to see a study on it. I suspect that it would help.

 

[CL82]

Everyone loves to compare Rugby to football, but in many aspects it is a very different. Not an expert on Rugby or concussions, but I suspect many football concussions are the result of vicious hits on defenseless players (QB sacks, receivers hit by the secondary, special teams play, multiple blocks on a player, etc). Some notable differences in rugby:

. There is no blocking
. No forward passing, which takes away sacks, vicious down field hits on receivers or vicious tackles.
. Rugby defense basically forms a line against the offense formation (you dont have defensive players spread all over the field, so I think there are fewer vicious hits at full speed and head on collisions).
. They do not have kickoffs and punts (which is one of the more violent aspects of football).

I agree some concussions are caused by helmet to helmet and certainly not saying that rugby isnt a physical sport. I just think certain aspects of football may make the sport more prone to those injuries.
FYI - I have traveled alot to Europe and many rugby followers think football is much less violent because of helmets and other protective gear.

Rugby has less guys hurtling at each other from opposite directions. For the most part, everyone is moving together.

 

[CL82]

The Romans played football? How about those Germans? Alexander the Great? Ghengis Kahn? Napoleon?

Napolean tried out but he was too small.

 

[CL82]

https://library.noctrl.edu/archives...l_at_miltary_training_centers_during_wwII.pdf

Football at these institutions was used for a number of reasons as outlined by the creators of the V-5 program.

The program had backing in very high places such as from the Secretary of Navy Frank Knox. Knox believed strongly in the use of football as a training tool for combat. He was one of the biggest advocates of the program and he
8
was also in the best position to see that the program continued on during the war years. Knox is quoted in the Great Lake’s Bulletin as saying, “[t]his is a war where you kill or get killed! And I don’t know anything that better prepares a man for bodily contact, including war, than the kind of training we get on the football field.”13 As one can see from these strong words, Knox believed deeply in the advantages of using football as a training technique. He goes on to say that “[there is] a definite relationship between the spirit which makes great football players and the spirit that makes great soldiers or sailors.”14




OK? so people that don't think football is respected and treated as a sport that trains men for warfare, perhaps you'd rather the Nazi's won world war 2.

Congrats, you earned it!

 

[FAIRTIDES]

I'm so sick of people comparing football to war. Get some fahkin perspective.

Here's a list of the athletics at West Point....

Schedules

• Baseball
• Men's Basketball
• Women's Basketball
• Cross Country
• Football
• Golf
• Gymnastics
• Hockey
• Lacrosse
• Rifle
• Sprint Football
• Swimming & Diving
• Men's Soccer
• Women's Soccer
• Softball
• Men's Tennis
• Women's Tennis
• Track
• Volleyball
• Wrestling

WTF do Golf and Tennis have to do with war?

Our military academies could scrap football tomorrow and we'd still have the most powerful military in the world for several reasons (in no particular oder):

All-Volunteer force
Resources
Technology
Infrastructure
Population

FOH with that nonsense.

"Uconn68," where are you on this subject? I think you are the RVN Veteran who mentioned serving with 1/327 or 2/327 Infantry (101 Abn) in 1969 and 1970. That might have put you in the Northwestern corner of the Ashau in May of '69. If that's the case, was playing/not playing football relevant?

 

[BlueMAB]

"Uconn68," where are you on this subject? I think you are the RVN Veteran who mentioned serving with 1/327 or 2/327 Infantry (101 Abn) in 1969 and 1970. That might have put you in the Northwestern corner of the Ashau in May of '69. If that's the case, was playing/not playing football relevant?

I never said it wasn't relevant. Chess is relevant too.

I said it wasn't integral.

When they make it mandatory at boot camp and combat training, I'll agree with Carl.

This whole argument is stupid, and off topic, and I apologize for my part in that.