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Message: [QUOTE="Matrim55, post: 2401780, member: 3376"] I don't disagree with the first part – as I said, hard fouls tended to be harder back then. As for the second part, look at the highlights from MJ's 63-point game: [MEDIA=youtube]tsRu0x_bQeY[/MEDIA] So many clean catches off screens, so many uncontested looks, and just about any time he went into the lane it was whistled. There was low ambient, per-possession physicality in the league until the mid-90s, save for 1v1 post battles. LeBron got hit more last night in a random November game than Jordan did in that playoff game 30 years ago: [MEDIA=youtube]z6RYi1hCGoo[/MEDIA] You couldn't hammer him the way the Pistons hammered him. You could, for sure, take away at least part of his mid-range genius with the type of defenses we see today. Jordan would still be great, mind you. He'd get to the line a ton and would be super-efficient. But the new defensive rules are designed to limit the value of the type of mid-range stuff that he was so great at. So we just dismiss the Wizards years? And your point about "full season" is garbage as well. Everything about Jordan comes with these unspoken caveats that people are just supposed to accept because of the personality cult built around the guy. Bottom line: The Bulls without MJ were a 55-win team. For sure. You're one of the best to have a discussion with on this forum, and I enjoy this back-and-forth even if it seems we're destined to disagree. And for the dumdum Skip Bayless-wannabes who blow off LeBron's clutchness, here you go: [URL='https://www.theringer.com/2017/5/31/16039508/2017-nba-playoffs-lebron-james-vs-michael-jordan-cb62c5c876b5']LeBron James vs. Michael Jordan Is a Real Conversation Now, So Let’s Have It[/URL] relevant block: He’s actually hit [URL='https://twitter.com/WindhorstESPN/status/597577262033014784']more go-ahead shots in the final 10 seconds of playoff games on fewer attempts than Jordan[/URL]. [I]FiveThirtyEight[/I] [URL='https://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/lebron-may-be-the-most-clutch-playoff-shooter-of-his-generation/']found that James has been the most clutch postseason shooter in its data set[/URL], although that dates back to only 2000. James has been an absolute menace in Game 7s, winning all four he’s played since 2008: He had 37 to win the 2013 Finals and a 27-point triple-double last year to complete Cleveland’s epic comeback against the Warriors. (A reminder: He became the first player to lead the NBA Finals in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, and steals while playing on the first team to rally back from a 3–1 deficit in the NBA Finals, and he did it against the first team ever to win 73 games in a season.) Jordan never played in a Game 7 in the Finals — because he was so clutch that he didn’t even need to be clutch, I guess — but his 2–1 record in non-Finals Game 7s is identical in percentage to LeBron’s 4–2 record. Clutch sample sizes are extremely inconclusive, but in big moments, LeBron tends to do really well. As well as Jordan? Tough to say. I think we should just agree: Both are extremely good at basketball. EDIT: I really should include the end of that column, which is great: After all, we need to save our energy. Every second we spend debating LeBron vs. Jordan is a second we should be focusing on humiliating the people who think Kobe Bryant belongs in this conversation. [/QUOTE]

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