Non-Key Tweets

[06029]

The ACC, like the Big East, is not going to toss ND out. Does anyone really think that they would?

The funny thing about this is that no ND source of any nature says a word about the most controversial issue in ND history but some guy in Minnesota "knows all"?

There is not one word at all, not one, from any ND source, "insider", message board, disgruntled alumni (which are legion and vocal on this issue),.....nothing....nobody...nada.

Contrast this silence with the firestorm that happened when ND was talking to the Big Ten in 1999.

Further, not one ACC source says a word about Notre Dame football about to join the conference?

This news would not cause a buzz or ripple in ACC land? No ACC insider, media guy, nothing?

But a Big Ten guy has the scoop?

Because ND somehow got a secret advisory opinion from a playoff committee that hasn't met yet that "spooked" ND into abandoning 127 years of football independence?

ND made a knee jerk reaction in panic about conference membership based on that?

Step back and look at this from about 30,000 feet high. Does any of that make any sense at all?

These are "Dude-like" tweets.

Do you think ND will be forced/compelled at some point to join a conference due to the new CFB playoff system? All other teams will have 1 extra conference championship game that could allow them to bump ND out of a playoff spot. Say two undefeated SEC teams meet in the conference championship game. One is ranked 2 and and one is 5. ND is also undefeated and ranked 4 before the conference championships. 5 beats 2 in OT. Does #2 fall to #5 and out of the picture or do they bump ND for the 4th spot? Say this happens several times to ND. Does this have enough impact on the ND fan base to make a move into a conference more palatable?

How about a 1 loss ND team being left out to several 1 or possibly a 2 loss teams that show greater strength based on the conference championship game? That extra game will certainly boost their strength of schedule/RPI (for lack of a better term). How many exclusions from the playoff will it take for the ND fan base to start wanting to join a conference?

 

[CTGoonie]

The ACC, like the Big East, is not going to toss ND out. Does anyone really think that they would?

The funny thing about this is that no ND source of any nature says a word about the most controversial issue in ND history but some guy in Minnesota "knows all"?

There is not one word at all, not one, from any ND source, "insider", message board, disgruntled alumni (which are legion and vocal on this issue),.....nothing....nobody...nada.

Contrast this silence with the firestorm that happened when ND was talking to the Big Ten in 1999.

Further, not one ACC source says a word about Notre Dame football about to join the conference?

This news would not cause a buzz or ripple in ACC land? No ACC insider, media guy, nothing?

But a Big Ten guy has the scoop?

Because ND somehow got a secret advisory opinion from a playoff committee that hasn't met yet that "spooked" ND into abandoning 127 years of football independence?

ND made a knee jerk reaction in panic about conference membership based on that?

Step back and look at this from about 30,000 feet high. Does any of that make any sense at all?

These are "Dude-like" tweets.

I don't think anyone is taking it too seriously but it's stil interesting to talk about. Frank The Tank has much more creditability and he's said in the past that Domers would rather remain independent above all else including bettering their chances of making the playoff.

 

[ramses 2.0]

Do you think ND will be forced/compelled at some point to join a conference due to the new CFB playoff system? All other teams will have 1 extra conference championship game that could allow them to bump ND out of a playoff spot. Say two undefeated SEC teams meet in the conference championship game. One is ranked 2 and and one is 5. ND is also undefeated and ranked 4 before the conference championships. 5 beats 2 in OT. Does #2 fall to #5 and out of the picture or do they bump ND for the 4th spot? Say this happens several times to ND. Does this have enough impact on the ND fan base to make a move into a conference more palatable?

How about a 1 loss ND team being left out to several 1 or possibly a 2 loss teams that show greater strength based on the conference championship game? That extra game will certainly boost their strength of schedule/RPI (for lack of a better term). How many exclusions from the playoff will it take for the ND fan base to start wanting to join a conference?

In the scenario you present the #2 SEC team mwould likely be out . If ND is undefeated against as solid schedule they will have a better than 75% chance of being selected IMO & would probably be a 50/50 bet with 1 loss . So until we get a better idea of how the committee selects teams their is no need for ND to panic.

 

[ramses 2.0]

I think that the reported support of Uconn from Duke and UNC and UVA is pure BS, especially the two NC schools. Why would either of those two schools want to add a more successful BB program when that sport is king at their schools and it is the sport that gives them the illusion of power in the world of college athletics? If those 3 schools were so supportive, where are they on Uconn FB's OOC schedules? Where are they on the MBB OOC schedules?

Never trust a southerner that smiles at you and tells you that "y'all are great and we think y'all would be a fine addition to the family. We just have to wait until garndpappy is in the right mood to secure his blessing. Y'all know how he is about yankees." They are real good at making you think everything is great when they have no intention at all of embracing what you want.

I know for a fact UNC has always been supportive of UConn & anyway only people outside of the south would classify UNC, UVA & especially Duke as southern.

 

[TerryD]

I don't think anyone is taking it too seriously but it's stil interesting to talk about. Frank The Tank has much more creditability and he's said in the past that Domers would rather remain independent above all else including bettering their chances of making the playoff.

Correct. ND doesn't care if its tougher. It will still remain independent.

ND only cares if it is legislated as an impossibility.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Correct. ND doesn't care if its tougher. It will still remain independent.

ND only cares if it is legislated as an impossibility.

I think that possibility exists. Legal challenges to the playoff could present problems for Notre Dame, as it would not be legal under antitrust laws, to treat ND differently than BYU or any other independent. I expect that ND leadership is well aware that the move to the P5 threatens their ability to remain independent.

That would be good news for UConn, as it would get an ACC invite about a minute after ND decides to join the ACC for football.

 

[buddy]

Correct. ND doesn't care if its tougher. It will still remain independent.

ND only cares if it is legislated as an impossibility.

I believe that you are correct. ND will never join until forced to join, and it is doubtful that that will ever happen. I don't believe given this is a CR board that it effects UConn. ACC can add UConn as 15 and ND can still be 16 except for football. Everyone would be happy except for FSU and BC.

I think that possibility exists. Legal challenges to the playoff could present problems for Notre Dame, as it would not be legal under antitrust laws, to treat ND differently than BYU or any other independent. I expect that ND leadership is well aware that the move to the P5 threatens their ability to remain independent.

That would be good news for UConn, as it would get an ACC invite about a minute after ND decides to join the ACC for football.

I believe that Terry is correct in that ND will only join the ACC unless that absolutely are forced to join. I also believe that ND need not join the ACC in football for UConn to eventually get an invite.

 

[NC_Uconn_Fan]

I know for a fact UNC has always been supportive of UConn & anyway only people outside of the south would classify UNC, UVA & especially Duke as southern.

Most people in the south do not consider VA or NC southern anymore.

 

[06029]

I know for a fact UNC has always been supportive of UConn & anyway only people outside of the south would classify UNC, UVA & especially Duke as southern.

Then UNC has lost almost all of its clout in the ACC since they allowed BC to choose Pitt and Cuse over Uconn and then they allowed Lville in to keep the FB schools happy. So their support is worth nothing.

And NC is definitely more southern than say, CT, MA, NY and PA. Maybe not the schools in terms of the student body, but much of their fan base is very southern. I have been to games there. I have seen it first hand. And we are not even mentioning the most southern school of all in the ACC which is located in Raleigh which is closely followed by the VT fan base in terms of the typical "southern" stereotype fan. Clemson fans are clearly southeners, but they are more southern gentleman like than the other southener type you see at NC State and VT. Of course the most southern school of all in terms of stereotypes now plays in the Big 12, UWV. Red neck, piss bag throwing, toothless SOB's.

 

[TerryD]

I think that possibility exists. Legal challenges to the playoff could present problems for Notre Dame, as it would not be legal under antitrust laws, to treat ND differently than BYU or any other independent. I expect that ND leadership is well aware that the move to the P5 threatens their ability to remain independent.

That would be good news for UConn, as it would get an ACC invite about a minute after ND decides to join the ACC for football.

I tend to think that "threat" is overstated, but that is another topic.

It is the idea that ND got some advisory opinion from the playoff committee that "blindsided" them or made them "panic" into a sudden course reversal this quick over the thing most fundamentally important to them that I find very doubtful.

When have you known ND to be blindsided or outflanked at the negotiation table?

Jack Swarbrick was credited with brokering the playoff deal in the first place. The conference commissioners picked him to go to the podium to announce the deal.

He has done a great deal of work the past couple of years setting up the partial ACC deal and the ten year renewal of the NBC deal (which doesn't start until 2015).

The idea that he was completely in the dark of the implications of the playoff deal and spooked by some advisory opinion (from a dubious source) into abandoning one of the pillars of ND's (not just its sports) identity so fast is doubtful, to me at least.

 

[upstater]

I tend to think that "threat" is overstated, but that is another topic.

It is the idea that ND got some advisory opinion from the playoff committee that "blindsided" them or made them "panic" into a sudden course reversal this quick over the thing most fundamentally important to them that I find very doubtful.

When have you known ND to be blindsided or outflanked at the negotiation table?

Jack Swarbrick was credited with brokering the playoff deal in the first place. The conference commissioners picked him to go to the podium to announce the deal.

He has done a great deal of work the past couple of years setting up the partial ACC deal and the ten year renewal of the NBC deal (which doesn't start until 2015).

The idea that he was completely in the dark of the implications of the playoff deal and spooked by some advisory opinion (from a dubious source) into abandoning one of the pillars of ND's (not just its sports) identity so fast is doubtful, to me at least.

Have you really forgotten that the BE's comm. was the spokesman for changes just a few years ago?

It should be obvious to everyone that Delany has eaten Swofford's lunch. Grabbing up the entire mid-atlantic from NYC to DC and including PA shows that he is way ahead. Swofford has grabbed small outposts in Chestnut Hill, Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville. Meanwhile, Delany is eating huge swaths of land. This allows the B1G to start printing money and establish dominion over the ACC.

If this were a game of Risk, the ACC would be holding a continent, with many soldiers battening the borders of that continent, but with very little ability to break out anywhere and land another card. It would be constricted slowly as the B1G continues its buildup and bides time for its eventual invasion. It all comes down to $$$ and in this case, territory = $$$.

 

[TerryD]

Have you really forgotten that the BE's comm. was the spokesman for changes just a few years ago?

It should be obvious to everyone that Delany has eaten Swofford's lunch. Grabbing up the entire mid-atlantic from NYC to DC and including PA shows that he is way ahead. Swofford has grabbed small outposts in Chestnut Hill, Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville. Meanwhile, Delany is eating huge swaths of land. This allows the B1G to start printing money and establish dominion over the ACC.

If this were a game of Risk, the ACC would be holding a continent, with many soldiers battening the borders of that continent, but with very little ability to break out anywhere and land another card. It would be constricted slowly as the B1G continues its buildup and bides time for its eventual invasion. It all comes down to $ and in this case, territory = $.

I never mentioned John Swofford. I think that ND and Jack Swarbrick are better at this game (and in a better position) than Swofford was/is.

The topic was the tweets from the Minnesota guy that ND got some advisory opinion and immediately did a 180 degree course change on independence. That is what I question.

It had nothing at all to do with John Swofford or the ACC.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I tend to think that "threat" is overstated, but that is another topic.

It is the idea that ND got some advisory opinion from the playoff committee that "blindsided" them or made them "panic" into a sudden course reversal this quick over the thing most fundamentally important to them that I find very doubtful.

When have you known ND to be blindsided or outflanked at the negotiation table?

Jack Swarbrick was credited with brokering the playoff deal in the first place. The conference commissioners picked him to go to the podium to announce the deal.

He has done a great deal of work the past couple of years setting up the partial ACC deal and the ten year renewal of the NBC deal (which doesn't start until 2015).

The idea that he was completely in the dark of the implications of the playoff deal and spooked by some advisory opinion (from a dubious source) into abandoning one of the pillars of ND's (not just its sports) identity so fast is doubtful, to me at least.

What are you talking about? I have no doubt that the committee is working with ND, and that nobody was blindsided. I also deal with antitrust law in my job, and I can tell you that no matter what the committee, NCAA, P5 or ND want, they cannot justify treating ND differently than BYU. The whole P5 concept is on somewhat shaky ground, but the inclusion of ND is the weakest link, legally. Once the challenge comes in the courts, ND will have a decision to make.

 

[Dooley]

The playoff could force two things:

1. panic by Notre Dame that they need to be part of a conference to qualify;
2. extreme resentment by the rest of the ACC members if ND is tapped for the playoffs over their conference champion

If either of those become a serious issue, then we'll see movement. Until then, ND will continue to parasite willing conferences with XX football game contracts so that they can provide conference play for their other sports.

 

[upstater]

I never mentioned John Swofford. I think that ND and Jack Swarbrick are better at this game (and in a better position) than Swofford was/is.

The topic was the tweets from the Minnesota guy that ND got some advisory opinion and immediately did a 180 degree course change on independence. That is what I question.

It had nothing at all to do with John Swofford or the ACC.

The fact that ND partnered with the ACC is why I'm questioning your faith in ND's farsightedness. ACC is not playing at full strength, which is why they accepted ND in the first place.

 

[UConnJim]

All of this discussion is mute anyway. In my opinion, there is no way that the playoff stays at 4 teams. Going to 8 teams solves so many problems: Each of the 5 conferences gets an auto bid (each conference decides their winner) and then there are 3 at large bids. No conference champ is then left out of the playoff. The at large bids means that some conferences will get 2 teams in on occasion, ND and BYU are potential options without taking a P5 slot, and it even opens a potential spot for a G5 team every so often. Plus, the money would be great! Everyone is happy, except maybe some bowls.

With a 4 team playoff, ND MIGHT have to move to a conference. With an 8 team playoff, there is no need to give up football independence just to make the playoff.

 

[The Funster]

The fact that ND partnered with the ACC is why I'm questioning your faith in ND's farsightedness. ACC is not playing at full strength, which is why they accepted ND in the first place.

ND fled the BE because it was falling apart. ND's choices were ACC or Big 12. We can assume that ND favored the ACC because a) they were in a weaker position and could thus squeeze a more favorable deal b) didn't have a behemoth like Texas in the conference and c) the ACC was a better match for Olympic sports.

 

[TerryD]

What are you talking about? I have no doubt that the committee is working with ND, and that nobody was blindsided. I also deal with antitrust law in my job, and I can tell you that no matter what the committee, NCAA, P5 or ND want, they cannot justify treating ND differently than BYU. The whole P5 concept is on somewhat shaky ground, but the inclusion of ND is the weakest link, legally. Once the challenge comes in the courts, ND will have a decision to make.

What I am talking about is that I do not believe the tweets. I think he is just throwing stuff on the wall, like his agent, The Dude.

 

[ramses 2.0]

I was speaking about the school themselves& not the states or fan bases any school who have little if any thing to do with conference realighnment. At least 4 schools were against UConn for whatever reason & were unlikely to change their minds. With 8 of 11 schools needed for approval then sometimes you have to compromise

Then UNC has lost almost all of its clout in the ACC since they allowed BC to choose Pitt and Cuse over Uconn and then they allowed Lville in to keep the FB schools happy. So their support is worth nothing.

And NC is definitely more southern than say, CT, MA, NY and PA. Maybe not the schools in terms of the student body, but much of their fan base is very southern. I have been to games there. I have seen it first hand. And we are not even mentioning the most southern school of all in the ACC which is located in Raleigh which is closely followed by the VT fan base in terms of the typical "southern" stereotype fan. Clemson fans are clearly southeners, but they are more southern gentleman like than the other southener type you see at NC State and VT. Of course the most southern school of all in terms of stereotypes now plays in the Big 12, UWV. Red neck, piss bag throwing, toothless SOB's.

 

[TerryD]

The fact that ND partnered with the ACC is why I'm questioning your faith in ND's farsightedness. ACC is not playing at full strength, which is why they accepted ND in the first place.

I think that the GOR bought ND ten years, at least. I think that ND was a big mover on the GOR and increased exit fee as part of its ACC negotiations.

I think ND knew what it was doing, i.e. "farsighted". What does any of that have to do with the content of the Minnesota guy's tweets?

 

[ramses 2.0]

I think both the ACC & ND benefit. The ACC improved it's secondary bowl lineup, received some monetary compensation for the 5 games deal & ND stays Indy with a nice home for it's Olympic sports & bowl alliance if they don't make a major bowl or the playoffs

 

[HuskyHawk]

What I am talking about is that I do not believe the tweets. I think he is just throwing stuff on the wall, like his agent, The Dude.

They could be a load of bunk. Most of these things are. But if ND isn't consulting with legal experts and considering the possibility that they will be forced to join a conference, then they are morons. Since neither of us think they are morons, the possibility they have sought outside expert opinions on the likelihood that they may be forced to join the ACC is pretty high. In that context, the tweets are at least plausible. I don't think Notre Dame can stay independent for long given the recent changes.

 

[Samoo]

All of this discussion is mute anyway.

Moot. If it was mute, you couldn't hear it.

 

[ScottBonz]

Moot. If it was mute, you couldn't hear it.

You clearly understood what he said. So why be a dick and correct him. Its a message board. These things don't need be nipped in the butt.

 

[Husky25]

You clearly understood what he said. So why be a dick and correct him. Its a message board. These things don't need be nipped in the butt.

"I could care less. (Really?!?!? Because if you could care less, presumably, you would care less)," is my favorite. It's like nails down a chalkboard, but I resist the urge, unless it is a "pet peeve" or "Festivus" thread.