Non-Key Tweets

[Doggie Style]

Another older article, this one about the BIG's contract negotiation in 2004:

ESPN's 'lowball' offer triggered Big Ten expansion
Failed negotiation also led to Big Ten Network

An amiable session in which the Big Ten and ESPN cleaned up "housekeeping matters" — schedules and announcers — took a nasty turn at the one-hour mark. That's when talk turned to a contract extension, a negotiating session that went nowhere. Fast.

"The shortest one I ever had," Delany told the Tribune. "He lowballed us and said: 'Take it or leave it. If you don't take our offer, you are rolling the dice.' I said: 'Consider them rolled.' "

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...ioner-jim-delany-john-wildhack-espn-officials

"Consider them rolled" I love that line, Delaney is legit no doubt!

Two things as I read this: one is that Shapiro's tone and approach just amplifies the arrogance that was/is ESPN. They feel they can dictate terms and usually can but that eventually comes back to bite you from time to time. This was confirmed when Shapiro admitted so with his opinion "in retrospect."

The second is that Delaney negotiates from a position of power and haves his clearly wired at all times. He knew what his backup plan was, as well as any additional contingency requirements before they even come up..... Thats excellent situational awareness, unlike what the Big East possessed.

Back to my previous point re ESPN, again, they are the 100 pound gorilla and only seem to back down when punched in the face! Well... Delaney gave them an upper cut and honestly.... If we are not on Delaney's "secret list", the State of CT better do the same thing! I think many of us would agree that as tax payers, ESPN has screwed every resident in the state out of millions of dollars whether you are a sports fan or not, with that tax free (close to) deal they held over the state. I mentioned this before, but an Executive I know at ESPN shared with me that he feels the only way Uconn gets into a conference is if the State goes to ESPN and says make it happen or this deal is off the table. Again, this guy is a Uconn/Big East fan and hates our situation so I feel there is merrit there. The only conclusion a reasonable person can conclude with the recent silence of the state and Uconn administration, is that something is in our future... and that I what I will continue to believe to remain calm and not lose my mind over all this nonsense![/QUOTE]

 

[upstater]

"Consider them rolled" I love that line, Delaney is legit no doubt!

Two things as I read this: one is that Shapiro's tone and approach just amplifies the arrogance that was/is ESPN. They feel they can dictate terms and usually can but that eventually comes back to bite you from time to time. This was confirmed when Shapiro admitted so with his opinion "in retrospect."

The second is that Delaney negotiates from a position of power and haves his clearly wired at all times. He knew what his backup plan was, as well as any additional contingency requirements before they even come up..... Thats excellent situational awareness, unlike what the Big East possessed.

Back to my previous point re ESPN, again, they are the 100 pound gorilla and only seem to back down when punched in the face! Well... Delaney gave them an upper cut and honestly.... If we are not on Delaney's "secret list", the State of CT better do the same thing! I think many of us would agree that as tax payers, ESPN has screwed every resident in the state out of millions of dollars whether you are a sports fan or not, with that tax free (close to) deal they held over the state. I mentioned this before, but an Executive I know at ESPN shared with me that he feels the only way Uconn gets into a conference is if the State goes to ESPN and says make it happen or this deal is off the table. Again, this guy is a Uconn/Big East fan and hates our situation so I feel there is merrit there. The only conclusion a reasonable person can conclude with the recent silence of the state and Uconn administration, is that something is in our future... and that I what I will continue to believe to remain calm and not lose my mind over all this nonsense!

[/QUOTE]

You have to remember that Execs really work from themselves. Shapiro was out of there a year later to run 6flags (into the ground). At each stop, he made more than he made before. He had no allegiance to ESPN. His superiors rewarded him for being brash. If there was no reward, he wouldn't have been.

 

[businesslawyer]

Bizlaw, it does matter how much people watch, but not nearly as much as it does for advertising. More important is whether people, at the time of their cable subscription decision, think they may want to watch later. They buy cable in order to have the OPTION to watch in the future, not because they are necessarily committed to watching. People (and businesses) often pay for options they end up not using. Especially when it comes to TV, which is commonly used as a backup entertainment option.

On the cable company side, they know people will pay $50/month for their bundle, so the question is more about the marginal subscribers -- channels get paid according to how many additional subscribers they bring in. BTN may bring in a number of male sports fan who otherwise would skip cable, but who then neglect to watch; while the Weather Channel may get lots of viewers but not bring in many subscribers.

So it's possible to be a poorly watched channel yet worth a lot of money in subscriber fees.

Yes, but only to a point. Manhattan sports consumers may gladly pay more for their cable bill once because it's added the BTN to it, and it sounds cool, but if you never watch it you are not going to want to continue paying for it (even as bundled product).

I'm not trying to overstate the importance of how many people watch it, but to think there will ever be a product for which ultimate consumer use is irrelevant is just silly.

 

[businesslawyer]

Almost all sports networks get a disproportionate affiliate fee against what their ratings are. The BTN is already a perfect example of that.

USA gets higher ratings than ESPN - one of them gets 6-7 times more in their fee - guess which one.

While I'm being somewhat over the top - you can google affiliate fees and you can google ratings.

If ratings drove affiliate fees the BTN wouldn't cost more within the footprint than networks that get 10 times the audience for Family Guy and Modern Family reruns.

The BTN is going to get about $12 per household per year in NYC for a grand total of about 4 football games that unless Rutgers gets a lot better will be viewed in NYC by
1-2% of the market. The rest of the year you can measure the audience in 5 figures.

The BTN's affiliate fee is already long disconnected from their ratings.

I understand the point about, in the short term, ratings being less important than cable boxes in the market. It is a true statement.

We can quibble about whether you are overstating or misstating, but there is no point. Ultimately, the number of people who want to watch games on the BTN will matter.

 

[uconnell]

We ha be the BTN as part of a bundle, didn't really want it, don't watch cause I have no interest in any teams in that conference .

 

[jostar1]

Christopher Lambert retweeted
Jon Solomon @JonSolomonCBS · 5m 5 minutes ago
Steve Patterson: Paying FB & MBB players will force nonrevenue sports to be eliminated.

Big 12 Conference @Big12Conference · 7m 7 minutes ago
#Big12Forum: @SIPeteThamel - Lower tier schools not in the "Big 5" - fear of purge in non-revenue sports.

 

[noeynox]

Christopher Lambert retweeted
Jon Solomon @JonSolomonCBS · 5m 5 minutes ago
Steve Patterson: Paying FB & MBB players will force nonrevenue sports to be eliminated.

Big 12 Conference @Big12Conference · 7m 7 minutes ago
#Big12Forum: @SIPeteThamel - Lower tier schools not in the "Big 5" - fear of purge in non-revenue sports.

Some schools just need to come to the realization that half assing it trying to keep up with the P5, is not in their long term best interest if they have zero hope of ever getting elevated to a P5 conference and the revenue distribution that comes with that. So instead of eliminating sports to offer the same benefits if Basketball and Football, just embrace that you won't offer the same benefits but offer what you currently offer to student athletes.

Since the majority of NCAA schools fall on the opposite end of being well off, I'll be surprised if the whole thing doesn't collapse within ten years.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The non-P5 are eventually going to sue the P5, and they will win. The P5's market power comes from it being a cartel of independent entities whose primary purpose is to restrain trade. They can't do that. Microsoft and Oracle can't decide to work together to lock up the database market. If the NCAA wants to allow individual schools to pay players, that is up to the schools, but when the conferences are working in concert to make decisions, it becomes illegal.

 

[jostar1]

MH3 @MH3 · 3h 3 hours ago
Is espn trying to keep the B12 together yet again?? Hearing rumors that LHN may be converted to a B12 Network

MH3 @MH3 · 3h 3 hours ago
Hearing LHN would remain as a companion network available in some areas but that most of the resources would go to a true B12N

MH3 @MH3 · 3h 3 hours ago
May start buying out IMG TV games as early as next year.

MH3 @MH3 · 3h 3 hours ago
I'll post more as I hear it.

 

[uchusky32]

MH3 @MH3 I'm hearing voices from the Satellite Dish on the side of my house. I'll post more of what the voices are saying later.

 

[clmssun]

I noticed I started getting LHN on my U-Verse recently. It has always been "available" on U-Verse, but it started out as a U450 channel for viewers outside of Texas. Now I have it in my U300 package in Ohio. I watched it a little this weekend with Texas-Iowa State game, and I thought it was pretty awful. I think the B1G has crap for football, but I can enjoy watching BTN. The SEC Network is great. LHN... blecch.

Have any New Englanders noticed LHN on their U-Verse (below U450) package?

 

[Kolumbo]

Can't non-revenue sports just say "look, it's ridiculous for us to be a part of this football realignment mess." UCONN Tennis could go play any of the dozens of New England schools within driving distance. Better to do that than just close shop.

 

[CL82]

Can't non-revenue sports just say "look, it's ridiculous for us to be a part of this football realignment mess." UCONN Tennis could go play any of the dozens of New England schools within driving distance. Better to do that than just close shop.

You'd think, right? But if it isn't a club sport (which is what I suspect will eventually happen) I'd expect there would be some complaint about how the tennis student athletes put in the same hours, work as hard, and represent the school as well as football and thus should receive the same benefit. Tough to make the Animal Farm argument that all athletes are equal but some are more equal than others. I think all scholarship athletes would have to get the cost of attendance payment, but only revenue sports would get the "image" payment. End result has to fewer sports, especially if you aren't getting 10's of millions of dollars in media revenue.

 

[pj]

You'd think, right? But if it isn't a club sport (which is what I suspect will eventually happen) I'd expect there would be some complaint about how the tennis student athletes put in the same hours, work as hard, and represent the school as well as football and thus should receive the same benefit. Tough to make the Animal Farm argument that all athletes are equal but some are more equal than others. I think all scholarship athletes would have to get the cost of attendance payment, but only revenue sports would get the "image" payment. End result has to fewer sports, especially if you aren't getting 10's of millions of dollars in media revenue.

If policies are set at the conference level, then you just affiliate each team with a conference that has the policies you want. We're already split between the AAC and Hockey East. Why not have 20 conferences for 24 sports. No reason not to go that way, unless you have a conference TV network that needs content.

 

[Husky25]

You'd think, right? But if it isn't a club sport (which is what I suspect will eventually happen) I'd expect there would be some complaint about how the tennis student athletes put in the same hours, work as hard, and represent the school as well as football and thus should receive the same benefit. Tough to make the Animal Farm argument that all athletes are equal but some are more equal than others. I think all scholarship athletes would have to get the cost of attendance payment, but only revenue sports would get the "image" payment. End result has to fewer sports, especially if you aren't getting 10's of millions of dollars in media revenue.

Tennis is a bad comparison. The best players in the world in their sport come out of college football and basketball and the pro leagues have the age limit, not the NCAA. For football, an NFL player must be at least 20 (I believe) years old and 3 years removed from his high school or preparatory graduation to be eligible for the draft (either in April or supplementary). That typically means RS Sophomore or later. The NBA has a similar rule, but it's 19 and 1 year removed. The reason in the NBA is the same as having a rookie wage scale...money for development. $5 million is a bad investment for an 18 year old kid who may or may not have played against quality competition. Get better on someone else's dime. The same reason applies to the NFL, except there is also a safety component to it (i.e. fully mature 280 lbs. 28 year old LB vs. a 19 year old 150 lb. running back who is still growing. Not too much good can come from that combination).

In tennis, your career is half over at 22 years old.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I noticed I started getting LHN on my U-Verse recently. It has always been "available" on U-Verse, but it started out as a U450 channel for viewers outside of Texas. Now I have it in my U300 package in Ohio. I watched it a little this weekend with Texas-Iowa State game, and I thought it was pretty awful. I think the B1G has crap for football, but I can enjoy watching BTN. The SEC Network is great. LHN... blecch.

Have any New Englanders noticed LHN on their U-Verse (below U450) package?

No. I am outside Boston, with FiOS and we've had the BTN for years as part of the base HD package. The SEC network just showed up, but again, basic carry not on the special sports package. BTN is really only useful for hockey and some basketball, as the better B1G football games are on the networks anyway. SEC channel I find more useful, as the SEC games that aren't national can still be games like Missouri-LSU or similar.

 

[ScottBonz]

Our boys Fluge and Mhver have been at it all day but I am too lazy to even cut and paste today.

 

[jostar1]

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@Mh3 We are going to know in Spring or Summer of 15 if ACCN comes about....if not....many moving parts. ACC need new REV stream

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 VA TECH AD has said so in public......VA TECH has said so in private. Bottom half of ACC in $$$$ need a ACCN for $$ and branding.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 The other major development of 15 is how does Delany negotiate with ESPN knowing FOX will over pay for Tier 1 rights. Steam is...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MHver3 ...rising on the upcoming negotiations....and having more than just $$$ at stake.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 VT would be a fine addition for anyone. I'm on record.....it has become clear that Maryland and VT have a very close realattionship

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 VT is becoming a willing candidate for Big 10 in the next go-around. VT is viable because of their #40 ranking in research$......

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 VT is the fastest rising reseach expenditures $ big school in the country from 2006 until now. Timothy Sands (Purdue) is VT Pres...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 VT only common ACC school is Pittsburgh....but VT wants Football & Research schools combos. UVA is not willing for B1G....just not

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 In a vacuum, yes. But VA TECH is more willing. VA Tech in research is much closer to Michigan & Wisconsin than UVA. Important.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 There is a reason why Babcock AD made a public statement on the need for a ACCN....internal groundwork at VA TECH being laid down

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 Let me put it this way.....Delany said PSU was a bridge to Maryland & Rutgers....now Delany says Maryland will be a bridge. In....

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 research/academics and in college politics Maryland had no closer relationship to anyone in ACC than VA TECH. Period.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 3h 3 hours ago
@MH3 Babcock is worried about paying the bills at VA Tech. The real relationship is Sands & Big 10....and of course there is one.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
Got some more info on possible B12 network.

MHver3‏@MHver3 4h4 hours ago
It is indeed a conversion of LHN but it won't happen all at once

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
Espn looking to possibly buy out certain T3 contracts that have a lot log years left on them but that could take time

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
Some of the contracts are coming to an end soon and those will be the first to join LHN

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
LHN may still be branded as LHN until at least half the conference is signed on

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
But there is a news for more inventory and now espn is wanting B12 to add a couple of teams fairly soon and go to 8 conference games

MHver3@MHver3 · 4h 4 hours ago
Espn willing to restructure B12 contract to include some Tier2 on the network and up the $ as well

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
The network would involve an unequal revenue sharing model for the first contract period.

Carnot Evans‏@carnot3 4h4 hours ago
@MHver3 which teams? Not that ACC nonsense you said yesterday

MHver3‏@MHver3 3h3 hours ago
@carnot3 it wasn't nonsense. Both ACC and B12 are vulnerable. One could fall

Mountaineer Steve ‏@Mountaineer_Ste 3h3 hours ago
@MHver3 Unequal with whom? New teams or TexAss getting more.

MHver3‏@MHver3 3h3 hours ago
@Mountaineer_Ste UT getting more...for now

Mountaineer Steve ‏@Mountaineer_Ste 3h3 hours ago
@MHver3 Screw that, it was what almost broke the 12 up before.

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
BYU and UC are the 2 names I've heard that espn has bandied about.

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
LHN won't go away and UT still gets their cut-eventually the Network would split and Be a companion network to B12N

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
Florida market important to any conference network but espn realizes B12 can't water down the product too much. Wait and see approach

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
Aresco knows UC could be an option for B12 soon and is scrambling to find a potential replacement.

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
BYU could potentially be a partial member-3 sports-and no Sunday play would be honored

Carnot Evans‏@carnot3 3h3 hours ago
@MHver3 UCF a better product than Cincy. More potential, too.

MHver3‏@MHver3 3h3 hours ago
@carnot3 not arguing but with the future so uncertain could have better opportunity in that state in next 2-3 years.

MHver3‏@MHver3 3h3 hours ago
@carnot3 also Florida now puts another school on an island. UC somewhat bridges the gap with WVU

Carnot Evans ‏@carnot3 3h3 hours ago
@MHver3 like BYU wouldn't be an island. Ha.

MHver3‏@MHver3 2h2 hours ago
@carnot3 true but they are a national-if not worldwide-brand. Also would be a partial member

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
If espn can buy out all B12 T3 and increase footprint then projections are $15-$20 mil per team within 5-7 years

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
BYU as a partial member means they wouldn't get a full share but what they get would be more than now.

Randall Lee Rowberry‏@Randelius 3h3 hours ago
@MHver3 From whom? Taking into account their current deal with ESPN?

MHver3‏@MHver3 2h2 hours ago
@Randelius yes

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
You'd be splitting it in 11 1/2 shares and with the addition of a CCG it could net current members an additional 3-4 million on T1&2

MHver3@MHver3 · 3h 3 hours ago
UC would get a graduated rate for several years.

MHver3@MHver3 · 2h 2 hours ago
BYU budget for athletics is allegedly over $100 million per year. They aren't hurting for cash

Taylor Pierce‏@taylorgpierce 1h1 hour ago
@MHver3 doubt it. Probably closer to 65-70M.

MHver3‏@MHver3 1h1 hour ago
@taylorgpierce the figure they shared with the B12 was over $100m.

Taylor Pierce ‏@taylorgpierce 19m19 minutes ago
@MHver3 Back in 2012 they reported $55M to the dept of education. Maybe a couple unreported items, but big leap to $100M+ in a couple yrs.



ME: Translations: ESPN knows that it will not bid high on the next Big 10 package but, instead, concentrate on improving the exposure for the Big 12 and ACC. Future trends point them that way. B12 might take BYU and Cincy for the first round, then hope that they can lure in FSU and Miami. ACC would replace them with UCF and USF and then offer UConn a ND-type deal. Big 10 won't offer UConn because they'd be paid handsomely by Fox, NBC or CBS.

Then again, none of those yahoos are ever reliable.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

And from Flugaur and "The Dude":

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
Hey #UCONN get ready for that ACC invite to replace UNC.

Omega Supreme ‏@OmegaSupreme914 5h5 hours ago
@theDudeofWV UNC is Toast!

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
@OmegaSupreme914 1,500 athletes over 18 years.

Greg Flugaur‏@flugempire 5h5 hours ago
@theDudeofWV @OmegaSupreme914 University of Minnesota had a huge academic fraud problem 25 years ago and we had our Final 4 wiped out...

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
@flugempire @OmegaSupreme914 I'm not shedding a single tear for UNC.

Omega Supreme ‏@OmegaSupreme914 5h5 hours ago
@theDudeofWV @flugempire you and me both

Greg Flugaur ‏@flugempire 5h5 hours ago
@theDudeofWV @OmegaSupreme914 I don't anyone is outside of UNC. This is going to hurt the ACC in ways that is hard to put on a ledger.

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
@flugempire @OmegaSupreme914 If you believe UNC is the flagship school of the ACC then I agree.

Greg Flugaur ‏@flugempire 5h5 hours ago
@theDudeofWV @OmegaSupreme914 UVA looking at UNC and saying "Oh, so that's what we've been competing against since Ralph Sampson graduated"

M A Fitzgerald ‏@afitz66 5h5 hours ago
@flugempire @theDudeofWV @OmegaSupreme914 Don't look now but the Cuse is under NCAA investigation too.

Omega Supreme ‏@OmegaSupreme914 5h5 hours ago
@afitz66 @flugempire @theDudeofWV Atlantic Cheaters Conference



ME: Ha! The Big 10 (as well as the SEC) would still take them, even in their current state. Not that they're leaning that way in the current time...

 

[whaler11]

Seriously Aresco is scrambling to potentially replace Cincinnati?

A league that invited Tulane and Tulsa?

If you don't feel like throwing a dart at the CUSA standings... I'm pretty sure UMass would answer the phone.

 

[SubbaBub]

Seriously Aresco is scrambling to potentially replace Cincinnati?

A league that invited Tulane and Tulsa?

If you don't feel like throwing a dart at the CUSA standings... I'm pretty sure UMass would answer the phone.

Yes, the sofa cushions are candidate free after the T schools. Next spot is under the fridge.

 

[CL82]

And from Flugaur and "The Dude":

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
Hey #UCONN get ready for that ACC invite to replace UNC.

..

Mr. Delaney, you are on the clock.

 

[pj]

Don't get the "replace UNC" tweet. There are no death penalties any more. The NCAA is a paper mouse. It's afraid to say, "squeak."

 

[jostar1]

Don't get the "replace UNC" tweet. There are no death penalties any more. The NCAA is a paper mouse. It's afraid to say, "squeak."

He's being sarcastic. All of the "eers" hate the ACC with a passion.

Christopher Lambert @theDudeofWV · 8h 8 hours ago
@_Wasted_Space_ I wasn't being serious but I'm sure if the ACC had to replace UNC they would add a basketball school.