NIL Feeder Program AKA "Farm System" Rumor

[aburks41]

So I just read an interesting post. This random person said they heard a rumor about P5 programs trying to establish a farm system with local mid major programs. For example, a recruit that UK thinks can develop into a good player, but isn't ready to play at UK just yet will get steered to WKU to develop. A UK booster would give the WKU kid an NIL deal in exchange for a promise that if they develop into a good player, they will transfer to UK in 2 or 3 seasons. In a world of NIL and unpunished tampering, what is stopping programs from doing this? The benefit for the P5 program is obvious, and the mid major would likely receive some sort of kick backs from this too (which would probably be a violation but the NCAA clearly doesn't even care anymore)

Obviously this is unproven, but it wouldn't surprise me if this started happening in the future in both football and basketball

 

[auror]

What would stop it is boosters not wanting to pay a random dude not yet good enough for his school. Seems like a real waste of money.

 

[Lefty2one]

I'm not sure the P5 needs to bother with this. Just go pluck the kids you want when the time comes.

What if you send Player A to a "feeder" mid-major and in 2-3 years when it's time for him to transfer there's Player B, who's far more proven (and/or better), that's begging to come to your school?

College basketball is going to become such an in-the-moment sport; there's no point in planning anything 2-3 years down the line.

 

[Chin Diesel]

So I just read an interesting post. This random person said they heard a rumor about P5 programs trying to establish a farm system with local mid major programs. For example, a recruit that UK thinks can develop into a good player, but isn't ready to play at UK just yet will get steered to WKU to develop. A UK booster would give the WKU kid an NIL deal in exchange for a promise that if they develop into a good player, they will transfer to UK in 2 or 3 seasons. In a world of NIL and unpunished tampering, what is stopping programs from doing this? The benefit for the P5 program is obvious, and the mid major would likely receive some sort of kick backs from this too (which would probably be a violation but the NCAA clearly doesn't even care anymore)

Obviously this is unproven, but it wouldn't surprise me if this started happening in the future in both football and basketball

Almost like a kid whose academics aren't the best getting in to a directional state U with a promise to go to the main campus if they maintain a certain GPA after one or two years. Plenty of states are doing that with academics. No reason it can't be done with athletics.

 

[navery12]

The biggest reason I don't see this happening is there's nothing forcing the kid to actually go to the P5 school. Maybe it works for Kentucky and Duke where nobody is realistically swooping in, but for the majority of schools it's just not worth the risk when the kid can still go anywhere he wants in a year or 2

 

[AdamaNation]

I'm not sure the P5 needs to bother with this. Just go pluck the kids you want when the time comes.

What if you send Player A to a "feeder" mid-major and in 2-3 years when it's time for him to transfer there's Player B, who's far more proven (and/or better), that's begging to come to your school?

College basketball is going to become such an in-the-moment sport; there's no point in planning anything 2-3 years down the line.

The portal proved that all schools are feeder programs. If there isn’t any pt players are out.

 

[uconnsouth]

This currently happens in college baseball. JUCO programs get kids for a year or two and then the kids will transfer to the D1

Florida Juco baseball programs in particular do this often

 

[aburks41]

I'm not sure the P5 needs to bother with this. Just go pluck the kids you want when the time comes.

What if you send Player A to a "feeder" mid-major and in 2-3 years when it's time for him to transfer there's Player B, who's far more proven (and/or better), that's begging to come to your school?

College basketball is going to become such an in-the-moment sport; there's no point in planning anything 2-3 years down the line.

I tend to agree with this...but if there is a kid who is in that 150-200 recruiting range and you think they just need a few years of consistent playing time to develop, but they aren't are the level of your program right now, then why not have a booster give them $50-100k a year to go to a local mid major with the promise that if they develop into a high major player and want to transfer, you get first dibs on them. Basically you're paying for their transfer rights. It's a risk that they may not develop into a high major player, but the reward is you get first dibs on a guy if you want him.

It would basically be a mix of the loan system in European soccer and the farm system for baseball. I'm not advocating for this to happen, I'm just saying that with NIL, this has become a very real possibility for rich P5 programs to explore.

 

[CTBasketball]

 

[JohnFSilver]

It is all going to end up going away because players, agents and some schools just went crazy.

What will happen is players will sign contracts with schools. 2,3, 4 year deals.

This is the first time in athletics history labor has an advantage over management. The colleges won’t like what is happening. The fans of those teams are gonna hate it. And there will now be a way to restrict player movement.

How they looks? I don’t know, but we will probably see the one year sit out rule out in effect. We will also have the coaching staffs regain control of where a player can transfer as well as conferences agree to a no transfer policy.

Why?

Because the teams need more control. This isn’t a moral issue, or saying what is fair or not fair. Current system is not sustainable.

Who is benefitting from all this Money in college football? The schools are going broke. No one is flush with cash outside of sec schools and a couple of big Ten teams.

Coaches and media are the biggest beneficiaries.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

The biggest reason I don't see this happening is there's nothing forcing the kid to actually go to the P5 school. Maybe it works for Kentucky and Duke where nobody is realistically swooping in, but for the majority of schools it's just not worth the risk when the kid can still go anywhere he wants in a year or 2

Unless you make him sign a contract
The kid may just prefer too stay where he
is or go somewhere else because playing time is always an issue.
Actually rather than a Dejur system a defacto system of sorts is already being created that prevents lesser teams from getting better. A Dejur system also has serious
Monopolistic legal ramifications.
Look at ECU they recruit two good guards
Gardner and Newton one left last year for VA the other this year for UConn . Just imagine if our best players transferred annually. How many would remain fans. Programs like that are on a treadmill.
One of the allures of fandom is hope
The current environment squashes any hope a base has if improving. I believe that hurts the game.
I suspect in todays environment it would have been impossible or. at least more difficult for UConn to rise. Even getting a good coach to come to a down program would also be difficult.
Someone has to take the situation by the b***s before they killed the goose thst lays the golden eggs.

 

[CTBasketball]

Unless you make him sign a contract
The kid may just prefer too stay where he
is or go somewhere else because playing time is always an issue.
Actually rather than a Dejur system a defacto system of sorts is already being created that prevents lesser teams from getting better. A Dejur system also has serious
Monopolistic legal ramifications.
Look at ECU they recruit two good guards
Gardner and Newton one left last year for VA the other this year for UConn . Just imagine if our best players transferred annually. How many would remain fans. Programs like that are on a treadmill.
One of the allures of fandom is hope
The current environment squashes any hope a base has if improving. I believe that hurts the game.
I suspect in todays environment it would have been impossible or. at least more difficult for UConn to rise. Even getting a good coach to come to a down program would also be difficult.
Someone has to take the situation by the b***s before they killed the goose thst lays the golden eggs.

The portal and NIL will soon destroy college hoops unless some drastic changes are made.

 

[thatguyed]

This is only potentially valid if it was overheard at a car wash.

 

[navery12]

Unless you make him sign a contract
The kid may just prefer too stay where he
is or go somewhere else because playing time is always an issue.
Actually rather than a Dejur system a defacto system of sorts is already being created that prevents lesser teams from getting better. A Dejur system also has serious
Monopolistic legal ramifications.
Look at ECU they recruit two good guards
Gardner and Newton one left last year for VA the other this year for UConn . Just imagine if our best players transferred annually. How many would remain fans. Programs like that are on a treadmill.
One of the allures of fandom is hope
The current environment squashes any hope a base has if improving. I believe that hurts the game.
I suspect in todays environment it would have been impossible or. at least more difficult for UConn to rise. Even getting a good coach to come to a down program would also be difficult.
Someone has to take the situation by the b***s before they killed the goose thst lays the golden eggs.

But that's the point, you can't make him sign a contract because that would be illegal. Has to be handshake deals which could easily backfire

 

[SubbaBub]

What would stop it is boosters not wanting to pay a random dude not yet good enough for his school. Seems like a real waste of money.

And, a complete lack of any reason for a recruit to honor such a deal should the parent program eventually want him.

Minor league players in all other sports have contracts with the parent organization and are assigned to the scout teams.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

It is all going to end up going away because players, agents and some schools just went crazy.

What will happen is players will sign contracts with schools. 2,3, 4 year deals.

This is the first time in athletics history labor has an advantage over management. The colleges won’t like what is happening. The fans of those teams are gonna hate it. And there will now be a way to restrict player movement.

How they looks? I don’t know, but we will probably see the one year sit out rule out in effect. We will also have the coaching staffs regain control of where a player can transfer as well as conferences agree to a no transfer policy.

Why?

Because the teams need more control. This isn’t a moral issue, or saying what is fair or not fair. Current system is not sustainable.

Who is benefitting from all this Money in college football? The schools are going broke. No one is flush with cash outside of sec schools and a couple of big Ten teams.

Coaches and media are the biggest beneficiaries.

Agree on that the system is our of control and unsustainable.

Disagree on your solution. Why is it a bad thing that labor has leverage over management? Particularly a labor force that has never been compensated, ever, while athletic directors, coaches, conference commissioners, bowl games, march Madness, University presidents, and universities make millions and billions.

We're in a world where a college coach can make $5M a year and that's accepted but a kid making $100k on some NIL is where agents have gone crazy?

It may ultimately ruin the division 1 landscape but I'd argue post conference realignment it was already on its way, and the solution shouldn't be take away the labor forces ability to earn.

 

[Rico444]

It is all going to end up going away because players, agents and some schools just went crazy.

What will happen is players will sign contracts with schools. 2,3, 4 year deals.

This is the first time in athletics history labor has an advantage over management. The colleges won’t like what is happening. The fans of those teams are gonna hate it. And there will now be a way to restrict player movement.

How they looks? I don’t know, but we will probably see the one year sit out rule out in effect. We will also have the coaching staffs regain control of where a player can transfer as well as conferences agree to a no transfer policy.

Why?

Because the teams need more control. This isn’t a moral issue, or saying what is fair or not fair. Current system is not sustainable.

Who is benefitting from all this Money in college football? The schools are going broke. No one is flush with cash outside of sec schools and a couple of big Ten teams.

Coaches and media are the biggest beneficiaries.

Schools aren't the ones paying these kids though, boosters are. And if the amount they're paying isn't sustainable, they'll stop paying or get worse players. I don't see what isn't sustainable about it.

 

[businesslawyer]

I tend to agree with this...but if there is a kid who is in that 150-200 recruiting range and you think they just need a few years of consistent playing time to develop, but they aren't are the level of your program right now, then why not have a booster give them $50-100k a year to go to a local mid major with the promise that if they develop into a high major player and want to transfer, you get first dibs on them. Basically you're paying for their transfer rights. It's a risk that they may not develop into a high major player, but the reward is you get first dibs on a guy if you want him.

It would basically be a mix of the loan system in European soccer and the farm system for baseball. I'm not advocating for this to happen, I'm just saying that with NIL, this has become a very real possibility for rich P5 programs to explore.

So you acknowledge that there are rules that this would violate, and yet you think someone with money is giving a kid $50k for a verbal promise about what he would do in a few years that is totally legally unenforceable to begin with?

 

[aburks41]

So you acknowledge that there are rules that this would violate, and yet you think someone with money is giving a kid $50k for a verbal promise about what he would do in a few years that is totally legally unenforceable to begin with?

Yes. Boosters with tons of money mixed together with the emotions of sports can make irrational financial decisions. I would bet a lot of money that this becomes a prevalent thing in college sports in the near future. A Tennessee booster gave a HIGH SCHOOL kid $8M to commit to Tenn. I'd reckon that if people are throwing that kind of money around to a high school senior, it would be almost a guarantee that they use some of it to create a farm system of some sort.

 

[Rico444]

Yes. Boosters with tons of money mixed together with the emotions of sports can make irrational financial decisions. I would bet a lot of money that this becomes a prevalent thing in college sports in the near future. A Tennessee booster gave a HIGH SCHOOL kid $8M to commit to Tenn. I'd reckon that if people are throwing that kind of money around to a high school senior, it would be almost a guarantee that they use some of it to create a farm system of some sort.

Why would they do that when they can't get a legally binding guarantee to that player's right if and when they blow up? Why wouldn't they just wait until the player blows up and pay them then?

 

[uconndogs]

It is all going to end up going away because players, agents and some schools just went crazy.

What will happen is players will sign contracts with schools. 2,3, 4 year deals.

This is the first time in athletics history labor has an advantage over management. The colleges won’t like what is happening. The fans of those teams are gonna hate it. And there will now be a way to restrict player movement.

How they looks? I don’t know, but we will probably see the one year sit out rule out in effect. We will also have the coaching staffs regain control of where a player can transfer as well as conferences agree to a no transfer policy.

Why?

Because the teams need more control. This isn’t a moral issue, or saying what is fair or not fair. Current system is not sustainable.

Who is benefitting from all this Money in college football? The schools are going broke. No one is flush with cash outside of sec schools and a couple of big Ten teams.

Coaches and media are the biggest beneficiaries.

I agree that it's not sustainable for the vast majority of college athletics, but it probably is for 30 or 40 programs. So when the NCAA tries to address this my bet is those programs split. They will feel they can garner media deals that will support their athletic programs the way they want to.

With Texas and Oklahoma on their way to the SEC it would not surprise me in the least if the BiG is talking to programs in the PAC12. At that point there is a clear North-South conference divide for the SEC and BiG to breakoff. Those two conferences will pick up some of remaining plums (ND, FSU, etc.). Pro sports under college umbrellas.

 

[superjohn]

We should just have all the cartels support all the players financially, Kentucky Sinaloa Wildcats and the Baylor Los Zetas Bears.

 

[aburks41]

Why would they do that when they can't get a legally binding guarantee to that player's right if and when they blow up? Why wouldn't they just wait until the player blows up and pay them then?

Because the point is to give them an NIL bag for a promise that you get first dibs on them should they decide to transfer. Of course there cannot be a legally binding system, but that's as close as you can get. It's the semi-illegal version of the loan system in soccer.

 

[businesslawyer]

Why would they do that when they can't get a legally binding guarantee to that player's right if and when they blow up? Why wouldn't they just wait until the player blows up and pay them then?

That is exactly the point. It's not that boosters might not spend money on this. It's that they're not giving someone $50k two years ahead of time in a non-binding and non-enforceable agreement, only to watch a booster from another school give the kid $10k the day he actually transfers and get him to go somewhere else.

 

[August_West]

We should just have all the cartels support all the players financially, Kentucky Sinaloa Wildcats and the Baylor Los Zetas Bears.

That's exactly how this is all going to go down. And really already is.

 

[Billy Bob]

Yes. Boosters with tons of money mixed together with the emotions of sports can make irrational financial decisions. I would bet a lot of money that this becomes a prevalent thing in college sports in the near future. A Tennessee booster gave a HIGH SCHOOL kid $8M to commit to Tenn. I'd reckon that if people are throwing that kind of money around to a high school senior, it would be almost a guarantee that they use some of it to create a farm system of some sort.

Allegedly, Sam Gilbert was throwing out dough in the John Wooden years

 

[superjohn]

That's exactly how this is all going to go down. And really already is.

If they're going to ruin college sports at least we get to see it run by big time criminals. The cat and mouse game between the feds and the criminals is going to be more exciting than the actual games.

This is what most people wanted so they should fully embrace.

 

[bfs3]

Doesn’t make any sense. Why pay them before they’re good when you would just save the money to make a bigger offer when they’re actually good? Throwing them a few bucks early on isn’t buying you a discount when it comes time to transfer