NET TOP 40 this week (12/10/2024

[visitingcock]

Why Top 40? Because that 40th ranked team you play on the road is a Quad One game!

Quadrant 1 (Q1)
Home (1-25)
Neutral (1-35)
Away (1-40)

NET	Team	Record	SOS	NC Rec	NC SOS	Home	Road	Neutral	Q1	Q2	Q3	Q4
1	South Carolina SEC (0-0)	9-1	2	9-1	2	3-0	1-1	5-0	4-1	2-0	0-0	3-0
2	Connecticut Big East (0-0)	8-0	45	8-0	44	4-0	0-0	4-0	2-0	1-0	0-0	5-0
3	Kansas State Big 12 (0-0)	10-1	155	10-1	158	8-0	1-0	1-1	0-1	2-0	1-0	7-0
4	Texas SEC (0-0)	8-1	36	8-1	37	3-0	2-1	3-0	1-1	1-0	1-0	5-0
5	UCLA Big Ten (1-0)	9-0	102	8-0	105	4-0	2-0	3-0	1-0	2-0	0-0	6-0
6	Michigan State Big Ten (0-0)	9-0	95	9-0	95	6-0	1-0	2-0	2-0	0-0	0-0	7-0
7	Notre Dame ACC (1-0)	7-2	6	6-2	4	3-0	4-0	0-2	2-2	0-0	2-0	3-0
8	Vanderbilt SEC (0-0)	9-1	164	9-1	166	6-0	2-0	1-1	0-1	0-0	4-0	5-0
9	TCU Big 12 (0-0)	9-1	42	9-1	42	7-0	0-0	2-1	2-1	0-0	1-0	6-0
10	Duke ACC (1-0)	9-2	4	8-2	3	5-0	2-2	2-0	2-2	4-0	1-0	2-0
11	LSU SEC (0-0)	11-0	190	11-0	191	8-0	0-0	3-0	1-0	2-0	1-0	7-0
12	West Virginia Big 12 (0-0)	9-1	212	9-1	212	7-0	0-0	2-1	0-1	0-0	1-0	8-0
13	USC Big Ten (1-0)	8-1	49	7-1	60	4-1	1-0	3-0	1-1	1-0	1-0	5-0
14	Oklahoma SEC (0-0)	8-1	81	8-1	78	4-0	3-0	1-1	0-1	2-0	0-0	6-0
15	Ohio State Big Ten (1-0)	8-0	227	7-0	261	4-0	2-0	2-0	0-0	2-0	1-0	5-0
16	North Carolina ACC (0-0)	9-1	80	9-1	76	5-0	1-0	3-1	0-1	3-0	1-0	5-0
17	Maryland Big Ten (1-0)	10-0	159	9-0	137	5-0	3-0	2-0	1-0	1-0	1-0	7-0
18	Ole Miss SEC (0-0)	6-3	20	6-3	22	4-0	1-1	1-2	0-3	1-0	0-0	5-0
19	Michigan Big Ten (1-0)	8-1	112	7-1	87	6-0	0-0	2-1	0-1	2-0	1-0	5-0
20	Mississippi State SEC (0-0)	9-1	113	9-1	114	5-0	1-1	3-0	1-1	0-0	1-0	7-0
21	Alabama SEC (0-0)	9-1	224	9-1	223	5-0	2-1	2-0	0-1	1-0	0-0	8-0
22	Baylor Big 12 (0-0)	9-2	230	9-2	229	7-0	0-1	2-1	0-0	2-2	0-0	7-0
23	Georgia Tech ACC (0-0)	9-0	184	9-0	187	6-0	1-0	2-0	1-0	2-0	0-0	6-0
24	North Carolina State ACC (0-0)	6-3	9	6-3	11	5-0	0-1	1-2	1-3	0-0	0-0	5-0
25	Utah Big 12 (0-0)	8-2	64	8-2	59	7-0	0-1	1-1	1-1	2-0	1-1	4-0
26	Richmond Atlantic 10 (0-0)	9-1	126	9-1	127	3-1	3-0	3-0	1-0	3-0	0-1	5-0
27	Tennessee SEC (0-0)	7-0	135	7-0	140	6-0	0-0	1-0	1-0	1-0	1-0	4-0
28	Oklahoma State Big 12 (0-0)	9-1	231	9-1	230	8-0	0-0	1-1	0-1	1-0	1-0	7-0
29	Nebraska Big Ten (1-0)	8-1	205	7-1	233	7-0	0-1	1-0	0-1	1-0	0-0	7-0
30	Florida State ACC (1-0)	9-2	121	8-2	96	6-0	0-2	3-0	0-2	0-0	2-0	7-0
31	California ACC (0-0)	9-1	92	9-1	92	5-0	3-0	1-1	1-1	1-0	1-0	6-0
32	Stanford ACC (0-0)	7-2	101	7-2	102	7-0	0-2	0-0	0-1	0-1	0-0	7-0
33	Kentucky SEC (0-0)	8-1	90	8-1	90	6-0	0-1	2-0	0-1	2-0	0-0	6-0
34	Harvard Ivy League (0-0)	10-1	165	10-1	167	4-0	6-1	0-0	0-0	2-1	2-0	6-0
35	Iowa Big Ten (0-0)	8-1	193	8-1	194	3-0	1-0	4-1	0-1	1-0	3-0	4-0
36	Creighton Big East (1-0)	7-2	44	6-2	32	2-0	3-2	2-0	0-1	2-1	0-0	5-0
37	Minnesota Big Ten (0-1)	10-1	252	10-0	351	6-0	0-1	4-0	0-1	0-0	0-0	10-0
38	Illinois Big Ten (0-1)	7-2	68	7-1	185	5-0	1-1	1-1	0-2	1-0	1-0	5-0
39	Saint Joseph's Atlantic 10 (0-0)	6-2	163	6-2	165	2-1	3-1	1-0	0-1	0-1	2-0	4-0
40	George Mason Atlantic 10 (1-0)	8-1	182	7-1	151	3-0	5-0	0-1	0-1	0-0	2-0	6-0

 

[Bigboote]

How is K State #3 with a 155 strength of schedule, a loss, and zero quad 1 wins? This is even weirder than the previous NET.

 

[12au]

How is K State #3 with a 155 strength of schedule, a loss, and zero quad 1 wins? This is even weirder than the previous NET.

NET likes when you pile-drive teams

 

[Plebe]

Why Top 40? Because that 40th ranked team you play on the road is a Quad One game!

Quadrant 1 (Q1)
Home (1-25)
Neutral (1-35)
Away (1-40)

Close but not quite.

Q1 range for away games is 1-45.

DI Women’s Basketball Committee OKs quadrant-based team sheets, complete seed list - NCAA.org

At its summer meeting this week in Austin, Texas, the NCAA Division I Women's Basketball Committee approved a move to quadrant-based team sheets in 2024-25 and to

www.ncaa.org

 

[YoDore]

@visitingcock , you been hanging out at Warren Nolan again?...lol. It's actually away games against top 45 teams that are Quad One. They had the numbers at Nolan's site corrected at one time, then, for some reason, they changed again.

Quad 1 (home 1-25, neutral 1-35, away 1-45)
Quad 2 (home 26-55, neutral 36-65, away 46-80)
Quad 3 (home 56-90, neutral 66-105, away 81-130)
Quad 4 (home 91+, neutral 106+, away 131+)

 

[visitingcock]

How is K State #3 with a 155 strength of schedule, a loss, and zero quad 1 wins? This is even weirder than the previous NET.

Record.
The quad analysis ( from what I understand) is not a part of the the algorithm that determines NET rank. Instead, it is a factor that is to be used by the committee to adjust the ranking.

I think SOS is a part of the algorithm and I can’t explain their rank with a 100+ SOS

 

[visitingcock]

@visitingcock , you been hanging out at Warren Nolan again?...lol. It's actually away games against top 45 teams that are Quad One. They had the numbers at Nolan's site corrected at one time, then, for some reason, they changed again.

Quad 1 (home 1-25, neutral 1-35, away 1-45)
Quad 2 (home 26-55, neutral 36-65, away 46-80)
Quad 3 (home 56-90, neutral 66-105, away 81-130)
Quad 4 (home 91+, neutral 106+, away 131+)

Guilty as charged.

 

[Plebe]

How is K State #3 with a 155 strength of schedule, a loss, and zero quad 1 wins? This is even weirder than the previous NET.

Quads per se don't affect NET calculation. That's only a post hoc categorization used by the committee to facilitate analysis.

Vanderbilt, now at #8, has a somewhat similar profile to KSU. In fact, Vandy has no Quad 1 or Quad 2 wins thus far. It's a reminder that a strong or weak SOS doesn't per se move you up or down. How you perform relative to that schedule (with game location factored in) does. And it's not just about wins and losses; net efficiency (adjusted for strength of opponent and game location) is also a factor.

The NET is designed to work best with a full season of data, not 20%. So these early season glimpses are always going to have anomalies that more data will help to mitigate.

 

[cancontent]

This is wild.

 

[Plebe]

This is wild.

This is where we have to remember that the NET (like the RPI before it) isn't really meant to be followed day-to-day as if it were the stock market. The only NET that matters is the one in early March that reflects a full season of data.

This one game accounts for 10% of Georgia Tech's resume right now, but by early March it will be about 3%. Besides, a 7-spot swing in the NET is not going to matter in terms of tournament seeding. And, FWIW, I noticed the committee this year added a clarification to its FAQ on the NET: “Scheduling “down” to increase efficiencies will be noted by the committee during the selection process.”

 

[cancontent]

This is where we have to remember that the NET (like the RPI before it) isn't really meant to be followed day-to-day as if it were the stock market. The only NET that matters is the one in early March that reflects a full season of data.

This one game accounts for 10% of Georgia Tech's resume right now, but by early March it will be less than 3%. Besides, a 7-spot swing in the NET is not going to matter in terms of tournament seeding. And, FWIW, I noticed the committee this year added a clarification to its FAQ on the NET: “Scheduling “down” to increase efficiencies will be noted by the committee during the selection process.”

Agreed, but the change still struck me as wild because of how things can fluctuate from game to game.

 

[visitingcock]

Agreed, but the change still struck me as wild because of how things can fluctuate from game to game.

The fluctuations will finish as we progress to 30 days. That’s why I TRY to keep up with Quad 1& 2 games more than rankings - though Quad s will also fluctuate too. I ignore Quad 3/4rankings for now

 

[Kaizen]

UCLA beats #1 and #17 teams and is un-defeated, and is #5.
While South Carolina defeated by UCLA is #1.
No matter what formulas you are using, no one will believe this.

 

[ConwayGmck]

UCLA beats #1 and #17 teams and is un-defeated, and is #5.
While South Carolina defeated by UCLA is #1.
No matter what formulas you are using, no one will believe this.

"UCLA beats X ranked teams and is Y in NET. No matter what formulas you are using, no one will believe this."

Yes we will, because whatever formulas being used do not necessarily correlate to one another. A media poll ranking and an equation-based formulaic rating system are apples to oranges. UCLA is currently 1-0 against Quad 1 opponents (versus South Carolina), and is 1-0 versus Quad 2 opponents (Louisville - that 17th ranked opponent at the time that now is ranked 32nd with a 5-4 record). Six (6) of their 10 games played thus far have been against Quad 4 opponents.

South Carolina may have lost to UCLA, but they still had to play them on UCLA's home floor, and UCLA is a Quad 1 opponent. Overall the Gamecocks have played five (5) Quad 1 opponents going 4-1, and seven (7) of their 10 games played thus far have been against Quad 1 and 2 opponents.

Based on the NET formula where the sum total - and not just 1 or 2 games played - supports the overall NET rating, this is totally believable......

 

[visitingcock]

UCLA beats #1 and #17 teams and is un-defeated, and is #5.
While South Carolina defeated by UCLA is #1.
No matter what formulas you are using, no one will believe this.

Every computer has SCar as no I. Net, Massey and RPI all "believe it."

Apparently algorithms don't care for head-to head that much. While I would make the humans' choice as well, I have witnessed the fails that result in overemphasizing htoh

 

[Kaizen]

Every computer has SCar as no I. Net, Massey and RPI all "believe it."

Not ESPN.
ESPN has UCLA #1, UConn #2 and South Carolina #3.

 

[GoChips20]

Every computer has SCar as no I. Net, Massey and RPI all "believe it."

Apparently algorithms don't care for head-to head that much. While I would make the humans' choice as well, I have witnessed the fails that result in overemphasizing htoh

Are Massey’s ratings pulling from last season still tho? I thought I read somewhere that Massey needs about a third to a half of a season to calibrate correctly. I followed Massey last year and it showed SC as #1 defensively and #2 offensively just as it does now. Massey still shows Iowa as the #1 offense which is why I suspect it’s not totally up to date.

 

[visitingcock]

Are Massey’s ratings pulling from last season still tho? I thought I read somewhere that Massey needs about a third to a half of a season to calibrate correctly. I followed Massey last year and it showed SC as #1 defensively and #2 offensively just as it does now. Massey still shows Iowa as the #1 offense which is why I suspect it’s not totally up to date.

Massey is right on the cusp. It is said that last years ratings fade in importance after ten game. But it’s not ever purely based iin this year alone .

 

[Plebe]

Massey is right on the cusp. It is said that last years ratings fade in importance after ten game. But it’s not ever purely based iin this year alone .

"It is said" -- Said by whom? A deft use of the passive voice as cover to perpetuate this urban myth. 10 is a number someone just made up out of thin air, and yet people for some reason keep invoking it.

Iowa is most certainly not the 6th best team this year.

 

[Darwin]

Massey rankings take a long while to reflect current year strength. Usually comes into its own late in the season. But yeah, SC is the dawg still until proven otherwise over 20-25 games. I’m not dismissing UCLA or ND etc, but SC is still the dawg until toppled at year end imo, and yeah, it’s close this year and will be for the rest of season, getting more competitive every year now.

 

[ConwayGmck]

"It is said" -- Said by whom? A deft use of the passive voice as cover to perpetuate this urban myth. 10 is a number someone just made up out of thin air, and yet people for some reason keep invoking it.

Iowa is most certainly not the 6th best team this year.

Thor: I need to go to Nidavellir

Drax: Nidavellir? That's a made up word!

Thor: All words are made up

 

[visitingcock]

"It is said" -- Said by whom? A deft use of the passive voice as cover to perpetuate this urban myth. 10 is a number someone just made up out of thin air, and yet people for some reason keep invoking it.

Iowa is most certainly not the 6th best team this year.

By whom?

They.

 

[GamecockFam]

Some of my relatives love to talk politics around Thanksgiving and they always use these vague references that make it seem like the point they are trying to prove is common fact. It's always fun to get the dumbfounded faces when I start asking them where they learned that information. I tend to not go further because I am one of the few Democrats in my family and I'd rather not have the mashed potatoes flung at my face. But still, it's fun to subtly call them out on their BS.

 

[Plebe]

Some of my relatives love to talk politics around Thanksgiving and they always use these vague references that make it seem like the point they are trying to prove is common fact. It's always fun to get the dumbfounded faces when I start asking them where they learned that information.

In language and communications there's a term for this type of rhetoric:

Weasel word - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[GamecockFam]

In language and communications there's a term for this type of rhetoric:

Weasel word - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Thanks! I never knew that there was a term.

 

[12au]

Texas is now No. 1 in NET after burying the Jackrabbits