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My Two Cents!

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fleudslipcon

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I've always wondered if the dilution of the bb programs hurt the major bb programs. If the major bb programs divorced themselves from the NCAA and formed their own version of the BCS they would have had similar negotiating powers as the football teams in the BCS conferences. But that opportunity has come and gone. So basketball makes money but football makes more because of supply and demand.

The move by Cuse and Pitt doesn't guarantee anything for them or the ACC. The first poaching by the ACC proved that. And a super strong football conference doesn't guarantee anything. The B12 proved that. There is no way of knowing if the football schools had split from the bb schools what would have happened. There is no way of knowing if the BE accepted the ESPN contract what would have happened. In the end most of us are placing logic on a situation that is as much driven by emotion.

Many fans targeted the ACC, Miami and BC for backstabbing the BE conference. And many of the same people are hoping UConn can do the same thing. So many of us hate greed, but in the end most people are looking for the most $$ and don't see the cup half full. If a conference lags behind other conferences in $$, even if the conference is doing very well, it isn't good enough. The BE was a good conference and made money. But jealousies, envy, insecurity, desire and intolerance will win out every time.

Almost every poster enjoyed seeing the failure that the additions of Miami and BC brought to the ACC. That move did not hurt the BE in football and ended up allowing the BE to leap ahead of the ACC in basketball. But some of the BE football schools were convinced that the bb only schools were to blame for the weakness with their football programs. That's the excuse they needed to bolt. But they will fail if they believe their shortcomings can be overcome by just going to a new environment.

Syracuse, and to a lesser extent Pitt, are trying to regain their glory days and are hoping the jump to the ACC will be the fix for their downward slide. But the ACC will give them nothing that the BE already provided to make up for bad coaching and bad recruiting.

I'm happy it was reported UConn had worked to maintain the BE. IMO this was the higher ground. The extra millions that JC turned down after the 2001 season, or JoePa giving back his salary to the University are anomalies in this day and age. Everybody wants the quick buck and the extra buck. And everybody justifies their entitlement to it. UConn may have no choice in seeking other conferences. But I'm not sure ending up in any new or altered conference will significantly change the outcome of its sports or academics in spite of all our protestations otherwise.

 
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Your comments are excellent but I'm choosing to ignore the economics and,unfortunately, things like loyalty and history simply because I can't control the decisions being made. So I will simply look at the hoops fallout for our Huskies. And the hoops in a Big Easternized ACC is mouthwatering to say the very least. Let's get this done!


 
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Here's the thing, fluedsipcon...basketball doesn't matter. Wishing it did doesn't change any of this. There are probably 5 schools in all of D-1 football where basketball is more important, and 2 of them are in the ACC. Two are in the Big East, and that has contributed to the problems.
 
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The money disparity skews everything. The TV rights simply are far more valuable for college football. Therefore, the Powers in Football (and not the most inclusive bunch ever) determined the shape of events. Stinks.
 
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Some good points, but the move of Miami, BC and VTech absolutely hurt the Big East in football. I know that Miami hasn't won titles since leaving, but VTech has consistently been a top 10 program.

I think the measure of damage to BE football isn't the success or lack thereof that those programs have had in the ACC, but should be looked at in terms of what they likely could have done if they had stayed in the Big East. I don't see how you can say having Miami, VT and BC in the BE over the past few years wouldn't have made the BE a stronger football conference.
 
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Good points, but football continues to rule. Its all about the money.
 
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The money disparity skews everything. The TV rights simply are far more valuable for college football. Therefore, the Powers in Football (and not the most inclusive bunch ever) determined the shape of events. Stinks.

And why is that? I believe it has a little to do with Sports Betting. Oklahoma -5 against Florida is more appealing in FB than it is in BB. Also, in the day of the DVR, live programming is the key. How many people watch commercials on their DVR?
 

fleudslipcon

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Here's the thing, fluedsipcon...basketball doesn't matter. Wishing it did doesn't change any of this. There are probably 5 schools in all of D-1 football where basketball is more important, and 2 of them are in the ACC. Two are in the Big East, and that has contributed to the problems.

Basketball doesn't matter at this time in its current format relative to football at this time in its current format. I agree with you but with this distinction.

We won't know if Pitt and Syracuse made the correct decision to bolt for the ACC for several years. It certainly did not turn out that way for Miami or BC.

I'm more grounded in the way things work than you might believe. Given the current situation, I'm torn between the options UConn is facing. The University has done quite well in progressing both academically and athletically over the last two decades and a good degree of this success should be attributed to its association with the BE imo.

I'm hoping for the best for UConn no matter what format it will be a part of in the future. But it is just as wishful thinking to believe there will be continued improvement in UConn's standings academically and athletically with a new affiliation.

You have stated a preference that UConn join the B1G on the football forum. You believe there will be an upgrade in academics and athletics. There is no guarantee that the B1G will invite UConn into AAU membership if they accept them into their sports conference. And then UConn could easily be buried in football in that conference, something they might avoid in other situations. Additionally they could end up in a significantly poorer bb conference than any of the other alternatives. This may not happen, but knowing exactly what happens is the problem.

We all believe we know the best answer for Uconn in its totality of academics and athletics. But all of our suggestions and proclamations are wishful thinking because none of us can accurately predict the future.
 

fleudslipcon

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Good points, but football continues to rule. Its all about the money.

I agree, it is all about the money. And we continue to perpetuate the problem. Money overrides all other factors relative to decision making in too many decisions imo. In many cases we have no choice. When it comes to survival, we would be hard pressed to survive without money.

But that certainly isn't the case with regards to conference realignment. The worse case scenario is that the football program at UConn goes backwards and becomes a non BCS football program. I would hate to see that happen but UConn should and would survive as an institution of higher education, which is its most important function. One of the two arguments I'm proposing is that humanity really struggles with distinguishing between survival and greed when it comes to money. And that has gotten a lot of institutions and societies into trouble in the past and present. And it most likely will occur in the future as well.
 
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Fleudslipcon,

I don't disagree with your points, especially that we don't know how this will work out. I'm not sure we'd be burried in Big 10 football either. On the basketball side, I'm not sure that I agree that the Big 10 is all that weak either. In fact, I think most commentators ranked them 2nd behind the Big East the last few years. they have gotten 7 bids many years, and Michigan State has been to the final four so often they almost have a reserved seat...6 final fours, 2 finals and 1 title since 1999.
 
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I've always wondered if the dilution of the bb programs hurt the major bb programs. If the major bb programs divorced themselves from the NCAA and formed their own version of the BCS they would have had similar negotiating powers as the football teams in the BCS conferences. But that opportunity has come and gone. So basketball makes money but football makes more because of supply and demand.

The move by Cuse and Pitt doesn't guarantee anything for them or the ACC. The first poaching by the ACC proved that. And a super strong football conference doesn't guarantee anything. The B12 proved that. There is no way of knowing if the football schools had split from the bb schools what would have happened. There is no way of knowing if the BE accepted the ESPN contract what would have happened. In the end most of us are placing logic on a situation that is as much driven by emotion.

Many fans targeted the ACC, Miami and BC for backstabbing the BE conference. And many of the same people are hoping UConn can do the same thing. So many of us hate greed, but in the end most people are looking for the most $$ and don't see the cup half full. If a conference lags behind other conferences in $$, even if the conference is doing very well, it isn't good enough. The BE was a good conference and made money. But jealousies, envy, insecurity, desire and intolerance will win out every time.

Almost every poster enjoyed seeing the failure that the additions of Miami and BC brought to the ACC. That move did not hurt the BE in football and ended up allowing the BE to leap ahead of the ACC in basketball. But some of the BE football schools were convinced that the bb only schools were to blame for the weakness with their football programs. That's the excuse they needed to bolt. But they will fail if they believe their shortcomings can be overcome by just going to a new environment.

Syracuse, and to a lesser extent Pitt, are trying to regain their glory days and are hoping the jump to the ACC will be the fix for their downward slide. But the ACC will give them nothing that the BE already provided to make up for bad coaching and bad recruiting.

I'm happy it was reported UConn had worked to maintain the BE. IMO this was the higher ground. The extra millions that JC turned down after the 2001 season, or JoePa giving back his salary to the University are anomalies in this day and age. Everybody wants the quick buck and the extra buck. And everybody justifies their entitlement to it. UConn may have no choice in seeking other conferences. But I'm not sure ending up in any new or altered conference will significantly change the outcome of its sports or academics in spite of all our protestations otherwise.
Good points. If you are a football fan you have to like it....no more useless cupcake football games on your season ticket schedule. If you are a basketball fan you have to ask yourself if leaving the best basketball conference will be an improvement. I doubt it. It is about money. Is there anyone left who thinks college athletics are amateur sports? Time to start paying these kids something.
 

tykurez

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Good post.

The dissolution of the BEast is going to be a sad sight ... but at this point it's more or less inevitable. From a basketball point of view, the BEast was just about as good as it gets. Strong teams with rich traditions, all within a nice geographical space. The players that came through the league are outstanding. MSG for the conference tournament is the prime spot.

But we're kidding ourselves if we think it's wise for UConn to stay where they are. It's unfortunate but it's now completely necessary that UConn moves on. There are too many negatives, for football and basketball, to stay where they are ... I just can't see a scenario where the teams will have long-term, continued success. It not only hurts financials, but also recruiting.

One of the other huge positives of a move to the ACC would be the implications for baseball.
 

tykurez

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Good points. If you are a football fan you have to like it....no more useless cupcake football games on your season ticket schedule. If you are a basketball fan you have to ask yourself if leaving the best basketball conference will be an improvement. I doubt it. It is about money. Is there anyone left who thinks college athletics are amateur sports? Time to start paying these kids something.

It's hard to say ... Pitt, Syracuse and UConn are arguably the cream of the BEast crop these days. Over the past few years the ACC has fallen a bit but if UConn were to join the league, there's no shame in playing in the same conference as Duke, UNC, Maryland, NC State, Wake et al. It's tough to gauge the implications of adding 3 powerhouse schools to a conference. It's a draw for recruits to want to play against those teams so it could lift the entire league.
 
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Didn't BC used to be relevant before going to the ACC? The ACC is the yellow brick road? I only see 2 decent BBall teams in that league, and 1 in football.
 

zls44

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Numbers matter.

D-I BB has 350ish teams.
FBS has 120 teams.
March Madness has 68 teams.

You will note that the less diluted the product, as listed above, the higher the ratings and Vegas action is.
 
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I just believe that by joining the ACC, the 'Cuse has watered down it's recruiting position. The "Cuse recruit nationally. They have for decades. Now they possibly are a "me too" school that competes with Duke and UNC. We'll see down the road what happens, but I'm glad that UConn is taking a more level-headed approach to this. I'm basically a half-full kinda person, and remain optimistic! It will all be unveiled soon, and I trust Susan Herbst to once again do the right thing.
 
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