Mugging Stef and the Refs

[Joe6cats]

Ctkaiser commented in another thread:

'As for Stefanie getting held, mugged and/or beaten in the post it's become a given and somehow refs don't seems to call many fouls on those defending her in the post.'

It often seems that way, but maybe I'm seeing with blue-colored glasses. Many on here watch a lot more WCBB than I do. What do Boneyard cognoscenti think of this statement?

You don't need to be a conspiracy theorist to wonder if our dominance inspires some selective inattention in many refs. Not to go too far off track, but it brings to mind a recent article in Scientific American about the unconscious mind. As ThisJustIn has pointed out, refs in WCBB are very underpaid, and people who talk about the low quality of officiating may overlook the difficulties our refs face. Are posts in general protected less against mugging than smaller players? Is it just Stef? Or is this just blue-tinted imagination?

 

[Phil]

Geno has suggested it is a posts versus perimeter players issue, rather than a Stef only issue.

 

[sarals24]

Stef gives as good as she gets.

 

[Kibitzer]

The posters here and elsewhere who cling to a referee-conspiracy theory are simply delusional.

 

[UcMiami]

I think the refs are allowing a lot of body contact in the paint - basically only calling hand/arm fouls. I see this in all games (not just Uconn) where there is frequently some displacement with the body on shots with no fouls unless there is also a arm foul involved. I am not that disappointed in this, though I think it is sometime over the line and should be called.

 

[HGN]

I do not believe that the ref's call it equally or fairly on both ends of the court where Stef is involved. Stef gets away with a lot less than most. Why that is I don't know . But it certainly seems that way.

In contrast , seemingly , you couldn't breathe on the same court with Skylar Diggins the last 3 years without being called for a foul. Why that was I don't know. Some players just always seem to get the benefit of the ref's call and some catch their wrath......... Stef seems to always float a little more to the left of their fairness.

 

[boontonbomber]

Ctkaiser commented in another thread:

'As for Stefanie getting held, mugged and/or beaten in the post it's become a given and somehow refs don't seems to call many fouls on those defending her in the post.'

It often seems that way, but maybe I'm seeing with blue-colored glasses. Many on here watch a lot more WCBB than I do. What do Boneyard cognoscenti think of this statement?

You don't need to be a conspiracy theorist to wonder if our dominance inspires some selective inattention in many refs. Not to go too far off track, but it brings to mind a recent article in Scientific American about the unconscious mind. As ThisJustIn has pointed out, refs in WCBB are very underpaid, and people who talk about the low quality of officiating may overlook the difficulties our refs face. Are posts in general protected less against mugging than smaller players? Is it just Stef? Or is this just blue-tinted imagination?

just a comment re ref's pay. one of the refs in the uconn-uc,davis game was someone i knew from years ago. in chatting with my neighbor, a very busy women's ref in D2, about her, he said she would probably have gotten $2500-$3,000 for that game, plus expenses. i was so surprised by that figure, that i failed to ask him whether it matters what teams are playing . i also have never asked him what he gets for the D2 games that he does. she has a teaching job, but he thought , given that she would be doing 45-50 games , she could get along quite nicely without the teaching job.

 

[meyers7]

The posters here and elsewhere who cling to a referee-conspiracy theory are simply delusional.

Not sure why you needed all the extra words.

 

[Kibitzer]

Not sure why you needed all the extra words.

I see what you mean. Thanks.

Snow is cold and sloppy and heavy and slippery and useful only to skiers, weather forecasters and guys who drive trucks with plows on overtime at the DOT. (John Altavilla)

 

[ThisJustIn]

just a comment re ref's pay. one of the refs in the uconn-uc,davis game was someone i knew from years ago. in chatting with my neighbor, a very busy women's ref in D2, about her, he said she would probably have gotten $2500-$3,000 for that game, plus expenses. i was so surprised by that figure, that i failed to ask him whether it matters what teams are playing . i also have never asked him what he gets for the D2 games that he does. she has a teaching job, but he thought , given that she would be doing 45-50 games , she could get along quite nicely without the teaching job.

IF after 10-12 years of working your way up through the ranks getting25-$100 a game at the high school level, no gas (and getting off your regular work to get there), to DIII (@50-500, limited gas) etc. etc. to where you DO get the "big bucks" at the TOP conferences ('cause they're the ones who pay'em -- and it depends on what the conference budgets) THEN you might be able to get along quite nicely with, after paying your workers comp insurance, health insurance and independent contractor taxes. It's the journey UP, not the being there, that is the issue. Again, referring to old, and yet somewhat still relevant articles:

MAKING THE CALLS: The World of Referees

COACHES AND OFFICIALS: Reaching Across the Divide– A look at the relationship between officials and coaches and the impact on recruiting efforts

EARNING THEIR STRIPES: Officials in Training

OFFICIATING UNDER REVIEW: Coaches, Conferences and the NCAA Working to Collaborate

 

[easttexastrash]

It is what it is...you have to adjust to what the officials are calling, right? The refs never impact the result of a game. It all evens out over hte course of the game.

 

[Zorro]

So much of it is in the eye of the beholder. e.g., I just happened to check out Volnation after the LSU game, and in the game thread several LV fans were screaming about getting jobbed by the refs, at a point in the game where LSU had had, I believe, 8 or 9 more fouls called against them than had UT. And they were dead serious. Actually, some of us, sometimes, do the same thing. A lot of us were convinced that D was generally treated unjustly by the refs; some other teams' fans were equally convinced that she got away with murder. Very hard to see things objectively.

 

[Kibitzer]

So much of it is in the eye of the beholder. Very hard to see things objectively.

We fair-minded and objective UConn fans are alternately amused or annoyed by the silly bias and perpetual whining about refs, expecially those from ND and Tennessee. Sometimes, Duke.

 

[Adesmar123]

Mugging Stef and the Refs

Great new Indie group...I have tickets to see them at Infinity Hall in March

 

[JoePgh]

Stef gives as good as she gets.

NO KIDDING!! My impression is that Stef is one of the more physical players in WCBB, and that she could legitimately be called for about twice as many fouls as are actually called on her. Any opposing center is going to have bruises by the end of the game. A routine part of her game is to use her substantial body mass to displace her defender or KML's defender on a perimeter screen, which works solely because she is bigger and beefier than 95% of her opponents.

There is nothing wrong with this, unless someone decides to enforce the "no displacement" rule rigorously and uniformly. As long as the game is being called as it is, she is smart to play that way and Geno and CD are smart to coach her that way.

As far as I can tell, the actual rules that are applied in the paint by officials (as opposed to what the rulebook says) are that pushing and shoving your opponent with your torso is OK as long as you don't use your hands or elbows, and as long as neither player has the ball. Once the offensive post player has the ball, then the official rules are actually enforced, and neither the offensive player nor the defender can displace the other. If that is a consistent approach (and it appears to be), then it's fine -- just as it's fine to consistently refuse to enforce the palming rule. It does give an advantage to post players with bulk, helping the Stefs of the world and disadvantaging the Stewies. I guess the theory is that thin, quick, agile players can get around bulky defenders by using their athletic skills. But I'm not sure how those thin / quick / agile players are supposed to defend against bulky offensive players if they can be pushed into oblivion before the bulky post receives the ball.

 

[Icebear]

Yes, she is physical but there are ways of being physical within the rules and those which are clearly outside the rules and need to be called. You rarely see Stef hammer people during a shot the way she gets hacked and hammered all the time.