Little good news...SEC looking to possibly add Clemson and UNC

[Rufus]

Another point on the ACC Championship Game - it aired at the exact same time as the B1G Championship Game. The B1G Championship Game ended up being the most watched conference championship game with 18.3 million viewers. The ACC Championoship Game had 3.8 million viewers.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Another point on the ACC Championship Game - it aired at the exact same time as the B1G Championship Game. The B1G Championship Game ended up being the most watched conference championship game with 18.3 million viewers. The ACC Championoship Game had 3.8 million viewers.

You are so awesome. I now fully appreciate the Big 10's greatness, and I appreciate your greatness for sharing it with us.

 

[Rufus]

You are so awesome. I now fully appreciate the Big 10's greatness, and I appreciate your greatness for sharing it with us.

And I appreciate all your silly predictions that will never come true. Tell me that part about how the best B1G and SEC schools will leave behind the rest and how Indiana will be a have not again. 🤣

 

[freescooter]

Or they end up like Maryland and Rutgers. Just another East Coast mediocre college football team.

That is the more likely scenario I think. And probably why the BIG 20 will move very carefully too. NFL players from the state, growing population are all interesting but bring not very much value. It’s not like Alabama or Ohio State can’t recruit kids from North Carolina if they want to and it’s not like UNC hasn’t tried this “we’re going to be a football power” thing before. Several times actually, with modest success at best. Last time in around 2010 they added a bunch of seats to their stadium. Hired a big name coach. Won zero ACC titles. Brought back the Big Nsme coach after he did win, at Texas, and won exactly zero ACC titles. Brought in another Big Name coach. Won as many ACC games as UConn and were not in the league! So far looking like more of the same. If you are the BIG or SEC why would you want to bring in another Rutgers or Mississippi State? Access to North Carolina brings you what, exactly? Not sure you know this but they have cable in North Carolina now so you can watch games from everywhere.

Whenever I read that X is going to the SEC or Big 10 I ask why would those leagues want them ? The answers rarely make sense.

 

[Rdkid]

That is the more likely scenario I think. And probably why the BIG 20 will move very carefully too. NFL players from the state, growing population are all interesting but bring not very much value. It’s not like Alabama or Ohio State can’t recruit kids from North Carolina if they want to and it’s not like UNC hasn’t tried this “we’re going to be a football power” thing before. Several times actually, with modest success at best. Last time in around 2010 they added a bunch of seats to their stadium. Hired a big name coach. Won zero ACC titles. Brought back the Big Nsme coach after he did win, at Texas, and won exactly zero ACC titles. Brought in another Big Name coach. Won as many ACC games as UConn and were not in the league! So far looking like more of the same. If you are the BIG or SEC why would you want to bring in another Rutgers or Mississippi State? Access to North Carolina brings you what, exactly? Not sure you know this but they have cable in North Carolina now so you can watch games from everywhere.

Whenever I read that X is going to the SEC or Big 10 I ask why would those leagues want them ? The answers rarely make sense.

Comparing Rutgers and MSU to UNC as athletic entities - and comparing NJ and Miss to N.C. as growth and football growth states is a silly comparison. Number of NFL players is an imperfect metric, but it indicates N.C. is a football state. If it gets twice the money as its in-state competitors by getting an invite to a football dominant conference, it will get good. Maybe Indiana good, maybe just better than historically.
All the chatter about UNC to the P2 is real despite your willful denial.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Comparing Rutgers and MSU to UNC as athletic entities - and comparing NJ and Miss to N.C. as growth and football growth states is a silly comparison. Number of NFL players is an imperfect metric, but it indicates N.C. is a football state. If it gets twice the money as its in-state competitors by getting an invite to a football dominant conference, it will get good. Maybe Indiana good, maybe just better than historically.
All the chatter about UNC to the P2 is real despite your willful denial.

Where does the “twice the money” come from? Conferences are done making new members into full partners.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

And I appreciate all your silly predictions that will never come true. Tell me that part about how the best B1G and SEC schools will leave behind the rest and how Indiana will be a have not again. 🤣

Thank you for confirming that you are here to troll UConn fans about how UConn is going to wither and die as an athletic program.

Fun fact: everyone here had figured that out already.

 

[ZooCougar]

And I appreciate all your silly predictions that will never come true. Tell me that part about how the best B1G and SEC schools will leave behind the rest and how Indiana will be a have not again. 🤣

That could still happen.

Also, why are you even here? Isn’t there place for fans of mediocre Big 10 schools?

 

[Rufus]

Thank you for confirming that you are here to troll UConn fans about how UConn is going to wither and die as an athletic program.

Fun fact: everyone here had figured that out already.

Tell me where I said UConn would wither and die.

That could still happen.

Also, why are you even here? Isn’t there place for fans of mediocre Big 10 schools?

I'm not a fan of Indiana. At least in the sense you are thinking of. I think most of America, including myself, wanted them to win the CFP. But I'm not a longstanding fan or anything.

 

[Rdkid]

Where does the “twice the money” come from? Conferences are done making new members into full partners.

UNC will get a full share wherever they go. I’ll be glad to revisit this exchange when the time comes. The SEC won’t beggar their partners - they are smart that way. ESPN knows that market/brand’s value. And the B10 knows they won’t get them on the cheap with the SEC in play.

 

[bendm]

While I don't believe a thing this guy says, it is an interesting thought. UNC is pretty obvious, but I'd be surprised by Clemson over UVA or VT.

UVA or VT?? How about Miami?

 

[bendm]

Clemson shares a market with South Carolina, and when they aren't a consistent 10-win team, they are not a TV draw; they don't really add anything to the SEC unless they need a team just to even out the numbers. Their best shot to the P2 is as secondary target to even out the numbers; but a few more mediocre years may cause them to get left behind.

Markets don’t matter anymore and the sec has never cared about them. The biggest tv markets in the sec are Nashville and Austin. it’s about national viewership/brand and Clemson was third in the ACC even in a down year.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Markets may have a far smaller impact than they once did, but that doesn't make redundancy in a market insignificant. I see one major motivation when the SEC expands again, which is establishing a presence in the two southern states they are not currently in (Virginia, North Carolina).

I can also see them somewhere down the road (maybe in a decade) adding Arizona & ASU.

 

[WrenchFan69]

UVA or VT?? How about Miami?

Miami doesn't have any fans

 

[CL82]

Markets may have a far smaller impact than they once did, but that doesn't make redundancy in a market insignificant. I see one major motivation when the SEC expands again, which is establishing a presence in the two southern states they are not currently in (Virginia, North Carolina).

I can also see them somewhere down the road (maybe in a decade) adding Arizona & ASU.

Agree regarding Virginia and North Carolina, but I'm not sure about Arizona and ASU. What's your thinking there?

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Agree regarding Virginia and North Carolina, but I'm not sure about Arizona and ASU. What's your thinking there?

While it will take quite a while, and happen in multiple steps, I believe the ultimate goal for both the B1G & SEC is 24 members, four divisions with six members.

Arizona has grown tremendously and is expected to continue its growth. That appears to be the best location for a western branch and both schools could be significant enough to warrant addition to the SEC.

 

[bendm]

Miami doesn't have any fans

And UVA does lol. Miami was third in attendance this year after FSU and Clemson so someone is going to their games. More importantly they are a national brand and have been for decades. They almost won the CFP for crying out loud. No one has ever given a whiff about UVA. This board has the weirdest respect for the Cavs and 99% of its due to their academics. The athletic ranked them as like the 4th or 5th least valuable ACC football program. The BIG will take Duke before UVA.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Markets don’t matter anymore and the sec has never cared about them. The biggest tv markets in the sec are Nashville and Austin. it’s about national viewership/brand and Clemson was third in the ACC even in a down year.

The SEC built its brand on football dominance that was based on rampant cheating. Having the best teams enabled it to drive premium pricing on cable TV in an era where there were limited channels widely available and networks wanted games that would attract the most casual viewers.

In streaming, fans want to watch their teams, and most fans have no idea what channel they are watching. Teams with large followings that can afford subscriptions become the most valuable, and the SEC is a mixed bag here. Florida, Texas, A&M, Oklahoma, Alabama, LSU, Kentucky in hoops, and a few others have large followings, but many of the fanbases are not wealthy, and the corporate support is a mixed bag too. A lot of the SEC is just along for the ride. Between NIL and House, the costs of running major programs have skyrocketed, and $25,000 of cash in a paper bag doesn't make a team a player in recruiting like it did 20 years ago when the SEC was dominating recruiting. It will be interesting to see how long the poorer states can hang in this world.

Before anyone says "but the TV contract", those TV contracts pre-date House. Now the SEC schools have to come up with tens of millions of costs when every nickel of revenue is already spoken for. The Big 10, which 10 years ago was in decline due to weakening local recruiting and aging and shrinking populations, is roaring back because it has huge local corporate and alumni and non-alumni support in wealthier states than in the south, and added Los Angeles, Portland and Seattle. In a world where all that matters is money, the Big 10 is really well positioned. It doesn't appear that all the Big 10 programs want to compete at the highest level, but an Illinois, Penn State, USC, UCLA, Oregon or Washington has can really go to war for recruits if they want to. Rutgers has every possible advantage (wealthy state, fanbase beyond just alumni, proximity to NYC) but they are Rutgers which supersedes all other factors. The Big 10 may no longer be the Big 2 and everyone else.

Clemson and FSU are still players in the ACC, but Virginia and UNC have a lot more natural advantages than Clemson and FSU. The ACC has some urban schools (Louisville, Pitt, SMU, Georgia Tech, Miami) that should be strong because they have access to corporate support and a fan base beyond just the alumni. Pitt and SMU also have wealthy alumni and big endowments. I will hold off judgment on Cal and Stanford because I am unclear if they are long-term for the ACC. Ironically, it appears some of the longer term members, like Virginia Tech and NC State, are simply on the wrong side of history. BCU and Syracuse do not appear to be trying.

UConn needs something to shake loose on the macro level, a big shakeup. Right now, none of the conferences need us, and therefore none of them want us.

 

[uconnyankee]

While it will take quite a while, and happen in multiple steps, I believe the ultimate goal for both the B1G & SEC is 24 members, four divisions with six members.

Arizona has grown tremendously and is expected to continue its growth. That appears to be the best location for a western branch and both schools could be significant enough to warrant addition to the SEC.

The one thing about SEC, they’ve pretty much kept it to southeast. I think they go further east before hitting AZ.

 

[uconnyankee]

The SEC built its brand on football dominance that was based on rampant cheating. Having the best teams enabled it to drive premium pricing on cable TV in an era where there were limited channels widely available and networks wanted games that would attract the most casual viewers.

In streaming, fans want to watch their teams, and most fans have no idea what channel they are watching. Teams with large followings that can afford subscriptions become the most valuable, and the SEC is a mixed bag here. Florida, Texas, A&M, Oklahoma, Alabama, LSU, Kentucky in hoops, and a few others have large followings, but many of the fanbases are not wealthy, and the corporate support is a mixed bag too. A lot of the SEC is just along for the ride. Between NIL and House, the costs of running major programs have skyrocketed, and $25,000 of cash in a paper bag doesn't make a team a player in recruiting like it did 20 years ago when the SEC was dominating recruiting. It will be interesting to see how long the poorer states can hang in this world.

Before anyone says "but the TV contract", those TV contracts pre-date House. Now the SEC schools have to come up with tens of millions of costs when every nickel of revenue is already spoken for. The Big 10, which 10 years ago was in decline due to weakening local recruiting and aging and shrinking populations, is roaring back because it has huge local corporate and alumni and non-alumni support in wealthier states than in the south, and added Los Angeles, Portland and Seattle. In a world where all that matters is money, the Big 10 is really well positioned. It doesn't appear that all the Big 10 programs want to compete at the highest level, but an Illinois, Penn State, USC, UCLA, Oregon or Washington has can really go to war for recruits if they want to. Rutgers has every possible advantage (wealthy state, fanbase beyond just alumni, proximity to NYC) but they are Rutgers which supersedes all other factors. The Big 10 may no longer be the Big 2 and everyone else.

Clemson and FSU are still players in the ACC, but Virginia and UNC have a lot more natural advantages than Clemson and FSU. The ACC has some urban schools (Louisville, Pitt, SMU, Georgia Tech, Miami) that should be strong because they have access to corporate support and a fan base beyond just the alumni. Pitt and SMU also have wealthy alumni and big endowments. I will hold off judgment on Cal and Stanford because I am unclear if they are long-term for the ACC. Ironically, it appears some of the longer term members, like Virginia Tech and NC State, are simply on the wrong side of history. BCU and Syracuse do not appear to be trying.

UConn needs something to shake loose on the macro level, a big shakeup. Right now, none of the conferences need us, and therefore none of them want us.

I don’t disagree with this.
I think the consensus is 2030 with expiring media deals, something is going to shake loose. What that is and how that affects UConn is wide open for debate.

I am hopeful ACC loses 2 or 4. That’s isn’t the death blow everyone expects. At that point, would media partners go all in creating clear #3 conference. And which platform is better: ACC or Big12?
That to me is the real battle.

If everything aligns, UConn is part of that equation, and in the ‘better’ platform.

 

[Ha Who]

I don’t disagree with this.
I think the consensus is 2030 with expiring media deals, something is going to shake loose. What that is and how that affects UConn is wide open for debate.

I am hopeful ACC loses 2 or 4. That’s isn’t the death blow everyone expects. At that point, would media partners go all in creating clear #3 conference. And which platform is better: ACC or Big12?
That to me is the real battle.

If everything aligns, UConn is part of that equation, and in the ‘better’ platform.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

The one thing about SEC, they’ve pretty much kept it to southeast. I think they go further east before hitting AZ.

I'm convinced that their next expansion will be into Virginia and North Carolina. After that, there really isn't much more they can do going east (unless Bermuda develops a school that becomes a large athletic brand).

Texas, Oklahoma, Missouri and even Arkansas from three and a half decades ago were all western moves.

This isn't going to happen overnight but the first set of additions should happen in half a dozen years, give or take a little, then eight, ten, twelve years later they'll add a couple more.

 

[CL82]

I'm convinced that their next expansion will be into Virginia and North Carolina. After that, there really isn't much more they can do going east (unless Bermuda develops a school that becomes a large athletic brand).

For the record, Storrs is east of Virginia, North Carolina any existing SEC school.

I'm just saying.

 

[Hoophound]

For the record, Storrs is east of Virginia, North Carolina any existing SEC school.

I'm just saying.

Chief00 called it years ago. Some random day, when we least expect it, it will be announced that UConn is joining the SEC.

 

[Hoophound]

Some people may think it’s funny but I actually think UConn to the SEC might be genius. If UConn were playing in and busting skulls in the SEC, the whole Northeast might jump on board. I’m sitting in Florida, but as a Northeastern guy, I pull for Penn St in the B1G. It just makes sense for me. They are most like us.

I don’t count Rutgers. They suck.

 

[JwittersPAC]

And UVA does lol. Miami was third in attendance this year after FSU and Clemson so someone is going to their games. More importantly they are a national brand and have been for decades. They almost won the CFP for crying out loud. No one has ever given a whiff about UVA. This board has the weirdest respect for the Cavs and 99% of its due to their academics. The athletic ranked them as like the 4th or 5th least valuable ACC football program. The BIG will take Duke before UVA.

Anybody who watched the ACC championship game saw how little following both UVA and Duke have in football. The announced attendance was less than 42,000. By far lowest attendance for any P4 football championship game.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

Anybody who watched the ACC championship game saw how little following both UVA and Duke have in football. The announced attendance was less than 42,000. By far lowest attendance for any P4 football championship game.

Pretty embarrassing, right? For a game of that magnitude (and given what each school has on the line right now in terms of trying to look good for the B1G/SEC) each team should've had at least 30k there. I know UConn would have. Duke's campus to Charlotte is 144 miles and Virginia's is 272 miles. I realize not all in attendance would be coming from campus, but both drivable. No excuses.

 

[CL82]

This could help get UConn to the ACC. Fingers crossed

 

[Rufus]

Anybody who watched the ACC championship game saw how little following both UVA and Duke have in football. The announced attendance was less than 42,000. By far lowest attendance for any P4 football championship game.

TV ratings were pathetic too.

 

[Hoophound]

Yeah, the ACC just has no juice anymore. No one wants to be there, including the fans. You basically have a few football teams and a few basketball teams that bring some excitement and the rest is dead right now.

Franklin being at Virginia Tech could really help the conference have a renaissance. If FSU, Clemson, Miami and VTech could all get it together, it would help dramatically. It would go from awful to excellent real quick.