Lesson Learned From Providence Game

[BlueMAB]

Thanks. Didn’t help one bit. I have no idea what PTP’er means.

Dick Vitale, not to be confused with Christian Vital. Is an announcer for NCAA basketball games on ESPN. He often calls players "PTPers" (Prime Time Players).

It's a compliment.

 

[Tenspro2002]

It would be really interesting to compare what's being said about Larrier now to what was said in the threads after we lost out on him back in HS.

What's more relevant is what was said after we got him as a transfer.

His rate stats at VCU were awful, but people overlooked that and chalked it up to youth and a quirky system under Shaka, claimed that we just landed a stud top 40 recruit (a lot of these same people still viewed Purvis as a Top 20 recruit, despite disappointing at NC State).

The most recent data is the most relevant, and it's apparent so far that many on this board over-hyped Larrier badly. That said, the season hasn't officially started and he still has a chance to rise to that level over the next few months. I'm doubtful, but hope it can be done.

 

[temery]

Dick Vitale, not to be confused with Christian Vital. Is an announcer for NCAA basketball games on ESPN. He often calls players "PTPers" (Prime Time Players).

It's a compliment.

Oh. Thanks. Eventually I settled in on Part Time Player, but yours makes more sense. I guess.

 

[Stainmaster]

What's more relevant is what was said after we got him as a transfer.

His rate stats at VCU were awful, but people overlooked that and chalked it up to youth and a quirky system under Shaka, claimed that we just landed a stud top 40 recruit (a lot of these same people still viewed Purvis as a Top 20 recruit, despite disappointing at NC State).

The most recent data is the most relevant, and it's apparent so far that many on this board over-hyped Larrier badly. That said, the season hasn't officially started and he still has a chance to rise to that level over the next few months. I'm doubtful, but hope it can be done.

Why is that the narrative surrounding Larrier, but people (yourself included) still tout Prince Ali as a huge miss on Ollie's part despite his stats being far worse than both Purvis and Larrier's?

 

[BlueMAB]

Grad transfers like Anderson should be viewed differently. 1) they're coming in with more experience. 2) they've graduated, they've shown they can handle the academics. 3) you know they can play immediately and you have them for one year as a stop gap.

Kromah helped us win a championship. Shonn Miller was very good for us. Anderson will play a role and play important minutes.

Pervis and Larrier were both very close to committing to UConn before going to NC State and VCU.

IIRC, the JUCOs were taken when we had recruiting misses and needed to fill scholarships for some depth.

It's not like Ollie is out there actively recruiting the JUCO ranks, and banking on transfers to fill our the core of the team.

I don't want to disrespect our guys, but this roster isn't made up of all of Ollie's first choices. I'm not excusing Ollie or the results, but this is one game. Let's see where we are in March. Ollie is accountable, but this roster wasn't built by design, it was patched together by necessity.

 

[80shusky]

Disappointing but again an exhibition and a good chance for the team to play a decent team early.

• I do not like Larrier and Gilbert on the floor at the same time. It shouldn't matter but there is something about it that doesn't work.
• Larrier shoots too much.
• We need more paint touches. UConn should be going inside more. A lot of dribbling around and jacking up shots rather than working the ball in and out.
• Just like Christopher Walken needs more cowbell, UConn needs more Vital.
• I like Carlton. He looks like he could develop into a good player.
• I like Polley. He looks like he could develop into a good player.
• MAL looked good and he has size. He needs a haircut.
• Anderson looked like our fourth guard, which he is.
• I didn't see Onuorah. Did he play?
• Anybody still think Larrier is a four?
• Not enough passing for baskets. Haven't seen a box score but I'm guessing we didn't have many assists.

 

[Towney007]

Transfers no matter how touted never seem to be our A listers.

Transfers are almost *never* A-listers. Most of them are barely B and C listers....

Transfers transfer because

-Not enough playing time
-Grades
-Being a dingus
-Disappointments
-Something that's bad that's not on the surface

You can get one-tool, job-site kind of guys through the transfer wire. You can get a dude who can rebound. You can get a guy to be the 8th guy off the bench who can handle the ball a little bit. Those guys you can find. 1 in 10, you'll get a guy who can start and contribute at a high level. Most of the time, they're transfers because they're not very good college athletes for whatever reason.

 

[Horatio]

Transfers are almost *never* A-listers.

Transfers transfer because

-Not enough playing time
-Grades
-Being a dingus
-Disappointments
-Something that's bad that's not on the surface

You can get one-tool, job-site kind of guys through the transfer wire. You can get a dude who can rebound. You can get a guy to be the 8th guy off the bench who can handle the ball a little bit. Those guys you can find. 1 in 10, you'll get a guy who can start and contribute at a high level. Most of the time, they're transfers because they're not very good college athletes for whatever reason.

Transfers and Juco kids should be supplemental players at Uconn. That changed with recruiting difficulties

 

[Towney007]

Transfers and Juco kids should be supplemental players at Uconn. That changed with recruiting difficulties

It's hard to recruit well when you're in a bad conference and your team stinks. This is true.

 

[jibsey]

It's hard to recruit well when you're in a bad conference and your team stinks. This is true.

I agree with you here, KO is landing the best quality he can so I don’t fault him there. He had MAL who is good quality but it didnt hold. What concerns me is the raggedy offense that seems frantic and ends up with players playing 1 on 1 street ball, while watching PC run set plays resulting in easy baskets. Is this teaching or execution? Remember teams like Harvard who ran back door cuts for easy layups? Their personnel was not better than ours now so KO needs to up his game. Unfortunately our OOC is front loaded as always so they better get moving.

 

[scotty0330]

I agree with you here, KO is landing the best quality he can so I don’t fault him there. He had MAL who is good quality but it didnt hold. What concerns me is the raggedy offense that seems frantic and ends up with players playing 1 on 1 street ball, while watching PC run set plays resulting in easy baskets. Is this teaching or execution? Remember teams like Harvard who ran back door cuts for easy layups? Their personnel was not better than ours now so KO needs to up his game. Unfortunately our OOC is front loaded as always so they better get moving.

It’s teaching or lack thereof. Too many seasons with different players to think it’s poor execution. And if it is continually poor execution that goes back to crappy teaching. Either way the buck stops with the multi million dollar a year coach.

 

[WrenchFan69]

Things I learned tonight:
Mohegan's arena is pretty nice
PC's dance team is very talented in every sense
Anderson, Gilbert, and Vital all have the talent to be elite defenders
Eric Cobb does a hilarious Al Horford impersonation

 

[BlueMAB]

It's not "1 on 1 streetball". It's a pro style offense which is a lot of pick and roll and iso. That's what Ollie knows/prefers. He does occasionally run offensive sets, but he seems to prefer to let his players create. It wll be ugly, and will take time to develop, but if Adams, Gilbert, and Vital make up their minds to relentlessly attack the rim, guys will get more layups/oops and open shots. Larrier has to let the game come to him, or stop settling for jump shots. If he takes 14 shots a game, 10 of them need to be in the paint.

Polley was impressive, I'd start giving more of Larrier's minutes to him.

 

[Towney007]

I agree with you here, KO is landing the best quality he can so I don’t fault him there. He had MAL who is good quality but it didnt hold. What concerns me is the raggedy offense that seems frantic and ends up with players playing 1 on 1 street ball, while watching PC run set plays resulting in easy baskets. Is this teaching or execution? Remember teams like Harvard who ran back door cuts for easy layups? Their personnel was not better than ours now so KO needs to up his game. Unfortunately our OOC is front loaded as always so they better get moving.

He hit on Adams. Hit on Hamilton. Purvis was fine. I like Vital. Couple of perfectly decent to good transfers in Gibbs and Miller who were fun. But literally almost every other guy has been a dumpster fire, left Uconn or grossly underperformed expectations. I'm not sure he has the best eye for talent. The locker room basically mutinied on him last year. The school's still chasing football money and with that program being a half-tick up from barely conscious, the conference situation isn't changing. Kids aren't dumb - they see that.

The whole thing is basically snowballing in front of everyone. I literally can't believe I'm like this after losing a pre-season game of all things, but I can't ever remember seeing a UConn team to obviously un-ready to play basketball... ever. And I just think it starts at the top. It's too much of the same thing. It's running pro-sets with players who just aren't good enough to run that style of an offense. It's a general lack of intensity. It's good players plateau-ing. The one or two obviously talented kids on the team are really good players and make waves nationally, but they're not developed as much as they could be - so you don't see guys like Allen, Hamilton, Butler, etc anymore.

I love the guy, but i'm tired of defending him.I don't think he's really that great of a college basketball coach. I could totally see him being great in the NBA, but this is just... it's not good.

 

[Travelman6]

I do not think anything can be taken from this game. It is an exhibition folks! Players are playing half assed (think of it like an all star game in the NBA), coaches are tinkering with line ups, defenses and offenses, teams are gelling and getting used to the new comers while filling the holes after departures, etc.

 

[temery]

I do not think anything can be taken from this game. It is an exhibition folks! Players are playing half assed (think of it like an all star game in the NBA), coaches are tinkering with line ups, defenses and offenses, teams are gelling and getting used to the new comers while filling the holes after departures, etc.

I like your attitude, but apparently PC showed up willing to play whole assed.

 

[Travelman6]

I like your attitude, but apparently PC showed up willing to play whole assed.

I just remain hopeful the team I grew up loving in the early 90s will return to prominence, like in those days.

 

[Stainmaster]

I just remain hopeful the team I grew up loving in the early 90s will return to prominence, like in those days.

The team you loved in the early 90s played in the best basketball conference in the country and employed the greatest basketball coach in the history of the sport. Do you think it's likely either of those things are true of this program ever again?

 

[selles]

Transfers are almost *never* A-listers. Most of them are barely B and C listers....

Transfers transfer because

-Not enough playing time
-Grades
-Being a dingus
-Disappointments
-Something that's bad that's not on the surface

You can get one-tool, job-site kind of guys through the transfer wire. You can get a dude who can rebound. You can get a guy to be the 8th guy off the bench who can handle the ball a little bit. Those guys you can find. 1 in 10, you'll get a guy who can start and contribute at a high level. Most of the time, they're transfers because they're not very good college athletes for whatever reason.

This is archaic thinking and not applicable to today's college basketball world, where approximately 8 million kids transfer every year. Also Larrier transferred because the coach left, not for any of the reasons you listed.

The kid basically hasn't played in two years and is coming off a major knee injury so this thread off an exhibition game that was scheduled a week ago is...premature. To put it kindly. And I say that as a guy who thinks Vital ought to be out there 35 minutes a game.

We need to give Terry a fair chance before we pan him.

 

[Stainmaster]

This is archaic thinking and not applicable to today's college basketball world, where approximately 8 million kids transfer every year. Also Larrier transferred because the coach left, not for any of the reasons you listed.

The kid basically hasn't played in two years and is coming off a major knee injury so this thread off an exhibition game that was scheduled a week ago is...premature. To put it kindly. And I say that as a guy who thinks Vital ought to be out there 35 minutes a game.

We need to give Terry a fair chance before we pan him.

Was gonna say, there are dozens of counterexamples of transfers who have been great players on ranked teams, teams that have made deep tourney runs, and even in the NBA.

Additionally, inferring that Larrier and Anderson are risks to team chemistry after this one exhibition game is foolish. Not grounded in reality at all.

 

[Towney007]

This is archaic thinking and not applicable to today's college basketball world, where approximately 8 million kids transfer every year. Also Larrier transferred because the coach left, not for any of the reasons you listed.

The kid basically hasn't played in two years and is coming off a major knee injury so this thread off an exhibition game that was scheduled a week ago is...premature. To put it kindly. And I say that as a guy who thinks Vital ought to be out there 35 minutes a game.

We need to give Terry a fair chance before we pan him.

I never mentioned Larrier, so I'm not sure what that's about, but it's not archaic thinking at all. Lots of kids transfer in other sports, too.

Occasionally you can find something good. Most of the time, you don't. A few have perfectly reasonable reasons for wanting to transfer. Mostly it's because they're not valued at their current program for whatever reason. A few here and there are correct - they're undervalued. Most of the time, they're just not that good. Just because everyone's doing it doesn't make it good and just because everyone's doing it doesn't mean UConn does it well and just because everyone's doing it means its a viable way to build a powerhouse.

So there's more of it - but the reasons behind it haven't changed much. The results haven't either.

But if we want to talk about Larrier -he's played a whopping sixteen minutes of basketball for UConn in two years or whatever. Regardless of whether that's *his fault* or not - he's not playing basketball. Until he succeeds, it's hard to call it a success. If you're not playing basketball, you're not helping a basketball team.

 

[selles]

I never mentioned Larrier, so I'm not sure what that's about, but it's not archaic thinking at all. Lots of kids transfer in other sports, too.

Occasionally you can find something good. Most of the time, you don't. A few have perfectly reasonable reasons for wanting to transfer. Mostly it's because they're not valued at their current program for whatever reason. A few here and there are correct - they're undervalued. Most of the time, they're just not that good. Just because everyone's doing it doesn't make it good and just because everyone's doing it doesn't mean UConn does it well and just because everyone's doing it means its a viable way to build a powerhouse.

So there's more of it - but the reasons behind it haven't changed much. The results haven't either.

But if we want to talk about Larrier -he's played a whopping sixteen minutes of basketball for UConn in two years or whatever. Regardless of whether that's *his fault* or not - he's not playing basketball. Until he succeeds, it's hard to call it a success. If you're not playing basketball, you're not helping a basketball team.

Sid Wilson pretty much refutes your point, and in my opinion Sid Wilson is a good example of the new mindset of college players. It's a different world now, kids view their commitments differently, and we'd be fools not to try to understand that and take advantage.

As for Larrier, the fact he busted his knee 3 games into last season is hardly a function of his transfer status. Of course you're correct that "until he succeeds, it's hard to call it a success". But it's equally true that until he has had a chance to succeed and fails, it's hard to call it a failure.

 

[CL82]

We need to give Terry a fair chance before we pan him.

Okay but is it fair to say he's on the clock?

 

[jibsey]

Larrier will be productive, but KO has to rein him in on shot selection. He can’t just jack it up. He’s easily 12 points a game on this team and some nights 18.

 

[InKembaITrust]

Is there any possible way a replay of this game?? Missed it due to work and really want to see how the players looked for the first game...