Last Rodeo for Kyla Irwin

[Bonpland]

I have not seen much of this young lady. Why is she ranked so low if she is that good. And yes I know they get it wrong at times.

But also what type of competition does she face in highschool.

I was at a combine with my oldest daughter some years ago and a top NCAA softball coach said "The clearest way to make a mistake about a recruit was to look at her statistics. Hitting homeruns against weak pitching means little."

She went on to say that a second string shortstop from San Diego (where they play 12 months a year in warm weather) is often a better choice than an all-star from a cold weather state. In other words who you're playing matters.

But here is where it gets interesting from a recruiting point of view. While other coaches may have seen Stef as a serviceable part of a frontcourt rotation, Geno and CD were able to mold her into an AA and two time National Champion.

Like you I don't know much about Kyla, but I'm hoping that what Geno saw in her that encouraged him to offer her a scholarship was some of the same stuff he saw in Dolson.

And about the rankings, the more educated members of the Board could probably provide us with a list of several former top ten prospects whose college careers have not gone the way that some thought that they would. (Tennessee has at least two on their roster right now.)

 

[malevocalist#]

I was at a combine with my oldest daughter some years ago and a top NCAA softball coach said "The clearest way to make a mistake about a recruit was to look at her statistics. Hitting homeruns against weak pitching means little."

She went on to say that a second string shortstop from San Diego (where they play 12 months a year in warm weather) is often a better choice than an all-star from a cold weather state. In other words who you're playing matters.

But here is where it gets interesting from a recruiting point of view. While other coaches may have seen Stef as a serviceable part of a frontcourt rotation, Geno and CD were able to mold her into an AA and two time National Champion.

Like you I don't know much about Kyla, but I'm hoping that what Geno saw in her that encouraged him to offer her a scholarship was some of the same stuff he saw in Dolson.

And about the rankings, the more educated members of the Board could probably provide us with a list of several former top ten prospects whose college careers have not gone the way that some thought that they would. (Tennessee has at least two on their roster right now.)

I understand where your coming from and I agree.

As a player who played the game statistics is good when consistently supported by raw talent. And especially when that talent is tested against better overall talented players regularly.

I also know athelets can be groom into better players. I have witness this fact over and over again at Uconn and abroad. I was that person.

When I see a kid play I look for potential and talent. Not stats, but the overall skills and determination.

Regarding Irwin...I dont know nothing about this kid. No I cannot judge her by rankings alone. Look at Russell for Tenn.

I would love to see her though and not just on film playing against midiocre talent. What I won't do ( like many) "who watched her play against week competition" is rave about how good she is until she is tested.

Do I beloved there is a strong possibility she can be groomed by Geno to be better than what she is now? You better believe I do. Geno measures the skill set, the guts, character and the heart of the player and also talent. He has been wrong sometimes as well. Not much.

To tell the truth. I've already assumed she just may be underated. Time will tell. I wished the best for all the recruits.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

It never ceases to amaze me that fans on this board, never even having seen a recruit scrimmage, will purport to judge their ultimate utility to the Huskies, no matter how many times they have been proven wrong. It certainly isn't the strongest attribute of a fan.

 

[magic]

I don't think next year is going to be a shock is my point. Players get better year-over-year. Two years Stokes was on the bench and she was vital her junior year and came up big in some games in her senior year.

I don't know though if we are "arguing . . " Are we? This team is potentially and plays many times like an all-time great team. A player like Chong and Ekmark are behind "greater" players. As is Collier- but Collier not quite as much but Gabby's ablity to defend guards like Courtney from USF sure makes it hard to not have her on the court at pf. And KLS is superior as wing and you have Stewie and Tuck adept anywhere.

So why would you play lesser players more minutes when it probably doesn't make your team better? Unless you feel a 10 player rotation is superior to a 7 man rotation type of thing? That would be in contrast to what Geno believes though I think eh said 7/8 I ideal. Collier is part of 7 man rotation but sort of last resort. Though again whose minutes do you want to drop from Stewie, Tuck, KLS and GW to get Collier more minutes? She is NOT as good as them right now. The others tremendous for what they do. Collier is really only super at having a nose for the ball. She is "good" defensively" but Gabby is great defensively and better offensively.

And as for next year, you don't believe in some player's getting a sophomore jump? Gabby's shot was bad last year. Awful. Collier's shot is much better than last year's GW. With her very good defense and very good rebounding, you don't think it reasonable to assume that she will be much, much better next year?

**So next year you should have some degree of confidence in 5 players, right? Nurse, KLS, Gabby, Collier and Danger?

I am assuming Morgan will leave for wnba. Otherwise why would she remove the brace. Except to show scouts she's a healthy player worth the pick. Now, the only other players I have confidence in are Nurse, KLS, and Gabby. Why ? Because noone else gets playing time even for a few minutes in important games. So now eveyone on this board seems to think over the summer Butler, Ekmark, and Chong will miraculously elevate their games. And a freshman will move right into Moriah's role, which Moriah couldn't even do 4 years ago. And then there are the other fresh who aren't even top 100 recruits who are going to turn into AA by next fall.

 

[hoophuskee]

I understand where your coming from and I agree.

As a player who played the game statistics is good when consistently supported by raw talent. And especially when that talent is tested against better overall talented players regularly.

I also know athelets can be groom into better players. I have witness this fact over and over again at Uconn and abroad. I was that person.

When I see a kid play I look for potential and talent. Not stats, but the overall skills and determination.

Regarding Irwin...I dont know nothing about this kid. No I cannot judge her by rankings alone. Look at Russell for Tenn.

I would love to see her though and not just on film playing against midiocre talent. What I won't do ( like many) "who watched her play against week competition" is rave about how good she is until she is tested.

Do I beloved there is a strong possibility she can be groomed by Geno to be better than what she is now? You better believe I do. Geno measures the skill set, the guts, character and the heart of the player and also talent. He has been wrong sometimes as well. Not much.

To tell the truth. I've already assumed she just may be underated. Time will tell. I wished the best for all the recruits.

I love your post!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love it!!!!!!!!!!

1-- I'm with you regarding Irwin and your overall philosophy of all from above. And because I'm uncertain of the raw talent she has, I've got to see for myself. And - as you say - I have no doubt she will improve a great deal under Geno. I don't agree with the reference the poster bonp made (I agreed with enalry everything from bonp) regarding Dolan though and for anyone else that has mentioned Stef in the past as some type of comparison in any manner with Irwin.

From what I remember, Dolson was high in some recruiting services. In addition, I believe Stef was an all-american in high school. I specifically remember she was regarded as the number 1 center recruit in her class. I remember several of us on the old ESPN Board thought she was very good - definitely much better than 30+ . . . The "athlete" sometimes gets overrated vs fundamentals and skill. Which these things might be with Irwin. But Stef was regarded as THE top center in her class.

I can't wait to find out though. Tiem to watch the men!!!!!!!!! Let's go UCONN!!

 

[hoophuskee]

I am assuming Morgan will leave for wnba. Otherwise why would she remove the brace. Except to show scouts she's a healthy player worth the pick. Now, the only other players I have confidence in are Nurse, KLS, and Gabby. Why ? Because noone else gets playing time even for a few minutes in important games. So now eveyone on this board seems to think over the summer Butler, Ekmark, and Chong will miraculously elevate their games. And a freshman will move right into Moriah's role, which Moriah couldn't even do 4 years ago. And then there are the other fresh who aren't even top 100 recruits who are going to turn into AA by next fall.

The men's game is on - I got to watch. But questions for you. Honestly if you had "gun-to-head" and someone asked you how good do you think Collier and Danger will be by the end of the year, Would you say a/b/c/d/f? Would you say le's say closer to b than c? Would you say high c+ or b-? Or other? If you are more than a grade off - you are in trouble!

 

[NewCorn]

I am assuming Morgan will leave for wnba. Otherwise why would she remove the brace. Except to show scouts she's a healthy player worth the pick. Now, the only other players I have confidence in are Nurse, KLS, and Gabby. Why ? Because noone else gets playing time even for a few minutes in important games. So now eveyone on this board seems to think over the summer Butler, Ekmark, and Chong will miraculously elevate their games. And a freshman will move right into Moriah's role, which Moriah couldn't even do 4 years ago. And then there are the other fresh who aren't even top 100 recruits who are going to turn into AA by next fall.

Of course all of the good thing projected by optimistic fans will not happen, but not all of them have to happen for UConn to reach the Final Four. If Collier and Butler can make substantial strides, which I think is probable, all will be well at UConn. You're correct, we can't expect the Danger to step in and fill MoJeff's shoes, but by the time of the NCAA Tournament, she may be able to contribute substantially. And she won't have to face-guard Skylar from behind.

 

[NewCorn]

There is something about Kyla's body language on the court that tells you she is going to compete whatever the level of competition.

 

[Cheddie]

I am assuming Morgan will leave for wnba. Otherwise why would she remove the brace.

I read/heard Geno say that the brace was really bothering her during games, slipping, and proving a distraction. She simply didn't like how it felt, and got the OK to dispense with it. I don't know if you've ever had to wear a health appliance. I use a CPAP while sleeping and, at times, I just want to take it off, even though I know it's good for me AND my wife will complain about the resulting snoring.

 

[donalddoowop]

She doesn't impress me at all at the moment. At the moment that is. I hope your correct. Please prove me wrong. I would love to be proving wrong regarding this hope.

I believe the talent is there. I know she has the desire and determination. That injury set her back and I believe hurt her confidence after being so ready to play mentally and physically. Missing all that time did not help. I think she is as good as the center at Nebraska and the center at Kansas State. Either one of them could have helped UCONN, imo. I believe Butler will excel next summer.

 

[Kaizen]

She doesn't impress me at all at the moment. At the moment that is. I hope your correct. Please prove me wrong. I would love to be proving wrong regarding this hope.

Butler just like Chong, both have lots pressure specially playing a team with 3 AA and 1 #1 High School recruit. There are several times Butler got the ball and, I really wish she can just jump and make a layup either score or be fouled. But she hesitated and then passed the ball to other or lost the ball.

She, sometimes can make easy layup, but not consistent. May be we expect too much from her. But I think after this summer she will be OK.

 

[Sluconn Husky]

Butler just like Chong, both have lots pressure specially playing a team with 3 AA and 1 #1 High School recruit.

Frankly, I think these are reasons they have LITTLE pressure on them. Next year will be a different story.

 

[magic]

I read/heard Geno say that the brace was really bothering her during games, slipping, and proving a distraction. She simply didn't like how it felt, and got the OK to dispense with it. I don't know if you've ever had to wear a health appliance. I use a CPAP while sleeping and, at times, I just want to take it off, even though I know it's good for me AND my wife will complain about the resulting snoring.

I've had several sports injuries, but luckily have never had to wear an appliance while playing. At least not anything like Morgan was wearing. But, you have to admit that the timing is curious. Morgan sat and rested the knee for 2 weeks, because of soreness. Then , she is playing without a brace, and no complaints about her knee. Just when we all know WNBA scouts are really fine tuning decisions by watching players down the stretch. My guess is the soreness must have been caused by the appliance itself. Still, you would think she'd be wearing something.

 

[Mdoggie]

Wait one cotton picking minute! I thought this was a Kyla thread? WTH?

 

[UcMiami]

Now, the only other players I have confidence in are Nurse, KLS, and Gabby. Why ? Because noone else gets playing time even for a few minutes in important games. So now eveyone on this board seems to think over the summer Butler, Ekmark, and Chong will miraculously elevate their games. And a freshman will move right into Moriah's role, which Moriah couldn't even do 4 years ago. And then there are the other fresh who aren't even top 100 recruits who are going to turn into AA by next fall.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I keep think back to last year and the following numbers: 5, 4, 5, 6, 3 - minutes for a scrub off the bench who absolutely couldn't be trusted against any good teams until the last few minutes even when the MOV was 18, 25, 21, 23, 10. I mean that Williams kid was just taking up a seat on the bench and using a scholarship that could have gone to a good player! It wasn't like there was any other competition for minutes - the starting 5 were being worn to the bone, and even that kid Kiah who some fool of a GM drafted in the first round could only get off the bench for 10, 7, and 11 minutes in three of those games. What a disaster, thank goodness we had 3 decent recruits arriving over the summer, cause we had a gaping whole created by the graduation of AA KML and that bench warmer Kiah.

In other words - we have pretty good coaches who know how to develop players, and players who take the seven months between the last game of a year and the first of the next year to grow as people and work on the holes in their game. And we have very good starters who are the best conditioned and coached players in the country and actually enjoy playing 35 or 40 minutes a game when the competition warrants it.

And each year is a new team with new dynamics and new roles for each of the players, and once a rotation gets set, they earn each other's trust, and the coaches trust through the course of the year. We debate and worry and wonder for all of those seven down months what is going to come out of that big box sitting in Gampel and each year when we get to open it, it is full of both the familiar and the completely unexpected, and it gives us immense pleasure for the next five months, until it gets sent back to the manufacturer for a complete overhaul. That is true of both the championship years and the ones that end a little short of the grand prize. Maya and Tina won it 50% of the time, Renee 25%, and Mel missed every year, but they covered our price of admission ten times over every year with the pleasure we derived from their journeys!

 

[UcMiami]

I've had several sports injuries, but luckily have never had to wear an appliance while playing. At least not anything like Morgan was wearing. But, you have to admit that the timing is curious. Morgan sat and rested the knee for 2 weeks, because of soreness. Then , she is playing without a brace, and no complaints about her knee. Just when we all know WNBA scouts are really fine tuning decisions by watching players down the stretch. My guess is the soreness must have been caused by the appliance itself. Still, you would think she'd be wearing something.

Whether she is wearing the brace or not, does not change the medical prognosis for her knee, nor does it alter her draft stock. Wearing a brace when the structure of a joint is sound is a trade off between comfort/mobility, and confidence/insurance - Morgan was constantly having comfort issues with the brace, constantly trying to adjust it both on the court and on the bench, and she had gone through quite a few different ones I believe, as the staff tried to improve the comfort and fit. She was not playing up to her standards in a series of games and decided (as athletes do all the time) that her play was struggling because of the brace. She tried playing without it and played better, so now psychologically her better play is directly connected to not wearing the brace, and for the next six games she is not putting it back on. Those six games and her play is all she is thinking about, and not what some GMs are thinking about her long term prognosis or her draft position.

 

[PhillyCoach]

With Butler's experience at Georgetown and one red-shirt year of practice with UConn--I expected Butler to be at a "starters level." The lack of live game experience for one plus year and the hand injury really threw everything out of kilter. To be honest, I was disappointed with Butler's play this season. Even taking in the negative circumstances. However, there was one factor that I (and some others) overlooked this season.
Geno has stated a few times that the starters work together as a team and need numerous reps to get into the flow. In the beginning of the year, each new starter got all the reps with the other 4 starters from last year. Just like the NFL when the # 2 or #3 players don't get the attention or the time. For Geno, it is a closed shop. Natalie got nothing during the injury and coming back slowly she probably was working with the last group who would see little floor time. In games, when Natalie played with "her group" she looked a little better. With a top group, she seemed unsure and a half-step slow. MY POINT - next year if/when Nat gets time with the starters she will smooth out and be much more effective. We do know that she can shoot the mid-range shot and she can pass the ball well. Her rebound average is pretty good too. The glass looks half full from here.

 

[UcMiami]

With Butler's experience at Georgetown and one red-shirt year of practice with UConn--I expected Butler to be at a "starters level." The lack of live game experience for one plus year and the hand injury really threw everything out of kilter. To be honest, I was disappointed with Butler's play this season. Even taking in the negative circumstances. However, there was one factor that I (and some others) overlooked this season.
Geno has stated a few times that the starters work together as a team and need numerous reps to get into the flow. In the beginning of the year, each new starter got all the reps with the other 4 starters from last year. Just like the NFL when the # 2 or #3 players don't get the attention or the time. For Geno, it is a closed shop. Natalie got nothing during the injury and coming back slowly she probably was working with the last group who would see little floor time. In games, when Natalie played with "her group" she looked a little better. With a top group, she seemed unsure and a half-step slow. MY POINT - next year if/when Nat gets time with the starters she will smooth out and be much more effective. We do know that she can shoot the mid-range shot and she can pass the ball well. Her rebound average is pretty good too. The glass looks half full from here.

Nicely put.
I think there is another significant factor in play with Natalie - she has a unique skill set that is very different from anyone else on the team. She will never be as quick or mobile as Tuck, Stewart, Williams, Collier, and Samuelson, the other players that have played 'post/forward' roles on this team. And with 2 months lost to her injury the team moved on from whatever systems they had started to put in to utilize her strengths of height and size. Returning mid-season there was nothing in the motion and cutting offense or the switching defense that matched up with her skills or the chemistry that had been established during the season. It would have been different if she was coming into a team built around Stef, a player she more closely resembles in strengths and weaknesses, but this team is two and a half years removed from that style of play at both ends of the floor.

We think of Kiah and her struggles her first two years as being a product of having difficulty adapting to Geno's system and college ball, and and there was certainly some of that, as well as some nagging injuries. But there was also a stylistic problem for her - she was a very different player from Dolson, the player she most often replaced. On defense she could fill the Dolson role pretty well, but on offense the wheels fell off - she could neither fill the high post passing/shooting of Stef, nor the low post scoring threat, and the whole team struggled. When Stef graduated and the offense by necessity had to change to revolve around a very different set of skills on the team, she suddenly came into her own. She was still coming off the bench, but the team was running cuts and motion that better suited her skills. She could replace Stewart or Tuck and not look like a fish out of water, and she could join them in a three big alignment that the team practiced from the start of training camp.

 

[PhillyCoach]

Uc = I appreciate your insights and peeling the onion down to that next level. You nailed it again on this issue. Now the question for next year will be---What style of offense and defense will Geno/CD settle on as the "best road to another final four?" The high post pass/shoot of the Stef mold (which Butler has pretty well) or a continuation of this motion offense and switch defense (which Collier & Gabby could handle very well.)

 

[Mdoggie]

So now that you mentioned Kyla in the "Kyla" thread. I am looking forward to her development.

 

[JRRRJ]

With Butler's experience at Georgetown and one red-shirt year of practice with UConn--I expected Butler to be at a "starters level." The lack of live game experience for one plus year and the hand injury really threw everything out of kilter. To be honest, I was disappointed with Butler's play this season. Even taking in the negative circumstances. However, there was one factor that I (and some others) overlooked this season.
Geno has stated a few times that the starters work together as a team and need numerous reps to get into the flow. In the beginning of the year, each new starter got all the reps with the other 4 starters from last year. Just like the NFL when the # 2 or #3 players don't get the attention or the time. For Geno, it is a closed shop. Natalie got nothing during the injury and coming back slowly she probably was working with the last group who would see little floor time. In games, when Natalie played with "her group" she looked a little better. With a top group, she seemed unsure and a half-step slow. MY POINT - next year if/when Nat gets time with the starters she will smooth out and be much more effective. We do know that she can shoot the mid-range shot and she can pass the ball well. Her rebound average is pretty good too. The glass looks half full from here.

I wonder which of Butler's games people have been watching.
For the season:
FG% 59.3 (2nd on the team)
Avg RB: 4.72 (4th on the team in the 8th most minutes)
FGA per 40: 14.39 (3rd on the team) Not much hesitancy here.
FGM per 40: 8.54 (2nd on the team)
Pts per 40: 20.08 (2nd on the team)
OR per 40: 5.22 (2nd on the team)
DR per 40: 8.22 (2nd on the team)
TR per 40: 13.44 (1st on the team)
BRATS per 40: 14.7 (4th on the team)

We'd love to have fewer turnovers, but what the heck were you expecting from the backup center? Perfection?

 

[Mdoggie]

I wonder which of Butler's games people have been watching.
For the season:
FG% 59.3 (2nd on the team)
Avg RB: 4.72 (4th on the team in the 8th most minutes)
FGA per 40: 14.39 (3rd on the team) Not much hesitancy here.
FGM per 40: 8.54 (2nd on the team)
Pts per 40: 20.08 (2nd on the team)
OR per 40: 5.22 (2nd on the team)
DR per 40: 8.22 (2nd on the team)
TR per 40: 13.44 (1st on the team)
BRATS per 40: 14.7 (4th on the team)

We'd love to have fewer turnovers, but what the heck were you expecting from the backup center? Perfection?

But what about Kyla? Lol

 

[JordyG]

Uc = I appreciate your insights and peeling the onion down to that next level. You nailed it again on this issue. Now the question for next year will be---What style of offense and defense will Geno/CD settle on as the "best road to another final four?" The high post pass/shoot of the Stef mold (which Butler has pretty well) or a continuation of this motion offense and switch defense (which Collier & Gabby could handle very well.)

A great group of posts by you guys. I think the secret is in the smaller, quick, gritty, versatile players that Geno seems to be recruiting. If and unless the wonderful Jade from The Colony makes and appearance I think this is going to be a continuation of a motion/switching high octane offense. Even with Jade I think it will remain so.

 

[Mdoggie]

A great group of posts by you guys. I think the secret is in the smaller, quick, gritty, versatile players that Geno seems to be recruiting. If and unless the wonderful Jade from The Colony makes and appearance I think this is going to be a continuation of a motion/switching high octane offense. Even with Jade I think it will remain so.

I hope next years offense is centered on what Kyla brings to the table. lol

 

[cbraarj]

I hope next years offense is centered on what Kyla brings to the table. lol

I have to ask.Are you related or family friend of Kyla Irwin?

 

[Mdoggie]

I have to ask.Are you related or family friend of Kyla Irwin?

No. I just assumed the discussion who be about her since the thread bares her name. . Why do you ask the family question?