Lance Armstrong Doping (OT)

[trisailin]

true - however, arbitration by essentially the same people who have accused him isn't really arbitration. Further, death by 1000 cuts is still death. How much is his time worth? The time of his lawyers? He's already spent countless hours fighting with no end in sight. As I said - I don't know if he did or didn't - just that the process really stinks.

 

[sarals24]

I agree, it seems like it has taken way too much time and expense. I'm sure his lawyers would tell you exactly how much their time is worth I can't imagine they are complaining about the long, drawn-out process.

 

[sarals24]

I guess it's hard to feel bad for him. When Diana was accused, it was under such strange circumstances and such an isolated incident that I was sure it was an abberation. (Plus, if truly innocent, you do what Diana did and keep fighting. Not give up because you didn't like how they went about accusing you)

This seems like a much more insidious, long-term, involved plan that implicates other riders and athletes. Even though I've always thought cycling was one of the dirtiest sports, I guess the the governing bodies wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't look into it. And he was obviously good enough pre-cancer to be a top contender, so I don't really understand the need to use PEDs.

 

[Drumguy]

Since everyone in cycling dopes his feats are still relative and amazing. It's hard to believe he gained that much of an advantage, again relative to the other cyclists.

What a stupid sport, they didn't catch him when it happened and now they are willing to throw out the Babe Ruth of the sport to be vindictive. How anyone can root for cycling is beyond me.

 

[alexrgct]

Since everyone in cycling dopes his feats are still relative and amazing. It's hard to believe he gained that much of an advantage, again relative to the other cyclists.

This is why I remain in awe of Barry Bonds.

 

[sarals24]

True, he was already a freak of nature with his amazing endurance. The rules seem to be applied at random.

 

[ZooCougar]

Hey zoo - can you explain why the Feds dropped their case? If it is all such a "slam dunk" obvious that even you KNOW...I'd have thought a couple million dollar investigation would have led to something. I have no idea whether Lance did or didn't dope - but I'd like to believe that the fed investigation would have FAR more info than anything you proclaim to know and they apparently didn't have enough evidence to proceed.

Because the Federal Case had to do with using Federal money to fund a doping operation in US Postal.

This USADA case just has to do with whether or not he doped.

Clear or not clear?

 

[ZooCougar]

Since everyone in cycling dopes his feats are still relative and amazing. It's hard to believe he gained that much of an advantage, again relative to the other cyclists.

What a stupid sport, they didn't catch him when it happened and now they are willing to throw out the Babe Ruth of the sport to be vindictive. How anyone can root for cycling is beyond me.

Did you hear about the latest fat ass baseball player to get busted doping?

Cycling is a great sport, but it's an acquired taste.

 

[Icebear]

Quite honestly, I think there needs to be a statute of limitations applied to all sports regarding this type of testing and pursuit of athletes. Anything longer than 5 years should destroyed as as unpursueable.

 

[ThisJustIn]

Not only a statute of limitations, but a serious look at the question of state/federal jurisdiction and sport governing board jurisdiction. I coukd care less if an athlete dopes or doesn't (legally . My opinion of them and their feats is skewed. Even then, i have questions sbut supplements and such vs. say, having superior drive, talent, coaching and equipment.)

What one does with all the money someone accrues (or raises, for instance) is probably a question of fraud.

But I'd rath time, money and resources be spent on, say, health insurace fraud, insider trading cases and such. Those have a financial impact on me....

 

[rjp172]

Quite honestly, I think there needs to be a statute of limitations applied to all sports regarding this type of testing and pursuit of athletes. Anything longer than 5 years should destroyed as as unpursueable.

There was a statute of limitations. When he came out of retirement the last time it started the clock again.

 

[sarals24]

Plus, they can hold on to the blood samples for years as more sophisticated testing methods are developed. I think the dopers are always a few years ahead of the testers.

 

[Icebear]

Plus, they can hold on to the blood samples for years as more sophisticated testing methods are developed. I think the dopers are always a few years ahead of the testers.

Yes, and that is why a statute of limitations is necessary. Otherwise we can investigate guys and gals dead 25 years so long as their pee is in storage somewhere. These things have to have an end.

 

[Man-Man]

I really would like to believe that he didn't cheat but would like to know for sure. After reading his first book and looking at the process he went through to overcome cancer many in the sport felt that the process gave him an unfair advantage. They would mix chemo with massive blood transfusions until he was near death and have him fight his way back to health the repeat it, then came the second cancer. He was arrogant and had a callous personality and anger issues no one really liked him. They felt that he shouldn't be able to compete through the treatment and that the process was actually making him stronger. In a way he kinda admitted that the whole process off stripping blood and replacing it would kill you and if it didn't your body would be regenerated.

USADA has always been know to be one sided, athletes are guilty unless they can prove with out a shadow of a doubt that they aren't. They are said to have completed their case before you are charged and once your called in its just more of a formality hearing. He may have cheated but if you read the story it is kinda like the Dark Knight Rises movie the way he had to rebuild his body, amazing and inspirational.

 

[UcMiami]

Yes, and that is why a statute of limitations is necessary. Otherwise we can investigate guys and gals dead 25 years so long as their pee is in storage somewhere. These things have to have an end.

Agree - and ... you are depending on labs that do not have a perfect track record to begin with to properly store and manage thousands of 'b' samples for years and years in 'perfect' conditions.
As far as USADA - it was able to bring this action without revealing to the 'defense' any of its evidence prior to the hearing - who was testifying, what they would be saying, and any 'pending' issues with those who were going to testify. It has been reported and I am certainly willing to believe that some of those people were given the choice of testifying or being banned for life themselves - a situation that in a court of law would allow a defense attorney to make total micemeat of said testimony.
Personally, I suspect he did find ways around the testing, as I suspect many other athletes have in the past. I just consider this particular case to be more of a witch hunt than an actual judicial process, and to have little if anything to do with 'cleaning up a sport.'

 

[JACKofallTrades]

Oh and congratulations to Greg Lemond.
The only American to ever win the Tour de France.

Just to set the record straight... Marianne Martin (US) not only won it, she did it before Greg did. (I'm a huge Lemond fan BTW )

 

[meganmatthews]

I heard his bike had fake air in the tires also.

 

[Icebear]

Just to set the record straight... Marianne Martin (US) not only won it, she did it before Greg did. (I'm a huge Lemond fan BTW )

You mean Le Grande Boucle. Only 617 miles, afterall, they had to change the name since the shortest tour ever was in 1904 and just over 1500 miles and the longest over 3700 miles, not km. You know that women couldn't ride that far.

 

[Kait14]

Have to weigh in on this.. In all honesty, WHO CARES if he doped. I'm on the side that believes he didn't, because there is ZERO proof.. USADA can say they have proof, which they've been saying for years, but they've never released it. They got what they want, they dragged a courageous human being through the mud and tarnished his legacy on a witch hunt. The man had STAGE FOUR CANCER.. and he won the Tour de France 7 times. I don't give a crap if he doped. How many people come back from STAGE FOUR CANCER to even walk around like a normal person, let alone win THE TOUR DE FRANCE?!?! He was better than every single one of the cyclists he competed against, the best ever. Say what you will about him, but regardless of whether he did or didn't, the man accomplished miraculous things, and there is absolutely nothing anyone can say to deny that.

 

[GoUconn7961]

My response will be bashed to the hilt - and personally I don't care. It was a witch hunt plain & simple. There are a lot of people who hate Lance. I met him personally, and he is an acquired taste.

 

[pap49cba]

Have to weigh in on this.. In all honesty, WHO CARES if he doped. I'm on the side that believes he didn't, because there is ZERO proof.. USADA can say they have proof, which they've been saying for years, but they've never released it. They got what they want, they dragged a courageous human being through the mud and tarnished his legacy on a witch hunt. The man had STAGE FOUR CANCER.. and he won the Tour de France 7 times. I don't give a crap if he doped. How many people come back from STAGE FOUR CANCER to even walk around like a normal person, let alone win THE TOUR DE FRANCE?!?! He was better than every single one of the cyclists he competed against, the best ever. Say what you will about him, but regardless of whether he did or didn't, the man accomplished miraculous things, and there is absolutely nothing anyone can say to deny that.

S.I.'s Rick Reilly agrees with you....