Ju Ju carried off the court with an injury

[CTBballfan243]

You people are either blind as bats or you have allowed your subliminal wishes to cloud your perspectives. Now the inside defender did nothing wrong. She was just holding her position. However, Ju Ju was being bodied by two defenders. The outside defender was pushing her into the inside defender. In this case Ju ju had position and was being fouled the entire way to the basket. The outside defender pushed and pinned Ju Ju between the defenders causing her to fall. As Ju ju was going down with one knee down and the other leg extended with the foot planted, the outside defender still maintained body contact pushing inward. That is when the ourside defender knee made contact with the exended legs below the knee pushing inward. That is what caused the ACL. Ju Ju's extended legs foot was planted her other knee was down and the defenders knee pushed against her extended and planted leg under her knee.

While I can understand not catching in game time, there is a still photo ( the one that has been used to show the injury happening) that shows the outside defenders knee hitting ju ju planted and extended leg. In the fllm you can see that the outside defender momentum carries her towards the inside one ju ju falls down and no longer provides returning pressure. It was the outside defender who cause that injury via contact and you can see that in the still picture. When the still is put into context with the video it becomes clear what happened.

The perspective that the defenders did nothing wrong is total BS. Now that would be true for the inside defender, but the outside defender was body contact pushing her during the entire drive to the basket. Ju ju was pinned between the players so she had no where to go. When Ju ju went down and the resistence from he was no longer there, the outside defenders momentum carried her inside leg into contact with Ju ju's inside knee causing the injury. It is obvious that the players were told to pressure Ju Ju as much as they could and they unfortunately took it too far. The refs should have blown the whistle earlier and that would have prevented what eventually resulted.

Those that are so quick to declare this injury to be just an unfortunate basketball event and not caused by a foul by a defender might want to ask themselves why they came to that conclusion so easily.

The injury had nothing to do with Miss State players. Just an unfortunate injury.

 

[Cuango]

You people are either blind as bats or you have allowed your subliminal wishes to cloud your perspectives. Now the inside defender did nothing wrong. She was just holding her position. However, Ju Ju was being bodied by two defenders. The outside defender was pushing her into the inside defender. In this case Ju ju had position and was being fouled the entire way to the basket. The outside defender pushed and pinned Ju Ju between the defenders causing her to fall. As Ju ju was going down with one knee down and the other leg extended with the foot planted, the outside defender still maintained body contact pushing inward. That is when the ourside defender knee made contact with the exended legs below the knee pushing inward. That is what caused the ACL. Ju Ju's extended legs foot was planted her other knee was down and the defenders knee pushed against her extended and planted leg under her knee.

While I can understand not catching in game time, there is a still photo ( the one that has been used to show the injury happening) that shows the outside defenders knee hitting ju ju planted and extended leg. In the fllm you can see that the outside defender momentum carries her towards the inside one ju ju falls down and no longer provides returning pressure. It was the outside defender who cause that injury via contact and you can see that in the still picture. When the still is put into context with the video it becomes clear what happened.

The perspective that the defenders did nothing wrong is total BS. Now that would be true for the inside defender, but the outside defender was body contact pushing her during the entire drive to the basket. Ju ju was pinned between the players so she had no where to go. When Ju ju went down and the resistence from he was no longer there, the outside defenders momentum carried her inside leg into contact with Ju ju's inside knee causing the injury. It is obvious that the players were told to pressure Ju Ju as much as they could and they unfortunately took it too far. The refs should have blown the whistle earlier and that would have prevented what eventually resulted.

Those that are so quick to declare this injury to be just an unfortunate basketball event and not caused by a foul by a defender might want to ask themselves why they came to that conclusion so easily.

Total speculation as to what caused the injury! It looked to me (also total speculation) that the knee went on the step before the final, awful looking one. If true, it happened before any contact.

If you watch the video from front and back, it looks as though she (JuJu) (front) picks the ball up and has a pained face before she actually made that awful looking last step and began to fall. From the back, it looks (to me) that something happened on the final right foot plant before the one where her knee splays out to the side. I believe that is when the knee went!

I’m convinced the combination of the weakened ankle (injured in the previous game) and the relentless minutes in pursuit of points, plus the clearly coach sanctioned reluctance to play team ball. She would not pass off to the wide open teammate streaking (all by herself) to the basket and was constantly playing iso, one on one basketball, driving to the basket instead of passing to teammates, knowing she would usually get foul shots.

Now this is not neccessarily always bad. Drawing fouls is a good thing. I’m also not saying that she never passed the ball! However, JuJu would drive when it was clear the lane was not really there and was routinely involved in physical collisions under the basket. Again, not always bad. But she would choose this over wide open teammates just as she attempted to do on the injury play! I believe all of this, the minutes, the bad ankle, the lack of fundamental team play (passing off to the open teammate) were all contributors to her injury.

As for your last snarky sentence, I came to my conclusion because I have eyes and watched the whole thing happen both in real time and on multiple replays! Imo, this injury was the almost inevitable result of multiple, cumulative bad decisions that must be laid primarily at the feet of the head coach. She simply did not make the choices that she, as the head coach should have made in order to both protect her player and to teach her team basketball concepts! These choices, taken singly, may not have ended with this horrendous result but cumulatively, they were simply too much!

 

[LGITB]

You people are either blind as bats or you have allowed your subliminal wishes to cloud your perspectives. Now the inside defender did nothing wrong. She was just holding her position. However, Ju Ju was being bodied by two defenders. The outside defender was pushing her into the inside defender. In this case Ju ju had position and was being fouled the entire way to the basket. The outside defender pushed and pinned Ju Ju between the defenders causing her to fall. As Ju ju was going down with one knee down and the other leg extended with the foot planted, the outside defender still maintained body contact pushing inward. That is when the ourside defender knee made contact with the exended legs below the knee pushing inward. That is what caused the ACL. Ju Ju's extended legs foot was planted her other knee was down and the defenders knee pushed against her extended and planted leg under her knee.

While I can understand not catching in game time, there is a still photo ( the one that has been used to show the injury happening) that shows the outside defenders knee hitting ju ju planted and extended leg. In the fllm you can see that the outside defender momentum carries her towards the inside one ju ju falls down and no longer provides returning pressure. It was the outside defender who cause that injury via contact and you can see that in the still picture. When the still is put into context with the video it becomes clear what happened.

The perspective that the defenders did nothing wrong is total BS. Now that would be true for the inside defender, but the outside defender was body contact pushing her during the entire drive to the basket. Ju ju was pinned between the players so she had no where to go. When Ju ju went down and the resistence from he was no longer there, the outside defenders momentum carried her inside leg into contact with Ju ju's inside knee causing the injury. It is obvious that the players were told to pressure Ju Ju as much as they could and they unfortunately took it too far. The refs should have blown the whistle earlier and that would have prevented what eventually resulted.

Those that are so quick to declare this injury to be just an unfortunate basketball event and not caused by a foul by a defender might want to ask themselves why they came to that conclusion so easily.

Wow, I didn't realize we had a world renowned interdisciplinary professional with experience in kinesiology, biomechanics, and psychology!

 

[Conndog]

I didn't see any hard contact in the replays. What you see, especially from the long view down the court is that the defender runs parallel to keep Juju from getting to the rim. She doesn't bump her, but she also doesn't make way for her. It was an ordinary blocking foul, if it was a foul at all.

This was not the defender's fault, as far as I can see, though looking to blame anyone in these things may not make much sense. Juju pushed the pace, which is what she does. It's part of what makes her a great player, and it usually results in her getting to the rim and getting an and-one opportunity. In a half court set, this doesn't typically result in injury because no one's moving that fast. But on a run out, if the defenders do their job and defend the play, the risks are a lot greater.

Why isn’t it a foul on JuJu since defender is parallel to her? Didn't JuJu veer into her? Defender should have every right to maintain her place on the court. Time after time, however, players like JuJu and Hidalgo from ND get rewarded with FTs when they initiate contact on drives to the basket. Maybe if refs call the offensive player for an offensive foul, then that kind of barreling into the defender would be discouraged, and perhaps injuries like this wouldn’t be the result.

 

[Bone Dog]

She simply did not make the choices that she, as the head coach should have made in order to both protect her player and to teach her team basketball concepts! These choices, taken singly, may not have ended with this horrendous result but cumulatively, they were simply too much!

I saw the injury more or less as you did, but I’m reluctant to blame the coach, at least not entirely. I wonder if JuJu would have been interested in signing with a coach who meant “to teach her team basketball concepts.” She struck me as a kid who thought she already had a complete game in high school and didn’t really need a coach to change it. And she wasn’t necessarily wrong about herself.

 

[HuskyNan]

I am disappointed at the USC fans’ reaction. Poor sportsmanship. As a Huskies fan, I understand well their emotions regarding an injury to a valuable starter. However, the reaction that one player would deliberately injure another should not be the response. Perhaps Coach Gottlieb after sleeping on it for two nights will put a stop to the blame game from her players.

This thread brought a wry smile to my face. The anger and vitriol directed at Notre Dame after Azzi’s knee injury puts the USC fans’ booing to shame. Boneyarders actually accused the ND player of deliberately throwing herself into Azzi’s teammate to cause the injury. Oh, the irony

 

[LGITB]

This thread brought a wry smile to my face. The anger and vitriol directed at Notre Dame after Azzi’s knee injury there puts the USC fans’ booing to shame. Boneyarders actually accused the ND player ofdeliberately throwing herself into Azzi’s teammate to cause the injury. Oh, the irony

I think both scenarios are pretty awful. I know social media isn't real life, but I'm seeing some vile, vile stuff being posted, and I feel bad for whoever is caught in the crosshairs of some of that rhetoric.

 

[YKCornelius]

You people are either blind as bats or you have allowed your subliminal wishes to cloud your perspectives. Now the inside defender did nothing wrong. She was just holding her position. However, Ju Ju was being bodied by two defenders. The outside defender was pushing her into the inside defender. In this case Ju ju had position and was being fouled the entire way to the basket. The outside defender pushed and pinned Ju Ju between the defenders causing her to fall. As Ju ju was going down with one knee down and the other leg extended with the foot planted, the outside defender still maintained body contact pushing inward. That is when the ourside defender knee made contact with the exended legs below the knee pushing inward. That is what caused the ACL. Ju Ju's extended legs foot was planted her other knee was down and the defenders knee pushed against her extended and planted leg under her knee.

While I can understand not catching in game time, there is a still photo ( the one that has been used to show the injury happening) that shows the outside defenders knee hitting ju ju planted and extended leg. In the fllm you can see that the outside defender momentum carries her towards the inside one ju ju falls down and no longer provides returning pressure. It was the outside defender who cause that injury via contact and you can see that in the still picture. When the still is put into context with the video it becomes clear what happened.

The perspective that the defenders did nothing wrong is total BS. Now that would be true for the inside defender, but the outside defender was body contact pushing her during the entire drive to the basket. Ju ju was pinned between the players so she had no where to go. When Ju ju went down and the resistence from he was no longer there, the outside defenders momentum carried her inside leg into contact with Ju ju's inside knee causing the injury. It is obvious that the players were told to pressure Ju Ju as much as they could and they unfortunately took it too far. The refs should have blown the whistle earlier and that would have prevented what eventually resulted.

Those that are so quick to declare this injury to be just an unfortunate basketball event and not caused by a foul by a defender might want to ask themselves why they came to that conclusion so easily.

Nah. Multiple views of the incident do not support what you are trying to sell, willtalk. First, your characterization of "outside defender" and "inside defender" is a little wonky. Presuming the "outside defender" is the one furtherest from the basket (DeShields), that player never touched JuJu with anything but her left hand grazing JuJu's arm prior to JuJu hitting the deck. DeShields knee was at least a foot away - maybe a foot and a half - from Watkins when JuJu went down.

Everyone can see this clearly on the ESPN footage showing the play from multiple angles. Nothing to do with "subliminal wishes" for goodness sakes.

The first time there is any contact is when Watkins and Prater pass the three point arc, with Prater being a half step in front of JuJu. At the moment of contact, JuJu's left arm contacts Prater's torso before - maybe just a millisecond before - the defender's right hand makes contact with JuJu's left hip. The contact with the hip is a result of JuJu's arm being overtop of Prater's arm which results in Prater's hand moving downward away from the ball.

From that moment of first contact to the moment JuJU falls, maybe a tenth of a second goes by. There was no time for the refs to "have blown the whistle earlier".

As multiple posters have stated, this play was a basketball play. Frankly, IMO the official should have swallowed his whistle since the it was incidental contact (at best) up to the point. Instead, a shooting foul was called even though there was no shooting motion whatsoever. I guess the referee assumed - like everybody watching the play - that there was no way in heck JuJu Watkins was going to pass the ball to her trailing teammate. Therefore a shot would have been forthcoming. Geez.

An extremely unfortunate play to put an end to a wonderful season for JuJu Watkins. I wish her a full recovery so we can see her back on the court better than ever.

 

[Geew1992]

I thought it was the crowd was booing everytime Mississippi State had the ball. I don't believe the players caused that injury. I hoped Coach Gottlieb would take the mike and tell them to stop the nonsense, but no.

Not only did she not saying anything, she pretty much backed the fans when asked

 

[Geew1992]

The injury had nothing to do with Miss State players. Just an unfortunate injury.

Juju was also injured the previous game. She twisted her ankle pretty badly. The team was up by 30 and the coach put her back in. I'm one that thinks, that injury may have played a part in the acl tear.

 

[cabbie191]

This thread brought a wry smile to my face. The anger and vitriol directed at Notre Dame after Azzi’s knee injury there puts the USC fans’ booing to shame. Boneyarders actually accused the ND player ofdeliberately throwing herself into Azzi’s teammate to cause the injury. Oh, the irony

Nan, the thought crossed my mind as well.

BUT c’mon, we’re talking about ND here! Rightfully or not, anything the Irish do that involves an injury to a Husky is going to bring out the best in us!

 

[BRS24]

No surprise here. A lot of the collegiate players all chat in the background and support each other thru injuries.

 

[Zarathustra]

No surprise here. A lot of the collegiate players all chat in the background and support each other thru injuries.

MORE than worth a listen to!!!

 

[fomalhaut]

Not only did she not saying anything, she pretty much backed the fans when asked

Took her four days to tell fans to stop attacking Mississippi State players online.

 

[Dublin]

You "doctors" out there know that torn ACLs can occur through contact or NOT. Though a Huskies fan, Lisa and MSU's Prater don't deserve all this negative diatribe. Lisa made her statement today:
Gottlieb defends MSU: JuJu not hurt on dirty play

For those who believe Lisa should have said this much sooner, give her a break since her mindset since a week ago was her team's path to a National Championship with a complete team. Now she has to figure out an entirely new path.

 

[Cuango]

You "doctors" out there know that torn ACLs can occur through contact or NOT. Though a Huskies fan, Lisa and MSU's Prater don't deserve all this negative diatribe. Lisa made her statement today:
Gottlieb defends MSU: JuJu not hurt on dirty play

For those who believe Lisa should have said this much sooner, give her a break since her mindset since a week ago was her team's path to a National Championship with a complete team. Now she has to figure out an entirely new path.

Doing the right thing is a matter of character not of convenience!

 

[Dublin]

Doing the right thing is a matter of character not of convenience!

It's not Lisa's "job" to respond to this criticism. If there is anyone to blame, just maybe, the person who "dropped the ball" was Amy Broadhead, USC's General Manager for Women’s Basketball, who is in her first season in this newly-created position. With over two decades of relevant basketball experience, Broadhead may never have faced such an emotional experience.

 

[MooseJaw]

Prayers to Juju. We know too well how devastating this is.

And hopefully a huge wake up call to ESPN/selection committee who have been too cute by half for a while now. Texas is not a better team than either USC or UConn and putting Paige vs Juju in the regionals for the sake of a big ratings juice heading into the Final 4 (similar to LSU-Iowa last year) was obvious and unfair to both teams.

Welcome, RitzLuce1, good post, and on target. Sure, many here agree and have many misgivings about many poor decisions made by the committee. Changing from 4 sites to only 2 sites, then add seeding, just mentioned 2 but a very big 2. There are more but for now 2 is enough for me. Again welcome.

 

[Cuango]

It's not Lisa's "job" to respond to this criticism. If there is anyone to blame, just maybe, the person who "dropped the ball" was Amy Broadhead, USC's General Manager for Women’s Basketball, who is in her first season in this newly-created position. With over two decades of relevant basketball experience, Broadhead may never have faced such an emotional experience.

Yeah, we’ll just have to disagree on that. I’ve seen many coaches grab a mike and settle (or try to) the crowd down. That could have been done in the moment but to allow those girls to get hammered on social media for three days was unconscionable. Imo, of course!

 

[Dublin]

At least. Amy Broadhead ordered some JuJu shirts for everyone.

 

[Dugway]

Who is Lisa?

 

[Dublin]

Who is Lisa?

USC head women's basketball coach Lindsay 'Lisa' Gottlieb