Jared Sullinger and Fab Melo to the Celtics...

[HeGotGame]

I like Sullinger, lottery talent and a good,skilled basketball player. I think this allows them to work the rumored sign and trade of Bass for a scorer like OJ Mayo.

Melo, I'm confused about. How different is he than JuJuan Johnson, who had some good moments last year?

I didn't want Avery Bradley, Rajin Rondo, Delonte West, Tony Allen...etc etc etc. Danny Ainge knows more than I do.

JuJuan Johnson is what he is, hes played basketball his whole life, played 4 years of college and will be 24 this season. There is not a lot of upside with him, most experts agree he can improve but will never be a starter in this league.

Melo will be 22 this season is still developing and improved immensely from his Freshmen to Sophomore year. Melo is already leaps and bounds better then Johnson defensively. Melo will not be a starter anytime soon, but at 22 the Celtics were not getting a starter in this draft, they drafted a big man on potential to hopefully replace Hollins or Steisma and a big man who a great college career, albeit two years, who has injury concerns. With their current roster and their position in the draft they chose to roll the dice on two big risk big reward players, I like it.

 

[NHUConnfan]

Comcast sports team objected to the idea that the back injury is serious. They said it may be solvable with just therapy and is definitely fixable with surgery. Said Sully decided to play through the pain all year. Great pick. Melo...ugh. Don't like it. Would like to see a scorer with that pick. But Dion Waiters at #4? What film are these guys watching?

I have no idea. That pick surprised me more than anything. How do the Cavs pass on Robinson?!

 

[NHUConnfan]

For what it's worth, there were rumors were trying to pick up Austin Rivers via trading up. I'm not sure what would have had to happen to get to a top 10 pick, but I can guarantee it that I'd rather have Rivers rather than having Sullinger+Melo+Joseph...any day of the week.

 

[HuskyHawk]

For what it's worth, there were rumors were trying to pick up Austin Rivers via trading up. I'm not sure what would have had to happen to get to a top 10 pick, but I can guarantee it that I'd rather have Rivers rather than having Sullinger+Melo+Joseph...any day of the week.

I think Sullinger will be a better pro than Rivers straight up. This was a very weak draft for SG and wings. Very strong draft at the PF. I think there are guys in the 2nd round who may end up being as productive as Rivers.

 

[HeGotGame]

For what it's worth, there were rumors were trying to pick up Austin Rivers via trading up. I'm not sure what would have had to happen to get to a top 10 pick, but I can guarantee it that I'd rather have Rivers rather than having Sullinger+Melo+Joseph...any day of the week.

Is this a serious statement? Who does Rivers play over on the Celtics, Rondo? Bradley? Nope. Not this year, not in five years. So you want to trade 3 picks for a guard who cannot defend and has a lot of question marks and at best will be the 1st or 2nd gaurd off the bench on the Celtics for 3 picks?

Stick to the message boards and do not apply for a GM job anytime soon.

I agree with HuskyHawk that if Sully is healthy he will be a better pro then Rivers.

 

[HeGotGame]

I have no idea. That pick surprised me more than anything. How do the Cavs pass on Robinson?!

Because he plays the same position as Tristan Thompson their #4 pick last year. The cavs needed someone who can take pressure of Irving and get to the basket. Waiters fits the bill. It was either going to be him or Barnes after they couldnt get Beal. Some people like Waiters more then Barnes, some people like Barnes, personally I like Waiters but we shall see.

 

[dogfan96]

I love Sullinger. I'm amazed real college bball fans don't remember watching him play. Dude can score with his back to the basket and facing the hoop.

Hate Melo, though.

In college he can score with his back to the basket. In the pros (as in college), he will have problems being guarded by taller guys. He really struggled to get his shot off against teams with size. Hopefully his face-up game will keep him in the league

 

[nomar]

In college he can score with his back to the basket. In the pros (as in college), he will have problems being guarded by taller guys. He really struggled to get his shot off against teams with size. Hopefully his face-up game will keep him in the league

He had one bad game against Kansas where he was being guarded by an NBA body in Withey and doubled by an NBA lottery pick in Robinson. It just so happened to be his last game, and everybody was watching. This is how you make value picks: by recognizing that everyone is overrating or underrating something or someone.

Hey, he'll get blocked in the pros. Everybody not named LeBron and Durant does. What I like about him is his offensive versatility. When he gets a good matchup, he can post-up and either make a move or pass out if he gets doubled. Then he also happens to have a nice jump shot out to 20 feet.

This is all speculation, of course.

 

[Robertelamin]

Fab Melo is a poor mans Thabeet and we have all seen how that has turned out...

 

[Cheddie]

Hey Nomar, I like the guy & nobody doubts his skill. He was probably a top 5 pick last year. I was just trying to point out that a guy with self-admitted weight issues and a herniated disk is a different type of roll of the dice. Ainge said last night that he'll need "short and long-term maintenance," whatever that means. Hope it works out for him and the C's.

 

[Deadrody]

JuJuan Johnson is what he is, hes played basketball his whole life, played 4 years of college and will be 24 this season. There is not a lot of upside with him, most experts agree he can improve but will never be a starter in this league.

This kind of thing cracks me up. Ever hear of Kevin Johnson ? One of the best scorers in the league from 1988 to 1997. Averaged over 20 ppg for a decade. Average 9, 7, and 12 ppg his first 3 years. The idea that everybody in the NBA already knows exactly how good JuJuan Johnson will ever be after a single season is laughable.

And he won't be 24 until next February.

 

[Dry Tortugas]

I just went to NBA.com to check #22 picks through history, but I couldn't even make it back to 1990 I was laughing so hard. Very few make it, including Marcus Williams, Tate George and Bill Curley.

 

[ZenConn]

Not a Celts fan but I would have liked to see them draft Perry Jones as well. If one of his problems was indeed playing hard, KG would straighten that out very quickly.

 

[HeGotGame]

This kind of thing cracks me up. Ever hear of Kevin Johnson ? One of the best scorers in the league from 1988 to 1997. Averaged over 20 ppg for a decade. Average 9, 7, and 12 ppg his first 3 years. The idea that everybody in the NBA already knows exactly how good JuJuan Johnson will ever be after a single season is laughable.

And he won't be 24 until next February.

Is February next season? Pretty sure it is.

The Kevin Johnson comparison makes 0 sense. He was the #7 pick overall and started almost 30 games as rookie. He was even rookie of the month once. Also, get your facts straight he averaged 12 ppg as a rookie and 20 ppg in his 2nd year. Pretty sure you got your stats from basketball reference but do not know how to read the charts. http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/johnske02.html

Try to read it again, what did he average in 1988-89?

The fact that you think you know what you are talking about and try to be smart cracks me up.

Johnson was the 27th pick and was able able to play in garbage time for a team that had major need at PF/C.

Your post could not have been a bigger failure.

 

[EricSD]

Not sure how either help them get by the Heat.

They don't. but i'm not sure there was anyone at 21 and 22 who could have helped them do that.

 

[NHUConnfan]

Because he plays the same position as Tristan Thompson their #4 pick last year. The cavs needed someone who can take pressure of Irving and get to the basket. Waiters fits the bill. It was either going to be him or Barnes after they couldnt get Beal. Some people like Waiters more then Barnes, some people like Barnes, personally I like Waiters but we shall see.

I always though Flynn was better...and look at what he's doing in the NBA.

 

[NHUConnfan]

I think Sullinger will be a better pro than Rivers straight up. This was a very weak draft for SG and wings. Very strong draft at the PF. I think there are guys in the 2nd round who may end up being as productive as Rivers.

Don't kid yourself. Sullinger could very well be the next Greg Oden...bust on arrival. If people want to talk about the potential of Fab Melo, then they need to look no further, Rivers has probably the highest ceiling of anyone in the lottery IMO.

 

[NHUConnfan]

Is this a serious statement? Who does Rivers play over on the Celtics, Rondo? Bradley? Nope. Not this year, not in five years. So you want to trade 3 picks for a guard who cannot defend and has a lot of question marks and at best will be the 1st or 2nd gaurd off the bench on the Celtics for 3 picks?

Stick to the message boards and do not apply for a GM job anytime soon.

I agree with HuskyHawk that if Sully is healthy he will be a better pro then Rivers.

Rivers wouldn't take time away from either of them in the first few years because he wouldn't start right away. He obviously won't take over Rondo because Rivers is a SG whereas Rondo is a pure PG.

And yes, I'd trade those three picks because the Celtics did jack for them.

I hate the Sullinger pick. I hope I'm wrong but I see bust on arrival Greg Oden style. There's a very good reason this guy fell as far as he did and there certainly is precedent of tOSU players not holding up physically in the NBA. The Fab Melo pick...don't even get me started. There are so many things wrong with this pick. The Celtics need a C now...so they draft someone who is probably 1-2 years from actually making an impact in the NBA? Seriously what kind of sense does that make?!! And as far as Kris Joseph...might as well throw that pick away just like how Kris Joseph threw away his immense talent and never blossomed into the player he should have been in Syracuse. To show you how excited I am that the Celts drafted Joseph...I think it was a better decision when they signed Kevin Pittsnogle to a contract after he went undrafted (and subsequently failed to ever crack the NBA).

Danny Ainge blew this draft hard. I am really upset over these picks. Here are the losses to the Celtics in FA this year:

Kevin Garnett
Ray Allen
Brandon Bass
Marquis Daniels
Kenyon Dooling
Jeff Green
Ryan Hollins
Sasha Pavlovic
Mickael Pietrus
Greg Stiemsma (restricted)

Granted many of them were just role players...but losing people like Garnett, Allen, Bass, and Green (who unfortunately the Celtics traded for when they dealt Perkins) is a huge loss. Maybe one of these players will return, but I doubt more than one will call the TD Garden home court next season. And so the Celtics drafted someone who is destined to have a shortened career due to injury (not to mention now prone to injuries during the season as well), another who is not ready for NBA level competition, and another who will probably never make it out of the D-League.

The Celtics have a lot to do during FA, which will probably be their only chance to build a team that can scrape their way to the playoffs next year.

 

[UConn990411]

What the duck* are you talking about?

Garnett is coming back, Green will probably sign with the Celtics, Ray and Bass are maybes (one of them will likely be signed), and those role players could be had very easily.

I hated the Melo pick, but as far as guys with the potential to contribute right away Sullinger was as good as you were going to get at 21.

 

[NHUConnfan]

Garnett has yet to say anything and there is more speculation he'll retire, especially since Danny Ainge an hour ago said that he's not sure. If Ainge is not sure, no one is sure. In recent days, Green's agent has made it clear that a return to Boston is not a certainty given the amount of interest he's garnering. Ray Allen is about as 50/50 as you can get (though he certainly will be relegated to a role player's position) and Brandon Bass is probably the most likely of the group to resign (though I know there's a huge contingent of Celtics fans that would rather not see that happen.)

 

[DoctorBombay]

Don't quite understand the Melo-bashing here, and I'll chalk up most of it to pronounced Cuse haterade.
Melo works, and he works hard. The kid got better every game, and honestly, pleasantly surprised alot of Cuse fans.
The old adage "you can't teach size" applies here- and as a 20+ pick, what more can you expect other than that he'll work hard, be a role player and eventually get better?
We're not talking Olajuwan here...but I doubt he's a Thabeet either. I think taking a flyer on Fab was a good move, especially with Sully already in the fold.

 

[tykurez]

Garnett has yet to say anything and there is more speculation he'll retire, especially since Danny Ainge an hour ago said that he's not sure. If Ainge is not sure, no one is sure. In recent days, Green's agent has made it clear that a return to Boston is not a certainty given the amount of interest he's garnering. Ray Allen is about as 50/50 as you can get (though he certainly will be relegated to a role player's position) and Brandon Bass is probably the most likely of the group to resign (though I know there's a huge contingent of Celtics fans that would rather not see that happen.)

From what I hear Stiemsma, Pietrus, and Bass are all expected to sign ... and who wouldn't want Bass back? He was an obvious upgrade over Baby.

 

[aceboon]

this thread pretty much defines NBA discussions on the boneyard....yikes

 

[NHUConnfan]

From what I hear Stiemsma, Pietrus, and Bass are all expected to sign ... and who wouldn't want Bass back? He was an obvious upgrade over Baby.

My most hardcore Celtics fan friends. They think he's lazy and that his bad games cost the Celtics more than his good games help the Celtics. I'm not a particular subscriber to that belief...but I'd say there's a healthy contingent who believe that.

 

[HeGotGame]

My most hardcore Celtics fan friends. They think he's lazy and that his bad games cost the Celtics more than his good games help the Celtics. I'm not a particular subscriber to that belief...but I'd say there's a healthy contingent who believe that.

You say the C's needed to draft a C who can play now. But you do not say who they should have taken? There is no C in this draft outside of Davis that can step in and start now and at the 22 pick there will never be one sitting there, unless the player is a complete surprise. The C's are hoping Melo is that surprise.

So many posters on this board judge picks in a vaccumm, without looking at what other players are there and what the team needs. Like the Waiters bashing here is so nonsensical. All they see is a guy who didnt start going #4 without looking at the Cavs roster and the other options available.

So instead of bashing the Melo pick please tell me who is the center they should have taken at 22?????

 

[nomar]

Hey Nomar, I like the guy & nobody doubts his skill. He was probably a top 5 pick last year. I was just trying to point out that a guy with self-admitted weight issues and a herniated disk is a different type of roll of the dice. Ainge said last night that he'll need "short and long-term maintenance," whatever that means. Hope it works out for him and the C's.

We're on the same page. It is a roll of the dice. Hard to do at, say, #10. But at #21 I'm happy to roll the dice...

 

[nomar]

My most hardcore Celtics fan friends. They think he's lazy and that his bad games cost the Celtics more than his good games help the Celtics. I'm not a particular subscriber to that belief...but I'd say there's a healthy contingent who believe that.

Those are people who b*tch and moan about everybody. Bass was a big upgrade over Baby. Period. Those people hated Baby worse; they just forgot about it when they found someone new to complain about. Bass is no All-Star but he's a better shooter and rebounder than Baby was. Davis was good as a rook and 2nd year guy but then suddenly thought he was KG. He took waaaay too many 15-17 footers. Bass makes them, at least.

 

[nomar]

p.s. FWIW, NHU, on the RealGM main board there is a thread "Draft Winners & Losers" and pretty much 90% of people named Celtics in their list of Winners and I didn't see a single person name them as a Loser. And it's not like the Celtics are fan favorites on RealGM.

I don't like Melo, myself, but I do like Sullinger. I hope I'm right about him and wrong about Fab.

 

[NHUConnfan]

p.s. FWIW, NHU, on the RealGM main board there is a thread "Draft Winners & Losers" and pretty much 90% of people named Celtics in their list of Winners and I didn't see a single person name them as a Loser. And it's not like the Celtics are fan favorites on RealGM.

I don't like Melo, myself, but I do like Sullinger. I hope I'm right about him and wrong about Fab.

Everyone is basing their "grades" on the Celtics draft that Sullinger will be a success. If he fails to produce, those "grades" won't matter.

 

[UConn990411]

And what else are they supposed to base it on right now?

Sullinger has "DeJuan Blair steal" written all over him, and he already has an NBA-ready offensive game. When you're drafting at 21 like the Celtics were, that's a guy you take a chance on...especially when the C's had the 22nd pick as well.