OT: - Japan: State of Emergency | The Boneyard

OT: Japan: State of Emergency

Boy that's tough. Quite the embarrassment for the country.

Oddly, they had a whole extra year to work on getting their country/city in shape for the Olympics. Vaccines were widely available months ago. Not sure what the country has been doing since Christmas, but knowing the Olympics were coming seems like it should have been a motivating factor to get their "house" in order.

I wonder if there is any chance they will postpone them again? Or like the NBA and WNBA last year - try to put competitors in a bubble of some kind? It's going to be a big mess...
 
Beemer said:
I don't understand why only 15% of their population has been vaccinated.
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I posted on this awhile back. Japan has a long, laborious process for drug approval. Initial approval of vaccines in Japan did not happen until the end of February, 3 full months after the US EUA. None of the approved vaccines were being produced in Japan, so the logistics of shipping vaccines to Japan that required extreme temperature control presented a 2nd barrier.

In addition, much like the US and many other countries, the actual rollout of the vaccine to get shots in people’s arms was initially faulty. Finally, the Japanese people have a high degree of vaccine hesitancy.

If that all isn’t enough, Japan has the second oldest population of any country in the world. Only the tiny nation of Monaco is older.
 
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Beemer said:
I don't understand why only 15% of their population has been vaccinated.
Expand ...
From what I’ve read, there are multiple reasons. For some reason, they were late getting supplies of the vaccine. Then it was not enough techs to administer the shots. Now, it’s the culture that doesn’t trust foreign medicine. At this point, it’s fair to assume that the population is against getting the vaccine. A hell of a place to be sending our athletes.
 
oldude said:
I posted on this awhile back. Japan has a long, laborious process for drug approval. Initial approval of vaccines in Japan did not happen until the end of February, 3 full months after the US EUA. None of the approved vaccines were being produced in Japan, so the logistics of shipping vaccines to Japan that required extreme temperature control presented a 2nd barrier.

In addition, much like the US and many other countries, the actual rollout of the vaccine to get shots in people’s arms was initially faulty. Finally, the Japanese people have a high degree of vaccine hesitancy.

If that all isn’t enough, Japan has the second oldest population of any country in the world. Only the tiny nation of Monaco is older.
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Thank you.
 
FWIW based on 100K people: With a markedly younger population, the United States has 16 times MORE SARS-2 DEATHS THAN JAPAN despite Japan's dramatically older population (Japan 28% > 65 years old; top 5 oldest national population).

coronavirus.jhu.edu

Mortality Analyses - Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center

How does mortality differ across countries? Examining the number of deaths per confirmed case and per 100,000 population. A global comparison.
coronavirus.jhu.edu coronavirus.jhu.edu

www.worldatlas.com

Countries With The Oldest Population

Advances in medical science and lower fertility rates have increased the median age of populations in most developed countries.
www.worldatlas.com www.worldatlas.com
 
LoboDays said:
From what I’ve read, there are multiple reasons. For some reason, they were late getting supplies of the vaccine. Then it was not enough techs to administer the shots. Now, it’s the culture that doesn’t trust foreign medicine. At this point, it’s fair to assume that the population is against getting the vaccine. A hell of a place to be sending our athletes.
Expand ...
All those reasons are accurate along with others I listed above. For what it’s worth, a month ago Japan was at a 5% vaccination rate. They have done a respectable job in the last month or so, but it’s hard to recover when they started out so far behind.
 
If there is any positive news, at least for the US team, it’s that almost all of the athletes on the American team will be fully vaccinated. While the USOC does not mandate that US athletes are vaccinated, many of the few remaining holdouts have been persuaded by teammates to get the vaccine.
 
Beemer said:
I don't understand why only 15% of their population has been vaccinated.
Expand ...
Right. It's totally unlike the Japanese to be anything but uber-organized. I've traveled in Japan; they are the most precise and predictable people on the planet. Also, conformity is in high regard there. Drop a piece of refuse, and the person behind you will pick it up. Tell folks to line up; they will. Tell them to get vaxed . . ? Go figure.
Larger issue: why are these Games proceeding?
 
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Japan's health and medical insurance system is different from the US - or even northern Europe's varieties.

First their liability laws hold the Government accountable for adverse side-effects from vaccines, at least this had been a long-time standard since 1992 or so.

Second - if you've ever listened to a US Presidential debate you know/should know that the pharmaceutical companies are not universally loved or trusted even among the US Governmental bodies. Seems some think they overcharge or make misleading claims to sell products of dubious human safety.

Multiply that caution many times in Japan where health ministers have publicly stated skepticism over "drug company" data on safety or side-effects, especially with Oxford Astrazeneca's vaccine which is a different mechanism than Pfizer or Moderna. Japan's health ministers are on public record expressing concern over longer term side-effects not visible in the truncated time tests done by J&J, OA, P & Moderna. They cite public history of the international pharmaceuticals being caught with tampered control tests and being fined billions of dollars - years after the damage was done.

Japan has had bad experience with - what in the US is standard - mumps/measles/rubella vaccinations linked to aseptic meningitis. So the MMR vaccination is not common there.

Same too with the, now common in US, HPV vaccine.

Some of the international vaccines like Sputnik and/or Sinovac are in play in more countries and establishing longer/larger population trials with independent study results - versus in-house drug company sponsored studies. While Japan has tenuous relations with Russian/China, those vaccine trials are seen as more transparent.

You can argue if Japan's approach is overly cautious vs the US, but it is not cavalier. They are a very thoughtful society.
 
I really hate to say this, but maybe the USOC should shut down and not go. We are in pretty good shape, save a few states. Why should we take a chance of re-infecting ourselves and put our nations health in jeopardy. Tough decision, but do we want to take that chance after what we already have been through?
 
I think the U.S. should send whatever vaccine supply to other countries. Americans clearly don't want them, so why not let other countries have it where they are dying and desperate for vaccines? Australia for example. I think they are under 10% vaccinated because they simply cannot get their hands on enough vaccine.
 
caseyb7 said:
You can argue if Japan's approach is overly cautious vs the US, but it is not cavalier. They are a very thoughtful society.
Expand ...
Too late for the Olympics but I hope they are thoughtful enough to look at the U.S. and the correlation between low vaccinated states and hospitalizations.
 

Japan stepping up vaccine diplomacy to counter Chinese influence​

Japan is stepping up its COVID-19 vaccine diplomacy to counter Beijing’s move to strengthen its influence by supplying Chinese-made vaccines to developing countries.

Japan shipped COVID-19 vaccine doses to Vietnam on Wednesday after already shipping doses to Taiwan. The government plans to provide vaccine doses to more member states of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations.

www.japantimes.co.jp

Article expired

News on Japan, Business News, Opinion, Sports, Entertainment and More
www.japantimes.co.jp www.japantimes.co.jp
 
hoopsfan22 said:
I think the U.S. should send whatever vaccine supply to other countries. Americans clearly don't want them, so why not let other countries have it where they are dying and desperate for vaccines? Australia for example. I think they are under 10% vaccinated because they simply cannot get their hands on enough vaccine.
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I believe the US has already committed over 100 million doses to other countries, with more to come. The process takes time as the US has to insure that those countries who receive the vaccine are able to handle the logistics required in storing and administering the vaccines.

As an example, in June the US sent a contingent of the Rhode Island National Guard to the Bahamas to manage the distribution of 7000 vaccine doses across 7 of the more remote Family Islands in
The Bahamas.
 
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huskyd said:
Right. It's totally unlike the Japanese to be anything but uber-organized. I've traveled in Japan; they are the most precise and predictable people on the planet. Also, conformity is in high regard there. Drop a piece of refuse, and the person behind you will pick it up. Tell folks to line up; they will. Tell them to get vaxed . . ? Go figure.
Larger issue: why are these Games proceeding?
Expand ...
Why are stadiums allowed full capacity, why are people being urged to return to the work place? There are so many questions that beg an answer. Some questions to ponder. If the virus as stated by the pros is here to stay when do you think we return to living our lives? Are you living in a bubble? There are athletic events taking place almost world wide with fans in the stands. With no spectators and a bubble like setting to take place in Japan why not compete? If they host it athletes will come. Why? Because it's what they do. The Japanese people will not be in contact with the participants, those working the games will be separated from the general population, vaccinated or both. If people are looking for an iron clad guarantee that there will be no one infected, aint gonna happen. Let the games begin.
 
MooseJaw said:
Why are stadiums allowed full capacity, why are people being urged to return to the work place? There are so many questions that beg an answer. Some questions to ponder. If the virus as stated by the pros is here to stay when do you think we return to living our lives? Are you living in a bubble? There are athletic events taking place almost world wide with fans in the stands. With no spectators and a bubble like setting to take place in Japan why not compete? If they host it athletes will come. Why? Because it's what they do. The Japanese people will not be in contact with the participants, those working the games will be separated from the general population, vaccinated or both. If people are looking for an iron clad guarantee that there will be no one infected, aint gonna happen. Let the games begin.
Expand ...

This is true of life as well. There has never been any such thing as absolutely safe or absolutely no risk. Get vaccinated and/or masked up and get on with life.
 
They should have cancelled and moved the Olympic cycle up one, with Tokyo getting the 2024 games.
 
There will be some surprises standing on the podiums. There's no way athletes can avoid this obstacle course. No way.
 
MooseJaw said:
Why are stadiums allowed full capacity, why are people being urged to return to the work place? There are so many questions that beg an answer. Some questions to ponder. If the virus as stated by the pros is here to stay when do you think we return to living our lives? Are you living in a bubble? There are athletic events taking place almost world wide with fans in the stands. With no spectators and a bubble like setting to take place in Japan why not compete? If they host it athletes will come. Why? Because it's what they do. The Japanese people will not be in contact with the participants, those working the games will be separated from the general population, vaccinated or both. If people are looking for an iron clad guarantee that there will be no one infected, aint gonna happen. Let the games begin.
Expand ...
I hear you MJ. An argument can be made for both going ahead (which is what will happen) or shutting down. No one wants life to stop. We are just getting a taste of "normal," and who wants to go back to a shut down?
I suppose I wonder why what is avoidable (postponing the Games) isn't going to be avoided. If deaths and sickness occur, it will be tough, IMO, to justify. Just saying.
 
huskyd said:
I hear you MJ. An argument can be made for both going ahead (which is what will happen) or shutting down. No one wants life to stop. We are just getting a taste of "normal," and who wants to go back to a shut down?
I suppose I wonder why what is avoidable (postponing the Games) isn't going to be avoided. If deaths and sickness occur, it will be tough, IMO, to justify. Just saying.
Expand ...
True, however death and sickness will occur with or without the games. Who needs the games the most? From the perspective of the participants the games are a culmination of years of hard work, sacrifice, and for some amazing accolades. For the public, a return to some sort of normalcy and a celebration of national pride. To the Japanese govt, a recovery of billions of dollars while showcasing the beautiful sections of their country.
Life goes on, the virus goes on, we are learning how to live with it. We must continue to move on with life, to do otherwise is to spiral into a slow decline with no recovery in sight. We can't afford to stand still any longer, move on and live, hunker down and get left behind.
 
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MooseJaw said:
True, however death and sickness will occur with or without the games. Who needs the games the most? From the perspective of the participants the games are a culmination of years of hard work, sacrifice, and for some amazing accolades. For the public, a return to some sort of normalcy and a celebration of national pride. To the Japanese govt, a recovery of billions of dollars while showcasing the beautiful sections of their country.
Life goes on, the virus goes on, we are learning how to live with it. We must continue to move on with life, to do otherwise is to spiral into a slow decline with no recovery in sight. We can't afford to stand still any longer, move on and live, hunker down and get left behind.
Expand ...
These games will be anything but normal. Japan will now lose big if the games go on.

www.insidethegames.biz

Study finds Tokyo 2020 with no spectators would result in loss of $23 billion

A study has estimated that staging this year's Olympic and Paralympic Games in Tokyo without spectators would result in a ¥2.4 trillion (£16.9 billion...
www.insidethegames.biz www.insidethegames.biz

terrible for the athletes who worked so hard but it’s starting to make little sense to hold these games.
 
LoboDays said:
These games will be anything but normal. Japan will now lose big if the games go on.

www.insidethegames.biz

Study finds Tokyo 2020 with no spectators would result in loss of $23 billion

A study has estimated that staging this year's Olympic and Paralympic Games in Tokyo without spectators would result in a ¥2.4 trillion (£16.9 billion...
www.insidethegames.biz www.insidethegames.biz

terrible for the athletes who worked so hard but it’s starting to make little sense to hold these games.
Expand ...
I know there will be a large loss with no spectators. The loss without any games would be much more significant. No TV revenue, loss of exposure on special areas of interest videos always shown as fillers during the games. If you have watched the games before I don't need to go further, if you haven't watched before there is no need to have even started this discussion. We need these games, we have given up more than enough already. The talking heads have said the virus will be with us from now on, the question is will you continue to hide or will you come out and reclaim what life you have left? The athletes are coming out to play, they know the risks, let em live.
 
MooseJaw said:
I know there will be a large loss with no spectators. The loss without any games would be much more significant. No TV revenue, loss of exposure on special areas of interest videos always shown as fillers during the games. If you have watched the games before I don't need to go further, if you haven't watched before there is no need to have even started this discussion. We need these games, we have given up more than enough already. The talking heads have said the virus will be with us from now on, the question is will you continue to hide or will you come out and reclaim what life you have left? The athletes are coming out to play, they know the risks, let em live.
Expand ...
I agree that they should go on, separated largely from the Japanese population. And, with athletes generally vaccinated, having (reportedly) access to vaccinations, testing protocols, etc. and with the Athlete's Village essentially a sort of bubble, I don't see this as an event likely to be a super-spreader throughout the world and certainly not throughout the US.

That said, you are being (in my opinion) too "one size fits all" in your remarks. There are areas (and Japan is one, apparently, and lots of other nations) where vaccines are not well distributed, rates of infection are still (relatively) high and coming out and reclaiming the life they have left could mean making that life very, very short. There are areas in the US where folks are resuming life as normal at very high risk - it is within their rights to do so, of course, but I wouldn't rush if I was unvaccinated in an area of remaining significant spread. If my wife did not remain at personal high risk (immunosuppressed) I would probably be pretty much back to normal, as it is not an area presenting undo risk to someone vaccinated. Since she can't, I can't.
 
Almost No one in Japan wants these games to happen (83% according to a recent poll.). Why are they still on? The answer, my pentathlon fans, is NBC. As we speak, they are saki-ing and dining the officials
At the Geisha house of their choice trying to convince them to hold the games. NBC loses big time if they are cancelled.
 
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