Jacobs Column - Do You Agree

[Icebear]

I'm not going to reply to your entire post (even though I have opinions on the XL) but just add a response/comment to the quoted issue above:

The term"fortune" is nebulous and non-specific and had a different meaning to different people. But I think the notion is erroneous that putting in chairs with seat-backs (presumably equivalent or similar to those in the rest of the arena) in the bench sections of Gampel is "simple" (inexpensive etc.). If you look at the construction of Gampel, the rows/tiers of the facility are all based on concrete structure. This becomes critical to the problem when you realize that in order to put in seat-back chairs, the pitch (spacing) of the rows would have to significantly increase. That means that all that concrete in the bench areas would need to be jack-hammered out and new concrete formed in a whole new set of rows/spacing. (Probably means the steps all need to be re-done too). So replacing the benches with seats, I believe is a relatively "costly" proposition.

So when you are done with the new seating you lose seats due to increased width of each seat and reduced rows. I once speculated with some primitive math that the capacity would be reduced by 1000-1500 seats but I did not keep my logic and calcs so don't ask me to reproduce it now...I can't. I had done it after one visit there and eyeballing the seating in both the bench areas and chair-back areas ans doing some simple math.

What you are left with then after paying a fair bill for the "upgrade" is less capacity and probably less revenue unless you of course raise the ticket prices (which would probably happen).

Gampel in unfortunately too much of a compromise of a building and I truly feel that in the end a new structure would be a more efficient solution (but I don't really see that as much of a possibility in the foreseeable future). :-(

Anyway that's why I think the ripping out of the benches in not going to happen.but I'd be pleased as punch if it did.

Stop being practical, you party pooper.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

I'm not going to reply to your entire post (even though I have opinions on the XL) but just add a response/comment to the quoted issue above:

The term"fortune" is nebulous and non-specific and had a different meaning to different people. But I think the notion is erroneous that putting in chairs with seat-backs (presumably equivalent or similar to those in the rest of the arena) in the bench sections of Gampel is "simple" (inexpensive etc.). If you look at the construction of Gampel, the rows/tiers of the facility are all based on concrete structure. This becomes critical to the problem when you realize that in order to put in seat-back chairs, the pitch (spacing) of the rows would have to significantly increase. That means that all that concrete in the bench areas would need to be jack-hammered out and new concrete formed in a whole new set of rows/spacing. (Probably means the steps all need to be re-done too). So replacing the benches with seats, I believe is a relatively "costly" proposition.

So when you are done with the new seating you lose seats due to increased width of each seat and reduced rows. I once speculated with some primitive math that the capacity would be reduced by 1000-1500 seats but I did not keep my logic and calcs so don't ask me to reproduce it now...I can't. I had done it after one visit there and eyeballing the seating in both the bench areas and chair-back areas ans doing some simple math.

What you are left with then after paying a fair bill for the "upgrade" is less capacity and probably less revenue unless you of course raise the ticket prices (which would probably happen).

Gampel in unfortunately too much of a compromise of a building and I truly feel that in the end a new structure would be a more efficient solution (but I don't really see that as much of a possibility in the foreseeable future). :-(

Anyway that's why I think the ripping out of the benches in not going to happen.but I'd be pleased as punch if it did.

Biff- - -Agree with your post, but have said all along that the new training center should have been the new Gampel with a Jordan/Penn St. arena! With 12,000 to 15,000 seating capacity.
The old Gampel should have been renovated into the training facility! I don't know costs from what was done to what could have been done but Gampel as it is now is a dump and for an on campus arena that's a shame! I asked Neal Eskin the Asst. AD in an e-mail if the UCONN fans were so important to the Athletic Dept. how about discounting the bench seating $1 to $3 bucks a game and got no response! Remember when Warde Manuel came in as AD an said he wanted to get rid of the benches in Gampel? That ended quickly! I've never heard of a college do more to piss off their season ticket holders as UCONN does to us! We've been the most loyal fans across the board and pay the highest prices in the USA for everything, in season games especially Webster Bank Arena, conference tournaments, NCAA, etc. We paid $109.00 for AAC tix from the SUN ARENA all other conference tournaments are around $40.00 to $50.00!

 

[JFC613]

Biff- - -Agree with your post, but have said all along that the new training center should have been the new Gampel with a Jordan/Penn St. arena! With 12,000 to 15,000 seating capacity.
The old Gampel should have been renovated into the training facility! I don't know costs from what was done to what could have been done but Gampel as it is now is a dump and for an on campus arena that's a shame! I asked Neal Eskin the Asst. AD in an e-mail if the UCONN fans were so important to the Athletic Dept. how about discounting the bench seating $1 to $3 bucks a game and got no response! Remember when Warde Manuel came in as AD an said he wanted to get rid of the benches in Gampel? That ended quickly! I've never heard of a college do more to piss off their season ticket holders as UCONN does to us! We've been the most loyal fans across the board and pay the highest prices in the USA for everything, in season games especially Webster Bank Arena, conference tournaments, NCAA, etc. We paid $109.00 for AAC tix from the SUN ARENA all other conference tournaments are around $40.00 to $50.00!

Absolutely on the mark. Couldn't agree more!

 

[HoopsFan21]

Isn't Gampel only 20-something years old? Demolishing or replacing a building that young seems a little foolish. If there is something functionally wrong with the building, then why?

 

[Harry Mangurian]

Unfortunately, the reality of college sports - in general - and the world we live in as well - means that the costs to renovate or redo an on-campus facility are huge.

The cost for an off-campus renovation is also huge. Either way, the taxpayer foots the bill.
The best option for UCONN athletically and academically is to stay on-campus.
The new downtown Storrs and an on-campus "boola boola" atmosphere can do much to overcome
our "cow town" reputation with potential students and especially recruits.

 

[ThetaZoo]

The busway is going to be a surprisingly successful. And it is not easier to go to a game in Storrs than Hartford from Newington. That's silly.

For whom...the 100-200 people who currently commute by bus from New Britain to Hartford?

 

[alexrgct]

OK, I guess I have to state a contrarian opinion here...

The XL Center absolutely is a more important focal point as a facility than Gampel. It's a cash cow. I'm a rare exception to this because I'm equidistant between Hartford and Storrs, but the Hartford MSA has 1.2 million people (or about a third of the state's population). If you are one of those people, wouldn't you prefer to go to a game in town than drive 45+ minutes to Storrs? And what if you live in New Haven Country or Fairfield County? Storrs then becomes even more of a trek, whereas Hartford is readily manageable.

Meanwhile, the XL Center has the capacity for huge attendance- far more than Gampel. 16,249 people came to watch UConn beat Florida State for its 89th win in a row (yes, including me). Same with Baylor in 2013. Had the games been at Gampel, attendance could only have been 10,100. In other words, XL may not always sell out, but it can fail to sell out and still seat more people than would even be possible at Gampel.
n be
Finally, alcohol is readily available at XL. Again, it's a cash cow.

In summary, location is critical, and XL is a better location for the critical mass of Nutmeggers. If you want to drink booze while you're at a game, you can. If you want to eat at a lovely restaurant (think Trumbull Kitchen or Feng) before or after a game, your options are far better then the mediocre food court at the UConn student union. Finally, if the game is a compelling matchup against a highly-ranked team, more people can come to the XL Center than can go to Gampel to watch it.

The XL center is the more important arena. I don't think it needs to be massively renovated...unless, of course, the cash cow is losing its ability to be effectively milked.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

Isn't Gampel only 20-something years old? Demolishing or replacing a building that young seems a little foolish. If there is something functionally wrong with the building, then why?

HoopsFan21- - - -I think Gampel was built in the late 1980's, 1990! If you haven't been in Gampel recently, the roof/ceiling looks like tiles etc. will fall down and occasional leaks, concession areas are setup for the 1970's & 1980's, small selling area & food choices are non-existent= "little brown missiles of death" (hotdogs), cold pizza, natchos, pretzels, popcorn, no real dinner type items, aforementioned large # of bench seating! Compare to Mohegan Sun Arena, Penn St./Jordan Center, YUM Center/L'ville, Webster Bank Arena (the building, not the prices of tix/food/parking), Peterson Center/PITT, to name a few! For the quality of the MBB & WBB that play there they deserve a better showcase/facility, it's used and abused!

 

[Intpseeker]

OK, I guess I have to state a contrarian opinion here...

The XL Center absolutely is a more important focal point as a facility than Gampel. It's a cash cow. I'm a rare exception to this because I'm equidistant between Hartford and Storrs, but the Hartford MSA has 1.2 million people (or about a third of the state's population). If you are one of those people, wouldn't you prefer to go to a game in town than drive 45+ minutes to Storrs? And what if you live in New Haven Country or Fairfield County? Storrs then becomes even more of a trek, whereas Hartford is readily manageable.

Meanwhile, the XL Center has the capacity for huge attendance- far more than Gampel. 16,249 people came to watch UConn beat Florida State for its 89th win in a row (yes, including me). Same with Baylor in 2013. Had the games been at Gampel, attendance could only have been 10,100. In other words, XL may not always sell out, but it can fail to sell out and still seat more people than would even be possible at Gampel.
n be
Finally, alcohol is readily available at XL. Again, it's a cash cow.

In summary, location is critical, and XL is a better location for the critical mass of Nutmeggers. If you want to drink booze while you're at a game, you can. If you want to eat at a lovely restaurant (think Trumbull Kitchen or Feng) before or after a game, your options are far better then the mediocre food court at the UConn student union. Finally, if the game is a compelling matchup against a highly-ranked team, more people can come to the XL Center than can go to Gampel to watch it.

The XL center is the more important arena. I don't think it needs to be massively renovated...unless, of course, the cash cow is losing its ability to be effectively milked.

All valid points...if we were talking pro sports teams, but we aren't. University of Connecticut. College sports. Students. Campus...but not in the Land of Steady Habits.

Students drive to the Rent or Hartford or Bridgeport, or the Sun for a "home" game. This makes sense only if the university is complicit in selling their athletic teams to various locations for various quid pro quo.

Think Cameron. Think Thompson-Boling. Think Gample, if they put the students first to create an insane environment that becomes a factor in a home games.

YMMV

 

[Waquoit]

My pipe dream would be to have a bigger, better facility on campus that can hold as many people as the XL Center. UCONN students deserve that!

They do? Why? The billions the state has pumped into UConn isn't enough?

 

[Waquoit]

For whom...the 100-200 people who currently commute by bus from New Britain to Hartford?

Articles like this make me think it just might catch on.

 

[alexrgct]

All valid points...if we were talking pro sports teams, but we aren't. University of Connecticut. College sports. Students. Campus...but not in the Land of Steady Habits. Students drive to the Rent or Hartford or Bridgeport, or the Sun for a "home" game. This makes sense only if the university is complicit in selling their athletic teams to various locations for various quid pro quo. Think Cameron. Think Thompson-Boling. Think Gample, if they put the students first to create an insane environment that becomes a factor in a home games. YMMV

think the XL Center at either of the two games I mentioned previously and tell me it wasn't every bit as good a game atmosphere. I'm also thinking about the dinners I've had at Feng before those games and noting the best I could do near Gampel has been a taco salad. What's more, I'm thinking of the huge game against highly-lauded USF in January 2012. My then-girlfriend and I had a lovely time at the Wadsworth Atheneum before going to the game, which was very well attended by virtue of being on a Saturday afternoon.

I go to Gampel for games happily, and I'll be there February 9 for South Carolina. I'll also be in at the XL Center this coming Monday, and it'll be a great scene there against Duke.

 

[Padutch5]

Completely ignoring the financial aspects of the discussion, the university and the state blew it with off-campus athletic facilities. It is a university. Students attend the university. Going to an on-campus game is part of the student experience. And don't get me going about the schools approach to the student sections.

If this is only about the Benjamins, and you aren't taking care of the students who attend the university, don't expect them to pony up for the endowment when they haven't had the campus experience of a place like Duke, for example.

Just say in'.

I've tried to ignore this whole thread that has been rehashed numerous times. Living in Farmington, I will no longer go to Storrs for season tickets. I really have no reason to fight rush hour traffic through Hartford to get to Storrs for a 7:00 game. If you cut off all of the ticket holders [and contributors-- you know, those terrible business people] you can begin looking for UCONN back in the league with the New Hampshires and Vermonts.
I am not a UCONN grad, but have men's, women's (both for Hartford, not Storr's) and football season tickets. Take away Hartford games, and I no longer contribute. Yes it is about the Benjamins . Multiple me by 8000 or 9000 others and I think you put a pretty big dent in the athletic budget. For all of those lobbying for Storrs facilities, I'd like to to see you list where you live. Putting a stadium in Storrs basicly cuts off the most populous section of the state.
I'll support an earlier post. Our politicians put their money in a busway that makes no sense economicly, but maybe it does politically. Light rail from Storrs to Hartford would have made a lot more sense. In a state facing a major deficit by 2016, I don't see any of these pie in the sky platitudes about building new stadiums or arenas in Storrs happining anytime soon. By the way, Penn State men's basketball is averaging something around 6000 this year. People are unwilling to make that drive for just a game [Yes I recognize their men's and women's teams do not compare to UCONN's]

While I'm on a rant, please stop using Penn State as an example. Until we allow camping on site for at least one night before a football game , and we join the Big Ten, theree is no way Storrs and Happy Valley can be compared.. By the way, Penn State men's basketball is averaging something around 6000 this year. People are unwilling to make that drive for just a game [Yes I recognize their men's and women's teams do not compare to UCONN's]

 

[HoopsFan21]

I've tried to ignore this whole thread that has been rehashed numerous times. Living in Farmington, I will no longer go to Storrs for season tickets. I really have no reason to fight rush hour traffic through Hartford to get to Storrs for a 7:00 game. If you cut off all of the ticket holders [and contributors-- you know, those terrible business people] you can begin looking for UCONN back in the league with the New Hampshires and Vermonts.
I am not a UCONN grad, but have men's, women's (both for Hartford, not Storr's) and football season tickets. Take away Hartford games, and I no longer contribute. Yes it is about the Benjamins . Multiple me by 8000 or 9000 others and I think you put a pretty big dent in the athletic budget. For all of those lobbying for Storrs facilities, I'd like to to see you list where you live. Putting a stadium in Storrs basicly cuts off the most populous section of the state.
I'll support an earlier post. Our politicians put their money in a busway that makes no sense economicly, but maybe it does politically. Light rail from Storrs to Hartford would have made a lot more sense. In a state facing a major deficit by 2016, I don't see any of these pie in the sky platitudes about building new stadiums or arenas in Storrs happining anytime soon. By the way, Penn State men's basketball is averaging something around 6000 this year. People are unwilling to make that drive for just a game [Yes I recognize their men's and women's teams do not compare to UCONN's]

While I'm on a rant, please stop using Penn State as an example. Until we allow camping on site for at least one night before a football game , and we join the Big Ten, theree is no way Storrs and Happy Valley can be compared.. By the way, Penn State men's basketball is averaging something around 6000 this year. People are unwilling to make that drive for just a game [Yes I recognize their men's and women's teams do not compare to UCONN's]

Comparing UConn to Penn State is silly. They aren't similar. One school is small and set in the countryside and has maybe 20k students, the other is one of the largest universities in the country. Look at Google maps. That giant football stadium which is apparently the 2nd largest stadium in the world, has a baseball field and the Jordan Center basically across the street. Parking looks plentiful, and all the roads around it are wide and a block or two from an interstate and another highway. That whole center part of Pennsylvania is centered around the school while UConn is basically the unwanted stepchild in its community. Besides, who knows what is going to happen to the basketball programs in 5-10 years. When Geno leaves the women's program is more likely to become Tennessee Part 2 than Geno Part 2. And on the men's side it's even more difficult to predict the future. The best plan is to sit tight with what we have, hope to get into a P5 conference, and re-evaluate after Geno retires to assess need. We can't build a new arena every 25-30 years just because some people want better nachos. I'd rather as much money as possible go into academics anyway. If Louisville wants to be a glorified community college with a great arena, then so be it, but I'd rather UConn be known more for academics than for basketball.

 

[Intpseeker]

They do? Why? The billions the state has pumped into UConn isn't enough?

Yikes! Are you serious or am I missing your sarcasm?

See...UCONN is a school. Students go to that school. Some of those students are athletes. The students who are not competing go to watch their fellow students compete against other schools athletes. It is about the students, and only in an ancillary way about non-students.

And for Connecticut to not have a world-class university, which costs bucks for sure, for her best students, would be a joke, kinda like Uconn (which it used to be before CT began rebuilding the '50's era cow college) was in the early to mid 1990's.

 

[alexrgct]

Another point of fact: attendance today at the SMU game was 9,972. That's an excellent number. The weather was lovely, it was on a Saturday...and the opponent was terrible. And yet nearly 10,000 people, or close to the capacity of Gampel, showed up for the game. This underscores the importance of the XL Center. Location and capacity matter.