Irrefutable, Undeniable ...

[RS9999X]

I don't think the average person can tell the difference between the New Big East and the New CUSA in football.

Watch UCF, SMU, Cincy, or UConn?

Or watch East Carolina, Hawaii, Nevada, or Colorado State?
If they add Temple and UMass -- average fans won't care.

 

[Carl Spackler]

There is no separation for me. I consider all sports when evaluating the conference. I find it a major negative that there are teams that are on the sidelines for aspects of the league. I don't like FB only or BB only schools. I think it fosters division and makes what should be a conference must more like a marriage of convenience. In the SEC UK is almost always among the worst at football, but best at basketball. Kansas is the same in the Big XII and Indiana at least used to be in the Big 10. UCLA in Pac 10. There's a balance. We have no balance. Losing to Boise on the football field will be less enjoyable knowing we can't stomp them at soccer and basketball. Plus I hate the idea of games in the western and mountain time zones, they better be day games, or nobody will see them.

I certainly don't agree that the football is better than it was before the defections of Miami, VT and BC. It may be a wash with what we recently had, at least until Louisville departs.

Now that's a nice response. Gets to the heart of the matter. College sports. Scholastic sports in general. Rivalry across all sports, rivalry in brand. Yale v. Harvard. Not lost - they got out the game a long time ago by stopping awarding grant aids (schollies). Kansas v. Missouri. It's lost. because of TV money. West Virginia v. Pittsburgh. Lost. TV money. Syracuse v. UConn. Lost. TV money.

Television money and the power of television revenue to drive college football decision making was opened up in the mid 1980s. Anti trust laws. Oklahoma and Georgia state universities suing the NCAA over regulating the numbers of football games that can be broadcast every year.

At the same time, ESPN was building it's empire based on the fact that there was no such regulation of broadcasting basketball games, adn the big east conference capitalized on it.

Ever since, the pursuit of top dollar in broadcasting has driven the movement of athletic programs around the country. Football drives the bus. Basketball has a place in the game becuase of the draw of the NCAA tournament, and the possibility that anybody can win.

The chaos in the intercollegiate landscape, won't stop until the same thing exists in the college football post season.

 

[gars44]

This is just nuts. What does culture have to do with it? I don't get the obsession with cultural or regional similarities or differences. You're really going to roll out the picnic blanket and have wine and cheese with your football opponent's fans? These are going to be your buddies that you can share your cultural affinities with? This has got to be one of the most ridiculous things to worry about that I've come across. Apart from message boards, people don't care too much about this cultural thing about what football team you play against. People care about winning. Until we figure out how to do that, let's not worry about cultural fits. To me it's almost laughable. Let's play ball and stop whining.

 

[baggerbob]

The BCS needs to be eliminated at the next vote for one obvious reason it is fatally flawed. Before the BCS teams from all the Big 6 conferences had a chance to be national champion. Since the advent of the BCS the SEC is guaranteed to have a representative and this year had both. The reason is the use of the national polls as part of the equation. Mr morris of south carolina in the AP basketball poll earlier this year showed why the polls are very biased. When everyone else was voting Syracuse 1st or 2nd he was voting us 4th and his reasoning was at the beginning of the season they weren't as talented as Ken,Ohio St, or North Carolina so i won't vote them any higher then 4th. That kind of bias occurs also in Heisman voting in the south whereas other regions of the country are more likely to vote based upon results. You need to eliminate the human element, thats why some kind of playoff between the conferences needs to be implemented.

 

[Jericho]

Yes, I admit I wish we were going elsewhere. And I'm still gonna go to all the games and have a great time. Bit isn't it a fact that the actual strength of the teams coming in will exceed the that of the teams leaving. And the overall level of play we'll see at The Rent will be at an all-time high? More good teams visiting than ever?

It's definitely not a fact. It's certainly possible, depending on how you count how good the teams are/were. But it seems Houston/SMU/Boise State are all peaking now. June Jones has rebuilt SMU, but barely avoided leaving for ASU. If he does leave, whether now or in a year, it will be a tough replacement for that program. Houston's already lost their coach, their star QB, and had their best season since the Andre Ware days. Are they really going to continue that type of season every year? And Boise State had a pretty much unprecedented run of success. All against lower tier competition. I see a lot of similarities of when Miami left and went into a funk. Houston and Boise State in particular are ripe to regress at least some. Not to say that have to suck, but Boise State cannot be expected to got 11-2 or 12-2 each season. And that's not including schools like UCF or Memphis, who have generally struggled against middle tier competition (UCF did have that one good year).

I think people are being optimistic in assuming the New Big East will be better. Pittsburgh and Syracuse may have regressed, but West Virginia was the class of the conference. And while schools like Rutgers, Cincy, and Louisville have had good runs, all have lost their coaches. There's a lot of questions to be answered. And outside of Boise State, no team that can be counted on to be ranked consistently.

Now the nature of football places the largest portion of the schedule on conference play. So someone will have to win those games. And someone will have to post decent records. And maybe some good programs emerge. But it's no guarantee, only a hope. We will have to see...

 

[ZooCougar]

It's more than just cultural differences and regional similarities. It's better for us to be in a conference with other institutions like ours. Otherwise you get a conference full of schools with divergent interests. When everyone is pulling in the same direction, that can be a powerful thing.

When half of you conference plays football, and the other half doesn't, and that half just wants the benefit of association with a BCS conference then you have instability.

It's not about having a picnic with all three of Memphis's fans. It's about having like interests and having operational and strategic strategies that support each other.

You guys think it's some kind of accident that the most successful and stable conferences are also the most homogenous? SEC, B1G, Ivy, SWAC, PAC 12 etc..

But at least we'll have conference for a few more years, at least until the next seismic shift occurs and people come back to their senses.

So who is in our conference these days? Did we add Iona and FIU yet?

 

[HuskyHawk]

This is just nuts. What does culture have to do with it? I don't get the obsession with cultural or regional similarities or differences. You're really going to roll out the picnic blanket and have wine and cheese with your football opponent's fans? These are going to be your buddies that you can share your cultural affinities with? This has got to be one of the most ridiculous things to worry about that I've come across. Apart from message boards, people don't care too much about this cultural thing about what football team you play against. People care about winning. Until we figure out how to do that, let's not worry about cultural fits. To me it's almost laughable. Let's play ball and stop whining.

I disagree entirely. The rivalry for the Red Sox is the Yankees. The SF Giants - Dodgers. Bama-Auburn, KU-Mizzou, UT-A&M, Yale-Harvard. There is no way that UConn ever develops any rivalry with San Diego State. They are too distant and too dissimilar. Other than Rutgers, there is no way we develop any rivalry with any football team in the conference. It matters.

 

[metsfan2323]

Other than Rutgers, there is no way we develop any rivalry with any football team in the conference. It matters.

So we haven't had a rivalry with West Virginia? The basketball team hasn't had a rivalry with Louisville?

There have been two games at the Rent that have resulted with a storming of the field, West Virginia and South Florida. I'll take those non-rivalry games over any game we have had with Syracuse.

Our rival is any good team that is blocking our path to a conference title.

 

[HuskyHawk]

So we haven't had a rivalry with West Virginia? The basketball team hasn't had a rivalry with Louisville?

There have been two games at the Rent that have resulted with a storming of the field, West Virginia and South Florida. I'll take those non-rivalry games over any game we have had with Syracuse.

Our rival is any team that is blocking our path to a conference title.

No, we don't have those rivalries. Stop thinking like this is a football conference, with some other sports added on that are irrelevant. Football is not the most important sport at UConn. Louisville has never been a hoops rival, not even close. Syracuse is really our only hoops rival with PC in the dumper. For the women it is Rutgers and ND. Football has no rivals. That doesn't mean there aren't important games on the schedule. A rivalry is what makes an unimportant game a can't miss event. It's a big part of what makes college sports fun.

 

[metsfan2323]

A rivalry is what makes an unimportant game a can't miss event. .

If that is the definition of a rivalry we have never had a rivalry with anyone and never will. Northeast fans are too fickle to be passionate about an unimportant game. You may find that type of passion in the south but not in CT.

Louisville has never been a hoops rival? Yikes.

I take it you have the UMASS game circled on your schedule.

 

[Adios]

We have Rutgers and Syracuse as rivals in football, at the very least. Hope you live in CT. Looks like the medical marijuana bill will pass this time.

 

[Carl Spackler]

No, we don't have those rivalries. Stop thinking like this is a football conference, with some other sports added on that are irrelevant. Football is not the most important sport at UConn. Louisville has never been a hoops rival, not even close. Syracuse is really our only hoops rival with PC in the dumper. For the women it is Rutgers and ND. Football has no rivals. That doesn't mean there aren't important games on the schedule. A rivalry is what makes an unimportant game a can't miss event. It's a big part of what makes college sports fun.

That is exactly the kind of thinking, that has gotten us where we're at kid.

 

[Adios]

We should schedule UMass for a game every year in football.

More money was spent on football than any other athletic program. I don't even know why I bothered to type that out.

 

[metsfan2323]

We should schedule UMass for a game every year in football.

I agree, we should have UMASS on the schedule every year. I actually think they are a local rival. I'm pretty sure HuskyHawk has said in the past that UMASS is not a rival even though they fit his definition to a tee.

IMO rivalries are something that develop organically, they are hard to define. Pitt has developed into a great Hoops rival due to some great, meaningful games we have had against them, and UMASS is also a rival even though we never play them.

In the 80's the Mets had rivalries with the Cubs and Cardinals, in the 90's it was the Braves and now its the Phillies. The Jets main rival was traditionally the Dolphins, but it is now the Pats because of their recent success.

Duke is without question a great hoops rival. The Boneyard is constantly obsessed with Duke.

 

[mets1090]

No, we don't have those rivalries. Stop thinking like this is a football conference, with some other sports added on that are irrelevant. Football is not the most important sport at UConn. Louisville has never been a hoops rival, not even close. Syracuse is really our only hoops rival with PC in the dumper. For the women it is Rutgers and ND. Football has no rivals. That doesn't mean there aren't important games on the schedule. A rivalry is what makes an unimportant game a can't miss event. It's a big part of what makes college sports fun.

If you don't think we have a basketball rivalry with Pitt you are off your rocker.

And football doesn't have any "true" rivals because they've only been playing D1-A for like 10 years. Rutgers is clearly heading towards being a rival with all the ridiculously close games we've head with them and the general dislike of New Jersey and Rutgers that we hold in Connecticut.

 

[mets1090]

We should schedule UMass for a game every year in football.

More money was spent on football than any other athletic program. I don't even know why I bothered to type that out.

I think we should schedule UMass every year. They would replace a school like Buffalo with a more local school that would probably draw a much bigger crowd.

 

[Carl Spackler]

I agree, we should have UMASS on the schedule every year. I actually think they are a local rival. I'm pretty sure HuskyHawk has said in the past that UMASS is not a rival even though they fit his definition to a tee.

IMO rivalries are something that develop organically, they are hard to define. Pitt has developed into a great Hoops rival due to some great, meaningful games we have had against them, and UMASS is also a rival even though we never play them.

In the 80's the Mets had rivalries with the Cubs and Cardinals, in the 90's it was the Braves and now its the Phillies. The Jets main rival was traditionally the Dolphins, but it is now the Pats because of their recent success.

Duke is without question a great hoops rival. The Boneyard is constantly obsessed with Duke.

My favorite UConn v. Duke moment in time, is when Rod Sellers drove Christian Laettner's head into the hardwood floor with his forearm in I believe 1991. He was suspened a tournament game the following year. But Rod Sellers will always be my favorite UConn b-ball player of all time because of that I think. Good reason why football players should stick to football. I was a disaster in pick up basketball. I could only play with other football players.

I love watching good basketball though. It's such an amazing game.

 

[metsfan2323]

I love watching good basketball though. It's such an amazing game.

.
Make sure you watch the Knicks then. Lin's basketball IQ is off the charts. Magic Johnson like.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I agree, we should have UMASS on the schedule every year. I actually think they are a local rival. I'm pretty sure HuskyHawk has said in the past that UMASS is not a rival even though they fit his definition to a tee.

IMO rivalries are something that develop organically, they are hard to define. Pitt has developed into a great Hoops rival due to some great, meaningful games we have had against them, and UMASS is also a rival even though we never play them.

In the 80's the Mets had rivalries with the Cubs and Cardinals, in the 90's it was the Braves and now its the Phillies. The Jets main rival was traditionally the Dolphins, but it is now the Pats because of their recent success.

Duke is without question a great hoops rival. The Boneyard is constantly obsessed with Duke.

I would love to have UMass as rival. Since we stopped playing them in any sport, I don't think they are right now.

 

[gars44]

I disagree entirely. The rivalry for the Red Sox is the Yankees. The SF Giants - Dodgers. Bama-Auburn, KU-Mizzou, UT-A&M, Yale-Harvard. There is no way that UConn ever develops any rivalry with San Diego State. They are too distant and too dissimilar. Other than Rutgers, there is no way we develop any rivalry with any football team in the conference. It matters.

I suppose it matters, just not that much at this point. Everything matters to some degree or another. Look. It would have been nice if back in the early 50's the decision was made at Uconn to compete at the upper levels, and we had a nice tradition like Syracuse or Pitt. But we didn't, and we don't. A much bigger concern right now is winning games, getting ranked, getting known, getting respect. Your concerns with rivalries are valid. The big problem with that is that none of the teams that you want us to be rivals with are interested in being rivals with us. They don't want it. I don't mean to be glib. But the evidence is, as Pudge would say, "Irrefutable, Undeniable." They voted with their feet. They don't want to be our rival. So, we should more concern ourselves with recruiting, and winning, and getting ranked, and actually, that is just what PP, and Susan Herbst and the rest of the Uconn administration appears to be doing. In retrospect, rich rivalries would have been nice. That decision was made long ago, and we now live with it. Let's roll!

 

[gars44]

It's more than just cultural differences and regional similarities. It's better for us to be in a conference with other institutions like ours. Otherwise you get a conference full of schools with divergent interests. When everyone is pulling in the same direction, that can be a powerful thing.

When half of you conference plays football, and the other half doesn't, and that half just wants the benefit of association with a BCS conference then you have instability.

It's not about having a picnic with all three of Memphis's fans. It's about having like interests and having operational and strategic strategies that support each other.

You guys think it's some kind of accident that the most successful and stable conferences are also the most homogenous? SEC, B1G, Ivy, SWAC, PAC 12 etc..

Yeah, but that all didn't happen overnight. Yes they are stable, but we didn't join back then. The stable conference we were in, where we had the rich rivalries and traditions, was the Yankee Conference. We quit that, yes? So, we didn't treasure our wonderful, decades old rivalries all that much when we had the chance to. We instead jumped off the ship, and contributed to the demise of those storied rivalries with Umass, Maine and New Hampshire. Those are our traditions.

And as to your point that we don't have a common interest with our new conference partners, that's just not true. Basketball has taken such a seat in the back that it has become as important as the lacrosse or hockey programs in the order of things. We have a lot in common with our new mates: football, football, football. That's all it is anymore. The rest is filler material.

 

[MTHusky]

I think we should schedule UMass every year. They would replace a school like Buffalo with a more local school that would probably draw a much bigger crowd.

Don't think replacing Buffalo anytime soon will happen with our new AD from there.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Yeah, but that all didn't happen overnight. Yes they are stable, but we didn't join back then. The stable conference we were in, where we had the rich rivalries and traditions, was the Yankee Conference. We quit that, yes? So, we didn't treasure our wonderful, decades old rivalries all that much when we had the chance to. We instead jumped off the ship, and contributed to the demise of those storied rivalries with Umass, Maine and New Hampshire. Those are our traditions.

And as to your point that we don't have a common interest with our new conference partners, that's just not true. Basketball has taken such a seat in the back that it has become as important as the lacrosse or hockey programs in the order of things. We have a lot in common with our new mates: football, football, football. That's all it is anymore. The rest is filler material.

I know that I'm cuckoo. BTW. It's when you don't know, that it's a problem.....

But anyway, basketball most definitely doesn't have to take a back seat, and shouldn't take a back seat. There are three money makers in intercollegiate athletics, and basketball makes up two of them.

the issue, is that basketball simply does not have the same social, and economic impact that football does. That fact does nothing to diminish the importance of big east basketball, and the big east schools that only compete in basketball in the future.

The best things those programs can do, is to be the best they can be in basketball, recruit, win games, get nationally ranked and win big east conference tournament games, and ncaa tournament games.

There was time, just over 10 short years ago, where the Big East conference, could have taken over the national landscape of intercollegiate athletics from the SEC and gotten control of the broadcasting market and college football post season.

The only reason it didn't happen, was because football was in the back seat when it came to leadership and decision making throughout the conference.

With football in the front seat, and Big East basketball doing it's thing in the front seat passenger side......it can happen again.

What has to happen, is that some of those doormat Catholic programs over the year, yes....you Providence, Seton Hall, St. John's..........Need to step up and fill the void that Syracuse, Pitt and WVU have left in basketball.

And for the new football programs, to go out and continue to win regular season games, and post season games.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Yeah, but that all didn't happen overnight. Yes they are stable, but we didn't join back then. The stable conference we were in, where we had the rich rivalries and traditions, was the Yankee Conference. We quit that, yes? So, we didn't treasure our wonderful, decades old rivalries all that much when we had the chance to. We instead jumped off the ship, and contributed to the demise of those storied rivalries with Umass, Maine and New Hampshire. Those are our traditions.

And as to your point that we don't have a common interest with our new conference partners, that's just not true. Basketball has taken such a seat in the back that it has become as important as the lacrosse or hockey programs in the order of things. We have a lot in common with our new mates: football, football, football. That's all it is anymore. The rest is filler material.

BTW: You forgot URI and that pathetic looking sheep with horns.

The Big East conference, and basketball, and the decision to forget rivalry and tradition in favor of broadcasting dollars - for basketball, not football......and jumping off the ship back then, has given us the opportunity to be among the largest and finest state flagship universities in the country. That's the ultimate irony in all of this, that very few around here will probably have the same understanding that I do of this.

Long before large scale universities were dumping on athletic rivalry traditions around football for broadcasting dollars, we did the exact same thing because of basketball. We owe everything we are in 2012, to the Big East conference - good and bad. And I believe we have paid that bitch, karma, back 10 fold and are now due to move forward even/steven.

 

[UCFBfan]

I think the biggest part that will be missed with the New Big East is the travelling fan bases. I love when fans from other schools fill the visitor section and add a different element to the taligating/game environment. However, think of the games that usually have few fans in the visitor section, USF and Louisville come to mind. How many Boise, SDSU, SMU, Houston, UCF, or Memphis fans are going to travel to East Hartford for a football game? I think we all know the answer.

I look forward to the hopeful re-alignment of all teams into geographic footprints. I don't know if this will ever happen but one can hope. The Northeast isn't huge on college football but imagine if all the major teams were in the same division? BC, Syracuse, Penn St, Pitt, RU, UConn, MD? Think of the great rivalries! However, this is all probably a pipe dream. However, I don't see why it couldn't happen. There's no long standing ties to any of these teams current conferences. The longest tenured team is Penn St in the B1G (it might actually be Maryland....not sure on that). Even that tenure is as early as 1994. I really wish a Northeast conference would be formed (not the current one!). It could be great in basketball and football and maybe make the Northeast care about college football again!