Geno & Tara on Number of Female Coaches (merged threads)

[PhillyCoach]

Please enlighten me--how does this infantile name calling show tolerance, diversity and inclusion? Deadspin and other such sites are just a waste of time and energy for me. There was little to no information shared that raised the conversation to "interesting" or "informative." I think I will go take a shower after reading that drivel. Then back to my stats and film review!

 

[Roger G]

Her report has the depth of a middle school book report.

 

[drweo]

I knew this was going to happen as I was watching Tara presser live. There are no sides to pick here. Tara and Geno have two separate (non-conflicting) theories as to why the number of women coaches are declining. Both theories are perfectly valid.
Geno says the number of women coaches are declining because Women have more & better options.
Tara says the women that are in the profession are not properly supported and compared to men don't have the ability to "recycle"-move from one job to another like Jhonny Dawkins getting fired at Stanford and moving on in a few weeks to coach UCF?

As Coco points out, the two explanations are not in conflict. Coach Auriemma says there are more and better opportunities available for women. Coach VanDeVeer says there are fewer phys ed majors, which she sees as the prep/avenue for future coaches. So women are majoring in non-sports related subjects and so pursuing other professions. Where is the conflict? Still, I think Coach Auriemma's explanation was over-simplified.

 

[CocoHusky]

I did listen to the entire session and while there is much else discussed regarding opportunities and lifestyle issues which I am at best luke warm on (all people/genders want to maximize lifestyle issues no shocker) , I imagine some people including me focused on the detail that concerns them the most. I for one do not care one bit about the demographics of the coaching staffs. I just care about the growth of the game.
I pointed out the 'spoiled kids and better opportunities part' because it affected "me" the most. Such comments and generalizations , even if out of context which they really were not, imho are not helpful to the growth of the game and attracting the best coaches. If you make the job sound like a thankless painful hardship that is not worthwhile (which is just opinion), how do we get the best coaches to consider these options (man or women).
I like listening to Geno and like his fearlessness to comment on any subject but sometimes, this leads to less than stellar responses.

Context has to be in relation to the original question which was about "demographics of the coaching staffs", specifically, the declining number of female head coaches. If we don't keep context in mind then any answer, to any question, can be about any subject. The growth of the game, NCAA attendance, scheduling format were all addressed in separate questions of the coaches. Quite honestly I'm surprised that Geno answer about " What best for ESPN not being best for his Student Athletes" was going to get more play today.

 

[UcMiami]

You may well be right about this Coco. I still don't understand why women have better choices and why men don't.....

The level of news reporting generally is so bad that no one can trust anything anymore. And sports reporting of WCBB doesn't command the best of a bad lot of reporters (which itself is sexist). See the thread I started with the NYTimes version which doesn't contain that (to my mind, unfortunate) quotation.

I think the point Geno was making is not that women have better choices than men, but that the change in our society over the last 30 years has increased the better options for women at a greater pace so the choices confronting women coming out of college with a degree are significantly different and much better than they were 30 years ago. They are still not equal to men, but they are an order of magnitude better than they were.

In his comments he talked about the choices 30 years ago were teaching or coaching which obviously is an oversimplification, but ... the opportunities are much more varied and the glass ceiling is much higher than it was.

 

[Wally East]

I think the point Geno was making is not that women have better choices than men, but that the change in our society over the last 30 years has increased the better options for women at a greater pace so the choices confronting women coming out of college with a degree are significantly different and much better than they were 30 years ago. They are still not equal to men, but they are an order of magnitude better than they were.

In his comments he talked about the choices 30 years ago were teaching or coaching which obviously is an oversimplification, but ... the opportunities are much more varied and the glass ceiling is much higher than it was.

That's fine but there's been a noticeable drop just in the last five or six years. That would appear to be a period too small to be explained by societal changes.

 

[Wally East]

I hope he is right but I don't have any data to prove one way or the other. Do you? If you don't have stats to support your belief that he is wrong, then you can only say you believe otherwise, not that he is wrong. So often opinions masquerade as facts.

Well, I'd love to see the data supporting him. Otherwise, he, too, is stating an opinion. An opinion that's more informed but still an opinion.

 

[ivrytontusker]

From the article:

When McGraw last had an opening for an assistant coach at Notre Dame, she said, the proportion of male applicants compared with women was about 70 percent to 30 percent.

Men will go where there is money, like the article says. There is money in WCBB now, which was not true 40 years ago. So that's where men are going.

 

[UcMiami]

That's fine but there's been a noticeable drop just in the last five or six years. That would appear to be a period too small to be explained by societal changes.

But that is the period - 20 years or so, for progression of a career starting in coaching to getting a D1 coaching job. Changes at the top which is what people are talking about trickle up from the ground level.

 

[UcMiami]

Well, I'd love to see the data supporting him. Otherwise, he, too, is stating an opinion. An opinion that's more informed but still an opinion.

Look at any study of corporate America percentage of employment of women in mid-level jobs - glass ceiling is still there, but ... Or number of women employed in any professional positions - college professors, doctors, lawyers, etc. It is an upward trend over the last 30 years.

 

[PhillyCoach]

Facts are that college graduates DO have more opportunities. Fact: more women graduate from college, more women are in Law School and more women are in Med School. Sounds to me like Geno had a strong point.

 

[UcMiami]

The other thing to realize here is that all three coaches that got this question (i don't believe Vic was asked) were in a pregame press conference and took maybe 3 minutes to give an answer to a very complex question. If you really want an answer and not a sound bite, you need to sit down for an hour at least with each of them and preferably with them all together and discuss it. Are more better paying jobs part of the equation - yes. Is alternative job opportunity a factor - yes. Is there some bias in hiring - yes, and both ways! Is life style choice a factor - yes. Are there other factors - yes. You have 3 minutes - why are their a lower percentage of coaches in WCBB at D1? Start now .... pencils down your three minutes are up!

Muffett also gave an answer to this type of question where she noted that for her last assistant job opening the applications she received were about 70-30 men to women, and her suggestion was maybe more women do not want to change schools - that they are more interested in the other aspects of life than purely career advancement than men are - pretty sexist answer on the face of it. But in surveys women tend to be more the quality of life choices than men are on a range of issue so sexist might also be said to be realistic in the real world in this case.

 

[ASweet3781]

The non PC answer is there are more good male coaches than women.

I don't think Mississippi State, Oregon State, Washington, and Syracuse are regretting the men they hired.

 

[CBear01]

Geno has always tended to respond with many many words to make a simple point. And that's all he was doing. He was simply saying that the work force environment is vastly different today than it was 30 years ago. And he's absolutely right and no one can argue against that point. Women today in the work force do essentially have more opportunities and the culture of women working has changed greatly over the course of modern time.

Look, it's just Geno. He's not in politics nor is he someone of such special importance that this question asked of him has really any significance. It's being blown up bc he's GENO. He offered an opinion, not a fact nor an official "public stance" on the issue. He answered honestly with his opinion. And opinions, as far as the last time I checked, can be agreed with or fought against as it is the natural way of events.

Man, give the guy a break. He just brought our Huskies once again UNDEFEATED to the final four!

 

[CajunHusky]

Facts are that college graduates DO have more opportunities. Fact: more women graduate from college, more women are in Law School and more women are in Med School. Sounds to me like Geno had a strong point.

No Geno doesn't have a strong point... there is an assumption implied in your facts that is because there are more opportunities there are insufficient number of qualified women for WBB coaching jobs. Doesn't work. You can just as easily make the assumption that there are less women in coaching because WBB coaching jobs are now more acceptable to men (money etc), and women are increasingly being shut out.

 

[j66kicker]

I don't agree with everything Geno said, or with everything Tara said. But to me the fundamental difference in their responses was Geno assigned responsibility for the trend to women themselves. This is typical of what I expect from "Mr. Accountability." OTOH Tara assigned blame outside of the women coaches themselves ("opportunity/lack of recycling"). (I had no expectations one way or the other from her on this).

 

[CajunHusky]

Read a study ...... from your own opinion.

Where Are the Women? | An NCAA Champion Feature | NCAA.org

 

[HuskyFan1125]

This is typical GA at the FF, anything to divert the attention to himself and off of his players. He does or says something like this every year. Lobo has even mentioned this how he protects the players and puts all spotlight on himself. He is the master at this.

 

[chrissaran]

Chris Dailey, Shea Ralph, Marisa Moseley, Jen Rizzotti, Jamelle Elliott, Tonya Cardoza, Carla Berube, Morgan Valley, Kristin Caruso, Wendy Davis, Stacy Hansmeyer, Tamika Williams Raymond, Paige Sauer, Brittany Hunter, Charlene Curtis, Meghan Culmo, Nykesha Sales

"I'm not coaching girls; I'm coaching athletes." Sue Bird, Diana Taurasi, Swin Cash, Maya Moore, Tina Charles, Breanna Stewart, Ashja Jones

 

[Charliebball]

Per Raul:

Geno Auriemma: ‘Not as many women want to coach.’ His daughter: ‘DAD. WALK IT BACK.’

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Geno should have just said "I don't know the reason,why and I wouldn't want to speculate". In today's PC world your not allowed to have an opinion unless it is a liberal one. You're (Geno) would be better off just saying nothing.

Actually, his opinion is "liberal" - he believes it is because women have better opportunities, and if you knew anything about your own coach you would realize that he has consistently supported that sort of thing, including opportunities within WBB.

The objection may be phrased by some that it isn't "pc" - (btw, I'm quite liberal but think "pc" needs to go away) buy the real objection I had was "oversimplification". Other opportunities for women's careers are a part of the issue, but there is certainly little doubt that more men have become interested in the coaching positions as the pay and perception of the job have become better than was the case when most coaches were women.

 

[oldude]

I have to believe that if Geno were given the opportunity to answer the question a 2nd time, he would likely answer it differently. At the same time, Geno has done more to promote women coaches in his sport than any other individual I can name. In addition to all the former Husky players that Geno has encouraged, promoted and provided references for, there are a number of coaches like Sherri Coale at Oklahoma that have their jobs in part because of a strong recommendation from Geno.

 

[EricLA]

Did I read it correctly that there was only a 2% decline over the past 9 years? Is that even statistically significant? I guess it makes for a story since they asked the HC's and they both responded, but it hardly seems like an issue...

 

[gamer]

Sadly, I think the real reason for this decline in women's coaches is pure old sexism. Probably mostly unconscious, when push comes to shove, a lot of people have the deepset belief that men are smarter when it comes to sports, that the real sports geniuses are men. Another probably factor is conscious or unconscious homophobia, the suspicion that many women coaches are gay and not wanting to deal with that.