Game Two Semifinals: ColoradoUCFan vs. NYC_Husky22 ***Winner: NYC_Husky22*** | The Boneyard

Game Two Semifinals: ColoradoUCFan vs. NYC_Husky22 ***Winner: NYC_Husky22***

Who wins?


  • Total voters
    46
  • Poll closed .
Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,382
Reaction Score
23,714
ColoradoUCFan

G -
Kevin Ollie
G - Ben Gordon
F - Nadav Henefeld
F - Donyell Marshall
C - Amida Brimah

Bench:

Scott Burrell
Kirk King

NYC_Husky22

G - Khalid El-Amin
G - Ryan Boatright
F - Caron Butler
F - Donny Marshall
C - Hilton Armstrong

Bench:

Brian Fair
Craig Austrie
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
413
Reaction Score
798
The Argument: Vote Colorado

In the Paint: More on that later, but let’s be clear: Donyell, Brimah and King will own the paint vs Donny and Hilton. But, let me start with guard play, because that’s what you guys all seem to think wins games:

Guard play: Let me be very clear. ColoradoUCFan’s lead guards can penetrate and deliver the rock better than NYC. At first glance, one might think that Khalid and Boat will out play Colorado. Lets look at the facts: For starters, Ben Gordon actually averaged 4.7 assists for two straight seasons ‘03 & ‘04. And even more when it counted, 5.75 in BE play in ‘03, for instance. It’s easy to forget that Ben was a good ball handler, because he was one of UConn’s all-time best shooters. Obviously KO was a quick sneaky effective PG, averaging 6.4 assists his senior year, and 619 over his career. That’s over 11 assists per night between Colorado’s top two guards. Not to detract from Boat and Khalid, but they just don’t match up. In his best season, the NC year of ‘99, Khalid only averaged 3.9 assists. Boat played great this year, but only averaged 3.4 assists. NYC’s ball handling guards, 7.3 assists to Colorado’s 11 is no comparison. But, then if we consider Colorado’s small forward, Nadav Henefeld, who dished out 108 assists during the Dream Season, the passing & penetrating game is obviously in Colorado’s favor.

Outside Shooting: This isn’t even close. Ben is the best on the court. Ben hit 104 threes in ’04, on his way to leading the stacked NC team with 18.5 pts per game. Let's compare to NYC. Caron hit 30 threes in ’02. Fair is seen as a 3 specialist, but he hit just 58 his senior season. But, Ben isn’t alone on team Colorado, 5 of Colorado’s players hit the three pointer over 30%. NYC has the same stat, but Colorado’s best is better than NYC’s best. And, NYC has barely the inside presence that Colorado has. Colorado’s players can play inside and outside. Donyell for instance hit 41 3’s in ’94. Two of Colorado’s other forwards Burrell and Henefeld also can shoot over 30%. NYC is stacked with guards. But, Khalid and Boat are average 3 pt shooters for guards .376 & .338. But, nothing like Ben’s .433! Brian Fair had a sweet stroke in his career, but let’s put this in perspective. He hit half as many his best season as Ben. Why? Maybe it’s because Fair started just one game. And, Austrie wasn’t a regular starter either, even as a senior!

Is NYC a smarter coach than Jim Calhoun? NYC actually drafted 2 non starters as guards when we have the full history of all UConn legends to choose from, especially great guards. Riddle me this, how are Fair and Austrie even in consideration for an all-time UConn team roster chosen from the best players of the last 113 years if they couldn’t regularly crack the starting 5 in their senior seasons? It could appear that NYC is stacked with 4 guards, but gentlemen, only 2 of them were everyday UConn starters.

Full court & Guard D: Colorado is full of versatile athletes. So have fun against our press facing Scott Burrell and Nadav Henefeld. Remember that press they had in 89-90? That was the best ever. Team Colorado owns that press now bitches. Damn it, Nadav could be the single best full court defender in UConn history. From his single season, Nadav still holds the single season steals mark with a whopping 138 for a 3.7 per game average. Guess who’s number two alltime? That’s right, Scott Burrell with 3.6. Also on Team Colorado. Do not assume that NYC’s guards will easily handle this pressure. Boat has a pension at times to get out of control; and even Khalid averaged almost 3 TO’s a game in ’99. This legendary fullcourt press from ’00 will be a problem; and especially more effective when Austrie and Fair come in. Finally, let’s not forget how awesome KO was on defense. He will be in Khalid’s grill all game.

IN THE PAINT: COLORADO CRUSHES

Donyell: Just wanted to mention that Donyell Marshall averaged 25 pts / 8.9 boards / 3.3 blocks in ‘94. Our first AA. Our First BE Player or the year. Our First BE Defensive player of the year. UConn’s first lottery pick. NYC has no player even close to this type of domination. Nobody can stop him.

Rebounding: NYC will get crushed. Donyell will lead the team, like he did in 94 with 8.9 a game. King can pound in the paint, before he was suspended in ’97 was averaging over 7 a game. Colorado’s bench guy is a better rebounder than anyone on the entire NYC roster. Scotty got 6 per as a senior and “Freshman” Nadav got 5.6 per game. Colorado clearly is in control here. Donny’s 5.8 compared to Donyell’s 8.9? Hilton’s 6.6 boards for NYC is comparable to Colorado’s 2 small forwards: Nadav and Scotty.

NYC will not score in the paint: NYC does not have the ability to score in the paint vs Donyell / Amida / King. Just not going to happen! No UConn forward has ever blocked as many shots as Donyell Marshall did in ’94 with 3.3. But, Amida actually is as a good a shot blocker per minute as Emeka was in his best season. Emeka averaged 4.7 blocks in 02-03 in 33 minutes a game. Brimah averaged 2.3 blocks in 16.2 minutes. Colorado has the best shot blocking forward and center tandem in the league. BTW, when we bring in ‘97 version on Kirk King off the bench, he averages over 2 blocks a game, plus he is going to get real physical on you when we go “short” when Amida gets in foul trouble.



Leadership: Colorado has Kevin Ollie & nobody else does. Have heard what Kevin Durant said about KO’s leadership skills or maybe Lebron or Iverson? KO is a natural born leader.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
413
Reaction Score
798
Jesus and these are the teams that advance. Holy hell.

The BOLDED text indicates who I voted for in your match up.

upload_2014-5-1_0-17-50.png
 
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
830
Reaction Score
516
It's actually simple math, the boneyard members gave us better than 32% in the first round.

Are you trying to say that 90% of the people on here aren't idiots? He got the votes purely because of Kemba, the rest of his team is poorly constructed and reliant on relatively untalented older players.

You have Brimah as your starting 5, and you won a game. If that doesn't tell you people on here are too stupid to analyze beyond 1-2 names idk what will.
 
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
830
Reaction Score
516
Btw voted for Colorado bc of donyell. Also all the good teams were on the other half of the bracket.
 
Joined
Apr 1, 2013
Messages
7,098
Reaction Score
18,326
Going with NYC. A prime El-Amin is going to do serious damage in this game.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
13,283
Reaction Score
35,125
This is such a tough game to pick, since both teams are so similarly constructed: both have a guard who can score at (Ben more than Khalid) and a guard who can defend that guard (Boat > KO, in defense, but moreso on O).

They both have a dominant offensive force at the 4 who can score and rebound. Donyell > Caron, but this is close...Caron is more clutch, but not quite as prolific, and not quite the defensive player.

They both have a forward who can run and play great defense. Donny ~ Nadav, again very close. Donny is the better athlete and better scorer, but not as long or disruptive as Henefeld, and Nadav was a much better passer.

They both have rim protectors who are solid to good, but not great. 2006 Hilton >> 2014 Brimah, though. This is the biggest advantage for NYC_Husky22.

1-5 on defense, I think it's ColoradoUCFan, but close. The length of Donyell-Nadav-Brimah is tough, and KO can defend. But Brimah got in foul trouble so frequently that he'll likely be forced to play Donyell or Kirk King at center for long periods of time, and I think that could really ruin the cohesion.

I'm hoping to read more, because this is tough. I'm leaning towards NYC_Husky...but man is hard to vote against a Donyell-Ben Gordon-Nadav combo...even when going against a Caron-KEA-Boat combo.
 
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
413
Reaction Score
798
You have Brimah as your starting 5, and you won a game. If that doesn't tell you people on here are too stupid to analyze beyond 1-2 names idk what will.
There really aren't a ton of great centers in UConn history. When I chose Brimah I was not trying to get a scoring center because I already had the best offensive forward in UConn history. I was going for the best rim protector left.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
413
Reaction Score
798
A couple thoughts on Brimah and foul trouble. 1) if he's playing with Donyell then he's going to get in less foul trouble than he did playing with DD. Donyell was BE Defensive player of the year because he was an elite rim defender. 2) Kirk King can cover for him at the 5 spot. Colorado will lose height, but gain beef and boards.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
13,283
Reaction Score
35,125
A couple thoughts on Brimah and foul trouble. 1) if he's playing with Do yell then he's going to get in less foul trouble than he did playing with DD. Do yell was BE Defensive player of the year because he was an elite rim defender. 2) Kirk King can cover for him at the 5 spot. Colorado will lose height, but gain beef and boards.
I assume Donyell will be gaurding Caron? If that's the case, I think he slows Caron much more than Caron slows him...but, Caron can draw him to the perimeter, and once he's there, El-Amin and Boatright are going to be able to get into the lane. Brimah got fouls drawn on him in two ways: against a stronger, better offensive player (Hilton is that, but no such a good offensive player that I think Brimah is doomed), or in the help defense. I think he's going to have to help a good deal, and so I think he gets fouls called on him.

But I think you have good points here. This is such a good matchup.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,382
Reaction Score
23,714
Voted for ColoradoUCFan by the smallest of margins. I think he's screwed if he has to go against OK4 in the title game, though.
 
Joined
Apr 17, 2013
Messages
613
Reaction Score
1,425
Guard play: Let me be clear(er) – my lead guards can penetrate and dish either to my main wing player (Caron) or to my two Bigs who can catch and finish (but more on that later)….

Leadership – its very, very tough for me to make a case that my two guards are better leaders than my opponents. IMO Khalid and Boat have the slight edge due to defense pressure and the ability for Caron to come out and guard the perimeter against Ben.


Caron vs Nadav – Caron is just too much of an athletic freak – bigger, strong, faster and has that big X factor. No contest Caron > Nadav.

El Amin, Boat, Caron > Ollie, Ben, Nadav

Bigs – you have the individual edge here. No question. Donyell > Donny. But we are playing on what has happened and not potential. Freshman Brimah, as good as he is, would draw too many fouls and couldn’t keep up with a more seasoned Hilton. I also see issues for Colorado having to feed his bigs. Sure his guards can dish the ball, but can the Amida and company finish with any consistency?


Colorado has the edge on the glass and around the rim – but my selections will contest enough not to make this a huge swing in Coloardo’s favor.

Bench – as Colorado pointed out my bench isn’t as deep or as talented as others. So I thought I would point out why I added who I did. I did not want to draft stars into my reserve roles. Reason being that I did not want any bad chemistry on my team.. definitely a subjective stance but a real concern for any all-star team. (*See 2012*)

I chose defensive minded, glue guys from teams past who can shoot the ball decently and wouldn’t clash with any of my starters.

Gotta get back to work – choose wisely my friends.. (sorry if there’s any typo’s .. busy morning)
 
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
830
Reaction Score
516
There really aren't a ton of great enters in UConn history. When I chose Brimah I was not trying to get a scoring center because I already had the best offensive forward in UConn history. I was going for the best rim protector left.

Clearly rim protection doesn't matter to people on here (outside of Oak apparently) or I wouldn't have gotten slid as bad as I did in voting. Brimah can't play more than a few minutes without getting into foul trouble, and isn't great with positioning yet.
 
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
830
Reaction Score
516
Voted for ColoradoUCFan by the smallest of margins. I think he's screwed if he has to go against OK4 in the title game, though.

Yeah probably a good idea to make sure you don't throw all the good teams on one side of the bracket if you ever do this again. Whoever wins this is going to get slaughtered by Oak/Kemba.
 

SubbaBub

Your stupidity is ruining my country.
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
32,203
Reaction Score
25,195
I like colorado. KO is a better floor general PG than KEA and can defend him better than KEA can defend KO.

RB can't defend KO (my preference) because Gordon would eat KEA alive if KEA is guarding him on the defensive end.

I really like Nadav at the 3, when he's not the primary option on offense. He's a better version of Giffey and can guard Donny or Caron. But most of all, he's a perfect match with Donyell as both can play the 3, the stretch 4, and post.

Colorado also has a functional bench, while not HR hitters, both guys can be used here without a huge drop off.
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
4,322
Reaction Score
7,421
Bench – as Colorado pointed out my bench isn’t as deep or as talented as others. So I thought I would point out why I added who I did. I did not want to draft stars into my reserve roles. Reason being that I did not want any bad chemistry on my team.. definitely a subjective stance but a real concern for any all-star team. (*See 2012*)

I chose defensive minded, glue guys from teams past who can shoot the ball decently and wouldn’t clash with any of my starters.

Gotta get back to work – choose wisely my friends.. (sorry if there’s any typo’s .. busy morning)
That bench logic is crazy, do you know these aren't real teams? I can see not picking Oriakhi because of chemistry issues or someone like Stanley or Dyson that weren't able to translate his athleticism into team bball success. But with the Fair pick you whiffed on Henefeld or Sellers or Denham or Earl Kelley or even Travis if you had to have a center. You probably still could have had Fair with last pick in draft. Brimah was a head scratching pick by Colorado, but rest of his draft was solid. Depth counts I vote CO
 
Joined
Apr 17, 2013
Messages
613
Reaction Score
1,425
That bench logic is crazy, do you know these aren't real teams? I can see not picking Oriakhi because of chemistry issues or someone like Stanley or Dyson that weren't able to translate his athleticism into team bball success. But with the Fair pick you whiffed on Henefeld or Sellers or Denham or Earl Kelley or even Travis if you had to have a center. You probably still could have had Fair with last pick in draft. Brimah was a head scratching pick by Colorado, but rest of his draft was solid. Depth counts I vote CO
Wait... they aren't actually REAL teams?
 
Joined
Apr 1, 2013
Messages
7,098
Reaction Score
18,326
were you watching the Huskies in 94?

Yeah - I saw for example UCLA Tyus Edny give us fits I believe. But more importantly, KEA in his frosh year was a beast. He was Big East Tourney MVP I believe.

Ask yourself this- is El-Amin a good pick late first round/early 2nd? The answer is yes.

Where do you get Ollie?

So if there is a discrepancy why do you think so?

I believe it's because El-Amin was awesome as a frosh and we tend to forget that.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
413
Reaction Score
798
Yeah - I saw for example UCLA Tyus Edny give us fits I believe. But more importantly, KEA in his frosh year was a beast. He was Big East Tourney MVP I believe.

Ask yourself this- is El-Amin a good pick late first round/early 2nd? The answer is yes.

Where do you get Ollie?

So if there is a discrepancy why do you think so?

I believe it's because El-Amin was awesome as a frosh and we tend to forget that.
I was trying to say that Donyell was more dominant than Khalid was
 
Joined
Sep 6, 2011
Messages
46
Reaction Score
116
I voted for Colorado. Commissioner Gordon was a lottery pick after leaving UConn and Donyell was just so dominant on so many fronts. And Nadav, he was a pro when he played for us during the dream season. This backcourt is stronger.

Caron was awesome, but I think he's on the weaker team.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Online statistics

Members online
156
Guests online
2,007
Total visitors
2,163

Forum statistics

Threads
160,181
Messages
4,220,289
Members
10,083
Latest member
ultimatebee


.
Top Bottom