Further Big East Expansion

[buddy]

This is about as big as a league can get without separating into haves, and have nots, which is what happened in the old BE when it got large. Yeah, it was great to send 11 teams to the NCAA's, but it wasn't so great for Rutgers, PC, SH, etc., who got buried by the massive amount of good teams in the league. ND would certainly be a have, and we expect UConn to be one as well. Add Xavier to the list, and it starts to become hard for the teams at the bottom to rise. Finish out of the money for 3, 4, 5 years, and your image becomes that of an also ran, like DePaul. Thus, while adding ND, and maybe Gonzaga, would be great for the image of the league, and the quality of play, there would be some who would be losers in that scenario.

Seems like things worked out pretty well for Rutgers!

 

[scoscox]

Big east recruiting thread is closed but butler just got a commitment from Myles Tate. 2020 4 star. Posh Alexander commitment apparently imminent to St. John’s.

Recruiting is extremely strong across the league for 2020. 5 teams currently in the top 25. 2 in the top 10, 3 in the top 15.

 

[A10 fan]

Seems like things worked out pretty well for Rutgers!

Just shows you how unimportant basketball really is for the P5.

 

[scoscox]

Just shows you how unimportant basketball really is for the P5.

Are you implying the Rutgers big ten invite was based on their football program?

I think it was clearly about geography and nothing else. really not a statement on either sport

 

[billybud]

When you deny the obvious logic of the UConn move back to the Big East, and mock it as even a possibility, it must seem like magic when it actually happens.

There’s no place like home.

...the affliction of being humorless.

 

[billybud]

The SEC does now have a GOR...they signed one in their deal...

Why 2023? It starts with expiring TV contracts. The ACC and SEC both have long-term media grant-of-rights agreements, running through 2035-36 and 2033-34, respectively. But the other three Power 5 conferences have agreements ending roughly around the same time (the SEC's Tier 1 deal with CBS runs through 2023-24). The Big Ten last summer opted for a shorter agreement with Fox and ESPN, which runs through 2022-23. The Pac-12 deal expires after the 2023-24 sports year, and the Big 12's ends the following year.

Save the date: All signs point to 2023 for conference realignment

There hasn't been much talk publicly about realignment, but that doesn't mean power brokers across the nation aren't thinking about it. In fact, a variety of forces are lining up that could create a seismic shift in conferences in less than a decade.

www.espn.com

 

[businesslawyer]

Seems like things worked out pretty well for Rutgers!

No, it didn't. Yes, Rutgers has locked in money where it will survive athletically for a long time. But it has put Rutgers in a position where winning -- even achieving what they achieved in the Schiano era -- will be much more difficult.

Financial security in athletics is great as a tool for having athletic success, but it is not an end in itself. If all the move does is cement RU as an almost permanent loser in a successful conference, it has achieved nothing. The end in athletics is to win. Rutgers was much better off in the old Big East.

 

[buddy]

No, it didn't. Yes, Rutgers has locked in money where it will survive athletically for a long time. But it has put Rutgers in a position where winning -- even achieving what they achieved in the Schiano era -- will be much more difficult.

Financial security in athletics is great as a tool for having athletic success, but it is not an end in itself. If all the move does is cement RU as an almost permanent loser in a successful conference, it has achieved nothing. The end in athletics is to win. Rutgers was much better off in the old Big East.

If a school doesn't have money, then it will have to start phasing out certain sports. I would rather be last place Rutgers in the Big Ten any day. Any win they get will deserve a great celebration!

 

[freescooter]

Now that UConn's back in the fold, would a school like Notre Dame ever be interested in returning to it's roots and coming back to the Big East? Now before you say it's impossible, thats what most people were saying about UConn's return up until it actually HAPPENED (still can't believe it), give the idea a chance.

I actually think it could make a lot of sense for Notre Dame and the Big East. They fit the geographic footprint, there catholic, we don't need to worry about football (independence) and they would make a similar amount (I think/hope I'm correct about this, otherwise this is a horrible first post) from the Big East as they do the ACC (they take in about 6.8 million a year from ACC and with Big East re-negotiations currently undergoing and if Notre Dame actually joined I assume school distribution would be around 7 million from Big East).

It would also be great for Women's Basketball which would pit the games 2 biggest rivals against each other. And finally the men's ND team which has sat in the doghouse at the bottom of the ACC for the past 2 seasons would return to its roots (and maybe prevalence) with richer recruiting pipelines, and a return to its natural rivals.

What do you guys think, and if not ND and the Big East did indeed decide to expand further beyond UConn, who would be a target? Are there other schools that moved to P5 conferences during the great realignment that have since struggled mightily, that would ever think of returning? Or have they resolved themselves to never winning again and just collecting a paycheck every year?

Some people are just so utterly clueless. Honestly. Not everyone has an MSG fetish and if you’ve ever been to an ACC tourney you would actually know that it is every bit equal to the Big East

 

[CL82]

No, it didn't. Yes, Rutgers has locked in money where it will survive athletically for a long time. But it has put Rutgers in a position where winning -- even achieving what they achieved in the Schiano era -- will be much more difficult.

Financial security in athletics is great as a tool for having athletic success, but it is not an end in itself. If all the move does is cement RU as an almost permanent loser in a successful conference, it has achieved nothing. The end in athletics is to win. Rutgers was much better off in the old Big East.

Are you kidding? Rutgers losing is great tradition in New Brunswick. Doing it while get a full share of B1G revenue is certainly preferable to doing it while losing in the NBE and being an independent for football.

A-10 to Big East to Big 10. RU is one of the biggest winners in CR, perhaps the biggest. We are the probably the biggest loser.

 

[businesslawyer]

Are you kidding? Rutgers losing is great tradition in New Brunswick. Doing it while get a full share of B1G revenue is certainly preferable to doing it while losing in the NBE and being an independent for football.

A-10 to Big East to Big 10. RU is one of the biggest winners in CR, perhaps the biggest. We are the probably the biggest loser.

We are the biggest loser. But money in sports -- especially for a non-profit entity -- is just a means to an end. Rutgers has put itself in a position where it will never achieve the end. Why that should make it a big winner is beyond me.

It guarantied survival. Nothing more. You should have higher aspirations

 

[CL82]

We are the biggest loser. But money in sports -- especially for a non-profit entity -- is just a means to an end. Rutgers has put itself in a position where it will never achieve the end. Why that should make it a big winner is beyond me.

It guarantied survival. Nothing more. You should have higher aspirations

Survival is the primary aspiration. Without it every other aspiration is meaningless. I'm sure they'd like to be better. They've guaranteed themselves a chance at it.

 

[ctchamps]

Are you kidding? Rutgers losing is great tradition in New Brunswick. Doing it while get a full share of B1G revenue is certainly preferable to doing it while losing in the NBE and being an independent for football.

A-10 to Big East to Big 10. RU is one of the biggest winners in CR, perhaps the biggest. We are the probably the biggest loser.

From a financial standpoint Rutgers wins. But I’d rather be a North Dakota State football fan than a Rutgers football fan. Of course comparing any college football fans to UConn football fans is a no brainer.

The Boneyard football forum is in the running for best sports fans. I doubt many fans on the women’s bb forum would have survived if they were football fans. And by survive I mean not die.

The men’s bb fans are not that much tougher. Businesslawyer has survived several abysmal losing seasons.

Not many in this forum have demonstrated to me that they have the fortitude to handle a perennial last place finish. The preference you and buddy propose goes against what I’ve observed in the responses you both have made over the past three seasons, which, as bad as they were are no where near the level of UConn football’s abysmal seasons or the probable Rutgers fate that @businesslawyer expresses.

Where I agree with you both is that the money provides a better opportunity to make substantive hires and provides a better probability of moving up in the ranks. But if that didn’t happen I absolutely have a preference for a hypothetical winning team in an inferior conference over a perennial losing team in a superior conference. Otherwise why spend time watching college sports.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

From a financial standpoint Rutgers wins. But I’d rather be a North Dakota State football fan than a Rutgers football fan. Of course comparing any college football fans to UConn football fans is a no brainer.

The Boneyard football forum is in the running for best sports fans. I doubt many fans on the women’s bb forum would have survived if they were football fans. And by survive I mean not die.

The men’s bb fans are not that much tougher. Businesslawyer has survived several abysmal losing seasons.

Not many in this forum have demonstrated to me that they have the fortitude to handle a perennial last place finish. The preference you and buddy propose goes against what I’ve observed in the responses you both have made over the past three seasons, which, as bad as they were are no where near the level of UConn football’s abysmal seasons or the probable Rutgers fate that @businesslawyer expresses.

Where I agree with you both is that the money provides a better opportunity to make substantive hires and provides a better probability of moving up in the ranks. But if that didn’t happen I absolutely have a preference for a hypothetical winning team in an inferior conference over a perennial losing team in a superior conference. Otherwise why spend time watching college sports.

I’ve been around (65 seasons) for some bad ones.
I also attended many games in the Perno era that despite an early lead the only question was in what bizarre manner we would somehow manage to lose.. We lost a game at Georgetown where we had the ball and a one point lead with seconds to go.
That gives you a different prospective than people who came on board in 1999.
The women’s board is less a partisan UConn board as its among the best women’s sports board available..The number of visitors vs fans to that board is usually extremely high

 

[ctchamps]

I’ve been around (65 seasons) for some bad ones.
I also attended many games in the Perno era that despite an early lead the only question was in what bizarre manner we would somehow manage to lose.. We lost a game at Georgetown where we had the ball and a one point lead with seconds to go.
That gives you a different prospective than people who came on board in 1999.
The women’s board is less a partisan UConn board as its among the best women’s sports board available..The number of visitors vs fans to that board is usually extremely high

As a generalization goes posters of this forum who were fans well before the Dream Season are more likely to be stoic. But that is only a generalization.

I love the women’s forum. Very knowledgeable and bright people. But almost all UConn women’s bb fans became fans after the first NC. That combined with the average age provided an opportunity to make a survival joke.

 

[Zissou]

If not for the horrible new AAC deal with ESPN this doesn’t happen. It wasn’t obvious logic at all to pay $20M to get to a conference with a lower media payout. There were a lot of unique circumstances that caused it to happen, including an underperforming basketball team (not the fault of the conference).

I’m supportive now because I think the only real shot at the ACC is to excel in the Big East and show football value beyond what is expected. That means Indy with a TV deal and out performing that deal. Filling seats for all sports. UConn has to demonstrate that it’s not G5 and this is the better path. I wasn’t convinced of that before. And if that never happens, the changing TV landscape will make football Independence more viable than it has been.

But to suggest that ND is better off in the BE is just silly.

To be clear, I wasn't the advocate for ND to the Big East. FND.

Now for BillyBud and the other of the 9% curmudgeons hating on the Big East, their heads stayed in the sand long past the AAC TV deal was known.

 

[Scrutineer]

I’ve been around (65 seasons) for some bad ones.
I also attended many games in the Perno era that despite an early lead the only question was in what bizarre manner we would somehow manage to lose.. We lost a game at Georgetown where we had the ball and a one point lead with seconds to go.
That gives you a different prospective than people who came on board in 1999.
The women’s board is less a partisan UConn board as its among the best women’s sports board available..The number of visitors vs fans to that board is usually extremely high

No loss was worse to me than the one in the late 80's vs. Syracuse at the Civic Center. Jeff King's ill fated inbounds pass was intercepted by Stevie Thompson who went in for the dunk and the win at the buzzer.
Then there was UConn vs. Villanova at the Civic Center in the late 80's where we allowed them to drive the length of the floor with less than 5 seconds to go to score a layup at the buzzer to win yet again.