Fertile recruiting grounds or the right coach?

[Marty Jackson]

No, of course not. All I am was saying was that to build a great program with multiple National Championships you need to recruit on a national level especially when your home state is small and doesn't produce many 5 star recruits and is just not a hot bed of top recruits for the sport in question. This is true in both basketball and FBS football, and this is true for UCONN as well as Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, Tennesee, etc (in men's and women's basketball) and Notre Dame, Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, and FSU and Florida. If your school IS in a hot bed area that coach needs to get those local stars as well as the national ones.
I think you are forgetting all the great players that JC recruited nationally that helped him establish his program. Khalid El Amin was from Minnesota, Ray Allen was from South Carolina, Okafor was from Texas, Rudy Gay was from Maryland, Hamilton was from Western PA, Caron Butler was from Wisconsin, Voskhul was from Texas, Donny Marshall was from Washington State, Donyell Marshall was from PA, Ricky Moore was from Georgia, Josh Boone was from Maryland, both Marcus Williams and Kevin Ollie were from Crenshaw High in Los Angeles. Now were any of these guys I named from the states you mentioned (ny or ma) besides Connecticut, the schools home state? Same thing for Geno, he recruited all over the place.

the gomes comment was a joke.
I didn't forget those recruits from far away. Remember, it was your comment about when the last time JC or Geno recruited CT that I was responding to.

unlike football, the northeast does produce a ton of top tier recruits. while the mens and womens programs have become national programs and as such get national recruits, they both recruit heavily in the northeast.

currently 6 out of 15 are from NY, Conn, or MA (40%). I have no idea if that's higher or lower than the past 5 years, but I don't think the football team can have as much success with that mix. And, I don't think that if the mix for bb went to 60%, it would be a problem. there is enough talent in the northeast for bb.

 

[Marty Jackson]

No, of course not. All I am was saying was that to build a great program with multiple National Championships you need to recruit on a national level especially when your home state is small and doesn't produce many 5 star recruits and is just not a hot bed of top recruits for the sport in question. This is true in both basketball and FBS football, and this is true for UCONN as well as Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, Tennesee, etc (in men's and women's basketball) and Notre Dame, Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, and FSU and Florida. If your school IS in a hot bed area that coach needs to get those local stars as well as the national ones.
I think you are forgetting all the great players that JC recruited nationally that helped him establish his program. Khalid El Amin was from Minnesota, Ray Allen was from South Carolina, Okafor was from Texas, Rudy Gay was from Maryland, Hamilton was from Western PA, Caron Butler was from Wisconsin, Voskhul was from Texas, Donny Marshall was from Washington State, Donyell Marshall was from PA, Ricky Moore was from Georgia, Josh Boone was from Maryland, both Marcus Williams and Kevin Ollie were from Crenshaw High in Los Angeles. Now were any of these guys I named from the states you mentioned (ny or ma) besides Connecticut, the schools home state? Same thing for Geno, he recruited all over the place.

almost half of the women's roster are from NY or CT.

 

[weyuo]

If there ever was a deal it merely should have been "if the kid warrants an offer he'll get an offer".

I may be in the minority here but if every kid on the team (outside of a handful of walkons to help fill out the roster) is from somewhere other than Connecticut and we are winning at a high level I will be thrilled.

What I mean by P's deal with CT high school coaches is that he tried to make UConn as accessible as possible, with clinics and such. It can't hurt to have your backyard schools doing what they can to help fill your roster with good talent. You guys are gonna shoot down Coach P every chance you get but at least he tried to make a difference as far as home grown talent goes. I just hope the next guy does the same.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

What I mean by P's deal with CT high school coaches is that he tried to make UConn as accessible as possible, with clinics and such. It can't hurt to have your backyard schools doing what they can to help fill your roster with good talent. You guys are gonna shoot down Coach P every chance you get but at least he tried to make a difference as far as home grown talent goes. I just hope the next guy does the same.

All jokes aside what is your connection to P? It's gotta be something the way you vigorously defend the guy......

 

[huskymedic]

In the end, it just makes good program sense to keep a cooperative working relationships with in state coaches. Make them feel welcome by allowing them access to facilities and clinics, etc. and maybe it pays dividends as opposed to creating anti-UConn animus which has reportedly happened in the past (and this applies to all programs - not just football.)

If CT can keep the best of the best in state - fantastic. You clearly can't fill a competitive roster w/ just CT/New England kids and I don't believe that has been anyone's intention (rah-rah sound bites aside). I guess what I'm trying to say is with minimal effort you can have the best of both worlds.

 

[UConnDan97]

All jokes aside what is your connection to P? It's gotta be something the way you vigorously defend the guy......

On this one, he's not wrong. I also want us to foster the "State U" mentality for the younger generation, so that we no longer lose the Jordan Reed's of the world, or Schwapp, or Sullivan, or Shaughnessy, or...you get the point. I'm not saying that the next coach has to have his nose up the backside of the CT High School Football Association (or whatever the hell they're called), but holding in-state camps and such is not a bad thing. I don't want someone to make the mistake of thinking that there is zero talent in the state, because we do produce our share and we should keep our share...

 

[huskyrob1]

the gomes comment was a joke.
I didn't forget those recruits from far away. Remember, it was your comment about when the last time JC or Geno recruited CT that I was responding to.

unlike football, the northeast does produce a ton of top tier recruits. while the mens and womens programs have become national programs and as such get national recruits, they both recruit heavily in the northeast.

currently 6 out of 15 are from NY, Conn, or MA (40%). I have no idea if that's higher or lower than the past 5 years, but I don't think the football team can have as much success with that mix. And, I don't think that if the mix for bb went to 60%, it would be a problem. there is enough talent in the northeast for bb.

That's right I did make that comment "when was the last time JC or Geno recruited a big time recruit from CT" and stand by that. It was you that arbitrarily added NY and MA to bolster your still pretty weak argument about local talent. All those players that I mentioned that you now claim not to have forgotten were the greatest players JC ever recruited, they put UCONN on the map and NONE that I mentioned were from CT or even the other two states you added to the mix. I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success. JC's ability to recruit kids on a national and international level (Doron Sheffer, Nadav Henefeld) is what won by a huge margin, three NC's. Not saying JC didn't get some kids locally (Ben Gordon, Chris Smith, Scott Burrell) that contributed, but it was the national recruiting train that was responsible for 3 NC banners.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

On this one, he's not wrong. I also want us to foster the "State U" mentality for the younger generation, so that we no longer lose the Jordan Reed's of the world, or Schwapp, or Sullivan, or Shaughnessy, or...you get the point. I'm not saying that the next coach has to have his nose up the backside of the CT High School Football Association (or whatever the hell they're called), but holding in-state camps and such is not a bad thing. I don't want someone to make the mistake of thinking that there is zero talent in the state, because we do produce our share and we should keep our share...

Edsall held camps. They didn't like him because he gave the coaches an honest assessment and didnt hand out token hometown discounts on scholarship offers.

 

[noeynox]

On this one, he's not wrong. I also want us to foster the "State U" mentality for the younger generation, so that we no longer lose the Jordan Reed's of the world, or Schwapp, or Sullivan, or Shaughnessy, or...you get the point. I'm not saying that the next coach has to have his nose up the backside of the CT High School Football Association (or whatever the hell they're called), but holding in-state camps and such is not a bad thing. I don't want someone to make the mistake of thinking that there is zero talent in the state, because we do produce our share and we should keep our share...

There are a lot of CT HS players playing in the NFL every weekend. Not all of them are four and five star players. Upstater has done a great job detailing this for everyone. CT should provide UConn with competitive starting point to the roster.

 

[huskyrob1]

almost half of the women's roster are from NY or CT.

This really is an odd year with 4 or 5 from NY and even one from CT. Normally 1 or 2 are from NY and usually just one or two from CT. Usually, especially in recent years, Geno makes it a point to get a walk on from CT so it doesn't look like the state is being ignored. Geno and Meghan Culmo have stated that several times. Arguably, his greatest team 2002 had one walk on from CT (who later was awarded a scholly) and Sue Bird from NY.

 

[Marty Jackson]

That's right I did make that comment "when was the last time JC or Geno recruited a big time recruit from CT" and stand by that. It was you that arbitrarily added NY and MA to bolster your still pretty weak argument about local talent. All those players that I mentioned that you now claim not to have forgotten were the greatest players JC ever recruited, they put UCONN on the map and NONE that I mentioned were from CT or even the other two states you added to the mix. I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success. JC's ability to recruit kids on a national and international level (Doron Sheffer, Nadav Henefeld) is what won by a huge margin, three NC's. Not saying JC didn't get some kids locally (Ben Gordon, Chris Smith, Scott Burrell) that contributed, but it was the national recruiting train that was responsible for 3 NC banners.

fine... Olander. I believe he's from CT. There you go.

 

[Marty Jackson]

That's right I did make that comment "when was the last time JC or Geno recruited a big time recruit from CT" and stand by that. It was you that arbitrarily added NY and MA to bolster your still pretty weak argument about local talent. All those players that I mentioned that you now claim not to have forgotten were the greatest players JC ever recruited, they put UCONN on the map and NONE that I mentioned were from CT or even the other two states you added to the mix. I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success. JC's ability to recruit kids on a national and international level (Doron Sheffer, Nadav Henefeld) is what won by a huge margin, three NC's. Not saying JC didn't get some kids locally (Ben Gordon, Chris Smith, Scott Burrell) that contributed, but it was the national recruiting train that was responsible for 3 NC banners.

"I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success."

little history lesson...
Chris Smith and Rebecca Lobo. both put Uconn on the map.
Both were huge recruits from CT and both are very responsible for where Uconn is today. Without those, it's debatable whether Uconn makes the transition to a national power in bb for men and women.

You are making an argument and debating with yourself. Uconn is a national program and recruits nationally. It also recruits CT, New England, and the Northeast. There is a lot of talent in the northeast locally and at the prep-school level.

If you are suggesting that CT doesn't produce the same number of recruits as the rest of the country, you're right. But whoever said they did.

I don't even know what your point is anymore.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I could have sworn that Lobo was from Southwick Mass but whatever. When the day arrives that one or two quality recruits will be sufficient to build a football program I will alter my stance, until then I will believe that we will need to bring in many recruits each year and unfortunately for those who want Connecticut talent making up a large portion of the roster, there won't be enough players capable of contributing at the level where we want to compete.

 

[huskyrob1]

I could have sworn that Lobo was from Southwick Mass but whatever. When the day arrives that one or two quality recruits will be sufficient to build a football program I will alter my stance, until then I will believe that we will need to bring in many recruits each year and unfortunately for those who want Connecticut talent making up a large portion of the roster, there won't be enough players capable of contributing at the level where we want to compete.

You beat me to it. Lobo is from Southwick Mass. Mr Jackson keeps making stuff up.

 

[Marty Jackson]

You beat me to it. Lobo is from Southwick Mass. Mr Jackson keeps making stuff up.

born in ct. raised in southwick.
you got me.

no ct player has had any impact on uconn. you win.

 

[huskyrob1]

"I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success."

little history lesson...
Chris Smith and Rebecca Lobo. both put Uconn on the map.
Both were huge recruits from CT and both are very responsible for where Uconn is today. Without those, it's debatable whether Uconn makes the transition to a national power in bb for men and women.

You are making an argument and debating with yourself. Uconn is a national program and recruits nationally. It also recruits CT, New England, and the Northeast. There is a lot of talent in the northeast locally and at the prep-school level.

If you are suggesting that CT doesn't produce the same number of recruits as the rest of the country, you're right. But whoever said they did.

I don't even know what your point is anymore.

Your history is faulty. Lobo was from Southwick Mass and was recruited by everyone, it was testament to Geno's recruiting abilities to get her to choose UCONN over Stanford, Tennessee, and Georgia.

If you want to give Chris Smith kudos' great, I'll give him too, but look at who he played with…Phil Gamble…DC, Tate George…NJ, Cliff Robinson…Buffalo NY, Donyell Marshall…PA, Donny Marshall….Washington St, Brian Fair…Arizona, Kevin Ollie…California, Nadav Henefeld…Israel, I could name more. And the year after Smith graduated Calhoun recruited a guy named Ray Allen out of South Carolina, this was 1993 and it was still 6 years before UCONN's first NC. Chris Smith was a great player but to say he and he alone put UCONN on the map and was a Connecticut kid just to support your idiotic argument really is a slap in the face to all the great players that came before and after him, AND did not come from Connecticut or New England for that matter. Give it a rest OK.

BTW if you really want to name one player who had more to do with UCONN wining it's first NC, I would say a kid from Minnesota named Kahlid El-Amin. When he came to UCONN he energized the team and IMO put them on a path to 1999 and "We shocked the world". His games at Pitt and his jawing with the Pitt fans were classic.

 

[huskymedic]

no ct player has had any impact on uconn. you win.

LOL - I'm telling ya, it's easier that way.

 

[noeynox]

Smith also played with guys named Burrel and .Murray Williams.

 

[UConnDan97]

Smith also played with guys named Burrel and .Murray Williams.

Scotty Burrell, the pride of Hamden...yeah, he sucked. He got to play for pay with a man named MJ.

Also, the state always seems to provide role-players for the team as well (RJ Evans, Craig Austrie, etc.). Doug Wiggins was from my hometown of East Hartford. The list goes on and on, I'm sure, but I'm too lazy to look up every one of them...

 

[huskyrob1]

fine... Olander. I believe he's from CT. There you go.
↑
That's right I did make that comment "when was the last time JC or Geno recruited a big time recruit from CT" and stand by that. It was you that arbitrarily added NY and MA to bolster your still pretty weak argument about local talent. All those players that I mentioned that you now claim not to have forgotten were the greatest players JC ever recruited, they put UCONN on the map and NONE that I mentioned were from CT or even the other two states you added to the mix. I think you are flat out wrong with your statement that local talent was responsible for much of UCONN's success. JC's ability to recruit kids on a national and international level (Doron Sheffer, Nadav Henefeld) is what won by a huge margin, three NC's. Not saying JC didn't get some kids locally (Ben Gordon, Chris Smith, Scott Burrell) that contributed, but it was the national recruiting train that was responsible for 3 NC banners.
fine... Olander. I believe he's from CT. There you go.
Marty Jackson, Today at 7:29 PM

Look I like Olander, plays his heart out and gets better each year, love watching him play, and as you so skillfully pointed out, yes he is from CT, but he was not a big time recruit or McD AA before college.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I'll try to bring this back to something that actually is relevant to football:

1 - How many recruits does a program that plans on competing at a high level in FBS football need to bring in every year?
2 - How many players at that level could we realistically hope to find in state on a consistent basis year after year?

 

[huskyrob1]

I'll try to bring this back to something that actually is relevant to football:

1 - How many recruits does a program that plans on competing at a high level in FBS football need to bring in every year?
2 - How many players at that level could we realistically hope to find in state on a consistent basis year after year?

Thank you...
On your 1st point I would say at least 10, just to keep up with graduating seniors. Maybe more if you include other factors.

On your 2nd point, I would say 3 or 4 at best, and that's in a good year. I mean how many D1 players does the state produce each year? At first for a new coach, I think we'd be lucky to get one third of those, but with some program success that might improve.

 

[Excalibur]

The urge of some to over-correct on the value of recruiting the home state is troubling.

 

[metsfan2323]

Edsall held camps. They didn't like him because he gave the coaches an honest assessment and didnt hand out token hometown discounts on scholarship offers.

You seem to be implying that P gave out token hometown discounts? Name one player? I can't think of any.

Edsall could of and should of done a better job recruiting in state. That was one area where he was not "all in". His dumb ass comment that Maryland has more talent in some individual high schools then the entire state of CT revealed the lousy attitude he had.

 

[UConn07]

Actually many programs, Nebraska is a great example, target in state kids.

Georgia won its only national championship when they convinced an in state RB to stay at home and not go to USC.

Ohio State considers it an insult to lose a player to Michigan and vice versa. Both recruit their in state players heavily and both use in state pride as a selling tool.

And there is this.....Connecticut's best chance to land an elite player is to land an in state elite player.

That's well and good, but Connecticut kids are not cutting it.

Jordan Reed
Aaron Hernandez
John Sullivan
Scott Lutrus
Matt Shaughnessy
Dan Orlovsky
Dwight Freeney
Tebucky Jones
Donald Thomas

I count 9 players (please add any that I've missed) over the past 15+ years that have gone on to play at the next level and STUCK that are from CT. The talent level is not there. Not even close compared to the rest of the country. If you want to build the program by just CT kids, we might as well just go back to playing URI.

Recruiting is about getting the best players to come to your school, regardless of where they are from. Should a superstar come along, ok keep him home. But if we are talking mid-level players vs highly developed players, we go the highly developed route. Edsall made it by developing the lower level players, helping them mature and making them better. That way of recruiting is not going to lead to long-term sustained success. We need the freak athletes, the guys that stand out among great players. CT doesn't have that. We need to go elsewhere.