ESPNs Top 25 Players at the Tourney | The Boneyard

ESPNs Top 25 Players at the Tourney

Blue Blood

Blue Blood

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No UConn inclusions thought Cole might sneak in but at #22 Josh Carlton some very good recognition for him and a little bulletin board material for RJ and Adama
 
Good for Josh. Well earned.

No bulletin board material. This team this year has never been one guy. It is its biggest strength and greatest weakness at the same time. I have no gripes with that list.

For the season, (and most likely the tourney) here is your barometer:

Hawkins + Polley = 10 points or more = Win

Less? We can lose.
 
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I love Josh but he isn’t even top 3 on our team. Josh played well this year but Sanogo played way better and if he makes 4 more bunnies against Nova Sanogo would be in top 15 on this list.
 
12.0 ppg6.4 rebs0.9 asts0.5 stls1.2 blks1.6 tos
14.9 ppg8.9 rebs0.9 asts0.8 stls2.0 blks2.4 tos

how is this not bulletin board material?

which is carlton and which is adama?

hint- the center we preferred to keep put up better numbers in a MUCH better conference, including 9 double doubles and 3 games with 20+ pts and 15+ boards.
 
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bendm said:
12.0 ppg6.4 rebs0.9 asts0.5 stls1.2 blks1.6 tos
14.9 ppg8.9 rebs0.9 asts0.8 stls2.0 blks2.4 tos

how is this not bulletin board material?

which is carlton and which is adama?

hint- the center we preferred to keep put up better numbers in a MUCH better conference.
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There is a lot more to it than that. Look deeper at Carltons minutes early and what he played later, and his season long effective FG%, his Per's , and a bunch of other stats and get back to me. Ive been hard enough on Adama since Friday night and I have no interest in dragging more hard data points up here because it only makes me feel (and look) like I'm picking on the kid. And I really like him and I'm glad we have him. I'm glad Josh found a a great situation for him, and I'm glad Adama is our guy. But yeah, not bulletin board material. If you really want to dive into those weeds, its bulletin board material for Josh.
 
August_West said:
There is a lot more to it than that. Look deeper at Carltons minutes early and what he played later, and his season long effective FG%, his Per's , and a bunch of other stats and get back to me. Ive been hard enough on Adama since Friday night and I have no interest in dragging more hard data points up here because it only makes me feel (and look) like I'm picking on the kid. And I really like him and I'm glad we have him. I'm glad Josh found a a great situation for him, and I'm glad Adama is our guy. But yeah, not bulletin board material. If you really want to dive into those weeds, its bulletin board material for Josh.
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he plays in a mid major conference. it's not trashing the guy to say he's not a top 25 player in the dance or as good as sanogo.
 
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August_West said:
There is a lot more to it than that. Look deeper at Carltons minutes early and what he played later, and his season long effective FG%, his Per's , and a bunch of other stats and get back to me. Ive been hard enough on Adama since Friday night and I have no interest in dragging more hard data points up here because it only makes me feel (and look) like I'm picking on the kid. And I really like him and I'm glad we have him. I'm glad Josh found a a great situation for him, and I'm glad Adama is our guy. But yeah, not bulletin board material. If you really want to dive into those weeds, its bulletin board material for Josh.
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He plays in the AAC. Enough said. Sanogo is a far better player than Josh. To say it’s bulletin board material for Carlton lol. Yea dominating Tulsa and Tulane. Cmon man.
 
Candyman34 said:
I love Josh but he isn’t even top 3 on our team. Josh played well this year but Sanogo played way better and if he makes 4 more bunnies against Nova Sanogo would be in top 15 on this list.
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IF
I don't think Sanogo played way better - he had better games for sure offensively but Josh is a better defender and if they broke down the stats by minutes played I'd be willing to bet that Josh averages more rebounds and blocks.
That has been the issue with Sanogo - he has been a force about 60% of the time but it's that 40% that hurts him. I understand that his overall production is better than Josh's but Josh has had some big games playing some of the better 5s and I feel Sanogo hasn't played his best games against the better big guys.
Do I think Adama is one of the best players in the tournament? yes, but there's a lot of players to consider. Josh may not have deserved the top 25 but Sampson has said many times that Houston would not be a top 25 team if Josh Carlton was not on the team. Josh was a huge factor in Houston's victory over a red hot Memphis team in the AAC championship game. Yes the NBE is a much better conference than the AAC - no argument at all but both Houston and the current Memphis team would be among the top teams in the NBE.
Let's hope that Sanogo proves to everyone that he really belongs on that list just as Tyrese showed why he should have been named on one of the all NBE teams.
 
Candyman34 said:
He plays in the AAC. Enough said. Sanogo is a far better player than Josh. To say it’s bulletin board material for Carlton lol. Yea dominating Tulsa and Tulane. Cmon man.
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Do your homework.
 
gtcam said:
IF
I don't think Sanogo played way better - he had better games for sure offensively but Josh is a better defender and if the broke down the stats by minutes played I'd be willing to bet that Josh averages more rebounds.
That has been the issue with Sanogo - he has been a force about 60% of the time but it's that 40% that hurts him. I understand that his overall production is better than Josh's but Josh has had some big games playing some of the better 5s and I feel Sanogo hasn't played his best games against the better big guys.
Do I think Adama is one of the best players in the tournament? yes, but there's a lot of players to consider. Josh may not have deserved the top 25 but Sampson has said many times that Houston would not be a top 25 team if Josh Carlton was not on the team. Josh was a huge factor in Houston's victory over a red hot Memphis team in the AAC championship game. Yes the NBE is a much better conference than the AAC - no argument at all but both Houston and the current Memphis team would be among the top teams in the NBE.
Let's hope that Sanogo proves to everyone that he really belongs on that list just as Tyrese showed why he should have been named on one of the all NBE teams.
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Stop comparing Tulane to Creighton. Your stats are flawed because NBE is so tough compared to AAC. Sanogo in the AAC would be player of the year if Josh was 1st team. We seen 4 years of Josh so that makes us experts I would say.

He had a very good year in the AAC. But he’s not top 50 player in the tourny. Sorry.
 
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August_West said:
Look at the real stats.
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if you think carlton is capable of scoring 30 against a team like auburn (not like usf) or having multiple games of 20+ pts and 15+ rebs in the BE (he did it once against ecsu 3 years ago) then i'll agree to disagree because those are real, dominant, stats.
 
Candyman34 said:
You said Josh has bulletin material over Sanogo cause his stats in a much much weaker AAC is lower still but not by much. Cmon.
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See now you are making me do this. And I didn't want to

Josh Carltons PER this year is 30.1
Sanogos is 24.7

Carltons Effective FG% is .626
Sanogos is .506


Carltons Offensive win Share is 3.0
Sanogos OWS is 1.8


Carltons Defensive win share is 1.8
Same as Sanogos, DWS: 1.8



Cant we just tip our cap to Josh and be done? He had a better year than Adama , by all measurements. Even then Im still glad we have Adama.
 
"Josh has had some big games playing some of the better 5s and I feel Sanogo hasn't played his best games against the better big guys"

What 5's in the AAC are better than the bigs in the NBE? Jalen Duran dominated Carlton 2 out of the 3 games they played. Check the stats. Carlton averaged 7 points and 4 rebounds against Memphis. Sanogo has gone to war against very, very good defensive centers and the kid from Creighton and the the big from SH disrupted him this last game but not the games before.

lets not forget Sanogo dominated the kid from Auburn, one of the best shot blockers in the country.
 
August_West said:
See now you are making me do this. And I didn't want to

Josh Carltons PER this year is 30.1
Sanogos is 24.7

Carltons Effective FG% is .626
Sanogos is .506


Carltons Offensive win Share is 3.0
Sanogos OWS is 1.8


Carltons Defensive win share is 1.8
Same as Sanogos, DWS: 1.8



Cant we just tip our cap to Josh and be done? He had a better year than Adama , by all measurements. Even then Im still glad we have Adama.
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It's a stupid comparison. The American was putrid this year.
 
August_West said:
See now you are making me do this. And I didn't want to

Josh Carltons PER this year is 30.1
Sanogos is 24.7

Carltons Effective FG% is .626
Sanogos is .506


Carltons Offensive win Share is 3.0
Sanogos OWS is 1.8


Carltons Defensive win share is 1.8
Same as Sanogos, DWS: 1.8



Cant we just tip our cap to Josh and be done? He had a better year than Adama , by all measurements. Even then Im still glad we have Adama.
Expand ...
Why are you doing it then when you know Sanogo is better than Carlton?
 
August_West said:
See now you are making me do this. And I didn't want to

Josh Carltons PER this year is 30.1
Sanogos is 24.7

Carltons Effective FG% is .626
Sanogos is .506


Carltons Offensive win Share is 3.0
Sanogos OWS is 1.8


Carltons Defensive win share is 1.8
Same as Sanogos, DWS: 1.8



Cant we just tip our cap to Josh and be done? He had a better year than Adama , by all measurements. Even then Im still glad we have Adama.
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All meausres? Sanogo is way way better and not close. Theres a reason why he left UConn. Sanogo made the list for top 5 centers in the country but hey lets compare stats from a much weaker conf.
 
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Candyman34 said:
All meausres? Sanogo is way way better and not close. Theres a reason why he left UConn. Sanogo made the list for top 5 centers in the country but hey lets compare stats from a much weaker conf.
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Sanogo doesnt shoot within 10 percentage points of the 4 other centers on the list.
 
BigErnMcCracken said:
I had the same question. I don't understand what he's going for.
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Im going for the same thing Ive been saying since December. Sanogos usage rate is much too high for his inefficiency. That's on coach, not Adama.

I like Sanogo better than Carlton because he has a much higher long term upside. That's easy to see. But he didn't have some kind of killer season this year. Not for his usage or with his numbers. Lets be honest. Next year? He could be the 5 man of the year.

And certainly Josh being picked as an impact player isnt a slight or bulletin board material for Sanogo. Josh simply had a great season.
 
Candyman34 said:
And yet he’s still on the list. You must be so mad.
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Not at all. I also think he deserved 1st team BigEast.

But please dont let accolades cloud actual performance.
 
August_West said:
Not at all. I also think he deserved 1st team BigEast.

But please dont let accolades cloud actual performance.
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I looked at Josh’s boxes against tourney teams. It’s a bit of a mixed bag.

His two against Memphis in the regular season he was a no show. Same with Ok St and Wisconsin.

He had nice outings against Memphis in the tourney and SMU (crediting as a borderline tourney team).

I think there’s some reasonable doubt to accept his efficiency stats in a 1:1 with Adama. That said, let’s root for them both and move on.
 
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August_West said:
See now you are making me do this. And I didn't want to

Josh Carltons PER this year is 30.1
Sanogos is 24.7

Carltons Effective FG% is .626
Sanogos is .506


Carltons Offensive win Share is 3.0
Sanogos OWS is 1.8


Carltons Defensive win share is 1.8
Same as Sanogos, DWS: 1.8



Cant we just tip our cap to Josh and be done? He had a better year than Adama , by all measurements. Even then Im still glad we have Adama.
Expand ...
Carlton had numbers like that as a sophomore and we all forget because he wasn't effective as a Junior. Incredibly efficient on offense. The reality is he simply doesn't fit what Dan wants to do, especially on defense. I was happy he landed at Houston and I'm not surprised he is playing well.
 
Can we just agree that Sanogo is asked to do more which hurts his efficiency? I believe that if he played at Houston in the ACC he would have the ability to put up better efficiency numbers than Carlton. I also believe that if Carlton was on our team he would not be able to be the centerpiece of our offense
 
August_West said:
There is a lot more to it than that. Look deeper at Carltons minutes early and what he played later, and his season long effective FG%, his Per's , and a bunch of other stats and get back to me. Ive been hard enough on Adama since Friday night and I have no interest in dragging more hard data points up here because it only makes me feel (and look) like I'm picking on the kid. And I really like him and I'm glad we have him. I'm glad Josh found a a great situation for him, and I'm glad Adama is our guy. But yeah, not bulletin board material. If you really want to dive into those weeds, its bulletin board material for Josh.
Expand ...

Your post inevitably made me think of this…lol
 
UCLJ0211 said:
There is a lot more to it than that. Look deeper at Carltons minutes early and what he played later, and his season long effective FG%, his Per's , and a bunch of other stats and get back to me. Ive been hard enough on Adama since Friday night and I have no interest in dragging more hard data points up here because it only makes me feel (and look) like I'm picking on the kid. And I really like him and I'm glad we have him. I'm glad Josh found a a great situation for him, and I'm glad Adama is our guy. But yeah, not bulletin board material. If you really want to dive into those weeds, its bulletin board material for Josh.

Your post inevitably made me think of this…lol
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What was the take tonight

Will ya please

Is Peter Kiss on the list? "Top Players." If they are talking about top players, Sanogo over Carlton. Stats don't matter to people who watch them play. Of course, I haven't seen Josh play all year but I stand by my evaluation.
 
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