ESPN not happy with LHN?

[Cleanface]

Nope, 11. MSU and Purdue aren't the flagship schools. They could be if their respective states didn't already have one, but, technically they are not.

I've seen both listed as Flagships. Not many states have two schools with this distinction, but I thought IN and MI were two of them.

Hell, check their Wiki pages!...FLAGSHIPS. Wiki is always right.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Please explain to me what Clemson has done since 1988 to be considered a "national power"? You have Florida State and that's it.

Worse is that some of the more yahoo fans of that program act like they're Alabama or something. That and their strange fascination with a piece of rock taken from a California desert. I only wish they value the total of their program, not just the football team.

 

[pj]

A little OT, but is that all it takes for someone to be considered a "football school"? Is Rutgers a "football school" because their basketball is even more pathetic?

Rutgers is a fencing school.

 

[RatholeMA]

Which two events have a higher probability of occurring:
1) A Big Ten school leaving the B1G to go to the ACC.
2) An ACC school leaving the ACC to go to the B1G.

The answer to this question will tell if the ACC is catching up. BTW, There are no possible scenarios where the SEC or Pac 12 try to poach from the B1G.

There were rumors of Northwestern to the ACC.

 

[dayooper]

There were rumors of Northwestern to the ACC.

The rumors were that The ACC went after NW and PSU. Whether they were interested or if it really happened is something I have no clue on, but those were the rumors.

 

[Calamitous]

The rumors were that The ACC went after NW and PSU. Whether they were interested or if it really happened is something I have no clue on, but those were the rumors.

Many think this was the catalyst that made Delany go for the ACC's jugular. That and sneaking into South Bend to grab that "valuable" non-football property. I think Wake's prez was reaching out to NW and Pitt's prez to PSU. At least that was the rumor I heard.

 

[upstater]

Many think this was the catalyst that made Delany go for the ACC's jugular. That and sneaking into South Bend to grab that "valuable" non-football property. I think Wake's prez was reaching out to NW and Pitt's prez to PSU. At least that was the rumor I heard.

Huh??!!! I should think that Delany would do backflips at the prospect of Northwestern to the ACC.

 

[btstimpy]

The rumors were that The ACC went after NW and PSU. Whether they were interested or if it really happened is something I have no clue on, but those were the rumors.

I'm not sure I believe that the ACC did this. First of all there wasn't anyone at Penn State to discuss this with. They fired their President Spanier and AD Curley, and they're trying to put both in jail. Only now has the school backfilled those jobs 2 years later. Any change in conference would not be done with interim people. Could Pitt and Wake have floated the idea out there with those schools? Possibly. But it would have been informal and just to see if there might be any interest. Northwestern isn't much of a fit IMO geographically. That would pull the league further into the midwest where it doesn't belong.

 

[RatholeMA]

Huh??!!! I should think that Delany would do backflips at the prospect of Northwestern to the ACC.

Indeed, the replacement of Northwestern with UConn would seem to be a huge plus for the B1G.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Huh??!!! I should think that Delany would do backflips at the prospect of Northwestern to the ACC.

Not really. The B1G, more than the others, have this strange loyalty to the ideal of combining big time athletics with research elitism. Plus, NW is located in the heart of the conference. So, from that perspective, while it wouldn't be a big loss in terms of athletic prowess, from the standpoint of the midwest elitist circles it would a huge blow to their egos. This is the kind of thing that gets a reaction from the COP/C and Delany. You underestimate the potential impact.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Indeed, the replacement of Northwestern with UConn would seem to be a huge plus for the B1G.

UConn is NOT AAU! You have no idea how much value those people put on that designation. If you think they look down on Ruddy that is not half of what they think of Connecticut. Another thing people overlook is that conferences use at least one private school to go around the FOIA rules that public institutions are required to follow. Should they lose NW then most likely they will look for a comparable replacement. Cornell, anyone?

 

[ArizonaKnight]

Not really. The B1G, more than the others, have this strange loyalty to the ideal of combining big time athletics with research elitism.

Forging a big time athletics conference made up of like-minded institutions is strange? Rutgers is a land grant, flagship state school and research powerhouse joining an athletic conference made up of peer institutions and its academic counterpart, the C.I.C. The B1G is more than an athletic conference. As an example...

http://www.bigtencrc.org/#prettyPhoto/0/

Strange is a conference where UVA and Duke are palling around with the "University" of Louisville. Just my opinion.

 

[B1GOSU]

If the Maryland/ACC lawsuit goes to trial, we will find out exactly what happened with the Northwestern/Penn State to the ACC rumors. Whether it's a rumor or fact, there is a snowballs chance in hell that either program would leave the B1G. The goal of conference realignment is promotion to a better conference, not demotion to a lesser one. In the B1G, Penn State is Pitt's superior. In the ACC, Penn State is Pitt's equal.

 

[RatholeMA]

UConn is NOT AAU! You have no idea how much value those people put on that designation. If you think they look down on Ruddy that is not half of what they think of Connecticut. Another thing people overlook is that conferences use at least one private school to go around the FOIA rules that public institutions are required to follow. Should they lose NW then most likely they will look for a comparable replacement. Cornell, anyone?

So I suppose they'll be booting out Nebraska any day now.

 

[dayooper]

UConn is NOT AAU! You have no idea how much value those people put on that designation. If you think they look down on Ruddy that is not half of what they think of Connecticut. Another thing people overlook is that conferences use at least one private school to go around the FOIA rules that public institutions are required to follow. Should they lose NW then most likely they will look for a comparable replacement. Cornell, anyone?

Neither is Nebraska. I know they were when they were admitted, but the process was already in motion when the invite was made. Michigan and Wisconsin led the charge to get them removed. They wanted to take a vote a year earlier, but knew they didn't have the votes to do so.

 

[dayooper]

If the Maryland/ACC lawsuit goes to trial, we will find out exactly what happened with the Northwestern/Penn State to the ACC rumors. Whether it's a rumor or fact, there is a snowballs chance in hell that either program would leave the B1G. The goal of conference realignment is promotion to a better conference, not demotion to a lesser one. In the B1G, Penn State is Pitt's superior. In the ACC, Penn State is Pitt's equal.

Those two schools were the best chance they had. Many PSU fans have been disillusioned with the Big10 for various reasons and the extra Sandusky punishment put down by the Big10 made things worse. PSU has always saw themselves as East Coast and The ACC has many East Coast schools.

NW is a small, highly acclaimed, private school who may seem out of place but fit right in with Duke, WF, BC, Pitt, and Miami. NW resides in the third largest DMA in America (Chicago) and located very close to ND.

Taking the state of Pennsylvania would cut off The Big 10 with its new East Coast members, much like taking UMD cut The ACC off from their new New England brethren. Planting a flag with an original member in a large DMA just might have enticed ESPN to start that ACC Network. ESPN just may have encouraged it. That's the rumor.

All of this being said, I really don't think this happened. ESPN is smarter than that. I have to believe the ACC is as well.

 

[upstater]

UConn is NOT AAU! You have no idea how much value those people put on that designation. If you think they look down on Ruddy that is not half of what they think of Connecticut. Another thing people overlook is that conferences use at least one private school to go around the FOIA rules that public institutions are required to follow. Should they lose NW then most likely they will look for a comparable replacement. Cornell, anyone?

Yeah, they care about it so much that that the President of Wisky said it was never once discussed when they added Nebraska. Which makes sense, because Michigan and Wisconsin were the two schools shoving Nebraska out the door of the AAU.

 

[Calamitous]

Huh??!!! I should think that Delany would do backflips at the prospect of Northwestern to the ACC.

Ehh... I think 4 of the 5 P5 conferences need their token private schools for image purposes. PAC with Stanford and USC; B12 with Baylor and TCU; SEC with Vandy; B1G with NW. But much more than that won't fly in those conferences. Although, if the B12 is forced to expand to 12, they may look toward another private university.

 

[upstater]

Ehh... I think 4 of the 5 P5 conferences need their token private schools for image purposes. PAC with Stanford and USC; B12 with Baylor and TCU; SEC with Vandy; B1G with NW. But much more than that won't fly in those conferences. Although, if the B12 is forced to expand to 12, they may look toward another private university.

These athletic departments could really care less about opponent's academic credentials. Vanderbilt is no worse at all for playing Mississippi state year in and year out. The ACC didn't care at all about Louisville's academics. To quote one of your presidents, "This decision [to add Louisville] had absolutely nothing to do with academics."

The B12 in fact wanted absolutely nothing to do with Baylor, but they were forced into it by Texas politicians.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Those two schools were the best chance they had. Many PSU fans have been disillusioned with the Big10 for various reasons and the extra Sandusky punishment put down by the Big10 made things worse. PSU has always saw themselves as East Coast and The ACC has many East Coast schools.

NW is a small, highly acclaimed, private school who may seem out of place but fit right in with Duke, WF, BC, Pitt, and Miami. NW resides in the third largest DMA in America (Chicago) and located very close to ND.

Taking the state of Pennsylvania would cut off The Big 10 with its new East Coast members, much like taking UMD cut The ACC off from their new New England brethren. Planting a flag with an original member in a large DMA just might have enticed ESPN to start that ACC Network. ESPN just may have encouraged it. That's the rumor.

All of this being said, I really don't think this happened. ESPN is smarter than that. I have to believe the ACC is as well.

I am of the position that the ACC has many things going for them that Penn State isn't necessary to strengthen the conference, although ideal for certain schools. However, knowing how much they value football, I doubt they would have viewed playing BC, SU, Pitt as more important than playing Ohio State and Michigan. Plus having two schools as close neighbors helps their travel. I know there are a bunch of ACC fans who want to "get back" at the B1G for "stealing" Maryland. The difference here is the UMD admins wanted to change conferences, despite a lot of dissent from their fans at first, but the Penn State admins don't seem inclined to make a similar change.

I think the real issue here is too many college sports administrators depend on ESPN for guidance and, thus, give credence to the rumors of such type. This doesn't create good will among peer colleges and conferences. I would think those who are in the B1G understand as well. This is one reason I would support moving the American Athletic Conference to the P5, to create the P6. When the top conferences are at 14 members, there really is no more room for more schools. At some point, you want to play against the programs you have been familiar with the most, then play the best teams in your OOC schedule. I know the UConn fans are pissed at their current situation but hoping certain conferences dissolve for them to move up is counterproductive.

I like what the PAC did and created their own network to insure that their teams be seen by the fans, thereby reducing their reliance on third parties for exposure. The SEC went the opposite way and went full in with ESPN and CBS and now have to toe those networks' lines to be in their good graces. If the ACC had to do things all over again, I would have preferred the PAC model. At least we'd have our own network by now and not have to go to ESPNU or ESPN3 for games.

 

[Calamitous]

To quote one of your presidents, "This decision [to add Louisville] had absolutely nothing to do with academics."

I've heard that as well. Which University president was it, do you remember? Sure hope it wasn't VPI&SU.

Edit: BTW... it's the university presidents that vote on the schools, not the athletic departments. Although I'm sure the ADs have the presidents ears.

 

[upstater]

I've heard that as well. Which University president was it, do you remember? Sure hope it wasn't VPI&SU.

Edit: BTW... it's the university presidents that vote on the schools, not the athletic departments. Although I'm sure the ADs have the presidents ears.

UNC's.

 

[Calamitous]

UNC's.

That makes sense. UNC voted against VT in 2003, citing things like subpar academic performance for student athletes and lack of institutional control. Oh the bitter irony.

 

[buddy]

UConn is NOT AAU! You have no idea how much value those people put on that designation. If you think they look down on Ruddy that is not half of what they think of Connecticut. Another thing people overlook is that conferences use at least one private school to go around the FOIA rules that public institutions are required to follow. Should they lose NW then most likely they will look for a comparable replacement. Cornell, anyone?

No one is leaving the B1G voluntarily or otherwise. Does anyone really think it matters if Northwestern doesn't fit the profile of the other state schools of the B1G. Does anyone think UNorthwestern cares if it loses or wins any games? They are getting the same money win or lose. They are not going anywhere. And yes, you are correct, UConn is not AAU, which is a requirement for admission to the B1G.

 

[Calamitous]

Cornell, anyone?

Private... Ivy... Land Grant... located in the Empire State... all wrapped into one. If they played P5 football and had decent basketball, they would be one hot commodity. Unfortunately, that whole education thing keeps getting in their way